2023 NHL Entry Draft

[Kuzy]

6 hours ago, HighOnHockey said:

I'll reserve final judgment until after the World Championships, assuming Carlsson is there. To me they are razor-close and have been neck in neck all year. Maybe I'm biased because I had Carlsson ahead of Fantilli coming into the year and have been tenuously holding on to that belief by a thread all season. We know NHL teams love everything about a player like Fantilli - his complete game, his physicality, NHL-ready next year. But we know NHL teams also love the what-if of elite skill on a big frame. What if it isn't such a tiny bit more upside? Maybe Fantilli maxes out as a 80 point two-way center while Carlsson develops into a 100+ point offensive center. It's also not that much extra risk, as Carlsson already had a pretty big year at a much higher level of hockey than Fantilli did.

 

I just keep going back to what I believe was the first time I saw Carlsson at the 2021 fall 4 Nations, and I still wasn't familiar with players' numbers yet. There were multiple plays where at a glance I legit assumed it was Noah Ostlund carrying the puck through the neutral zone the way he slipped and slithered through opposing forecheckers, only to realize it was not the 5'10, 165 lb Ostlund but this 6'3 freak of nature. And watching him in the SHL, the way he's able to be deceptive against pro players down low in particular, with the little stutter steps and shoulder fakes. Fantilli is the more translatable NHL player overall, but Carlsson's offensive game looks highly translatable, and combined with his level of pure skill I just think the potential is there for a really special offensive player.

I kind of get Kopitar vibes from Carlsson, maybe it's just his similar stature but he's one of those players that is extremely hard to knock off the puck when he's faced away from the attacker.

[R3aL]

6 hours ago, HighOnHockey said:

I'll reserve final judgment until after the World Championships, assuming Carlsson is there. To me they are razor-close and have been neck in neck all year. Maybe I'm biased because I had Carlsson ahead of Fantilli coming into the year and have been tenuously holding on to that belief by a thread all season. We know NHL teams love everything about a player like Fantilli - his complete game, his physicality, NHL-ready next year. But we know NHL teams also love the what-if of elite skill on a big frame. What if it isn't such a tiny bit more upside? Maybe Fantilli maxes out as a 80 point two-way center while Carlsson develops into a 100+ point offensive center. It's also not that much extra risk, as Carlsson already had a pretty big year at a much higher level of hockey than Fantilli did.

 

I just keep going back to what I believe was the first time I saw Carlsson at the 2021 fall 4 Nations, and I still wasn't familiar with players' numbers yet. There were multiple plays where at a glance I legit assumed it was Noah Ostlund carrying the puck through the neutral zone the way he slipped and slithered through opposing forecheckers, only to realize it was not the 5'10, 165 lb Ostlund but this 6'3 freak of nature. And watching him in the SHL, the way he's able to be deceptive against pro players down low in particular, with the little stutter steps and shoulder fakes. Fantilli is the more translatable NHL player overall, but Carlsson's offensive game looks highly translatable, and combined with his level of pure skill I just think the potential is there for a really special offensive player.

I think one difference is some teams are viewing Leo as a winger at the NHL level over a C like Fantili is a C without any doubt. Do you see him as a C for sure?

[eeeeergh]

46 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Benson or Reinbacher? 

Benson all day long

He would probably be top-3 any other year

 

I dont know about Reinbacher. Feels like a "safe" pick. Decent at everything, great at nothing. Gets a big boost in draft value because of his position (RD). 

 

Players that are exceptional but have a "knock" on them (Petey was too skinny.. Caufield was too small..) are going to be the best picks imo. 

 

If we're not getting Bedard/Michkov/Fantilli (McDavid/Ovechkin/Eichel), we should get the next Brayden Point, and thats Benson. In a draft where you can pick up high end potential 1st line players, we shouldnt go for guys that probably end up in the middle-6 forwards, or middle D pairing. 

 

This is the draft you draft BPA, positional needs be damned. 

[Warhippy]

3 hours ago, Outsiders said:

Would anyone part with the 11th selection if we could nab Laf and Schneider from NYR and maybe we throw in Hoglander who they wanted badly for Kravtsov

 

Laf-Petey-Kuz

Beauvillier-Miller-Boeser

 

Hughes-Schneider

OEL-Hronek

 

 

We get a 21 yr old RHD who's a bit of a throw back. Would compliment Hughes perfectly. 6'3 210

We take a gamble on another 21 yr old Alexis Laf who had 0 points in 7 games for NYR against Devils. Emilie Castonguay would have inside scoop and maybe knows what we could do to take his career to next level

 

 

Thoughts?

Yes.  100% and then flip Laf to the Habs

[eeeeergh]

3 hours ago, Outsiders said:

Would anyone part with the 11th selection if we could nab Laf and Schneider from NYR and maybe we throw in Hoglander who they wanted badly for Kravtsov

 

Laf-Petey-Kuz

Beauvillier-Miller-Boeser

 

Hughes-Schneider

OEL-Hronek

 

 

We get a 21 yr old RHD who's a bit of a throw back. Would compliment Hughes perfectly. 6'3 210

We take a gamble on another 21 yr old Alexis Laf who had 0 points in 7 games for NYR against Devils. Emilie Castonguay would have inside scoop and maybe knows what we could do to take his career to next level

 

 

Thoughts?

theyre not trading us Laf and Schneider for a 1st + Hoglander

 

They will continue to overvalue Laf because of his 1st overall pedigree. 

 

2x 1sts + Hoglander + another very good prospect might get it done

[Alflives]

48 minutes ago, eeeeergh said:

theyre not trading us Laf and Schneider for a 1st + Hoglander

 

They will continue to overvalue Laf because of his 1st overall pedigree. 

 

2x 1sts + Hoglander + another very good prospect might get it done

Agreed that the cost would be high but yuk. Lafreniere looks like a nothing burger player. And that Schneider guy had a big drop off. Rather keep 11OA and Hogs. 

[eeeeergh]

2 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Agreed that the cost would be high but yuk. Lafreniere looks like a nothing burger player. And that Schneider guy had a big drop off. Rather keep 11OA and Hogs. 

yes especially if theres a chance 11oa could get us Benson, that would be insane

imagine adding a brayden point to our top-6

 

Beauvillier-Petey-Kuzy

Mikheyev-Miller-Benson

 

We can move on from Boeser and Garland and reinvest that cap space into Gavrikov. Id say pick up Gudas as well, as he'll run the PK from the right side

 

Gavrikov-Hronek

Hughes-Bear

OEL-Gudas

 

 

[HighOnHockey]

3 hours ago, R3aL said:

I think one difference is some teams are viewing Leo as a winger at the NHL level over a C like Fantili is a C without any doubt. Do you see him as a C for sure?

I can't imagine why anyone would think that... lol, considering he's played wing most of this year in SHL and at every international competition I've seen him. I just see him as a center. I don't wanna say anything for sure, but I can't see any reason why not. His puck carrying and distribution are exceptional. His defensive game certainly isn't on the level of a Fantilli or Dvorsky, but looks pretty decent in the SHL for his age. The deficiencies in the defensive zone with him tend to be more of an issue of commitment - he's just a kid who thinks offense first. In other words it's coachable. Whatever NHL team drafts him is going to want him to be a center. If he's willing to make that commitment to staying above the puck and taking care of his own zone, then he's going to be a center. I'm sure it'll be the first question teams ask at the combine - "do you see yourself as a center?"

[Off_The_Schneid!]

7 hours ago, Pure961089 said:

I wouldn't be surprised if Benson fell out of the top 10. Wood shot up in the draft rankings before the u18 tourney, he looked like cemented his spot in the top 10 as an elite power forward.  Todd Bertuzzi's are rare and hard to come by.  I think Dvorsky, Wood, and Pellikka will push Benson out of the top 10.  Benson had fallen to 8th before the u18 tourney in some mock drafts.  I still think Cristall is the sleeper in the draft though.

 

[kenhodgejr]

I think the moves Vanouver should make should be small and calculated. We need to use the 1st round pick to add another good prospect to the team. We also need to find value in cheap players that cost under 1m. Good team management has cheap players making big contributions. We have done a good job with signings. We could make a couple small trades for cheap players who are AHL/ NHL guys that could contribute. Id be looking at a projectable RD in the AHL with speed, IQ, defensive awareness who is under 25 

[J.I.A.H.N]

20 minutes ago, HighOnHockey said:

I can't imagine why anyone would think that... lol, considering he's played wing most of this year in SHL and at every international competition I've seen him. I just see him as a center. I don't wanna say anything for sure, but I can't see any reason why not. His puck carrying and distribution are exceptional. His defensive game certainly isn't on the level of a Fantilli or Dvorsky, but looks pretty decent in the SHL for his age. The deficiencies in the defensive zone with him tend to be more of an issue of commitment - he's just a kid who thinks offense first. In other words it's coachable. Whatever NHL team drafts him is going to want him to be a center. If he's willing to make that commitment to staying above the puck and taking care of his own zone, then he's going to be a center. I'm sure it'll be the first question teams ask at the combine - "do you see yourself as a center?"

I think the most important thing people need to understand, is just what you said...he is 17, with a fantastic skill set...........better than almost all except for 3 others....#1, 2, and 3.....and that is debatable, and will sort its self out over the on coming years.

Edited May 3, 2023 by J.I.A.H.N

[kenhodgejr]

3 minutes ago, kenhodgejr said:

I think the moves Vanouver should make should be small and calculated. We need to use the 1st round pick to add another good prospect to the team. We also need to find value in cheap players that cost under 1m. Good team management has cheap players making big contributions. We have done a good job with signings. We could make a couple small trades for cheap players who are AHL/ NHL guys that could contribute. Id be looking at a projectable RD in the AHL with speed, IQ, defensive awareness who is under 25 

Maybe a guy like 

 

Ville Ottavainen

Defense -- shoots R
Born Aug 12 2002 -- Oulu, Finland
[20 yrs. ago]
Height 6.05 -- Weight 218 [196 cm/99 kg]

Drafted by Seattle Kraken

- round 4 #99 overall 2021 NHL Entry Draft

[hammertime]

Antti Tuomisto

Defense
Born Jan 20 2001 -- Pori, Finland
[22 yrs. ago]
Height 6.05 -- Weight 205 [196 cm/93 kg]

Drafted by Detroit Red Wings

- round 2 #35 overall 2019 NHL Entry Draft

 

 

 

 

 

			Regular Season						Playoffs
Season	Team	Lge	GP	G	A	Pts	PIM	+/-	GP	G	A	Pts	PIM
2020-21	U. of Denver	NCHC	24	2	9	11	23	-2
2021-22	U. of Denver	NCHC	35	1	8	9	21	20
2022-23	TPS Turku	SM-liiga	60	5	15	20	20	-6	3	0	2	2	6

Embed Antti Tuomisto stats! | View as text

[Eddie]

Anyone seen Pronman's latest rankings drop ? 

 

I won't post the list here as where I read it, it was premium content but - He is super high on Danielson and Reinbacher - Has Benson at 17 - which is interesting with all the talk of him falling on here.  Also ranks ASP in the 20's and is really low on all the wingers + Moore as well. Leonard is also much lower than most-  Like Buttons last list its a pretty different. 

 

Need to watch more tape of Daneilson as he sounds super interesting, I know a bunch of the really well researched guys on here are big on him too. 

 

Think were gonna get such a good player at ~11 its awesome - no way I'm trading the pick for Laff etc who is being compared to Yakupov by a lot of Rags fans right now. A highly skilled cost controlled asset will really help support the current core and we can totally get that from this spot - either a 2/3C - RHD or power winger for Petey that can step right into the line up in a years time I think.

[Off_The_Schneid!]

 

 

Anyone have access and want to post ? 

[mordekai]

1 hour ago, Eddie said:

Anyone seen Pronman's latest rankings drop ? 

 

I won't post the list here as where I read it, it was premium content but - He is super high on Danielson and Reinbacher - Has Benson at 17 - which is interesting with all the talk of him falling on here.  Also ranks ASP in the 20's and is really low on all the wingers + Moore as well. Leonard is also much lower than most-  Like Buttons last list its a pretty different. 

 

Need to watch more tape of Daneilson as he sounds super interesting, I know a bunch of the really well researched guys on here are big on him too. 

 

Think were gonna get such a good player at ~11 its awesome - no way I'm trading the pick for Laff etc who is being compared to Yakupov by a lot of Rags fans right now. A highly skilled cost controlled asset will really help support the current core and we can totally get that from this spot - either a 2/3C - RHD or power winger for Petey that can step right into the line up in a years time I think.

He has been high on Danielson for a long time now. But I don’t see anyone else ranking Danielson as high as Pronman has

[HighOnHockey]

9 minutes ago, mordekai said:

He has been high on Danielson for a long time now. But I don’t see anyone else ranking Danielson as high as Pronman has

Recrutes has him at 10 since at least Christmas.and I believe it was @R3aL here who was pumping Danielson's tires very early on saying he preferred Danielson to Ritchie (who was still pretty consensus top 10 at the time).

[Off_The_Schneid!]

46 minutes ago, HighOnHockey said:

Recrutes has him at 10 since at least Christmas.and I believe it was @R3aL here who was pumping Danielson's tires very early on saying he preferred Danielson to Ritchie (who was still pretty consensus top 10 at the time).

Projected as a good 3rd line RHC, exactly what the Canucks need. Safe pick I wouldn’t be upset unless Dvorsky Leonard, Reinbacher we’re still on the board 

[J.I.A.H.N]

Soooo.I have been thinking about this for a while........I think the canucks will draft one of these guys

 

 

Dvorsky, Leonard, Barlow, Danielson, Sandin Pellikka, or Reinbacher

 

 

I don't think Dvorsky will be there when we pick, but we would take him if he was there.all the rest we have a shot at?

[HighOnHockey]

20 hours ago, Hamhuis2 said:

Hi all,

 

Posting my rankings for the 1st round of the 2023 draft for feedback and discussion.

 

I'm curious as to what CDC thinks about the 2023 first round. Pre-draft, it's looking like one of the best I can remember, with absolute franchise/elite players at the top, and first-line players available well into the middle of the round. It's a good year to have a 1st (or two... :/).

 

Brief stylistic comparisons and projections included here - let me know what you think!:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

2023 1st Round Draft Rankings:

Player - Position - Potential - Point Projection - Stylistic Comparable - Notes

1. Bedard - C - Top-5 player - 100+ points - Joe Sakic mixed with Patty Kane - Dynamic sniper, sneaky edgework, elite skill.

 

2. Michkov - RW - Top-5 goalscoer - 100+ points - Nikita Kucherov - Intelligent, high-skilled player who excels at darting into space in the offensive zone. Can score from anywhere. Potential 50 goal scorer.

 

3. Fantilli - C - Top-10 centre - 90+ points - Jonathan Toews - High-end physical tools + aggressive + solid hockey sense.

 

4. Carlsson - C/LW - Top-10 centre - 90+ points - Filip Forsberg - High degree of drive + skill. Uses his body to protect the puck very well.

 

5. Smith - C - #1 centre - 80+ points - Trevor Zegras - Creative, controls the pace of the game, which can sometimes cause him to look slow.  Can lack on defensive effort, but is an offensive wizard.

 

6. Benson - LW/RW - Play-driving 1st line winger - 80+ points - Brayden Point - Workhorse with high-end skill. Above average straight-line speed, but elite edges. Small, but tenacious.

 

7. Reinbacher - RD - Top-pair defenceman - 40 points -  Alex Pietrangelo - Above-average puck skills. Very good distance passer and decision maker. Above average skater with room to improve pivots. Great reach and overall defensive play.

 

8. Leonard - RW/C - Complementary 1st line winer - 70 points - Zach Parise - Elite motor, high-end shot and puck skills. Good two-way player who plays like a smaller power forward.

 

9.  Moore - C - High-end #2 centre - 65 points - Dylan Larkin - Best skater in the draft, with a willingness to play inside the dots. Good puck skills and passing. Above average hockey IQ.

 

10. Dvorsky - C - High-end #2 centre - 60 points - Anze Kopitar - Advanced defensive game, great shot, but needs time to get it off. Above average puck skills. Heavy feet, but ok speed once he gets going.

 

11. Cristell - LW - Complementary 1st line winger or bust - 75+ points or bust - Claude Giroux - Elite puck skills, highly creative. Fantastic passer with a great shot. One of the best players in the offensive zone, though he can force plays. Good edges but average separation and top speed.

 

12. Sandin-Pellikka - RD - Offensive #3 defenceman - 50+ points - Quinn Hughes - Elite skater, including great four-way mobility. Play-driver from the backend, with good vision and passing. Typically good decision-making; prone to some lapses. Average defensively.

 

13. Barlow - LW - 1st/2nd line power forward - 60 points - Mason McTavish - High-end shot and physical tools. Plays a direct game with above-average skating. Above-average hockey IQ, but probably won't be the primary creator on his line.

 

14. Wood - 1st line power forward or bust - 75+ points or bust - Jason Robertson - High-end tools, including shot, size, and puck skills. Incredibly intelligent player. Below-average acceleration and average top speed. Skating could limit his upside, or he could become the next Jason Robertson.

 

15. Perrault - Complimentary 1st line winger - 60 points - Jake Guentzel - Not the biggest or the fastest, but the hockey IQ is near the top of the class, and he has good skill.  Wide spread on this player, but he's too smart to fail.

 

16. Yager - 1st/2nd line sniper - 60 points - Mike Hoffman -  Great shot and good skating, but plays a bit too much on the perimeter, leading to inconsistencies in creating. Average/above-average hockey IQ.

 

17. Danielson - #2 two-way centre - 50 points - Anthony Cirelli - Prototypical two-way #2C. Very responsible player who is a jack of all trades. Good, but not great at everything.

 

18. Sale - RW - 1st line offensive winger or bust - 65+ points or bust - Taylor Hall - Great individual puck skills and speed. More of a playmaker, but has a good shot - needs to use it more. Very inconsistent - can disappear for games at a time and then look like the best player on the ice.

 

19. Heidt - LW/C - 2nd line playmaker - 55 points - Nick Schmaltz - Great passer and playdriver from the centre or wing. Good mobility, especially carrying the puck in transition. He has high-end hockey IQ, and should play C at the next level. Despite low goal totals, he is a good one-timer option on the PP.

 

20. Simashev - LD - #3-4 shutdown defenceman - 25 points - Jonas Siegenthaler - Big shutdown defenceman with a good stick, above average skating & physicality, and some offensive upside. Potential the best defensive player in the draft.

 

21. Brindley - 2nd line pest - 50 points - Brad Marchand - Tenacious player with a high-end motor and good puck skills. Great at puck retrievals and keeping plays alive in the offensive zone.

 

22. Honzek - C/LW - 2nd line powerforward - 50 points - Danius Zubrus - Plus size and above-average skating. Doesn't shy away from the middle of the ice, especially the front of the net. Can be inconsistent and needs to work on his defensive play.

 

23. Willander - RD - #3-4 two-way defenceman - 30 points - Anton Stralman - Very efficient player with good mobility, decision-making, and passing. Isn't flashy, but always seems to make the right play. Could improve his

 

24. Ritchie - C - #2 two-way centre - 50 points - Ryan O'Reilly - Above average in everything except average skating.

 

25. Stenburg - C - #2 two-way centre - 50+ points - Philip Danault - Good two-way player with above-average skating and hands. Likes the puck on his stick and excels in transition. Plus shot from range.

 

26. Gulyayev - LD - #4 offensive defenceman - 50+ points - Tyson Barrie - Elite skater with high-end offensive tools, including stickhandling and passing in the offensive zone. Loves to join the rush, and can get back due to his elite speed. In-zone defending and strength need improvement.

 

27. Sawchyn - C -  Middle-six energy forward - 45 points - JG Pageau - High-end motor and good passing, especially in tight spaces. He's a tenacious forechecker who can play higher in the lineup due to his hockey IQ and good skill base, though may be limited by his size.

 

28. Musty - LW - Top-6 playmaker or bust - 55+ points or bust - Benoit Pouliot - Above-average individual skill, creativity, and vision. Struggles with inconsistency, physicality, and skating - especially his acceleration.

 

29. Ziemmer - RW - Top-6 power forward - 50 points - Timo Meier - Excellent at using his size to protect the puck and drive the net. Has a great shot, good IQ and passing ability, but can lack explosiveness.

 

30. Lindstein - LD - #4 two-way defenceman - 30 points - Henri Jokiharju - Smooth skating defender with a big shot, but can struggle under pressure with his decision-making.

 

31. But - LW - Top-6 power forward or bust - 50+ points or bust - Evgeni Malkin - Massive physical player with good puck skills and a hard, but inaccurate shot. He's very raw, and has an awkward stride that doesn't generate much power, leading to poor acceleration but decent top speed. Honestly could go anywhere from 10-50.

 

32. Gauthier - RW - Middle-six pest - 40 points - Mike Richards - Good motor, especially on the forecheck. He is relentless, and an intelligent two-way player. Average skating and skills limit upside, but he's hard to play against.

 

 

Note: This is not a mock draft. If I'm the Canucks, my realistic targets are Reinbacher, Moore, Leonard, Sandin-Pellikka, or Wood, probably in that order.

 

Another solid list. Interesting comparisons even if I don't agree with all of them. I like the Bedard comparison. I've actually compared him to a Sakic/Selanne hybrid - he just always appears at the puck in scoring positions, whether explosively (Selanne/Bure) or sneakily (Sakic). Michkov to Kucherov is solid, but I like to use use comparisons that highlight the skating agility and edges, as I believe it's his greatest strength - Skinner, Kariya, Crosby. I always try to use a few different comparisons as one direct comparison can never capture a prospect's individuality.

 

Fantilli is a really tough player to compare because he's just such a unique, multi-faceted player. Toews captures the defensive specialist side of him, but it misses the Mike Peca/Ryan Kesler side. Some might argue that none of them fully capture his offensive upside. Leo Carlsson to Filip Forsberg is decent if you think he's a winger - definitely open to debate - but I see more evasiveness and smoother stick skills on Carlsson than Forsberg. @Kuzy compared him to Anze Kopitar which has some merit but he has a long way to go on the defensive side of things. I've also seen Mats Sundin comparisons and that one makes a lot of sense to me, except he's not quite gonna be 6'5 and probably never 230. Personally I see a lot of Jack Eichel to Leo Carlsson, the way they so seamlessly blend finesse and power.

 

On your question/comment about the quality of the draft, I think it's overall an above average draft class, but probably not warranting of the level of hype it's getting. That top 4 has a trickle-down effect where now you have a crop like Dvorsky, Smith, Benson, Leonard who would make up a fine top five in a lesser draft, and guys like Wood, Barlow, Yager, Perreault who should go top ten a lot of years. Aside from that it's a strong and deep forward crop, but that is balanced out a bit by the lack of defensemen toward the top end. So overall pretty similar to the 2020 draft, except that this big four is even better than that big four (Lafreniere, Byfield, Stutzle, Raymond), perhaps by a wide margin, and I don't think there are any defensemen as highly regarded as Sanderson or Drysdale in this draft.

Edited May 3, 2023 by HighOnHockey