Gawdzukes Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 36 minutes ago, grandmaster said: Well it’s settled then. JR has spoken. Tanknation needs to stop. Like it or not. Not happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spook007 Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 51 minutes ago, Ghostsof1915 said: The team is self-destructing really well on it's own. Why bring in a new coach if it's not going to change anything? Spot on... it would be insanity at this stage, to get another 'Bruce bump'... And it defo doesn't sound like JR wants them to go above and beyond to win some games... let the tank continue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 41 minutes ago, grandmaster said: Well it’s settled then. JR has spoken. Tanknation needs to stop. Like it or not. Not happening. Where did you see that? Read between the lines and Rutherford basically admitted they’re gonna try for the number one pick. Not telling your players to not play hard doesn’t mean they can’t influence results with roster decisions. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junkyard Dog Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 Just now, DeNiro said: Where did you see that? Read between the lines and Rutherford basically admitted they’re gonna try for the number one pick. Not telling your players to not play hard doesn’t mean they can’t influence results with roster decisions. Trade them players out. He wants young NHLers though? good luck with that. IDK why they not interested in picks/prospects as much. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spook007 Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 48 minutes ago, chon derry said: I don’t think so we’re bad because he overestimated miller, underestimated horvat , putting to much expectation on demko saving the defensive deficiencies the canucks suck because he estimated the players,the team ,and the fan base rather than actually doing his due diligence and complete analysis. He’s an idiot! Love you man lol I wasn't too impressed to start the campaign when they drafted Lekkerimakki, when it was blatantly obvious, we were needing D... and two big lumps were avaiable at our position. Draft with the pick after us and 3 spots firther down. I was on the fence with Miller and think Bo was gone... Now I'm almost certain, Bo is gone... We will go back to the table to discuss with Bo again.... yes that'll show suitors, that we won't let him go for nowt... But here's the problem, we can't afford Bo and Miller and Kuz etc etc without letting somebody go... So management has tied themselves in a knot, and that should have been dealt with before. So yes I don't disagree about his 'mental' capacity, but when even die hard supporters like Deb is starting to hope for a better draft pick, even our management must see it... and I'm sure they are. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chon derry Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 10 minutes ago, spook007 said: Love you man lol I wasn't too impressed to start the campaign when they drafted Lekkerimakki, when it was blatantly obvious, we were needing D... and two big lumps were avaiable at our position. Draft with the pick after us and 3 spots firther down. I was on the fence with Miller and think Bo was gone... Now I'm almost certain, Bo is gone... We will go back to the table to discuss with Bo again.... yes that'll show suitors, that we won't let him go for nowt... But here's the problem, we can't afford Bo and Miller and Kuz etc etc without letting somebody go... So management has tied themselves in a knot, and that should have been dealt with before. So yes I don't disagree about his 'mental' capacity, but when even die hard supporters like Deb is starting to hope for a better draft pick, even our management must see it... and I'm sure they are. The way things are unfolding I’m starting to believe JRs comments way back that he demanded full autonomy. Which at the time I didn’t believe given all the past rumours of FAs meddling. But the horvat oversite thing doesn’t even happen-had aqua intervened at the time ?? It won’t get any better with the Swedish moron version either when JR finally lets the door hit him on the way out. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 33 minutes ago, Junkyard Dog said: Trade them players out. He wants young NHLers though? good luck with that. IDK why they not interested in picks/prospects as much. Picks are like 7-8 years from being impact players. That’s not their timeline. When he says he wants young NHLers it’s guys like Newhook, Jarvis, Necas, Dobson etc. I have no problem targeting those players. Everyone wants to connect it to what Benning did but I don’t see it that way. Benning was a horrible pro scout and he overpaid for players who were already on the verge of busting. What JR and co hopefully do is acquire actual NHL players who are just being buried on deep rosters. That’s a much better strategy. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 (edited) 39 minutes ago, DeNiro said: Where did you see that? Read between the lines and Rutherford basically admitted they’re gonna try for the number one pick. Not telling your players to not play hard doesn’t mean they can’t influence results with roster decisions. He basically said Demko isn’t coming back anytime soon. So JR is definitely on team tank. Edited January 16, 2023 by Elias Pettersson 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 Just now, DeNiro said: Picks are like 7-8 years from being impact players. That’s not their timeline. When he says he wants young NHLers it’s guys like Newhook, Jarvis, Necas, Dobson etc. I have no problem targeting those players. Everyone wants to connect it to what Benning did but I don’t see it that way. Benning was a horrible pro scout and he overpaid for players who were already on the verge of busting. What JR and co hopefully do is acquire actual NHL players who are just being buried on deep rosters. That’s a much better strategy. Michael Rasmussen, Callan Foote to name two guys who could really help on the penalty kill. Plus the assets from a Horvat trade. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 1 minute ago, Elias Pettersson said: He basically said Demko isn’t coming back anytime soon. So JR is definitely on team tank. One of the first things I noticed. That to me says they don’t wanna rush him back because he hurts their chances of finishing lower. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 Just now, DeNiro said: One of the first things I noticed. That to me says they don’t wanna rush him back because he hurts their chances of finishing lower. Exactly. I think JR is smart enough to figure out that if you indeed want to tank then this is the year to do it. Drafting Connor Bedard would be the greatest moment in Vancouver Canucks history. I am sure JR would love to be a part of that history. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 Just now, Elias Pettersson said: Michael Rasmussen, Callan Foote to name two guys who could really help on the penalty kill. Plus the assets from a Horvat trade. Exactly. Benning targeted guys like Clendening, Baertschi, Pouliot, Granlund, and Gudbranson. Players that obviously weren’t gonna reach their potential and were already well on their way to being disappointing players. These players didn’t simply need a second chance. It will ultimately come down to how well our pro scouts identify players based on how the team wants to play. That will be crucial and something Benning and his group did a very poor job at. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 Just now, DeNiro said: Exactly. Benning targeted guys like Clendening, Baertschi, Pouliot, Granlund, and Gudbranson. Players that obviously weren’t gonna reach their potential and were already well on their way to being disappointing players. These players didn’t simply need a second chance. It will ultimately come down to how well our pro scouts identify players based on how the team wants to play. That will be crucial and something Benning and his group did a very poor job at. If Tocchet is indeed the guy then we are probably looking at a more defensive minded team with more defensive structure. And also a team that is harder to play against. More in your face puck pressure hockey. And maybe we add a couple of face punchers as well. Tocchet was a face puncher himself and played old school hockey. At the very least the country club atmosphere will be eliminated. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goal:thecup Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 23 minutes ago, chon derry said: The way things are unfolding I’m starting to believe JRs comments way back that he demanded full autonomy. Which at the time I didn’t believe given all the past rumours of FAs meddling. But the horvat oversite thing doesn’t even happen-had aqua intervened at the time ?? It won’t get any better with the Swedish moron version either when JR finally lets the door hit him on the way out. Yeah, I guess that's next: it is all Patrick's Fault, eh Jim? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goal:thecup Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 8 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said: Exactly. I think JR is smart enough to figure out that if you indeed want to tank then this is the year to do it. Drafting Connor Bedard would be the greatest moment in Vancouver Canucks history. I am sure JR would love to be a part of that history. If JR is so smart, what did he gain by throwing coaches and players under the bus? Couldn't come up with better ways of handling situations? Didn't have enough management assistants to figure out the right things? When was his last dementia test? I think its time to test again, compare results to last test, see if its getting worse.. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maginator Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 6 minutes ago, DeNiro said: Exactly. Benning targeted guys like Clendening, Baertschi, Pouliot, Granlund, and Gudbranson. Players that obviously weren’t gonna reach their potential and were already well on their way to being disappointing players. These players didn’t simply need a second chance. It will ultimately come down to how well our pro scouts identify players based on how the team wants to play. That will be crucial and something Benning and his group did a very poor job at. All those players mentioned are 'projects' IMO. Players who haven't met their potential yet, based on their draft pedigree. Essentially bustaroos. If JR has proven that he's good at anything, it's pro scouting. I like his pro scouting moves so far, we just need more of them. They will come when salary opens up. JR won't be acquiring any 'projects', but players who will actually rise to their potential. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junkyard Dog Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 24 minutes ago, DeNiro said: Picks are like 7-8 years from being impact players. That’s not their timeline. When he says he wants young NHLers it’s guys like Newhook, Jarvis, Necas, Dobson etc. I have no problem targeting those players. Everyone wants to connect it to what Benning did but I don’t see it that way. Benning was a horrible pro scout and he overpaid for players who were already on the verge of busting. What JR and co hopefully do is acquire actual NHL players who are just being buried on deep rosters. That’s a much better strategy. Like I said good luck. Those who have don't want to give. Not for what we have. Not all players drafted take till 25/26 year olds to become impact player. Especially high picks. Prospects also are assets that can be used in trades. Bad prospect pool = can't make those trades that pop up. Pretty much same strategy as what JB wanted to do with when acquiring the Granlunds, Baertschis, Veys, Pouliots, etc. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boudrias Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 39 minutes ago, DeNiro said: Exactly. Benning targeted guys like Clendening, Baertschi, Pouliot, Granlund, and Gudbranson. Players that obviously weren’t gonna reach their potential and were already well on their way to being disappointing players. These players didn’t simply need a second chance. It will ultimately come down to how well our pro scouts identify players based on how the team wants to play. That will be crucial and something Benning and his group did a very poor job at. Really the only player on that list that meant anything was Gudbranson. He had a great season prior to coming to Van. Rutherford is in a far stronger position than Benning was. Rutherford actually has some strong pieces to move if he wants to. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 9 minutes ago, Junkyard Dog said: Like I said good luck. Those who have don't want to give. Not for what we have. Not all players drafted take till 25/26 year olds to become impact player. Especially high picks. Prospects also are assets that can be used in trades. Bad prospect pool = can't make those trades that pop up. Pretty much same strategy as what JB wanted to do with when acquiring the Granlunds, Baertschis, Veys, Pouliots, etc. Well that’s gonna be their task with a Horvat trade. Whether they can get those types of players remains to be seen, but that’s their goal I’m sure. How exactly do we get those high picks you propose? Any picks we get will be from contenders and be late picks. Those picks typically take that long to pan out, if at all. If you’re proposing that we completely tear down the roster so that our own picks are high ones, then that involves a full rebuild. Basically throw out Pettersson, Hughes, and Demko’s prime years (if they even wanna stick around). Acquiring prospects to use in future trades, sure. That’s no guarantee either though. Those prospects could lose value by the time you’re looking to trade them. It would be no less risky than acquiring young NHL players. I think Canucks fans continue to believe that there’s only one way to rebuild. It has to be a scorched earth, trade everyone for picks and prospects, or nothing. There’s other ways to do it that don’t involve wasting the good young talent you have. This team isn’t at the point where it needs to start a rebuild. The rebuild started with Pettersson and Hughes. The goal now is to keep building around them. Whether they call it a rebuild or a retool I could care less. How they surround these guys with talent that plays the right way is what I care about. The goal needs to be that when these guys are in their prime we have a good 5-6 year window to try and win a cup. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 33 minutes ago, Goal:thecup said: If JR is so smart, what did he gain by throwing coaches and players under the bus? Couldn't come up with better ways of handling situations? Didn't have enough management assistants to figure out the right things? When was his last dementia test? I think its time to test again, compare results to last test, see if its getting worse.. He’s won 3 Stanley Cups. I’ll give him the benefit of the doubt. Also, I am pretty sure that Boudreau and JR have already talked. Boudreau knows he’s a lame duck coach and is not coming back. So he knows other coaches are being interviewed. It’s not like he is oblivious to it like some of the media are trying to portray. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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