[Proposal] LA Kings and JT Miller

[laddie]

At this point I think I would rather keep Bo Horvat over JT Miller and trade Miller to LA who could use a 2nd line centre to allow them to move Danault to their 3rd line:

 

To LA: JT Miller and Danila Klimovich

 

To Vancouver: Sean Walker, Helge Grans and Alex Turcotte

[smithers joe]

46 minutes ago, laddie said:

At this point I think I would rather keep Bo Horvat over JT Miller and trade Miller to LA who could use a 2nd line centre to allow them to move Danault to their 3rd line:

 

To LA: JT Miller and Danila Klimovich

 

To Vancouver: Sean Walker, Helge Grans and Alex Turcotte

i like that trade. would LA?

[dm_ranger]

Miller isn't playing center for us right now.  Do you think other teams see him as a second line center?  Trade might work but I think any trade with Miller we will be lucky to get $0.75 on the dollar for him.

[smithers joe]

6 minutes ago, dm_ranger said:

Miller isn't playing center for us right now.  Do you think other teams see him as a second line center?  Trade might work but I think any trade with Miller we will be lucky to get $0.75 on the dollar for him.

i'ld still do it. even if takes moving both miller and horvat, to turn us around, i'ld go for it.  a step back now, for a stride forward in our future.

[wildcam]

47 minutes ago, smithers joe said:

i'ld still do it. even if takes moving both miller and horvat, to turn us around, i'ld go for it.  a step back now, for a stride forward in our future.

OMG, you can never move both Miller and Horvat?? Finding top centre men are as hard as finding RD men.. Vancouver would then be looking to find a # 2 centre? 1. Petey  2. ___ 3. ___ 4. Lazar--  Aman

Trade Miller get best deal you can and move on.. 

[Nucker 67]

LA might want to take that next step, but the Canucks would need to take cap back, as much as I'd love to add Turcotte and Grans to the VAN prospect pool

[NewbieCanuckFan]

5 minutes ago, wildcam said:

OMG, you can never move both Miller and Horvat?? Finding top centre men are as hard as finding RD men.. Vancouver would then be looking to find a # 2 centre? 1. Petey  2. ___ 3. ___ 4. Lazar--  Aman

Trade Miller get best deal you can and move on.. 

lol.  We're still looking for a 3C never mind replacing those other two.

[Alflives]

2 hours ago, smithers joe said:

i'ld still do it. even if takes moving both miller and horvat, to turn us around, i'ld go for it.  a step back now, for a stride forward in our future.

It seems like more and more of us fans are willfully nag to take a couple steps back now so we can be a better club down the road.  Will our owner agree?  

[Coconuts]

I don't think it'd work, they don't have the cap space to take on Miller making 8M next season. The only really large contract they have coming off the books is Quick and they get a bit from the Phaneuf buyout expiring. Edler, Lemiux, and Moore are pending UFA's too. 

 

But at the very least they'll need to replace Quick if he retires and they've got RFA's to sign. Vilardi could eat up a good chunk of the cap opening up if he continues to play how he has, he's had a great start. 15 points in 17 games thus far, even if they bridge him it'll eat up a good amount of cap if he continues producing this way. 

[spook007]

2 hours ago, wildcam said:

OMG, you can never move both Miller and Horvat?? Finding top centre men are as hard as finding RD men.. Vancouver would then be looking to find a # 2 centre? 1. Petey  2. ___ 3. ___ 4. Lazar--  Aman

Trade Miller get best deal you can and move on.. 

Yes, but are we expecting to challenge in the next 2-3 years?

If not, it doesn't really matter, does it? if its more than 3 years then Bo will be 32-33 and Miller 33-34, so this is probably the time to take stock, about witch direction we are going to take...

 

I don't like to tear it down neither, but its hard to watch this team struggle like this, and then another step forward followed by a step back... going nowhere...

 

If they think they can be competitive and really want to move one of those two players, it has to be Miller all day long... Bo may not be a no.1 (although atm he plays like one), but he is a good 2nd line C, and we have nobody to replace him.

 

Breaking it totally down now, will give us good opportunities to start the rebuild with a class draft (as per 'experts')... and in 3-4 years they should become relevant again. Draisaitl and McD were drafted in 14 and 15 so that give a kind of a time frame for when draftees should be able to carry a team... so likely 5-6 years from their are drafted, maybe less if surrounded by good players, but most likely 5-6 to be consistently expected to make the play offs...

 

So what to do.... the next McD is probably the top prize, or carry on hoping for players to improve enough to get us into the playoffs. Love the players...always have and always will, but losing sucks...

[smithers joe]

3 hours ago, wildcam said:

OMG, you can never move both Miller and Horvat?? Finding top centre men are as hard as finding RD men.. Vancouver would then be looking to find a # 2 centre? 1. Petey  2. ___ 3. ___ 4. Lazar--  Aman

Trade Miller get best deal you can and move on.. 

this is why canuck fans won't  accept  a rebuild.

[MrCanuck94]

4 hours ago, wildcam said:

OMG, you can never move both Miller and Horvat?? Finding top centre men are as hard as finding RD men.. Vancouver would then be looking to find a # 2 centre? 1. Petey  2. ___ 3. ___ 4. Lazar--  Aman

Trade Miller get best deal you can and move on.. 

If we trade Miller and Horvat, we would likely be able to draft a 1C in the first round. This is a very deep draft and those trades would likely give us multiple first round picks.

 

It's the perfect time to move on from those pieces.

Edited November 13, 2022 by MrCanuck94

[JustABandwagoner]

5 hours ago, smithers joe said:

i like that trade. would LA?

Nope

[JustABandwagoner]

5 hours ago, dm_ranger said:

Miller isn't playing center for us right now.  Do you think other teams see him as a second line center?  Trade might work but I think any trade with Miller we will be lucky to get $0.75 on the dollar for him.

I'd be willing to give him away for free. Just entirely reset this team. 

[wildcam]

3 hours ago, spook007 said:

Yes, but are we expecting to challenge in the next 2-3 years?

If not, it doesn't really matter, does it? if its more than 3 years then Bo will be 32-33 and Miller 33-34, so this is probably the time to take stock, about witch direction we are going to take...

 

I don't like to tear it down neither, but its hard to watch this team struggle like this, and then another step forward followed by a step back... going nowhere...

 

If they think they can be competitive and really want to move one of those two players, it has to be Miller all day long... Bo may not be a no.1 (although atm he plays like one), but he is a good 2nd line C, and we have nobody to replace him.

 

Breaking it totally down now, will give us good opportunities to start the rebuild with a class draft (as per 'experts')... and in 3-4 years they should become relevant again. Draisaitl and McD were drafted in 14 and 15 so that give a kind of a time frame for when draftees should be able to carry a team... so likely 5-6 years from their are drafted, maybe less if surrounded by good players, but most likely 5-6 to be consistently expected to make the play offs...

 

So what to do.... the next McD is probably the top prize, or carry on hoping for players to improve enough to get us into the playoffs. Love the players...always have and always will, but losing sucks...

I think Vancouver will be in trouble if they try full rebuild.. Have to do rebuilds like Jeff Gordon can do..This guy knows how to build teams look how he drafted and built NYR..Now he will do the same with Montreal...

Drafting in top 10 is a lottery.. Hieschier 1st O/A -- Petey #5 -- Bayfield #2 O/A  other players drafted later are doing much better..

Turcotte #5 - No NHL impact -- Cozen #7 okay -- Zegras #9 Star

I don't think Petey will resign if he knows Vancouver in having rebuild.. Then team will be at bottom of standings as other poster have already said trade Miller and Horvat.. 

This would be a mess for many years...

Trade 1 - Miller or Horvat -- Hope to get younger RD under 26 say # 3 RD can play 18--22 mins -- ( Prospect -- 2nd round pick)

trade  1 - Boeser  or Garland  -- Stay at home D man guy that can play 18--20 mins,  under 27

Get some good D men will make a big difference

[spook007]

15 hours ago, wildcam said:

I think Vancouver will be in trouble if they try full rebuild.. Have to do rebuilds like Jeff Gordon can do..This guy knows how to build teams look how he drafted and built NYR..Now he will do the same with Montreal...

Drafting in top 10 is a lottery.. Hieschier 1st O/A -- Petey #5 -- Bayfield #2 O/A  other players drafted later are doing much better..

Turcotte #5 - No NHL impact -- Cozen #7 okay -- Zegras #9 Star

I don't think Petey will resign if he knows Vancouver in having rebuild.. Then team will be at bottom of standings as other poster have already said trade Miller and Horvat.. 

This would be a mess for many years...

Trade 1 - Miller or Horvat -- Hope to get younger RD under 26 say # 3 RD can play 18--22 mins -- ( Prospect -- 2nd round pick)

trade  1 - Boeser  or Garland  -- Stay at home D man guy that can play 18--20 mins,  under 27

Get some good D men will make a big difference

Firstly as for building through the draft, yes its a lottery... I totally agree, and this is one of the reasons, I never liked the idea of tanking, and yes you never know if a better player comes along later... + we would likely never win the draft anyway.

In saying that, drafting at the top of the table does give you the best odds of getting a star player, and regularly a superstar player... 

 

This year there are at least 3 players at the top that could be 1OA in other years, and this year 1 of them has the potential to be the next In the Crosby, McD line...

Sucking this year may finally give us this superstar 1st line player we need, and a couple of trades will give us the foundation to build something good from.

 

I've been thinking about Pettersson as well... I think you are right, and that there's a good chance Petey will look elsewhere, if we start a total rebuild. However, with the way its going now, my question would be, why would he hang around for team maybe only slightly better?

 

I'm not so sure trading Miller and Boeser is enough to make this team able to compete... properly compete.

Miller is tied to a contract, and even though they may be able to move him, it won't be for a kings ransom. 

Boeser, is tied to a contract as well, and its not looking good for him atm...

 

Myers, will possibly be gone by TDL to a contender, so we would need 2 RHD (Myers doesn't fit this team)... And we still don't look like a contender to me, at least, so I think sacrificing a little more if possible, to get a better draft position would beneficial long term.

 

As @aGENTsaid in another post, this time of the year, trades are hard to make, so it won't be easy, but I for one, would be disappointed to be picking in the same range as last year 10-16th in a year, where the prices are so good. 

 

Maybe the remaining can carry the load for 2-3 seasons, while or draft picks gets settled, but I have been hoping for that since 2014, and must admit, I'm losing faith in that happening... 

[DownUndaCanuck]

Miller is hovering around a point per game, around a 40 goal pace, but a -9 which isn't attractive. I don't think we can get too much for him these days, especially with an 8M contract.

 

The Kings have Doughty locked down forever, Durzi and Clarke coming in through on RD so really have no space in the future for Roy or Walker. Roy is the better RD there, big, strong, still relatively young and could really complement Hughes or OEL well. He's on a 3.1M deal for 2 more years.

 

I'd do Miller for Roy + 1st in a heart beat but the Kings would need to free up 5M in cap space. Quick is on a 5.8M deal so is the only piece going back which makes sense.

The big problem is that the Kings have a lot of young guys who are going to need to be extended soon, but Kopitar is coming off the books in a couple of years.

 

Miller for Roy + 1st + Quick makes a lot of sense. If Quick's really just a cap dump they should add in an extra pick but probably won't. 

 

Why LA do this? They get a 40 goal scorer, 80-90 point player to really boost their team. On defence they literally don't miss Roy at all and at this rate they'll be a top-3 Pacific team so that 1st rounder is probably going to be mid to late. They made a big move for Fiala but Byfield is still ways off and Kopitar is slowing down, Miller in his prime really bridges the gap nicely and makes them a contender. Danault has been good but having Miller, an older Kopitar, Danault and Byfield as their centers lets them matchup nicely against the playoff teams. 

[R3aL]

5 hours ago, DownUndaCanuck said:

Miller is hovering around a point per game, around a 40 goal pace, but a -9 which isn't attractive. I don't think we can get too much for him these days, especially with an 8M contract.

 

The Kings have Doughty locked down forever, Durzi and Clarke coming in through on RD so really have no space in the future for Roy or Walker. Roy is the better RD there, big, strong, still relatively young and could really complement Hughes or OEL well. He's on a 3.1M deal for 2 more years.

 

I'd do Miller for Roy + 1st in a heart beat but the Kings would need to free up 5M in cap space. Quick is on a 5.8M deal so is the only piece going back which makes sense.

The big problem is that the Kings have a lot of young guys who are going to need to be extended soon, but Kopitar is coming off the books in a couple of years.

 

Miller for Roy + 1st + Quick makes a lot of sense. If Quick's really just a cap dump they should add in an extra pick but probably won't. 

 

Why LA do this? They get a 40 goal scorer, 80-90 point player to really boost their team. On defence they literally don't miss Roy at all and at this rate they'll be a top-3 Pacific team so that 1st rounder is probably going to be mid to late. They made a big move for Fiala but Byfield is still ways off and Kopitar is slowing down, Miller in his prime really bridges the gap nicely and makes them a contender. Danault has been good but having Miller, an older Kopitar, Danault and Byfield as their centers lets them matchup nicely against the playoff teams. 

I don’t think LA Will want to trade Roy at all. He’s like low key really good. And getting better. Established as a top 4 RD for less than $4 million.

 

I would do that deal in a heartbeat miller for Roy and a 1st and any cap dump, as long as the dos ain’t too long 

 

but can’t see them doing it

[204CanucksFan]

On 11/13/2022 at 10:31 AM, dm_ranger said:

Miller isn't playing center for us right now.  Do you think other teams see him as a second line center?  Trade might work but I think any trade with Miller we will be lucky to get $0.75 on the dollar for him.

 

On 11/13/2022 at 4:07 PM, Tank4Bedard said:

I'd be willing to give him away for free. Just entirely reset this team. 

Ok, I hate the Miller extension as much as many here. I was praying they'd move him at the last TDL for a quality return but that never happened. But can we please stop pretending that JT has little to no trade value, even with the extension due next year.

 

Miller is still a PPG player for us this year, as he has been for the past 3 seasons since coming here, so consistency isn't an issue. Despite not playing a ton of center this season he is still 4th on the team in faceoffs taken and 2nd in faceoff %. He is also tied for 7th in the league in goals and one of only 14 players with double digit goals so far this season. He is also 12th in the league in points since joining the Canucks, better than a lot of players making more money than his extension.

 

Yes, his defensive play as a center is atrocious but he is also still playing a hard, physical game for us, being 2nd on the team in hits and 1st among our forwards.

 

Yes, the extension makes him more difficult to trade but he is still very much a valuable trade piece, even at $8 mil, that any team would love to add if the cap could work.

 

Edited November 16, 2022 by 204CanucksFan

[dm_ranger]

1 hour ago, 204CanucksFan said:

 

Ok, I hate the Miller extension as much as many here. I was praying they'd move him at the last TDL for a quality return but that never happened. But can we please stop pretending that JT has little to no trade value, even with the extension due next year.

 

Miller is still a PPG player for us this year, as he has been for the past 3 seasons since coming here, so consistency isn't an issue. Despite not playing a ton of center this season he is still 4th on the team in faceoffs taken and 2nd in faceoff %. He is also tied for 7th in the league in goals and one of only 14 players with double digit goals so far this season. He is also 12th in the league in points since joining the Canucks, better than a lot of players making more money than his extension.

 

Yes, his defensive play as a center is atrocious but he is also still playing a hard, physical game for us, being 2nd on the team in hits and 1st among our forwards.

 

Yes, the extension makes him more difficult to trade but he is still very much a valuable trade piece, even at $8 mil, that any team would love to add if the cap could work.

 

I agree that he has value and I am not saying give him away, I just think the contract is a hard sell and so we can't expect the large haul we might get if he was still a UFA at the end of this season as a rental.  Valuable yes.  Would most teams want him?  Yes.  But I think 'maximum return' for him is a lot less than people seem to expect on this forum. Hence .75 on the dollar and not free.