avelanch Posted August 15, 2014 Share Posted August 15, 2014 because polls are accurate for predicting the future... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rollieo Del Fuego Posted August 15, 2014 Share Posted August 15, 2014 Okay no looking... when was the last time the Canucks got through a training camp without some roster player or likely roster player getting injuried before game one of the season? Without looking I would guess 0. So Horvat can have his 9 games if he looks good enough to warrant it, without having to lose someone to waivers by sending them down to the AHL. The great thing about this season is if Horvat is ready that could give us several promising rookies on the roster by season's end. Shinkaruk, Jensen, Gaunce, Fox, Grennier and Friesen will all have a shot at a call up and at least 3 or 4 of those guys have a good shot to do something with the chance. Shinkaruk in particular, we need a sniper. Jensen may have learned how to play D. by then and his shot and moves will only get better. Gaunce I still think needs a year in the AHL and Fox only time will tell. Friesen may be the sleeper here, he was injured a lot last season but came on strong at the end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boudrias Posted August 16, 2014 Share Posted August 16, 2014 Grenier will be very interesting to see how he does in camp. 23 years old at 200 pounds with a pretty good season last year. 39 points in 68 games on a team challenged for 2/3'rds of their season. He could surprise. I prefer the young guys coming from junior spend a full season in Utica. The only question mark is Horvat and whether NHL time is preferable to the OHL. He has a NHL body and a d-game that might help him stay in the NHL. More than that he has a strong mental approach that might handle the pressure. It is a risk for him as Van fans and media scrutinize ever game. IMHO that is why a AHL grounding is so important for these kids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-Money Posted August 16, 2014 Share Posted August 16, 2014 Okay no looking... when was the last time the Canucks got through a training camp without some roster player or likely roster player getting injuried before game one of the season? How many training camps have we had with Linden-Benning-Desjardins running things? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rollieo Del Fuego Posted August 16, 2014 Share Posted August 16, 2014 (edited) How many training camps have we had with Linden-Benning-Desjardins running things? Not sure what that has to do with injuries? The point is that players are not in mid season form but are trying there hardest to make the team, even veterans, so injuries occur more often then in the regular season. In the regular season we still have a man off on the injured list way more than we we have a complete injury free roster. So there will very likely be a spot for Horvat and Vey if they can impress enough in the pre season. Edited August 16, 2014 by Rollieo Del Fuego Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
73 Percent Posted August 16, 2014 Share Posted August 16, 2014 Not sure what that has to do with injuries? The point is that players are not in mid season form but are trying there hardest to make the team, even veterans, so injuries occur more often then in the regular season. In the regular season we still have a man off on the injured list way more than we we have a complete injury free roster. So there will very likely be a spot for Horvat and Vey if they can impress enough in the pre season.when's the last time we went through a Cano with no injuries... before kesler Raymond and booth. They're gone so we're golden. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rollieo Del Fuego Posted August 16, 2014 Share Posted August 16, 2014 Somebody do a poll already to see where Horvat will end up this year! CDC poll; Calder, Selke and Art Ross, TSN poll; injured 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rollieo Del Fuego Posted August 16, 2014 Share Posted August 16, 2014 (edited) when's the last time we went through a Cano with no injuries... before kesler Raymond and booth. They're gone so we're golden. That's how Booth met his wife and made his millions, by being injured all the time. Solid showing on the Me,me,me front. Brain injury...right...head case more like it. Edited August 16, 2014 by Rollieo Del Fuego Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toews Posted August 16, 2014 Share Posted August 16, 2014 Nylander ahead of Reinhart? Ehlers and Fiala ahead of Kuznetsov and Draisaitl? Horrible list. A lot of those guys on that list are 18 and 19 year olds. It is very difficult to project what player they will end up being when they reach the NHL level. Pronman is a scout, he gets paid to watch the players and he uses that experience to rank the players based on (his opinion) where they end up when they reach the NHL. Its a prediction of sort. Craig Button is similar, he also ranks the players based on his experience watching the players as a scout. If we had a draft with all the eligible prospects obviously Kuznetsov would be top 2, he is older more experienced and NHL ready. He is pretty much the safest bet out of all these players but these guys aren't making their list based on who the safest bet but they are predicting that those players would be end up better than Kuznetsov. Its one man's opinion on how these prospects end up when they hit the NHL, you can disagree but it doesn't make it a horrible list. If I created my own list based on my viewings of players I would rank them differently based on my instincts and yes I will play favorites as certain players will appeal to me that won't appeal to others. I am personally not that high on Ekblad, but very high on Ehlers, you can't tell me I am wrong until we actually see how these guys develop. I didn't mean to single you out as there are others who always make negative comments whenever someone makes a list. If you think its so easy to come up with a list then you should try doing so as it will require you to watch multiple junior teams (not just your favourite!) across multiple leagues and follow many junior tournaments. Pronman is a pro scout he gets paid to do that and he is paid to come out with a list. I trust his opinion over the random posters who think they are experts based on highlight videos on Youtube. I also like the fact that Pronman is willing to share his knowledge and answers questions on HF about how he views certain prospects. I can guarantee you the guy watches more amateur games than most of the people on this site combined. By the way he has the Canucks ranked as the 9th best prospect pool, up from 20th last year. Quite an impressive jump, he seems quite high on a number of Canucks prospects. Take it with a grain of salt, its one man's opinion but don't just dismiss it as horrible because he obviously spent a lot of hours watching and putting it together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
420since1974 Posted August 16, 2014 Share Posted August 16, 2014 The Canucks have definitely improved their prospect pool over the last 2 years (bottom 1/3 to top 1/3). Move a few more vets for draft picks and they could be very strong team over the next 2 - 5 years. The goal should be to go deep into the play-offs, not just make it to the first round. I know that many fans want to see the prospects NOW, but I believe that they will be better served waiting another year before playing in the NHL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boudrias Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 I expect positioning for the 2015 draft will dominate a lot of thinking in the 2014-15 season. By the March trade deadline a lot of teams will know whether they are contenders or not. I saw Benning's biggest challenge when hired as the conversion of the Canuck vets into draft pics and prospects. The level of talent and the depth of talent in the 2015 draft might lessen the conversion value as many teams will jockey for picks. I fully expect some teams to 'tank' early, trade what they can, and play their youth. I can only hope Van is part of that group. It might take another losing year to convince some NTC players to waive for a trade to a contender. Since Linden and Benning are new hires they have a level of creditability with management and fans that will allow them to do this. In another year the boo birds will be in action. The race to the bottom will be led by the TO Laffers. Hopefully Van can draft in the top 5 picks. Play all the young AHL aged players in Utica and create a winning attitude there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
70seven Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 we will likely pick somewhere between 10th and 18th overall this coming draft. Being a deep draft, there will be a real good prospect to snap up from that spot. Other than that, theres no veteran on this roster that will get us another 1st round pick. Its possible that we may be able to add a couple 2nds or 3rds if we move a d-man, but with all the NTCs, I dont get the feeling thatll be happening. Interesting to read some other opinions around the league on what the Canucks will look like this coming season. I honestly think this group is tremendously underrated. Back to Horvat, I really believe he'll get an honest look. NOt sure he makes the cut, but if he does, he could be in and out of the lineup as he gets accustomed to pro life, then still be loaned to the WJHCs. I dont necessarily think that would be a bad idea to spot him in here and there keeping him under the 9 game threshold untill x-mas for the big tourney... then decide either back to London or keep him up. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Off_The_Schneid! Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 (edited) Trade deadline : Trade burrows: he would be willing to trade to go to a contender and after a half season in the AHL Shinkaruk can replace him on the 2nd line Trade Hansen: it's clear he's the odd man out and frees up a spot for youth, grenier or zalewski With those two trades either individually or as a package we should be able to get a high 2nd round pick, a 3rd and a defensive prospect Could add in a prospect to sweeten the deal and receive more in return Edited August 17, 2014 by Off_The_Schneid! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toews Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 I expect positioning for the 2015 draft will dominate a lot of thinking in the 2014-15 season. By the March trade deadline a lot of teams will know whether they are contenders or not. I saw Benning's biggest challenge when hired as the conversion of the Canuck vets into draft pics and prospects. The level of talent and the depth of talent in the 2015 draft might lessen the conversion value as many teams will jockey for picks. I fully expect some teams to 'tank' early, trade what they can, and play their youth. I can only hope Van is part of that group. It might take another losing year to convince some NTC players to waive for a trade to a contender. Since Linden and Benning are new hires they have a level of creditability with management and fans that will allow them to do this. In another year the boo birds will be in action. The race to the bottom will be led by the TO Laffers. Hopefully Van can draft in the top 5 picks. Play all the young AHL aged players in Utica and create a winning attitude there. I don't think the Canucks have the roster for a top 5 pick. Its not really necessary to finish in that range to get a good player. There are some really nice prospects that should be available in the 10-20 range. Top 5 pretty much guarantees you a good player next year though, but you won't miss out if you draft well around the mentioned range above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dasein Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 (edited) Trade deadline : Trade burrows: he would be willing to trade to go to a contender and after a half season in the AHL Shinkaruk can replace him on the 2nd line Trade Hansen: it's clear he's the odd man out and frees up a spot for youth, grenier or zalewski With those two trades either individually or as a package we should be able to get a high 2nd round pick, a 3rd and a defensive prospect Could add in a prospect to sweeten the deal and receive more in return Is this your ideal situation? Not sure if Shinkaruk will be able to step in with just half a season in the AHL. Probably not IMO - I think Jensen could be close though. I think Hansen could be gone as early as the beginning of the season. I doubt we trade Burrows, but greater players have been moved against their will. I don't think the Canucks have the roster for a top 5 pick. Its not really necessary to finish in that range to get a good player. There are some really nice prospects that should be available in the 10-20 range. Top 5 pretty much guarantees you a good player next year though, but you won't miss out if you draft well around the mentioned range above. I agree. We definitely won't be finishing in the top 5 range unless there's a boat load of injuries to our core players. 10-20 is a realistic range for where we should be picking this year. That being said, I think Benning might try to move up again using our 1st round pick and prospects/players. I honestly think one of Shinkaruk or Jensen are going to be used in a trade package. For example, one of them can be packaged with our 1st in the 10-20 range for a top 10 pick. A package involving Tanev instead might also entice teams that needs defense more than offense, or need both (use Tanev for immediate help on defense, pick a forward with our 1st). Our willingness to part with Tanev would depend a lot on how close Corrado is to being able to replace Tanev. Or, we simply stay put and take someone in the 10-20 range if the price is too high to move up for a targeted prospect in the top 10. There are a lot of possibilities we can explore throughout the year. Now that we have a GM who is not afraid to pull the trigger on what he thinks is a hockey trade, I'm excited to see what pieces will come and go during the year, at the deadline and the next year's draft to shape our team's future. Edited August 17, 2014 by Dasein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dogbyte Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 I expect positioning for the 2015 draft will dominate a lot of thinking in the 2014-15 season. By the March trade deadline a lot of teams will know whether they are contenders or not. I saw Benning's biggest challenge when hired as the conversion of the Canuck vets into draft pics and prospects. The level of talent and the depth of talent in the 2015 draft might lessen the conversion value as many teams will jockey for picks. I fully expect some teams to 'tank' early, trade what they can, and play their youth. I can only hope Van is part of that group. It might take another losing year to convince some NTC players to waive for a trade to a contender. Since Linden and Benning are new hires they have a level of creditability with management and fans that will allow them to do this. In another year the boo birds will be in action. The race to the bottom will be led by the TO Laffers. Hopefully Van can draft in the top 5 picks. Play all the young AHL aged players in Utica and create a winning attitude there. It seems to me that people are really over-valuing the 2015 draft as if there are hundreds and hundreds of players far better than most players coming out of the draft in last decade. While there may be a couple of high profile players it's a draft just like any other year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimberWolf Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 I would give him a 9 game tryout and then send him back down probably unless he does well.Would still have to make roster space for that to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c00kies Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 Back to Horvat, I really believe he'll get an honest look. NOt sure he makes the cut, but if he does, he could be in and out of the lineup as he gets accustomed to pro life, then still be loaned to the WJHCs. I don't necessarily think that would be a bad idea to spot him in here and there keeping him under the 9 game threshold until x-mas for the big tourney... then decide either back to London or keep him up. I don't think you can do that, as the rule is 9 games or 30 days. Horvat would have to have one solid month to stay on board for the rest of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gyllenhaal Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 Would still have to make roster space for that to happen. You can just send down Sestito to the AHL, and if someone claims him then Lain or Archibald can easily replace him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustABandwagoner Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 You can just send down Sestito to the AHL, and if someone claims him then Lain or Archibald can easily replace him. We got Sestito for free anyways :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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