(Rumour) 4 teams interested in J.T. Miller

[Ted Lasso]

20 minutes ago, CanuckFan1123 said:

This thread is all ridiculous. 
 

1. we traded Bo basically to keep JT so I don’t understand why there is even a discussion still. 
 

2. why are we retaining 1.5 yearly on a deal that hasn’t even started yet that management made sure they got done so the player wouldn’t be considered trade bait anymore? 
 

3. why are we considering retaining 1.5 mil on an 8 year deal of a player we just signed about 6 months ago? 
 

4. why do people still genuinely think JT is getting moved? Why are we trying to “get out” of a contract that we worked hard to make sure we got done before it was too late? 
 

 

It is getting beyond ridiculous.

 

7 minutes ago, HorvatToBaertschi said:

Miller is a Canuck for life unless somebody massively overpays. His contract is fine, and although it doesn't align perfectly with our eventual cup run, he will be a vital part of the retool. If it goes well, and we start making runs in 3-4 years (probably optimistic but Pettersson Hughes and Demko are quite competitive), Miller will be a strong leader during the playoffs. Hopefully over time, some of his leadership, character and grit will rub off on our younger players; Podkolzin, Klimovich, Raty and co. 

 

Fact of the matter is that we kept the better player, for a better price, for less term. 

well said

[86Viking]

I have seen some Carolina fans say that JK has been playing better since December. He had a very slow start so his numbers look worse but I can't remember exactly but something like since Dec 1st JK has been playing at a 60pt pace or something. 

 

IF JT is moved for JK, I would still want at least something like Morrow or Suzuki and a 2024 2nd or something to off set the ppg JT is at and the potential of JK given he is still relatively young

[Ted Lasso]

44 minutes ago, aGENT said:

He's not. He'd (or a guy like Compher or Haula etc) be a cheap, short term stop gap until guys like Kotkaniemi, Raty, or our soon to be top 5 drafted C are ready to compete for that spot. Then you slide those guys down the lineup and/or flip them for more assets.

 

He's a 22 year old, high drafted, 0.5ppg C with size and a solid 2 way game that has nowhere to go but up and will likely be outproducing Miller in 4 years when the rest of the team is actually competitive.

 

Y'all need to stop fantasizing that this poorly constructed team with numerous contract that need to tick off, is going to be competing in deep playoff runs next year. This team won't START to be competitive for another couple years. And by the time it is, that's what 3C will be making, with a rising cap.

 

In the interim, it clears $3+m, adds assets and builds towards that future.

Literally no one thinks we’ll go on a deep playoff run. 
 

Y’all need to stop fantasizing Miller will be traded. It will push our competitive window out further

[Gawdzukes]

47 minutes ago, aGENT said:

He's not. He'd (or a guy like Compher or Haula etc) be a cheap, short term stop gap until guys like Kotkaniemi, Raty, or our soon to be top 5 drafted C are ready to compete for that spot. Then you slide those guys down the lineup and/or flip them for more assets.

 

He's a 22 year old, high drafted, 0.5ppg C with size and a solid 2 way game that has nowhere to go but up and will likely be outproducing Miller in 4 years when the rest of the team is actually competitive.

 

Y'all need to stop fantasizing that this poorly constructed team with numerous contract that need to tick off, is going to be competing in deep playoff runs next year. This team won't START to be competitive for another couple years. And by the time it is, that's what 3C will be making, with a rising cap.

 

In the interim, it clears $3+m, adds assets and builds towards that future.

Some people seem hellbent on trying to make this broken bones team compete. I consider that view simply impatience. That's what we've been doing for 5 years and it obviously isn't working. How people can't see that is beyond me. There are a bunch of concerns that need to be addressed and a lot of obstacles in the way. Miller being gone would help with that. Can we complete with him eventually? Possibly but it has a small window of opportunity and a bunch of future events need to fall into place. It's getting very tiresome to watch this approach fail time after time.

[Hairy Kneel]

5 minutes ago, Gawdzukes said:

Some people seem hellbent on trying to make this broken bones team compete. I consider that view simply impatience. That's what we've been doing for 5 years and it obviously isn't working. How people can't see that is beyond me. There are a bunch of concerns that need to be addressed and a lot of obstacles in the way. Miller being gone would help with that. Can we complete with him eventually? Possibly but it has a small window of opportunity and a bunch of future events need to fall into place. It's getting very tiresome to watch this approach fail time after time.

Keeping JT when we don't have defense is not a good plan for the playoffs. We cannot score our way out of losses. Especially in the playoffs. 

[jyu]

39 minutes ago, HorvatToBaertschi said:

Miller is a Canuck for life unless somebody massively overpays. His contract is fine, and although it doesn't align perfectly with our eventual cup run, he will be a vital part of the retool. If it goes well, and we start making runs in 3-4 years (probably optimistic but Pettersson Hughes and Demko are quite competitive), Miller will be a strong leader during the playoffs. Hopefully over time, some of his leadership, character and grit will rub off on our younger players; Podkolzin, Klimovich, Raty and co. 

 

Fact of the matter is that we kept the better player, for a better price, for less term. 

I'd agree that he is likely a Canuck for life unless somebody massively overpays -- which is highly unlikely so yes, he is a Canuck for life. 

 

I'm not sure if we kept the better player, but we definitely kept a more offensively minded player who has tendency to turn the puck over at critical moments in the game and also 2 years older. Better price (0.5 mil) and less term (1 year less)... not sure if that makes much of a difference.

 

The fact of the matter is that we had to trade one and get the best haul we can. And that's what happened.

 

We will see how Miller does under Tocchet. I like Miller's versatility to play winger/center so when we have a new top 6 center, Miller can eventually shift over to wing and still help the team. 

 

Age related decline is a huge concern though. When we are competitive, say 2-3 years later, he will be 32-33 with 4-5 years left on the contract. It has a chance to be Loui Eriksson all over again and remember how desperate people were on here to get rid of Loui? At this point, all we can do is pray that Miller doesn't experience sharp decline but a gradual decline and play well into mid 30's.

 

[CanuckFan1123]

46 minutes ago, stawns said:

Considering vintage is posting updates of miller chatter, fair to say it's still relevant, no?

Personally I don’t think there’s much to it and it seems like media just stirring the pot but I’m open to discussing it if a legitimate rumor of a deal happening comes along. 
 

I just think the commentary from fans is out of control. It seems like 80% of our fan base hates JT and can’t get over the fact that he got an extension, despite the fact that he had one of the best seasons in team history last year and was a total fan favorite. I know this year has been a struggle but it has also been for most of the team. 
 

On top of it you have the fans wanting to retain money on him in a trade or send him as a cap dump. I just think our fans are kind of dumb sometimes, if I’m being totally honest. 

[HorvatToBaertschi]

18 minutes ago, jyu said:

I'd agree that he is likely a Canuck for life unless somebody massively overpays -- which is highly unlikely so yes, he is a Canuck for life. 

 

I'm not sure if we kept the better player, but we definitely kept a more offensively minded player who has tendency to turn the puck over at critical moments in the game and also 2 years older. Better price (0.5 mil) and less term (1 year less)... not sure if that makes much of a difference.

 

The fact of the matter is that we had to trade one and get the best haul we can. And that's what happened.

 

We will see how Miller does under Tocchet. I like Miller's versatility to play winger/center so when we have a new top 6 center, Miller can eventually shift over to wing and still help the team. 

 

Age related decline is a huge concern though. When we are competitive, say 2-3 years later, he will be 32-33 with 4-5 years left on the contract. It has a chance to be Loui Eriksson all over again and remember how desperate people were on here to get rid of Loui? At this point, all we can do is pray that Miller doesn't experience sharp decline but a gradual decline and play well into mid 30's.

 

I mean, we can dive deep into it if you want, but Miller is statistically the better defensive player. 

[Ted Lasso]

16 minutes ago, CanuckFan1123 said:

Personally I don’t think there’s much to it and it seems like media just stirring the pot but I’m open to discussing it if a legitimate rumor of a deal happening comes along. 
 

I just think the commentary from fans is out of control. It seems like 80% of our fan base hates JT and can’t get over the fact that he got an extension, despite the fact that he had one of the best seasons in team history last year and was a total fan favorite. I know this year has been a struggle but it has also been for most of the team. 
 

On top of it you have the fans wanting to retain money on him in a trade or send him as a cap dump. I just think our fans are kind of dumb sometimes, if I’m being totally honest. 

[LegionOfDoom]

16 minutes ago, CanuckFan1123 said:

Personally I don’t think there’s much to it and it seems like media just stirring the pot but I’m open to discussing it if a legitimate rumor of a deal happening comes along. 
 

I just think the commentary from fans is out of control. It seems like 80% of our fan base hates JT and can’t get over the fact that he got an extension, despite the fact that he had one of the best seasons in team history last year and was a total fan favorite. I know this year has been a struggle but it has also been for most of the team. 
 

On top of it you have the fans wanting to retain money on him in a trade or send him as a cap dump. I just think our fans are kind of dumb sometimes, if I’m being totally honest. 

Especially as he’s been one of the better defensive players since tocchets arrival, all the haters kept bringing up how he’s a defensive liability but In Reality it looks like he just quit playing for Bruce and looks rejuvenated under a coach that stresses structure 

[ilduce39]

1 hour ago, .Naslund said:

Even when Kotkaniemi was drafted people were saying it was a reach. Getting fixated on draft status is what gets people to overpay for poor assets. Even when he signed that offer sheet Montreal were like “take him”.  

Kotkaniemi comes up not because he’s a target but because it makes the trade make sense.

Carolina gets the win-now player and we get a future-oriented player who can probably slot in at 3C on our team and save about 3 mil in cap. Carolina then adds to pay for the upgrade.

 

People could just post “Miller for Morrow and a 1st!” But why on earth would Carolina do that?  
 

At least by exchanging Kotkaniemi they’re buying 2-3 years of a clear upgrade on their contention window for only adding 3 mil in cap. They’d still have room to add in other areas as well. 
 

Kotkaniemi isn’t on a good contact either but it saves us some room and fits with the “young guys who haven’t fully worked out” that we’re targeting.  Also, after moving Bo and Miller it’d be tough to roll Dries out as 2C.  
 

It’s not perfect but if it comes with a 1st or Morrow it’s a nice bet and aligns the ages of our core players a lot more nicely.

[SilentSam]

1 hour ago, stawns said:

Agreed, but they won't get the assets they'd have gotten last tdl or draft

….   Here we go again,.
 

 

[ToTellTheTruth]

16 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said:

JR knows what the number is going to be.  He knows it isn't going to be $9 or even $10 million.  We are talking about locking up our superstar, future captain, who is on pace for over 100 points and may be a Selke nominee next year.  Barzal is definitely not the comparable for Petey.  His numbers are closer to MacKinnon then they are to Barzal.  What did MacKinnon sign for?

 

I think the guy they should have locked up long term is Petey not Hughes.  We probably could have had him for the BO contract.  Instead, we may need to pay him the MacKinnon contract now...

Have to trade Miler to have enough cap space, remember they are over now.

MacKinnon signed for less because he is already on a winning team, Petey is not.

If as a lot of post here suggest the cap goes up then Pettersson is likely to sign a short term contract, that might be what is out there for awhile to maximize a player's earning power.

Pettersson could easily go the way of Dubois as far as contracts go. His next might be just two years taking him to FA status, that might be a challenge to the Canucks to prove the team is improving rather than the lip service he has been given in has career so far. A two year deal also matches Kuzmenko's deal.

One poster suggested keeping Miller until a 2C is found. Get cap space, get more trade assets, trade for one.

There is one part of Miller's game that is a surety, he will decline and that may have started already.

[stawns]

35 minutes ago, CanuckFan1123 said:

Personally I don’t think there’s much to it and it seems like media just stirring the pot but I’m open to discussing it if a legitimate rumor of a deal happening comes along. 
 

I just think the commentary from fans is out of control. It seems like 80% of our fan base hates JT and can’t get over the fact that he got an extension, despite the fact that he had one of the best seasons in team history last year and was a total fan favorite. I know this year has been a struggle but it has also been for most of the team. 
 

On top of it you have the fans wanting to retain money on him in a trade or send him as a cap dump. I just think our fans are kind of dumb sometimes, if I’m being totally honest. 

I actually haven't seen a single person who hates miller

[stawns]

43 minutes ago, CanuckFan1123 said:

Personally I don’t think there’s much to it and it seems like media just stirring the pot but I’m open to discussing it if a legitimate rumor of a deal happening comes along. 
 

I just think the commentary from fans is out of control. It seems like 80% of our fan base hates JT and can’t get over the fact that he got an extension, despite the fact that he had one of the best seasons in team history last year and was a total fan favorite. I know this year has been a struggle but it has also been for most of the team. 
 

On top of it you have the fans wanting to retain money on him in a trade or send him as a cap dump. I just think our fans are kind of dumb sometimes, if I’m being totally honest. 

Of course there's going to be chatter and speculation, this is the last chance gas on miller and there's obviously interest in him 

[Kobayashi Maru]

6 minutes ago, ilduce39 said:

Kotkaniemi comes up not because he’s a target but because it makes the trade make sense.

Carolina gets the win-now player and we get a future-oriented player who can probably slot in at 3C on our team and save about 3 mil in cap. Carolina then adds to pay for the upgrade.

 

People could just post “Miller for Morrow and a 1st!” But why on earth would Carolina do that?  
 

At least by exchanging Kotkaniemi they’re buying 2-3 years of a clear upgrade on their contention window for only adding 3 mil in cap. They’d still have room to add in other areas as well. 
 

Kotkaniemi isn’t on a good contact either but it saves us some room and fits with the “young guys who haven’t fully worked out” that we’re targeting.  Also, after moving Bo and Miller it’d be tough to roll Dries out as 2C.  
 

It’s not perfect but if it comes with a 1st or Morrow it’s a nice bet and aligns the ages of our core players a lot more nicely.

This is exactly it, and why this is the only move that makes sense for both teams.  Carolina is in their window now and Miller will augment that core for the next few years.  Kotkaniemi is still a bit of a project and Morrow is still a year away.  That aligns with our timeline as our team needs some major surgery and that means acquiring many players so that we can determine who is part of that next core as they develop.

 

If Kotkaniemi doesn't improve and stays as a 3C, he will be worth his salary in a few years as the cap goes up.  If he becomes a 2C in a new environment then he is an absolute steal of a contract.  He has the foundational 2 way C ability and if he progresses on the offensive side based on his skill then we are even better.  The cap savings between him and Miller also gives us the ability to retain on contracts to get rid of, while filling needed gaps in our lineup.  Morrow is the exact type of player we need in the system and he has a high likelihood of being an NHL player and maybe even an impact RD.  If we get him, sign Livingstone and draft another RD, all of a sudden our situation improves incredibly from where we are at today.

 

This deal is literally perfect for both sides, and is completely based on the timing of both clubs.  I have been proposing this one the whole time and I would love to see it actually happen.

[The Lock]

49 minutes ago, CanuckFan1123 said:

Personally I don’t think there’s much to it and it seems like media just stirring the pot but I’m open to discussing it if a legitimate rumor of a deal happening comes along. 
 

I just think the commentary from fans is out of control. It seems like 80% of our fan base hates JT and can’t get over the fact that he got an extension, despite the fact that he had one of the best seasons in team history last year and was a total fan favorite. I know this year has been a struggle but it has also been for most of the team. 
 

On top of it you have the fans wanting to retain money on him in a trade or send him as a cap dump. I just think our fans are kind of dumb sometimes, if I’m being totally honest. 

Until the trade deadline happens, there's no point in ignoring anything in my opinion. I think rumours should be open to discussion no matter if they are look plausible or not.

 

Also, are you associating "hate" with a trade proposal? Just because someone proposes a trade or says we should trade Miller, it does not mean people hate Miller. Just because people are unhappy about Miller's contract, it does not mean they hate Miller. Those are 2 different ideas entirely. You can be happy with one idea while hating the other.

 

If you want to see hate, look at the Islanders Horvat signing thread and tell me if that sounds like what's happening here. Horvat's a player who gave us his all here and people have been dumping on him as if he were Messier. It's rather sickening and my perception of a few people on this forum really took a nose dive from that thread.

 

Anyway, I don't think a trade will happen although I do think his salary's potentially not aging well already 1 year in; however, if that means I "hate" Miller to someone else... I hope you don't get judged the same way when you have an opinion....

Edited February 21, 2023 by The Lock

[SilentSam]

44 minutes ago, jyu said:

I'd agree that he is likely a Canuck for life unless somebody massively overpays -- which is highly unlikely so yes, he is a Canuck for life. 

 

I'm not sure if we kept the better player, but we definitely kept a more offensively minded player who has tendency to turn the puck over at critical moments in the game and also 2 years older. Better price (0.5 mil) and less term (1 year less)... not sure if that makes much of a difference.

 

The fact of the matter is that we had to trade one and get the best haul we can. And that's what happened.

 

We will see how Miller does under Tocchet. I like Miller's versatility to play winger/center so when we have a new top 6 center, Miller can eventually shift over to wing and still help the team. 

 

Age related decline is a huge concern though. When we are competitive, say 2-3 years later, he will be 32-33 with 4-5 years left on the contract. It has a chance to be Loui Eriksson all over again and remember how desperate people were on here to get rid of Loui? At this point, all we can do is pray that Miller doesn't experience sharp decline but a gradual decline and play well into mid 30's.

 

good post ,    
     One thing many need to keep in mind with Miller,  in comparison to Erikssons decline.

 

we didn’t really know the player Eriksson was when we signed him.

             With Miller we do..  been here a while, and he is in his comfort zone.

Eriksson also had a series of head concussions.. and arguably declining before he got here.

Miller has been almost Iron like

 They are 2 completely different players in style.     

 

 

 

 

 

[aGENT]

1 hour ago, .Naslund said:

Even when Kotkaniemi was drafted people were saying it was a reach. Getting fixated on draft status is what gets people to overpay for poor assets. Even when he signed that offer sheet Montreal were like “take him”.  

I'm not fixated on his draft status. Young, cost controlled 3C with ~.5ppg floor, solid two way play and 2C ceiling, plus picks, prospects, andcap space to actually build towards a long term, competitive window is what I'm "fixated" on.

[jyu]

44 minutes ago, HorvatToBaertschi said:

I mean, we can dive deep into it if you want, but Miller is statistically the better defensive player. 

Appreciate it if you can provide the stats. Not disagreeing but I haven't seen any evidence to back up this claim.

 

IMO, Horvat is average defensive player while Miller is highly variable defensively.

 

Miller can play very well defensively because he actually can read plays well but he doesn't bother at times to the thing that is needed to be done and he can also be atrocious with the puck and make low percentage plays. Miller will sometimes make you think, "hmm that was a good defensive play by Miller" and the next moment, "wow that was terrible".

 

Horvat on the other hand doesn't have great anticipation of where the puck is going or the next moves of the opponents (not a great reader of the game), but he is always moving his feet to try to get in good positions so he's never atrocious the way Miller can be at times but elite opponents will surely find a way to beat him a couple of times for good scoring chances.