[Report] Sharks claim Jonah Gadjovich off waivers

[wallstreetamigo]

10 minutes ago, CanucksJay said:

Pretty sure most fans realize Gadj wont make or break this team. 

I think most were rooting for him because he is a homegrown talent and took a big step in the AHL last year and looked good this preseason but didn't get a fair shake. 

Lots would have preferred to keep him even as a 13th forward to give himself a chance to show what he's got before giving him up. 

He should have played the last 3 games and if Canucks waive him now and say Chiasson was better, so be it but he didn't even get that opportunity. He only got very little ice time in 2 games and scored 2 pts. One of them being a goal by being anetfront presence which is exactly what we need. 

No one is suggesting Gadjovich is a make or break player. That’s just a purposeful tactic by Green/Benning defenders to justify what really was an unforced error by the Canucks.

 

No one in the bottom 6 battle clearly outplayed Gadjovich. So it is actually possible to hate losing him on waivers for no clear reason AND realize he is not a saviour. 
 

He was 22 and brought an element this team sorely lacks. Expecting your team to not put such a guy on waivers unless he was clearly outplayed is not unrealistic.
 

 

[Gawdzukes]

5 hours ago, 48MPHSlapShot said:

You seem oddly defensive.

 

Gadj is a good player. The point is that he looked to be a better player than a quite a few of the guys still competing for a spot. Perhaps folk are upset because Gadj had quite noticeably outplayed others competing for the spot that have been kept ahead of him and had less upside? Perhaps they're miffed that he didn't get a longer look? Perhaps it's because the team didn't try to sneak him through when teams were closer to finalizing their rosters and sending their final roster cuts down?

 

Simply saying "good players get claimed" isn't justification enough for losing a recent 2nd round pick with size, coming off a nearly goal per game campaign last year in the AHL, that performed well in camp. It's especially egregious considering that multiple teams apparently made claims on Gadj while not one other player from yesterday's cuts was claimed at all.

 

However, if you agree with the cut, that would imply that a player on a PTO and a few fringe players that haven't really impressed were worth holding onto over Gadj. I don't believe this personally, but if you do, how can you still consider him a good pick? 

 

Point is that we lost a second round pick for nothing, which means that at some point the ball was dropped. 

 

Okay, well again you've demonstrated you just don't understand hockey that well. There are literally thousands of second round picks that didn't make it/lost for nothing. It doesn't mean 1000 balls were dropped. Second round picks are not protected at all costs. Once a player ends his ELC they are no longer afforded special treatment and move around the league until they find a home or move on. I guess in your mind all teams are obligated to keep there 2nd rounders until they choose to retire.

 

Once again a complete logic fail and ultimately attempting to bash management.

 

What it really means is the NHL is incredibly difficult and not everyone makes it.

 

Anyways I'm done arguing stupid stuff for one night. Cheers. Hope the rest of you guys can catch a couple winks after crying into your life size Gadj doll shoulders until 4 am. 

[CanucksJay]

3 minutes ago, Gawdzukes said:

Okay, well again you've demonstrated you just don't understand hockey that well. There are literally thousands of second round picks that didn't make it/lost for nothing. It doesn't mean 1000 balls were dropped. Second round picks are not protected at all costs. Once a player ends his ELC they are no longer afforded special treatment and move around the league until they find a home or move on. I guess in your mind all teams are obligated to keep there 2nd rounders until they choose to retire.

 

Once again a complete logic fail and ultimately attempting to bash management.

 

What it really means is the NHL is incredibly difficult and not everyone makes it.

 

Anyways I'm done arguing stupid stuff for one night. Cheers. Hope the rest of you guys can catch a couple winks after crying into your life size Gadj doll shoulders until 4 am. 

I think there might actually be an intelligence deficit that you are suffering from. 

Most of the comments you write make no sense and have no point and resort to belittling other people. 

Yes lots of 2nd rounders don't pan out. The fact that lots of 2nd rounders don't pan out has absolutely zero bearing in this situation because none of us know whether Gadj will pan out or not. It is illogical for you to say 2nd rounders generally don't pan out so who cares about Gadj because he's a 2nd rounder. There are also 2nd rounders that do pan out. Demko and Hoglander are prime examples of 2nd rounders that do pan out. There's 2 of them on this team.

Moreover, 2nd rounders aren't given up by their team when they are 22, play a power forward game and put up nearly a point a game in the AHL while showing steady improvement every year. 

What makes the situation worse is that he literally had 2 games this preseason in very limited time and still produced. He then got scratched the following 2 games and got waived while guys he seemingly outplayed are still here. 

 

[Gawdzukes]

11 minutes ago, CanucksJay said:

I think there might actually be an intelligence deficit that you are suffering from. 

Most of the comments you write make no sense and have no point and resort to belittling other people. 

Yes lots of 2nd rounders don't pan out. The fact that lots of 2nd rounders don't pan out has absolutely zero bearing in this situation because none of us know whether Gadj will pan out or not. It is illogical for you to say 2nd rounders generally don't pan out so who cares about Gadj because he's a 2nd rounder. There are also 2nd rounders that do pan out. Demko and Hoglander are prime examples of 2nd rounders that do pan out. There's 2 of them on this team.

Moreover, 2nd rounders aren't given up by their team when they are 22, play a power forward game and put up nearly a point a game in the AHL while showing steady improvement every year. 

What makes the situation worse is that he literally had 2 games this preseason in very limited time and still produced. He then got scratched the following 2 games and got waived while guys he seemingly outplayed are still here. 

 

Go and re-read it and the bolded part I was responding to. He claims we dropped the ball because we got no return for a second rounder. I explained it happens all the time ... most 2nd rounders end up nothing for nothing. What part don't you get? 

[wallstreetamigo]

Two things can simultaneously be true:

 

1. Losing Gadjovich is not a make or break moment.

 

and

 

2. Losing him for no discernible reason is an unforced mistake considering no one still here fighting for that spot really outplayed him in the limited chance he got.

 

They could have given him until the end of camp before trying to slide him through. The fact that all the other players waived that day got through and multiple teams placed a claim on Gadjovich is proof enough it was a mistake from a timing perspective.

[CanucksJay]

9 minutes ago, Gawdzukes said:

Go and re-read it and the bolded part I was responding to. He claims we dropped the ball because we got no return for a second rounder. I explained it happens all the time ... most 2nd rounders end up nothing for nothing. What part don't you get? 

I thought you were going to bed... Sorry to rile you up

 

7 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said:

Two things can simultaneously be true:

 

1. Losing Gadjovich is not a make or break moment.

 

and

 

2. Losing him for no discernible reason is an unforced mistake considering no one still here fighting for that spot really outplayed him in the limited chance he got.

 

They could have given him until the end of camp before trying to slide him through. The fact that all the other players waived that day got through and multiple teams placed a claim on Gadjovich is proof enough it was a mistake from a timing perspective.

I honestly don't understand the ppl that feel the need to bash his game to feel better about waiving him. 

It absolutely was an unforced error. 

If JB and TG had a crystal ball and knew he would get claimed, I would guarantee that Gadj would have played at least 1 if not both games that he sat prior to getting waived just so they can have a more informed decision as to whether they want to give up on him or not. 

To me, I feel like they were trying to be too smart and got caught and it was unnecessary because most of us that follow this team knew there was a high probability he would get claimed

Even TG said he had a good camp and were expecting to have him play with the team this year. 

Do you really think he feels the same about all the other guys that are still here like Dries? 

Edited October 8, 2021 by CanucksJay

[wallstreetamigo]

Just now, CanucksJay said:

I thought you were going to bed... Sorry to rule you 

 

I honestly don't understand the ppl that feel the need to bash his game to feel better about waiving him. 

It absolutely was an unforced error. 

If JB and TG had a crystal ball and knew he would get claimed, I would guarantee that Gadj would have played at least 1 if not both games that he sat prior to getting waived just so they can have a more informed decision as to whether they want to give up on him or not. 

To me, I feel like they were trying to be too smart and got caught and it was unnecessary because most of us that follow this team knew there was a high probability he would get claimed

This happens every time a player is lost for nothing or traded for crap. Toffoli (unnecessary at his good cap and a fluke year for MTL so PHEW Benning dodged a bullet letting him walk!), Tryamkin (didn’t REALLY want to sign in Van so Benning had no choice), Gaudette (not an NHL quality player but Highmore can sure skate fast!), Gadjovich, etc. The list of players whose game and character is trashed the minute they leave to justify mistakes Benning and Green make is pretty long.

[CanucksJay]

1 minute ago, wallstreetamigo said:

This happens every time a player is lost for nothing or traded for crap. Toffoli (unnecessary at his good cap and a fluke year for MTL so PHEW Benning dodged a bullet letting him walk!), Tryamkin (didn’t REALLY want to sign in Van so Benning had no choice), Gaudette (not an NHL quality player but Highmore can sure skate fast!), Gadjovich, etc. The list of players whose game and character is trashed the minute they leave to justify mistakes Benning and Green make is pretty long.

Totally. 

I still like this team that Benning has built. 

The fact we were missing 10 starters tonight and played pretty even hockey with a team that the media is hailing as top 2 in the west goes to show JB has done a good job. 

It doesn't mean I won't get pissy though when I see bad moves.

 

[iinatcc]

Just now, wallstreetamigo said:

This happens every time a player is lost for nothing or traded for crap. Toffoli (unnecessary at his good cap and a fluke year for MTL so PHEW Benning dodged a bullet letting him walk!), Tryamkin (didn’t REALLY want to sign in Van so Benning had no choice), Gaudette (not an NHL quality player but Highmore can sure skate fast!), Gadjovich, etc. The list of players whose game and character is trashed the minute they leave to justify mistakes Benning and Green make is pretty long.

Don't forget Kole Lind ... after he was selected by Seattle people here were saying that "we had Gadjovich anyways, and he's the more promising player" 

Yeah Toffoli one was laughable, like who is going to say no to a PPG player a 4.25 Million for 4 years 

 

My 2 cents on Gadjovich being claimed though is that things stings. My personal view is that since Gadjovich hasn't really shown much at this point in his career it's unlikely he's going to be more than a NHL tweener. That said this still kind of sucks losing both Gadjovich and Lind, not because neither panned out but but The Canucks hasn't really had a lot of draft picks during Bennings tenure that our hope for late round steals relied mostly on these two 2nd round 2017 picks. 

 

Canucks already lost out on Gaudette and traded away Forsling (who has turned out to be a NHL dman) now Lind and Gadjovich are also out of the club. Hoglander is nice but the team needs more Hoglander type home runs to have a sustainable team.

 

[wallstreetamigo]

2 minutes ago, CanucksJay said:

Totally. 

I still like this team that Benning has built. 

The fact we were missing 10 starters tonight and played pretty even hockey with a team that the media is hailing as top 2 in the west goes to show JB has done a good job. 

It doesn't mean I won't get pissy though when I see bad moves.

 

I agree. I am not a huge Benning fan but he redeemed himself a fair bit in my eyes with his off-season work.

 

People get too caught up in thinking it has to be an extreme of pro Benning or anti Benning. For me, it’s more I support what I like and call out what I don’t. 

 

Keeping as much of that depth as possible is important though. And this was a clear mistake. The team looks good though overall. I do wish Green would challenge some of his set in stone ideas about strategies and lineup combos though in the preseason. 

[Drakrami]

59 minutes ago, Gawdzukes said:

Okay, well again you've demonstrated you just don't understand hockey that well. There are literally thousands of second round picks that didn't make it/lost for nothing. It doesn't mean 1000 balls were dropped. Second round picks are not protected at all costs. Once a player ends his ELC they are no longer afforded special treatment and move around the league until they find a home or move on. I guess in your mind all teams are obligated to keep there 2nd rounders until they choose to retire.

 

Once again a complete logic fail and ultimately attempting to bash management.

 

What it really means is the NHL is incredibly difficult and not everyone makes it.

 

Anyways I'm done arguing stupid stuff for one night. Cheers. Hope the rest of you guys can catch a couple winks after crying into your life size Gadj doll shoulders until 4 am. 

Yeah no one is saying we should be married to our prospects. But losing a gritty 22 year old who has been progressing in the AHL to the point of 18points in 19 games last season is a failure of management. Gadjovich is good callup depth and 1-2 years down the road may become a good regular player for us. You trying to argue that away is "the complete logic fail" lol. 

 

On the other hand, let's say you are right and Gadjovich does suck. Then that just means Benning wasted another 2nd rounder and drafted no one. His homeruns of Pettersson, Hughes and Boeser over 7 years of drafting high (because our team has sucked for 7 years) is not looking so good when paired with Virtanen, Juolevi, Lind, Gadjovich. 

[DownUndaCanuck]

Shame, he's a bit of a project but still scored like 15 goals in 19 AHL games last year, he definitely has potential to be a 20 goal big strong NHL forward. We lose Lind and Gadjovic in one off-season, that's pretty rough for our future.

[st33]

If he doesn't make the team in SJ he will still have to clear waivers and we can just reclaim him, if he makes it then good on him because like many have said there was no avoiding this scenario. Different time, sure, but he's still going to be on waivers at one point or another.

[mll]

26 minutes ago, st33 said:

If he doesn't make the team in SJ he will still have to clear waivers and we can just reclaim him, if he makes it then good on him because like many have said there was no avoiding this scenario. Different time, sure, but he's still going to be on waivers at one point or another.

Teams who put in a claim have priority and there were apparently a few others.

[JeremyCuddles]

I was big on Gadjovich at the draft. Same with Lind. We lose both. I am so pissed man. Excuse me while I leave to go punch the air to avoid getting in trouble for using uncensored expletives on CDC. Fuuuuuuudge.

[canuck73_3]

Disappointed in the move and loss of Gadj, not enough for a full on melt down. But, a swing and a miss from Green and co. on this one.

[48MPHSlapShot]

2 hours ago, Gawdzukes said:

Okay, well again you've demonstrated you just don't understand hockey that well. There are literally thousands of second round picks that didn't make it/lost for nothing. It doesn't mean 1000 balls were dropped. Second round picks are not protected at all costs. Once a player ends his ELC they are no longer afforded special treatment and move around the league until they find a home or move on. I guess in your mind all teams are obligated to keep there 2nd rounders until they choose to retire.

 

Once again a complete logic fail and ultimately attempting to bash management.

 

What it really means is the NHL is incredibly difficult and not everyone makes it.

 

Anyways I'm done arguing stupid stuff for one night. Cheers. Hope the rest of you guys can catch a couple winks after crying into your life size Gadj doll shoulders until 4 am. 

It's difficult to believe that anybody on this board could have such a lack of understanding of the economics of the game, and yet here you stand, your mere existence here mocking me.

 

The fact that assets are thrown away by teams all the time is not an excuse for throwing one away when you don't have to, especially considering that the asset in question had outplayed our waiver wire fodder up to this point in the little time that he had.

 

 This may come as a shock to you, but stockpiling assets and using them either on your roster or as currency is part of the game. If you throw away an asset for nothing, you've failed at your job. So either Gadj had value, either to the roster or as a trade chip, and was thrown away for nothing, or he was a poor pick/wasn't developed properly, which means the initial value of our 2nd round pick was wasted on him. 

 

It's a failure on the organization no matter how you look at it.

 

But hey, if you want to bend over backwards trying to justify how losing a 2nd round pick for nothing isn't poor asset management, go for it.

 

 

 

Edited October 8, 2021 by 48MPHSlapShot

[wallstreetamigo]

1 hour ago, Drakrami said:

Yeah no one is saying we should be married to our prospects. But losing a gritty 22 year old who has been progressing in the AHL to the point of 18points in 19 games last season is a failure of management. Gadjovich is good callup depth and 1-2 years down the road may become a good regular player for us. You trying to argue that away is "the complete logic fail" lol. 

 

On the other hand, let's say you are right and Gadjovich does suck. Then that just means Benning wasted another 2nd rounder and drafted no one. His homeruns of Pettersson, Hughes and Boeser over 7 years of drafting high (because our team has sucked for 7 years) is not looking so good when paired with Virtanen, Juolevi, Lind, Gadjovich. 

This is a fair point that hammers home that drafting means little without development and turning those drafted players into value to the team on the roster or even in a trade.

 

You can’t say on one hand Benning is a great drafter while on the other saying letting those massive home run steal picks go for nothing is ok because they didn’t pan out. We’re they really that good of picks in that case?

 

You can’t have that argument both ways. Benning has drafted a good core. Mostly due to high picks though. EP, Hughes, Boeser, Podkolzin were all pretty much no brainers where they were picked. Virtanen, Juolevi definitely big misses at their spots. McCann was given away so essentially a wasted pick. Forsling, Tryamkin, Gaudette, Lind, Gadjovich. The return to Vancouver on those picks is Highmore. 
 

You have to give the Canucks Hoglander and Demko too as good picks. Outside of the core drafted due to the failure for several years of a retool strategy though, what is really in the cupboard for Vancouver?
 

Just consider that when wondering why losing Gadjovich on a day not one other waiver player was claimed might annoy some people.

 

 

[DeltaSwede]

6 hours ago, NHL97OneTimer said:

JB is a general manager.  Green is a coach.  Green is in charge of utilizing the players he's been giving.  I'm sure he advises on other matters as well.  However, JB on the other hand is responsible for who is on the roster and who is not.  Do you really think a coach could put an asset in a position to be removed from the roster without a GM being a part of the decision?

 

Like I said, totally different with a 2-way contract where Green could send him to the minors without losing the contract.

 

I'm not in the Canucks meeting rooms but this seems like a pretty obvious one.  Green should be fired if he did this without consultation.

2-way contracts don't have anything to do with waiver eligibility. This isn't NHL 21. 

 

Besides, Gadj has a 2-way. 

[Hairy Kneel]

It was too early to try and sneak him through. Waive a Dries or Patan first those two would clear all day. 

Gadj should have been the very last waive, but even then he would probably be claimed. Everyone knows his AHL numbers last year and his potential as a gritty net front presence.