Elon Musk Officially Purchases Twitter, Takes Company Private

[Smashian Kassian]

On 5/1/2022 at 1:43 PM, nuckin_futz said:

Hmmm Musk helping himself to someone ideas and passing them off as his own. Seems to be a bit of a recurring theme.

 

I dont think he claimed to have created the meme tho

 

 

On 4/29/2022 at 12:53 PM, 24K PureCool said:

US have always been a more right leaning country so to them it is radical. 

 

Like I said Bernie is considered a Commie in the US where he would be like a left leaning Liberal up here. Heck with JT's pack with the NDP probably even the right side of the Liberals. 

On 4/29/2022 at 12:45 PM, thedestroyerofworlds said:

Thing is wanting better healthcare, pay for workers, education, reduced pollution, better representation for minorities and women, better social programs really all that radical?  I guess in the eyes of crazy CONs, it is.  

 

In some ways centrism is kind of relative. I think your both correct in your comments, but different people from different areas & influences draw the line in a different place. It doesn't mean that there isn't valid reasons to have different beliefs, but its just all part of democracy & populations having autonomy.

 

 

Edited May 3, 2022 by Smashian Kassian

[thedestroyerofworlds]

1 minute ago, Smashian Kassian said:

 

 

In some ways centrism is kind of relative. I think your both correct in your comments, but different people from different areas & influences draw the line in a different place. It doesn't mean that there isn't valid reasons to have different beliefs, but its just all part of democracy & populations having autonomy.

 

 

Thing is, a lot of the things I listed poll well above 50%.  Some way way more. 

 

The problem is one side is over represented and has a well organized megaphone belting out catchy talking points.  Hint, they're riled up about CRT.

[Smashian Kassian]

1 minute ago, thedestroyerofworlds said:

Thing is, a lot of the things I listed poll well above 50%.  Some way way more. 

 

The problem is one side is over represented and has a well organized megaphone belting out catchy talking points.  Hint, they're riled up about CRT.

 

Well I think going by popular vote leads to the same problem, with more marginalization for less populated areas. And any mindless person can get riled up over catchy talking points - there are certainly alot of those folks in the urban cities of California & New York aswell as the swamps of Georgia. 

 

Maybe I'm a little crazy but I'd lean more towards de-centralization. Why should you be 'represented' (meaning; your well-being forcibly controlled) by people you despise, whom don't align with your values or care about your concerns in anyway?

[thedestroyerofworlds]

28 minutes ago, Smashian Kassian said:

 

Well I think going by popular vote leads to the same problem, with more marginalization for less populated areas. And any mindless person can get riled up over catchy talking points - there are certainly alot of those folks in the urban cities of California & New York aswell as the swamps of Georgia. 

 

Maybe I'm a little crazy but I'd lean more towards de-centralization. Why should you be 'represented' (meaning; your well-being forcibly controlled) by people you despise, whom don't align with your values or care about your concerns in anyway?

You can't please everyone.  Thing is, when there is a large consensus that agrees to a position, shouldn't that be the course that is taken?  As I posted, many of the positions that I listed are supported by a large majority, yet can't really get done because of an opposition that is over-represented.  And this opposition are the people who say those positions I listed are "radical".  At some point, the popular vote should matter.  Especially when support is north of 60%.  

[Smashian Kassian]

16 minutes ago, thedestroyerofworlds said:

You can't please everyone.  Thing is, when there is a large consensus that agrees to a position, shouldn't that be the course that is taken?  As I posted, many of the positions that I listed are supported by a large majority, yet can't really get done because of an opposition that is over-represented.  And this opposition are the people who say those positions I listed are "radical".  At some point, the popular vote should matter.  Especially when support is north of 60%.  

 

No, b/c 'popular' doesn't inherently = 'correct' on any scale. (imo) 

 

And with all the misinformation in the world; both from loons/charlatans on Twitter aswell as rich/powerful corporations & institutions - (all whom act in their self interest) - influencing large segments of the population is a real phenomena. Plus the natural social pressures of 'fitting in' that lead to artificially taking a position with no independent thought. 

 

And also the chances of a meta-'consensus' (narrative), which are often - if not always - influenced by the powerful, completely aligning with your perspective is generally small imo. 

 

Edited May 3, 2022 by Smashian Kassian

[JM_]

8 hours ago, Smashian Kassian said:

 

 

We're talking about a guy looking to put humanity on Mars. I feel like his ambitions are beyond merely getting into the corporate racket for the sake of his individual wealth.

 

(Tho I do appreciate thinking in terms of 'these people are motivated by self interest' - b/c politicians, their influencers, & the parties are in it for self interest more than we attribute to them, imo)

 

I don't think his personal or business ambitions are separate. Its all the same big Elon bubble. 

[JM_]

8 hours ago, Smashian Kassian said:

 

Well I think going by popular vote leads to the same problem, with more marginalization for less populated areas. And any mindless person can get riled up over catchy talking points - there are certainly alot of those folks in the urban cities of California & New York aswell as the swamps of Georgia. 

 

Maybe I'm a little crazy but I'd lean more towards de-centralization. Why should you be 'represented' (meaning; your well-being forcibly controlled) by people you despise, whom don't align with your values or care about your concerns in anyway?

because in a functioning democracy you don't always get your way. Not sure how else we could do it, you're not always going to have the gov't you want no matter who you are. 

[The Lock]

8 hours ago, Smashian Kassian said:

 

No, b/c 'popular' doesn't inherently = 'correct' on any scale. (imo) 

 

And with all the misinformation in the world; both from loons/charlatans on Twitter aswell as rich/powerful corporations & institutions - (all whom act in their self interest) - influencing large segments of the population is a real phenomena. Plus the natural social pressures of 'fitting in' that lead to artificially taking a position with no independent thought. 

 

And also the chances of a meta-'consensus' (narrative), which are often - if not always - influenced by the powerful, completely aligning with your perspective is generally small imo. 

 

"Correct" is not a good term. Correct implies there is only one way to move forward, your way. Correct is more a perspective of one's belief. It's an opinion, not a fact. Realistically, there is no single "correct way" as everyone will have their own idea on what is correct.

 

This is why popular is the next best thing, because you're not going to please everyone as mentioned previously. The popular vote is what the most people deem as being correct. There will also likely never be consensus when you're talking about millions of voters.

 

So, while you're right on there being misinformation that skews this, it's not just misinformation that's out there. It's all about influence. More influence means more votes which leads to more power. However, not all influence is necessarily misinformation.

Edited May 3, 2022 by The Lock

[nuckin_futz]

Musk on his plans for Twitter - may charge commercial/government users

Musk tweeting

 

 

 

 

This is how you drive people to the competition.

 

Edited May 3, 2022 by nuckin_futz

[bishopshodan]

1 hour ago, nuckin_futz said:

Musk on his plans for Twitter - may charge commercial/government users

Musk tweeting

 

 

 

 

This is how you drive people to the competition.

 

Wait a min.

 

The Freemasons aren't still running things? I gotta update my tinfoil hat. Is Bohemian Grove still gonna do the goat thing this year? I got my robe pressed and everything. Oh, is that an Illuminati event? I gotta check my calendar. 

 

[NewbieCanuckFan]

20 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:

Wait a min.

 

The Freemasons aren't still running things? I gotta update my tinfoil hat. Is Bohemian Grove still gonna do the goat thing this year? I got my robe pressed and everything. Oh, is that an Illuminati event? I gotta check my calendar. 

 

How many times do I have to tell you?  It’s the Stonecutters!

 

 

 

 

 

[bishopshodan]

3 minutes ago, NewbieCanuckFan said:

How many times do I have to tell you?  It’s the Stonecutters!

 

 

 

 

 

Exactly.

They evolved from the Loyal Order of Water Buffalo.  Which obviously dates itself to prehistoric times,

 

Edited May 4, 2022 by bishopshodan

[Smashian Kassian]

 

16 hours ago, JM_ said:

because in a functioning democracy you don't always get your way. Not sure how else we could do it, you're not always going to have the gov't you want no matter who you are. 

But I would say its *never. For the majority its never. And that's an important distinction.

 

The parties (take whatever on your want) push a binary with them as the hero that has the right answers (or correct views) on every issue, and the opposition as the evil that you must stand against at all costs. In reality most people stand in different places on all sorts of issues, often context depending.

 

These things are entities in themselves that care more about their power than the interest of the voting citizens imo.

 

 

16 hours ago, JM_ said:

I don't think his personal or business ambitions are separate. Its all the same big Elon bubble. 

 

I wonder if people at that level even think about 'business' in that sense though. Like they are so beyond being in 'business trouble' that its not even a concern & they are just pursuing what they want to pursue, in Elon's case space & tech.

 

Maybe you & I have similar concerns just aimed at different targets. 

[Smashian Kassian]

 

15 hours ago, The Lock said:

"Correct" is not a good term. Correct implies there is only one way to move forward, your way. Correct is more a perspective of one's belief. It's an opinion, not a fact. Realistically, there is no single "correct way" as everyone will have their own idea on what is correct.

 

Well it depends the context. In retrospect we look back on things & determine whether decisions made, or how situations were handled, were 'right' or 'wrong' (correct or not). Which indicates that there is a right way to proceed. 

 

In many context yes, Ex; your idea or my idea on how a particular policy ought to be handled - we may not know the answer. But on another level we have history to rely on in shaping & vetting our beliefs, and there are some truisms we've come too along the way that we can use.

 

 

15 hours ago, The Lock said:

 

This is why popular is the next best thing, because you're not going to please everyone as mentioned previously. The popular vote is what the most people deem as being correct. There will also likely never be consensus when you're talking about millions of voters.

 

So, while you're right on there being misinformation that skews this, it's not just misinformation that's out there. It's all about influence. More influence means more votes which leads to more power. However, not all influence is necessarily misinformation.

Your right about this, and I did mention this in my post. I don't regard this as necessarily a good thing tho.

Quote

Plus the natural social pressures of 'fitting in' that lead to artificially taking a position with no independent thought. 

 

And also the chances of a meta-'consensus' (narrative), which are often - if not always - influenced by the powerful, completely aligning with your perspective is generally small imo. 

 

Popular doesn't = informed or intelligent, and I don't even mean that as an insult. The smartest person in the world is ignorant of 99+% of human knowledge, never-mind the average person that is just trying to survive (& thrive) as a social being with limited time/energy/influence.

 

This leads back to what you said; your right that "correct" may not be the right term here, as people are in different positions & what's best or 'correct' isn't the same for everyone. (Even for the same person across time). But thats also part of why I wouldnt regard 'popular' as the next best option, I regard individual autonomy as the next best option.

 

[RUPERTKBD]

15 hours ago, bishopshodan said:

Wait a min.

 

The Freemasons aren't still running things? I gotta update my tinfoil hat. Is Bohemian Grove still gonna do the goat thing this year? I got my robe pressed and everything. Oh, is that an Illuminati event? I gotta check my calendar. 

 

Little known fact: The Freemasons were involved in the Space Race...

 

They had a top secret plan to put a man on the moon before the Americans and the Soviets....but they ran out of scaffolding....

Edited May 4, 2022 by RUPERTKBD

[JM_]

8 hours ago, Smashian Kassian said:

 

But I would say its *never. For the majority its never. And that's an important distinction.

 

The parties (take whatever on your want) push a binary with them as the hero that has the right answers (or correct views) on every issue, and the opposition as the evil that you must stand against at all costs. In reality most people stand in different places on all sorts of issues, often context depending.

 

`never? you mean never getting 100% of what you want? or never getting anything you want out of gov't?

[The Lock]

13 hours ago, Smashian Kassian said:

 

 

Well it depends the context. In retrospect we look back on things & determine whether decisions made, or how situations were handled, were 'right' or 'wrong' (correct or not). Which indicates that there is a right way to proceed. 

 

In many context yes, Ex; your idea or my idea on how a particular policy ought to be handled - we may not know the answer. But on another level we have history to rely on in shaping & vetting our beliefs, and there are some truisms we've come too along the way that we can use.

 

 

Your right about this, and I did mention this in my post. I don't regard this as necessarily a good thing tho.

 

Popular doesn't = informed or intelligent, and I don't even mean that as an insult. The smartest person in the world is ignorant of 99+% of human knowledge, never-mind the average person that is just trying to survive (& thrive) as a social being with limited time/energy/influence.

 

This leads back to what you said; your right that "correct" may not be the right term here, as people are in different positions & what's best or 'correct' isn't the same for everyone. (Even for the same person across time). But thats also part of why I wouldnt regard 'popular' as the next best option, I regard individual autonomy as the next best option.

 

Decisions made in the past provide experience as we can look back on them, yes; however, this doesn't determine whether a path is "correct" or not. It may provide facts to look at in determine potential future actions, but multiple paths can be formulated from these facts. Also, it depends on the direction each individual wants to go. What does each person want their country to look like? This, in turn, will also determine how they look at history itself. So, while context matters, it still come back to multiple "correct" paths to take.

 

So, at the end of the day, history doesn't really change what I'm saying. It doesn't change the fact that there "correct" is an opinion. "Correct" could have been assisted by history, but that's only as good as the person interpretting that history. It doesn't change that correct is still an opinion. It only makes some opinions more educated than others.

 

So then this whole thing goes back to influence. This whole thing goes back to majority votes being the next best thing. The answer the most people deem as the "most correct" is the answer that gets into power. Therefore, it's important to focus on making sure enough people have the more educated answers. You need to influence enough people with no mis-information in order to achieve what is it you sound like you want to achieve.

 

This whole notion that "correct" is better than "popular vote", it doesn't solve the problem. What will solve the problem (if it's a problem in the 1st place) is making what you deem as "correct" as being the popular vote, at least assuming that your "correct" path is a good idea to begin with.

 

You want to fight mis-information? Educate. Influence. That's what it's about. "Correct" could mean so many things. "Correct over popular" could even mean communism. It could mean fascism. Those "ideals" involved a small group of people thinking they had the correct path, in some cases, a single person. Popular, prevents these scenarios from happening for the most part.

Edited May 4, 2022 by The Lock

[I.Am.Ironman]

20 hours ago, nuckin_futz said:

Musk on his plans for Twitter - may charge commercial/government users

Musk tweeting

 

 

 

 

This is how you drive people to the competition.

 

If only corps/govs are charged why would 'casual users', which I interpret as us average joes, leave Twitter? If individuals are charged then I see people leaving, myself included.

[Bure_Pavel]

21 hours ago, nuckin_futz said:

Musk on his plans for Twitter - may charge commercial/government users

Musk tweeting

 

 

 

 

This is how you drive people to the competition.

 

Facebook and Google, already offer paid marketing and advertising services to businesses this will be no different.  

[nuckin_futz]

1 hour ago, I.Am.Ironman said:

If only corps/govs are charged why would 'casual users', which I interpret as us average joes, leave Twitter? If individuals are charged then I see people leaving, myself included.

In theory, casual users would leave because it's the most followed accounts that people usually interact with that drive the volume of posts. If it's just people with no followers interacting with other people with no followers it's gets boring real fast. When it gets boring people go elsewhere or do something else.

 

16 minutes ago, Bure_Pavel said:

Facebook and Google, already offer paid marketing and advertising services to businesses this will be no different.  

There's little alternative to those sites. Are people really going to attempt to resurrect the corpse of MySpace? Plus we're not talking about paid marketing services and advertising services. We're talking about using the most basic functions of the site. If the users start to migrate elsewhere it can create a tidal wave of exists. At one time MySpace was real competition to Facebook. Then the exits started and now no one uses it.

 

Bottom line, don't give people a reason to go elsewhere because they just might.