[PGT] Vancouver Canucks at Boston Bruins | Nov. 13, 2022

[bishopshodan]

Smells like we are still talking about the centres.

 

They're not the biggest problem on the team, not even close.

 

I wonder though, as we look to be not going all in, if Bo wants to be here.

Will he have the stomach for a rebuild? more years of losing....he's endured a lot of that. 

 

[Hairy Kneel]

13 hours ago, Jaimito said:

 

 

This year we are being led by Alvin and JR

[AnthonyG]

11 minutes ago, gurn said:

Anyone have a breakdown of Miller's plus minus?

Seems he gets his minus games when he plays center, and gets pluses when he plays wing with Bo.

Miller has primarily played wing this season. Hardly taken any faceoffs. Petey on the other hand….. is brutal in the faceoffs and they really need to swap him and Miller around.

[stawns]

4 minutes ago, AnthonyG said:

Miller has primarily played wing this season. Hardly taken any faceoffs. Petey on the other hand….. is brutal in the faceoffs and they really need to swap him and Miller around.

Nope

[aliboy]

4 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:

I wonder though, as we look to be not going all in, if Bo wants to be here.

Will he have the stomach for a rebuild? more years of losing....he's endured a lot of that. 

 

This is my thinking, he may have had enough, he has been a beast of burden. One good season and he's looking at multiple offers from quite a few teams, I would think.

[Harold Drunken]

33 minutes ago, stawns said:

He spends to the cap, spares no expense and gives the team a ton of support.  I think fans are a little spoiled and entitled and don't realize what a bad owner is actually like

Yes, he does spend to the cap every year. But also has never allowed a proper rebuild like the vast majority of current contenders have done. What does this tell you? An owner who spends to the cap every year, gives direction to GM's that it's playoffs or bust, so that GM trades picks and futures for players to help this team "hopefully play meaningful games in March" =  playoff revenue > contending for a cup. Which in turn causes this team to finish middle of the pack/bottom 3rd, picking outside of the top 5, never having enough cap room to improve the team significantly.  This leads to a never ending cycle of mediocrity....the proof is in the pudding with the on ice product the better part of the last decade. It's painfully obvious. OF COURSE ownership it partly to blame, and they have done anything but "spoil" their loyal fans. To say Canucks fans are spoiled is a pretty crazy statement haha.

 

Just because Aquilini spends money doesn't automatically mean he's a good owner, that's flawed logic. You have to look at the reason he spends it. 

 

 

Edited November 14, 2022 by Harold Drunken

[grandmaster]

17 minutes ago, stawns said:

Miller puts in the effort when he feels like it

I’m not going to say that he puts in 100% effort all the time. No one on the team does that. He sure as hell put in way more effort than what Messier did. 

[Harold Drunken]

28 minutes ago, stawns said:

Not only that a "tear down", the way people are using it here, is a myth.......4 big moves is about as "tear down" as any team goes.  What many are clamouring for here would set the org back decades.........that's never going to happen.

 

Nor does it need to

Rebuilds take decades???? So...20..30 years? That's quite the timeline you whipped up there. 

 

Edited November 14, 2022 by Harold Drunken

[Maniwaki Canuck]

2 hours ago, IBatch said:

Yep.  Yeo?   Was he hired in case Bruce's team flopped?   Yeo was always a head scratcher ... but he's not a head scratcher if Bruce gets fired and Yeo takes over.   A rebuild patsy.  

Yeo would be a scorched earth policy:  there would be no trouble with no-trade clauses with that guy in charge.

[Gurn]

16 minutes ago, AnthonyG said:

Miller has primarily played wing this season. Hardly taken any faceoffs. Petey on the other hand….. is brutal in the faceoffs and they really need to swap him and Miller around.

iirc Miller started the season as a center and was on the ice for the first 7 or 8 goals against?

Then went onto Bo's wing, and was put back a center for the last few games; where he has picked up a minus 2 in back to back games.?

[JM_]

15 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:

Smells like we are still talking about the centres.

 

They're not the biggest problem on the team, not even close.

 

I wonder though, as we look to be not going all in, if Bo wants to be here.

Will he have the stomach for a rebuild? more years of losing....he's endured a lot of that. 

 

I certainly can't blame him if he's done here. Dude's in his prime, and he's given his all to this team though some pretty crap years. And he was even willing to sign here again.

 

I don't think anything happens before the end of this road trip, in part because I don't think they want to overshadow this week for the Sedins, but I suspect we end up 1/5 and then there's two days off. If there was a time for something major prior to the TDL its then.

 

[CanucksJay]

22 minutes ago, AnthonyG said:

Aaron Rome literally put a guy on a stretcher… Raffi Torres, Rick Rypien RIP, Bieksa, Kesler, Tanner Glass.. We’ve had plenty of snarl over the years.

We tried with Dorsett to keep that going, unfortunately he had a career ending surgery, then we tried with Ferland and he had concussion issues.. JT Miller has some snarl, Podz was dropping the mitts, Pearson has dropped the mitts a few times… I dont think this team is that soft. Plus Myers has a mean side to him. They brought in Joshua for this reason, but he hasnt really shown much of it.

 

Willing to drop the mitts vs beating someone up is completely different. 

If a weakling wanted to fight me, I'd have zero issues and I wouldn't be deterred from acting the way I normally do. On the other hand if a 230 lb guy who was jacked wanted to fight me, pretty sure I'd be on better behavior. 

We don't scare anyone

Theres not a single person in the lineup that I'd be scared of in a fight. 

Maybe Schenn and Burroughs. 

Pearson might beat me up but it probably wouldn't hurt as much lol. 

[Goal:thecup]

12 hours ago, R3aL said:

I thought he battled hard and moved the puck well. Especially with Horvat. 
 

problem for him is he doesn’t have a shot on top of the lack of size 

 

and his last - was net front at the end of the game.

 

horvat and miller and him on for both even goals against. 

Also, and I really admire his grit, but Garland is a very slow skater, he cannot catch anyone or stay ahead of anyone.

I think he just looks fast cuz he is so short and his legs are going like crazy.

He has some good moves, but he is another little guy and imo we have too many little guys.

[EddieVedder]

13 minutes ago, gurn said:

iirc Miller started the season as a center and was on the ice for the first 7 or 8 goals against?

Then went onto Bo's wing, and was put back a center for the last few games; where he has picked up a minus 2 in back to back games.?

Also as bb6 as his rwer. Bo coincidence.  Last night petey was invisible, with bb6 on his rw.  No coincidence.  

Leave miller at wing.  Get rid of bb6 fast.

[CanucksJay]

5 minutes ago, JM_ said:

I certainly can't blame him if he's done here. Dude's in his prime, and he's given his all to this team though some pretty crap years. And he was even willing to sign here again.

 

I don't think anything happens before the end of this road trip, in part because I don't think they want to overshadow this week for the Sedins, but I suspect we end up 1/5 and then there's two days off. If there was a time for something major prior to the TDL its then.

 

At this point, I think we need to sell anyone over 23 years of age. 

A quick rebuild could be as little as 3 years when we are starting the rebuild with Quinn, Petey, Podz, Hogz, Karlsson, Lekkermaki, Klimovich, Rathbone, 

Keep a couple of guys like Schenn, Burroughs, Joshua and perhaps even add more toughness to protect the youth. 

 

The assets we can get from

Miller, Bo, Pearson, Garland, Mikheyev, Kuz, Boeser, OEL, Myers, Demko plus our own draft picks should be able to rebuild pretty quickly. 

 

The team actually has good players but the mix for whatever reason isn't working. I think not only do we have a solid group of youth to start a rebuild but we also have valuable assets to trade. 

 

I would hire a capologist to carefully plan out how we structure trades and future contracts to maximize cap space and trade value. 

I would retain cap on any players that have 3 years or less remaining on contracts to make them extremely attractive. We don't need cap space for 3 years. 

I would then use some of the returning assets from these trades to package the longer term contracts like Miller and OEL, to make those look better and to maximize the return on those deals. 

As long as ownership isn't fixated on winning now, we have the bones for quite an awesome rebuild. 

 

 

[stawns]

12 hours ago, Coconuts said:

I think Miller's best years would be wasted during a rebuild, I reckon he's maybe got three more years of top end production. Maybe lesser production depending on who's moved out, what roles x players have to fit, ect. I also want assets, even if it's just our freeing up cap space sooner because at least then we could weaponize it and take on shorter team headache contracts for picks and prospects. 

 

Horvat has to want to stay, I know he's loyal but I question whether he will. I don't see him choosing to leave as disloyalty, hockey's a business and I don't begrudge guys wanting to win. In the end it comes down to what he wants. 

 

If we're rebuilding I think we're better off selling off our older top assets, I don't see us being a playoff team sooner than later, let alone a contender. I don't want to carry on our history of holding on to assets too long. Look at the trades Montreal's made within the last year, now that's a team that's got it's eyes on the future. And they're still young and exciting to boot. https://www.capfriendly.com/trades/canadiens

 

I just don't see a short-term turnaround, and Bedard isn't a guarantee. The thing about rebuilds is once you've committed you've gotta stay the course because there are no guarantees, but at least there'd be a direction. 

 

As for Boston, they've still lead by the old bones we played in the final, who've gone on to what.. two finals since? I didn't see them having this kind of start, it's tough to explain, but they're doing something right. 

I can see a path to a quick turnaround if they're smart.

[JM_]

1 minute ago, CanucksJay said:

At this point, I think we need to sell anyone over 23 years of age. 

A quick rebuild could be as little as 3 years when we are starting the rebuild with Quinn, Petey, Podz, Hogz, Karlsson, Lekkermaki, Klimovich, Rathbone, 

Keep a couple of guys like Schenn, Burroughs, Joshua and perhaps even add more toughness to protect the youth. 

I think I'd be open to offers on Petey and Hughes as well, if someone shows up with a fat offer too good to pass up I'd do that as well. But if we can pull off the tear down and still have them thats great too. 

 

 

1 minute ago, CanucksJay said:

The assets we can get from

Miller, Bo, Pearson, Garland, Mikheyev, Kuz, Boeser, OEL, Myers, Demko plus our own draft picks should be able to rebuild pretty quickly. 

apparently we can retain 1/2 of Millers last year (at least thats what people seem to be saying) before the extension kicks in. I do think he is movable, I just don't expect more than a late 1st for him.

 

Bo should be the biggest piece, I think we're looking at the classic 1st, roster and prospect type deal there.

 

Kuzmenko is a found wallet.

 

We probably have to retain 1/2 on Myers, but at 3 mil for 2 years he should draw interest. 

 

Boeser is the real wildcard to me, we may just need to accept a pretty low return there.

 

1 minute ago, CanucksJay said:

The team actually has good players but the mix for whatever reason isn't working. I think not only do we have a solid group of youth to start a rebuild but we also have valuable assets to trade. 

 

I would hire a capologist to carefully plan out how we structure trades and future contracts to maximize cap space and trade value. 

I would retain cap on any players that have 3 years or less remaining on contracts to make them extremely attractive. We don't need cap space for 3 years. 

I would then use some of the returning assets from these trades to package the longer term contracts like Miller and OEL, to make those look better and to maximize the return on those deals. 

As long as ownership isn't fixated on winning now, we have the bones for quite an awesome rebuild. 

 

 

We do have a good capologist now, she did a great job this year getting us to max cap.

 

 

[MaxVerstappen33]

12 minutes ago, Goal:thecup said:

Also, and I really admire his grit, but Garland is a very slow skater, he cannot catch anyone or stay ahead of anyone.

I think he just looks fast cuz he is so short and his legs are going like crazy.

He has some good moves, but he is another little guy and imo we have too many little guys.

A package with Horvat and Garlund would be money for a win now team. 

[JM_]

2 minutes ago, MaxVerstappen33 said:

A package with Horvat and Garlund would be money for a win now team. 

put that on the Leafs and they might have a chance of getting out of the 1st round. 

[AnthonyG]

29 minutes ago, gurn said:

iirc Miller started the season as a center and was on the ice for the first 7 or 8 goals against?

Then went onto Bo's wing, and was put back a center for the last few games; where he has picked up a minus 2 in back to back games.?

Miller wasnt C yesterday Petey was. Petey Miller and Horvat took draws on saturday. They need to just stick to Miller at C. Petey cant win faceoffs and faceoffs and possession go hand in hand. Miller wins more draws.