[Rumour] J.T. Miller Trade/Contract Talks

[Alflives]

8 minutes ago, Coconuts said:

I mean, it'd help solve some of what we'd lose giving up Miller. Konecny's nothing to sneeze at. Not overly big but if you play him with say.. Horvat and Pearson or Horvat and Podz and that'd insulate things a bit. Just turned 25 too.

 

Hell, just the 5th overall and Konecny would be worth it imo. High pick, top six forward and whatever you save in cap by not extending Miller which would probably amount to 4.5M given Konecny makes 5.5M the next three seasons.

 

Because while he was our best forward last season there's a good chance he's peaked, and he'll be 30 by the time his contract kicks in. That matters because unless you're overpaying on a shorter term basis you're spreading your cap over 7-8 seasons and at some point during his extension he'll cease to be worth what he's paid; and that really matters because I reckon he can command 9M. Getting say.. maybe 3-4 seasons of higher end production isn't worth 3-4 years of him being an anchor of sorts when our young core is likely hitting their peak. 

 

It's also about selling high, which this club has a pretty poor history of doing. Move Miller and you can bring in assets to supplement the current team while building towards the future. Which, for an organization with a young core but a bleak prospect pool is pretty important. You've always gotta be looking towards that next wave of cost controlled, RFA talent. 

 

I'm tired of watching this team spin it's wheels in mediocrity, just trying to make the playoffs and hoping something happens, and we haven't even managed to do that successfully. Moving Miller is about looking at a window that's a bit further away than the next 2-3 seasons and about building around our young core pieces.

 

Going into next season with them un-signed would be a huge distraction and media talking point, particularly Miller given the noise that's already surrounding him.

 

Yup, he's not a buy low candidate or cap dump anymore as he's turned his game around.

 

I'd be down for that, I see a lot of upside regarding trading with Jersey.

 

Big if true, can you elaborate? 

Debrusk is a cap dump.  So I would do OEL for Debrusk.  Miller will return Carlo + Lysell.

So it’s Miller + OEL for Carlo + Lysell + Debrusk.  Or the Bruins can take a flying ****. 

[Coconuts]

8 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Debrusk is a cap dump.  So I would do OEL for Debrusk.  Miller will return Carlo + Lysell.

So it’s Miller + OEL for Carlo + Lysell + Debrusk.  Or the Bruins can take a flying ****. 

Alf, you're wrong. Full stop.

 

A soon to be 26 year old player who just scored 25 goals and 42 points signed for two more seasons at 4M per is not a cap dump. That's good value. If you overlook last season's shortened down year of a season he's scored 27, 19, and 25 goals over 3/4 of his last 4 seasons. If you look at his career numbers you can expect roughly 20 goals and 38-42 points. 

 

 

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, Coconuts said:

Alf, you're wrong. Full stop.

 

A soon to be 26 year old player who just scored 25 goals and 42 points signed for two more seasons at 4M per is not a cap dump. That's good value. If you overlook last season's shortened down year of a season he's scored 27, 19, and 25 goals over 3/4 of his last 4 seasons. If you look at his career numbers you can expect roughly 20 goals and 38-42 points. 

 

 

Debrusk is a dumperoo bonsais.  Pearson for Debrusk is an equitable trade.  Two guys who are trying, but who are dumperoos.  

Edited June 4, 2022 by Alflives

[mll]

57 minutes ago, coryberg said:

You can't sign a deal until then but you can talk to the agent all you want. 

Apparently not - with his agent also saying they can't negotiate before the summer:

 

On 5/31/2022 at 7:26 AM, aliboy said:

So here it is, I am surprised, would have thought a club can negotiate with their own player then sign after the appropriate date, but no.

 

RENEGOTIATION OF CONTRACTS

Will Clubs be able to renegotiate contracts with players?

No. Player contracts will not be renegotiated (upward or downward) during their term. Extensions may be negotiated but only in the final year of the contract and only if such extension is for an amount that can be accommodated in a Club's upper limit for the current year or as computed for future years.

 

[Coconuts]

2 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Debrusk is a dumperoo bonsais.  Pearson for Debrusk is an equitable trade.  Two guys who are trying, but who are dumperoos.  

Pearson is also decent value for what he brings, I dunno why he gets so much flack. He makes a shade over 3M and brings streaky but complimentary offense, a defensive conscience to any line he plays on, size and a degree of pushback, and gives you a middle six tweener who can play in either a second or third line role. He's maybe overpaid by 500k. That being said, no, you don't get Debrusk for Pearson. 

[JM_]

1 hour ago, higgyfan said:

Myers to Seattle for Morgan Geekie (C-R) 23yrs

 

Chytil     Geekie     Podz

(the scoring, stopping and stomping line)

that works for me 

[higgyfan]

11 minutes ago, Coconuts said:

Pearson is also decent value for what he brings, I dunno why he gets so much flack. He makes a shade over 3M and brings streaky but complimentary offense, a defensive conscience to any line he plays on, size and a degree of pushback, and gives you a middle six tweener who can play in either a second or third line role. He's maybe overpaid by 500k. That being said, no, you don't get Debrusk for Pearson. 

And neither of them are duperoos or bonzais.  Alf is drinking again...

[Coconuts]

Just now, higgyfan said:

And neither of them are duperoos or bonzais.  Alf is drinking again...

Someone needs to ship Alf a bonsai tree so he finally settles down 

[Alflives]

2 minutes ago, higgyfan said:

And neither of them are duperoos or bonzais.  Alf is drinking again...

Again? 

[Coconuts]

Just now, Alflives said:

Again? 

Alf has two settings

 

Drunk and asleep 

[SilentSam]

10 hours ago, Ghostsof1915 said:

Why is everyone so obsessed with trading Miller? The last time we had anyone at 99 to 104 points was the Twins and that was back in 2010-11.

Miller is 31 points above the next best Canuck. Seems to me, we'd be better served keeping him and getting rid of some the expensive dead weight.

It's possible we might have to move him anyways if an extension is too pricey. But the reality is not many teams have cap space. So you may not get what you are hoping for.

There’s been Some real wheeler dealing “brainiacs” in this thread for a while.

 

New York was a hot destination for a while lol.

 

Why the hell would Drury mess with the future in front of him and his team was my question back then .

 

I still don’t think Miller will be traded,  

his value s worth more signed than unsigned..

and I’m not sure he can talk to other teams until next season unless the Canucks allow it.

 

UFA is great,.   But being unsure of your destination is a bit of a wild card.

Sometimes familiarity breeds content.

 

I also think JT sees himself as a “complimentary” player ,  not a “lone wolf “ type hero.

In other words ,  he is the type of player that values his team and teamates to help create the game he brings.

Hope he stays,  I hope an amicable deal with the Canucks can fuel this player to many years of success with us and his team.

 

[mll]

1 hour ago, Alflives said:

I think @mllpointed out the negotiation period with 2023 UFAs doesn’t come until a week after the coming 2022 draft.  So 

Jersey wouldn’t be able to talk to JT (I think I’m right?) until after this draft.  

Was looking back at the Jones trade.  Like Miller, he had 1 year left when he was traded.  He was traded before the draft as they got Chicago's 12th overall to draft Sillinger.  His agent gave them only 2 teams - Dallas or Chicago.

 

Jarmo Kekalainen: “[Seth Jones’] agent did a good job of limiting our options [on where he’d sign an extension], that’s for sure.”

 

His 8-year extension was also disclosed before free agency.  Different agency but you'd think agents use the same rules.  Not sure why Miller's agent said they can't negotiate before the summer as Jones clearly did.

 

[SilentSam]

1 minute ago, mll said:

Was looking back at the Jones trade.  Like Miller, he had 1 year left when he was traded.  He was traded before the draft as they got Chicago's 12th overall to draft Sillinger.  His agent gave them only 2 teams - Dallas or Chicago.

 

Jarmo Kekalainen: “[Seth Jones’] agent did a good job of limiting our options [on where he’d sign an extension], that’s for sure.”

 

His 8-year extension was also disclosed before free agency.  Different agency but you'd think agents use the same rules.  Not sure why Miller's agent said they can't negotiate before the summer as Jones clearly did.

 

Maybe the agent dosent want to represent Miller in that same fashion.

Perhaps if it dosent work out for Miller here, they would still like to have UFA to go to.

 

 

[Baggins]

12 minutes ago, mll said:

Was looking back at the Jones trade.  Like Miller, he had 1 year left when he was traded.  He was traded before the draft as they got Chicago's 12th overall to draft Sillinger.  His agent gave them only 2 teams - Dallas or Chicago.

 

Jarmo Kekalainen: “[Seth Jones’] agent did a good job of limiting our options [on where he’d sign an extension], that’s for sure.”

 

His 8-year extension was also disclosed before free agency.  Different agency but you'd think agents use the same rules.  Not sure why Miller's agent said they can't negotiate before the summer as Jones clearly did.

 

I would be very surprised if there hasn't been some talks. But his agent would be an utter fool to make that public.

[aGENT]

2 hours ago, mll said:

Was looking back at the Jones trade.  Like Miller, he had 1 year left when he was traded.  He was traded before the draft as they got Chicago's 12th overall to draft Sillinger.  His agent gave them only 2 teams - Dallas or Chicago.

 

Jarmo Kekalainen: “[Seth Jones’] agent did a good job of limiting our options [on where he’d sign an extension], that’s for sure.”

 

His 8-year extension was also disclosed before free agency.  Different agency but you'd think agents use the same rules.  Not sure why Miller's agent said they can't negotiate before the summer as Jones clearly did.

 

Because the world isn't the literal place you'd like it to be MLL  Grey areas be everywhere hombre!

 

"Technically" players/agents/teams can't "negotiate a deal" prior to the UFA period.  But you're a fool if you don't think those parties are having "informal discussions" (AKA under the table negotiations) prior to. Including with potential trade partners if they're permitted.

 

The premise that Miller can only/strictly be a rental at the draft due to an inability to negotiate is simply naive.

Edited June 4, 2022 by aGENT

[Gollumpus]

I have to admit that I see a lot of the trade proposals being made here (and elsewhere) as being somewhat optimistic. If the Canucks were able to pull one of these Monty Hauls off, then good on them.

 

As perhaps a comparable, let's say that the Canucks back in 2010 - 11 were pursuing a trade for a Miller type of player, who had only one year left on his deal. The Canucks have a good chance of going all the way to the finals, but getting this guy would likely have guaranteed a Cup. The other team is asking for the Canucks' 1st (not a big deal as it would be the 30th OA), Schneider, Hodgson (at that time being hailed in some circles as the greatest prospect ever) and Tanev.

 

Now, try to look at the situation without your 20/20 hindsight glasses on, would you have pulled the trigger? I'm not sure that I would have.

 

                                                  regards,  G.

[Gollumpus]

15 minutes ago, aGENT said:

Because the world isn't the literal place you'd like it to be MLL  Grey areas be everywhere hombre!

 

"Technically" players/agents/teams can't "negotiate a deal" prior to the UFA period.  But you're a fool if you don't think those parties are having "informal discussions" (AKA under the table negotiations) prior too. Including with potential trade partners if they're permitted.

 

The premise that Miller can only/strictly be a rental at the draft due to an inability to negotiate is simply naive.

I especially like the deals that get signed on the first day of free agency, seemingly minutes after the old contract has expired.

 

                                                     regards,  G.

[aGENT]

9 minutes ago, Gollumpus said:

I especially like the deals that get signed on the first day of free agency, seemingly minutes after the old contract has expired.

 

                                                     regards,  G.

Yeah with complicated bonus structures, trade clauses etc 

 

Just threw that all together in 20 minutes...

 

 

[Smashian Kassian]

9 hours ago, Alflives said:

would be very exciting if we could trade Miller + 15 OA for Zacha + 2OA.

Would we draft Slfkovsky or one of the highly rated Right Shot D?  Hell, what if the Habs take Staflovsky or one of those D?  Do we take Wright?  

 

Yes. Worst case Pettersson or Wright move to center, (or just have 3 great centers) as we've experienced with Miller. 

 

If we got 2nd I'd take Slafkovsky, granted this is the least I've followed the draft in 10 years. I agree with you & @Coconuts, NJ is a very exciting trade partner. Severson, Wood, Zacha, all players that fit with what we need imo.

 

And even if 2nd overall isn't available, Holtz & some of their other young players/prospects (not L. Hughes) are very intriguing aswell. 

[mordekai]

I would like to see JT + 15th for Mercer and 2nd overall

we get a right handed Centerman in mercer and draft one of the rhd

one can dream 

Devils can sign gaudreau and they would have potent top 6 

jt-Hughes-bratt

gaudreau-hirshier-sharangovich