[PGT] Vancouver Canucks at Minnesota Wild | Apr. 21, 2022

[JM_]

5 minutes ago, stawns said:

It doesn't have to come from one player and it doesn't all have to be "replaced".  Bringing balance to the lineup, improving the dcorp, pk etc all pushes them forward.  It'd be awfully nice not to have to demko have a career game every single night wouldn't it?

 

Would you prefer Miller leave for nothing?

Miller leaving for nothing is a secondary consideration. The point is to win games, remember? 

[stawns]

Just now, JM_ said:

getting where? whats the actual plan?

To use the assets, from an area of strength, to reinforce areas of weakness.......dcorps, pk, middle 6.  

[JM_]

Just now, stawns said:

To use the assets, from an area of strength, to reinforce areas of weakness.......dcorps, pk, middle 6.  

OK so we have one of two wingers in Garland or Brock we can move and likely improve the d. 

[HKSR]

3 minutes ago, JM_ said:

taking an honest look at Brock, I can't see how he isn't viewed as a good complimentary piece to a team. He just can't get much more than he's making now, he's not really a core guy. And I really like him, I'm not ragging on him one bit. He's going to produce 20-30 goals, 50ish points, maybe play 70 games a year. 

 

So whats that worth?

I'm starting to view Boeser like a Kessel or Sharp type player.  Not a core piece, but definitely a very good complimentary piece to the core.

[IBatch]

8 minutes ago, stawns said:

Its the biggest part of getting there though.  

 

Problem is our team isn't in a tank spot anymore.    

[Phat Fingers]

Well, if the wheels are coming off, it was one hell of a comeback attempt.  
 

Give Demko break boost Halak’s numbers and value and or bring up Martin and Rathbone or Woo or anyone and let all banged up players rest and give Bruce a look at next season and what the farm has for him.  
 

the fans would love it, the players gave it their all, but the mismanagement of the early season, combined with the Covid illness of last year, due to most likely douche bag bad faith by a former player first draft pick of the last manager.  
 

time to get a lead into the next season, give the injuries being played thru extra healing time and make as much progress for next year now with this really great core that was mis managed by blind faith in a coach and a core that had only been under that coach, except for Bo.  
 

The future is bright and Ownership had no choice but to fire JB when JB would not fire Green.  
 

Team success always has to be more important than a GM being proved right by most of his pre season moves.  
 

two more wins in October and we would been being chased vs chasing down the stretch.  4 more wins in the first 22 and we are a solid playoff bound team.  
 

Well &^@# it, I love scouting and drafting, hate most other clubs so I won’t even cheer for the Older Canucks Core in Calgary.  JB right, twice over.  
 

Had he not &^@#ed up and committed two or three early rookie mistakes, Forsling, Willie D, JV over McCann and Player Name Here, then what he had built was decent.  
 

What we have now is a bright next year.  We have elite talent at nearly all key positions at mostly a young age with some core veterans.  With a puck moving Two way RHD who can be a Physical presence and produce, Ala KB3, we would be a playoff team.  
 

With two, we would be contenders.  
 

Love Myers, and he has been a Yeoman for us and is really under appreciated do to his contract.  
 

We would be a tire fire without him, Schenn and OEL.  
 

they had a rough year, but I want to see at least two return and would rather fix the RHD long term properly this time, than rush out and pay too much for a mini Puck Mover, we have one of the best already, he needs a Paryako type player in his future, then we could have a elite top pairing for a decade.  
 

on to the post season with the pain and effort left on the table.  
 

We all feared with the loss of Bo, it was too tall a last wall, and it appears so.  
 

When you leave it all to the last minute, you can’t afford bad luck.  
 

Phats.  
 

 

Edited April 22, 2022 by Phat Fingers

[CanucksJay]

58 minutes ago, stawns said:

Actually, Petey has been the #1 guy since mid Jan.

That's great and I've always been a huge Petey supporter but if Miller didn't play his butt off all season, fact remains we wouldn't even have a sniff at the playoffs.

 

 

[IBatch]

2 minutes ago, HKSR said:

I'm starting to view Boeser like a Kessel or Sharp type player.  Not a core piece, but definitely a very good complimentary piece to the core.

Kessel was a core player.   Routinely in the top ten or very close to it in his prime.  Where Miller is now with only one appearance.   Sharp is a decent comp, but i'm not even convinced that is his true comp.   Likely between Hoffman and Sharp.  

[Baratheon]

Trading/not trading Miller is ALL about the offer coming the other way.  If a bidding war occurs and teams are willing to overpay for JT then we have to pull the trigger.  If the offer is just "so so" then I think many posters here have explained why he should be kept.  

 

The way some fans are so dead set on not trading anyone who brings something positive to the team is unsettling however.  It seems like some are determined to only trade players if/when their value is at it's lowest.  Almost seems like we can't acquire anything of value because (some) fans are unwilling to part with anything of value.

[JayDangles]

1 hour ago, spook007 said:

Yeah I will be ok either way... only thing I don't want to happen is Miller leaving for free. 
 

And absolutely need an upgrade on the D + more size with speed. 

Actually there's something worse than Miller leaving for free. If he left for free the team is basically out a first round pick, a prospect and Millers talent.

 

The team can recover from that loss very quickly.

 

The worst thing is we sign him to some monster 8 year contract that handicaps the team long term.... And after 4 years when his point production drops off the map we realize Miller only plays hard in stints. He is a moody turnover machine that doesn't like to backcheck and completely gives up on the team and becomes an angry journeyman 4th liner.

 

I'm not saying this will happen, I just think it could, and that's way worse than losing him for nothing. 

[Coconuts]

7 minutes ago, JM_ said:

agreed but why can't that involve trading a winger instead of Miller? sure we'll be giving up fewer goals, but scoring less too. 

Because I don't want anything to do with the contract he'll likely command, I don't believe he'll be worth it for long enough. Folks have fallen in love with 26-29 year old Miller but he won't be that player forever, I actually think we're seeing his peak.

[CanucksJay]

2 minutes ago, Phat Fingers said:

Well, if the wheels are coming off, it was one hell of a comeback attempt.  
 

Give Demko break body Halak’s numbers and value and or bring up Martin and Rathbone or Woo or anyone and let all banged up players rest and give Bruce a look at next season and what the farm has for him.  
 

the fans would love it, the players gave it their all, but the mismanagement of the early season, combined with the Covid illness of last year, due to most likely douche bag bad faith by a former player first draft pick of the last manager.  
 

time to get a lead into the next season, give the injuries being played thru extra healing time and make as much progress for next year now with this really great core that was mis managed by blind faith in a coach and a core that had only been under that coach, except for Bo.  
 

The future is bright and Ownership had no choice but to fire JB when JB would not fire Green.  
 

Team success always has to be more important than a GM being proved right by most of his pre season moves.  
 

two more wins in October and we would been being chased vs chasing down the stretch.  4 more wins in the first 22 and we are a solid playoff bound team.  
 

Well &^@# it, I love scouting and drafting, hate most other clubs so I won’t even cheer for the Older Canucks Core in Calgary.  JB right, twice over.  
 

Had he not &^@#ed up and committed two or three early rookie mistakes, Forsling, Willie D, JV over McCann and Player Name Here, then what he had built was decent.  
 

What we have now is a bright next year.  We have elite talent at nearly all key positions at mostly a young age with some core veterans.  With a puck moving Two way RHD who can be a Physical presence and produce, Ala KB3, we would be a playoff team.  
 

With two, we would be contenders.  
 

Love Myers, and he has been a Yeoman for us and is really under appreciated do to his contract.  
 

We would be a tire fire without him, Schenn and OEL.  
 

they had a rough year, but I want to see at least two return and would rather fix the RHD long term properly this time, than rush out and pay too much for a mini Puck Mover, we have one of the best already, he needs a Paryako type player in his future, then we could have a elite top pairing for a decade.  
 

on to the post season with the pain and effort left on the table.  
 

We all feared with the loss of Bo, it was too tall a last wall, and it appears so.  
 

When you leave it all to the last minute, you can’t afford bad luck.  
 

Phats.  
 

 

Well said. 

The season was indicative of how we approach many of our games. 

Came out unprepared. 

Go down a few goals. 

Try to storm a comeback. 

Carry the play and come up short. 

 

We need a good start to the season like we need good starts to a game. 

 

Frustrating as all the pieces were there for a playoff team. Not quite same level as Minni or some other heavier teams but still a playoff team. 

Maybe it's better coming up short and making changes now than to keep going down this path. 

[JM_]

1 minute ago, Coconuts said:

Because I don't want anything to do with the contract he'll likely command, I don't believe he'll be worth it for long enough. Folks have fallen in love with 26-29 year old Miller but he won't be that player forever, I actually think we're seeing his peak.

I guess what I find confusing with the 'step back' vision tho is it seems to be advocating for something still kind of competitive, hoping for development out of other teams prospects. We won't be picking high either. I also don't see why Bo would hang around for 3-4 years of that. 

 

I'd rather see a full tear down that 3-4 meh years. At least we'd be picking top 5 and rebuilding around top tier talent. 

[mikeyman109]

11 hours ago, Green Building said:

I want a defense rebuild and don't care how we get it. Truth is I've given it no thought and don't see a way we can keep both Miller and Boeser next season and one of them could garner a top 4 dman.

No one is giving you a top 4 d man for Brock Boeser at this point. floats way too much and might garner a draft pick. maybe a 2nd if they are desperate for scoring. They know we have cap issues and we arent likely to want to sign BB to 7 mill+ they can just wait and when we walk away from him sign him for nothing

[IBatch]

2 minutes ago, Baratheon said:

Trading/not trading Miller is ALL about the offer coming the other way.  If a bidding war occurs and teams are willing to overpay for JT then we have to pull the trigger.  If the offer is just "so so" then I think many posters here have explained why he should be kept.  

 

The way some fans are so dead set on not trading anyone who brings something positive to the team is unsettling however.  It seems like some are determined to only trade players if/when their value is at it's lowest.  Almost seems like we can't acquire anything of value because (some) fans are unwilling to part with anything of value.

Funny how that works isn't it?  Bure got traded WITH a Hedican.   Wow.   Ouch.  Best player we've ever traded and we did - in his prime.   Had his best seasons in the dead puck era...i'd argue that was an even trade.   Hedican went on to win a cup and play what was it again?  Without looking over 1000 games.   Jovo of course was good great for 2-3 years.   Bure was better though.     Just because Miller is a great chip - doesn't mean he's the next Linden chip.    The roster player coming back will constantly be compared to whatever Miller is managing and the futures could be duds.    It happens, often.   Roy.   MTL lost that deal.    What the team really needs right now is some master Quin surgery.   A second for a Lumme.   A Butcher (Myers?) for a Ronning, Momesso and a Courtnall.   And a Gelinas picked up on waivers. 

[Chris12345]

7 minutes ago, Baratheon said:

Trading/not trading Miller is ALL about the offer coming the other way.  If a bidding war occurs and teams are willing to overpay for JT then we have to pull the trigger.  If the offer is just "so so" then I think many posters here have explained why he should be kept.  

 

The way some fans are so dead set on not trading anyone who brings something positive to the team is unsettling however.  It seems like some are determined to only trade players if/when their value is at it's lowest.  Almost seems like we can't acquire anything of value because (some) fans are unwilling to part with anything of value.

Exactly.

 

Trading or not trading Miller is a waste of time unless you know the return.

 

The Canucks should trade ANY AND ALL players if it makes the team better.

 

They shouldn't trade players for the sake of making a trade.

[CanucksJay]

34 minutes ago, stawns said:

These guys are professionals, they've all dealt with trades many, many times and I doubt they think they'd sink without Miller.

I agree with this. But There are also some ppl here that whined saying letting Tanev Toffi and Markstrom leave the team decreased morale which led to a downward spiral resulting in the tire fire we had in the first half. 

I don't see how letting Miller leave would be any different. 

[JM_]

3 minutes ago, IBatch said:

Funny how that works isn't it?  Bure got traded WITH a Hedican.   Wow.   Ouch.  Best player we've ever traded and we did - in his prime.   Had his best seasons in the dead puck era...i'd argue that was an even trade.   Hedican went on to win a cup and play what was it again?  Without looking over 1000 games.   Jovo of course was good great for 2-3 years.   Bure was better though.     Just because Miller is a great chip - doesn't mean he's the next Linden chip.    The roster player coming back will constantly be compared to whatever Miller is managing and the futures could be duds.    It happens, often.   Roy.   MTL lost that deal.    What the team really needs right now is some master Quin surgery.   A second for a Lumme.   A Butcher (Myers?) for a Ronning, Momesso and a Courtnall.   And a Gelinas picked up on waivers. 

A Miller trade could easily look like the O'Reilly deal, people seem to forget the potential downside of these big moves. 

[CanucksJay]

6 minutes ago, mikeyman109 said:

No one is giving you a top 4 d man for Brock Boeser at this point. floats way too much and might garner a draft pick. maybe a 2nd if they are desperate for scoring. They know we have cap issues and we arent likely to want to sign BB to 7 mill+ they can just wait and when we walk away from him sign him for nothing

Do we bite the bullet and Re-sign Boeser on a lower annual average that's front loaded to meet QO requirements? 

If he plays well, great. We have an option to keep him or trade him and he increased his value. 

I just don't like the idea of liquidating an asset on a poor year when he is still young and an RFA. 

[Chris12345]

39 minutes ago, IBatch said:

It happens often enough.  Hamilton.  AP. Tavares ...

Tanev, Markstrom, TT