Boudrias Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 1 hour ago, stawns said: I think the league is at one of its lowest points, at least since the dead puck era of the mid-lste 90's It what way? Quality of play? Management? Bettman seems to find ways to squeeze more money into the NHL each season. Covid exempt. New broadcast contracts from the USA. CAP likely exceeds $90 million this year. Will likely go to $90 million as soon as the escrow account recovers from Covid. My concerns: Advertising: I'm OK with it on uniforms but not on the rink boards. CAP: Created to protect small market teams. Larger markets like the Laffers are active trying to create a "special tax" on teams who exceed the CAP so they can retain their stars. In other words let's screw the little guys. Gambling I really laughed when fans lambasted Tocchet for gambling as the NHL dedicates time on each broadcast so that fans can bet their money. I understand the need to make money to pay players but I don't like it. Contracts: I would not be opposed to internal limits on player contracts. For example 3 contracts which would consume 30% of the team CAP. This type of thing should be self regulating and my idea doesn't hold water. I guess my hope is that such an idea would restrict UFA bidding and drive more money down the team pyramid to those who play for $1 to $2 million. Their careers are usually shorter and need the money more. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jyu Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 1 hour ago, stawns said: With the cost of RFA contracts for high draft picks, that might not end up being as great as you think it is. I don't know why we should be afraid of RFA contracts; the only leverage that the players have is sitting out, which does nobody any good. The agents can point to other players on other teams making xxx dollars; to that we simply say, we have our own cap structure. The only time where we may have to pay for RFAs is if their performance merits it. If we get Bedard and by year 2, he hits 100 points; well, we have to pay fair price for that in his next contract and no one should have a problem with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 1 minute ago, Boudrias said: It what way? Quality of play? Management? Bettman seems to find ways to squeeze more money into the NHL each season. Covid exempt. New broadcast contracts from the USA. CAP likely exceeds $90 million this year. Will likely go to $90 million as soon as the escrow account recovers from Covid. My concerns: Advertising: I'm OK with it on uniforms but not on the rink boards. CAP: Created to protect small market teams. Larger markets like the Laffers are active trying to create a "special tax" on teams who exceed the CAP so they can retain their stars. In other words let's screw the little guys. Gambling I really laughed when fans lambasted Tocchet for gambling as the NHL dedicates time on each broadcast so that fans can bet their money. I understand the need to make money to pay players but I don't like it. Contracts: I would not be opposed to internal limits on player contracts. For example 3 contracts which would consume 30% of the team CAP. This type of thing should be self regulating and my idea doesn't hold water. I guess my hope is that such an idea would restrict UFA bidding and drive more money down the team pyramid to those who play for $1 to $2 million. Their careers are usually shorter and need the money more. Every rink is the same Every team plays the same style no hitting no fighting over officiating young players getting grossly over paid for "potential" players kn their prime, who have earned their way into the league getting squeezed out for "potential" GM's who can't control themselves too many regular season games and not enough teams in the playoffs. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Heffy Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 1 hour ago, HKSR said: Y'know, you sit back and think about it and you wonder if JR/PA did little to address the biggest weakness on this team to NOT give the tools Boudreau needed to win games. Easy way to get the guy outta here and bring in Tocchet (who they wanted here all along). Just reiterating, it was blatantly obvious we needed defensive upgrades, but instead we brought in more wingers. Makes you think... I think that's exactly what happened. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jyu Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 28 minutes ago, DSVII said: I think the difference here is with Benning, his issues was that he was completely out of his depth and didn't know how to run an organization. We've seen so many aspects of this organization atrophy slowly under his watch. He missed layups and made tons of unforced errors when he didn't have to. But I get that. He wasn't suited for the role. With JR/PA, the issue is that they should have known better. Miller I think the jury is still out, but firing the coach and appointing an interim as soon as you decide he isn't the one is Management 101. JR has done this before, the standard is higher than what I expect from Benning, and tbh, I think even Benning knew enough to fire a coach as soon as it isn't tenable (Aqulini took that power away from him in his last days). I dunno, the conference just smacks to me of a guy whose cocky because he won two cups with Crosby and he feels he's above those norms. I think JR and PA still has the capacity to turn this around, but it's definitely not in the direction I like. Rumor is with Bo we aren't asking for ANY picks back at all, but players. It's frustrating, they have a fanbase begging for a more patient approach. How many GMs in a Canadian market had a fanbase WISHING they took their time? Their timeline is to turn this around in 2 years. As per the press conference. We have no draft assets and prospects to speak of , so the most they are aiming for is to top out as a wildcard team. That simply isn't good enough for me. I think they have more competence but they are doubling down on the wrong strategic direction. At least with Benning, i can always count on the unintentional tank to give me a hope of a top 5 pick haha. Sad times. If they aren't asking for picks and futures in Bo's trade and only younger roster players, then there is basically no trade to be made. And it's extremely disappointing. I assume they are asking for a RHD or C back in return? Who would give up a young contract controlled C/RD for an expiring one? Playoff teams aren't going to part with roster players. Non playoff teams wouldn't risk it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 3 minutes ago, jyu said: I don't know why we should be afraid of RFA contracts; the only leverage that the players have is sitting out, which does nobody any good. The agents can point to other players on other teams making xxx dollars; to that we simply say, we have our own cap structure. The only time where we may have to pay for RFAs is if their performance merits it. If we get Bedard and by year 2, he hits 100 points; well, we have to pay fair price for that in his next contract and no one should have a problem with that. rfa contracts are ruining the league and makes drafting high almost a bad thing. How much depth can you add to your team when you have to pay Bedard $10m+ on his second contract? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jyu Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 1 minute ago, stawns said: Every rink is the same Every team plays the same style no hitting no fighting over officiating young players getting grossly over paid for "potential" players kn their prime, who have earned their way into the league getting squeezed out for "potential" GM's who can't control themselves too many regular season games and not enough teams in the playoffs. No hitting and less variability in the style of player has indeed made the game worse. I don't mind no fighting and over officiating. You could argue that the league was under officiated for too long resulting in unnecessary injuries to players. They need to strike a balance between bringing back more physical play vs overofficiating, which they are failing at the moment in my opinion. GMs not being able to control themselves was around for a while so not sure why that's relevant only to the current NHL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spook007 Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 1 hour ago, HKSR said: Y'know, you sit back and think about it and you wonder if JR/PA did little to address the biggest weakness on this team to NOT give the tools Boudreau needed to win games. Easy way to get the guy outta here and bring in Tocchet (who they wanted here all along). Just reiterating, it was blatantly obvious we needed defensive upgrades, but instead we brought in more wingers. Makes you think... Agree 100%.... I wonder, if it was their way of tanking all along, while using Bruce as their fall guy. I even wonder if they have a behind the scenes agreement with Tocchet, to evaluate and introduce the systems he wants to use, but go easy on the win column... Yeah probably not, but it would make sense, to get the best odds for the future... How else are we going to get the superstars, PA was saying we didn't have? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jyu Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 2 minutes ago, stawns said: rfa contracts are ruining the league and makes drafting high almost a bad thing. How much depth can you add to your team when you have to pay Bedard $10m+ on his second contract? You can have two 10+ mil players and still have room to add depth. Toronto failed because they added a third 10+ million guy in Tavares (11.25 I think) instead of spreading it over Kadri (5.5 at the time), Hyman (~4), or even Mikheyev (~4). What Toronto does is non of our business. Who else has crazy RFA contracts? I don't think there are as many 10+ mils as you seem to think aside from McDavid, Matthews, Marner, who else? Jack Hughes is only getting 8+. Makar only 9+. Heiskanen also 8+. Quinn Hughes only 7+. Draisaitl signed at 8+. And the winner of them all, MacKinnon at 5+ in his current deal which is expiring this season. I think Raantanen is around 9 mil? You could argue that he was overpaid but I'd say that's fair value for his production (over PPG and consistent 30 goal scorer for all his career). Even Aho in Carolina is at 8+. All of these guys have shown not only the potential but tangible stats, both macro and micro level stats, to justify the high salary. You could argue that some of these young players ended up signing at a reduced salary in return for security, like Makar for 9+? He's easily worth 11+ if he were a UFA. There are also a good number of young players on a bridge deal, for example, Robertson in Dallas and Petey. We need high draft picks even if it's not a 1st overall, we could end up finding another top flight center like Petey at 5th overall or a #1RD partner for Hughes at 7th overall. Not wanting it because of a small handful of examples in Matthews and Marner isn't the reason to not want to draft a high end player that is cost controlled for at least 8 years. And even in the case of Matthews and Marner, they have fulfilled their potentials. Matthews 60 goal scorer and Marner a 100+ point defensive winger that kills penalty? I'd say not many players in the NHL have achieved what they have done so far in their careers. Toronto's mistake is not getting a better deal with Matthews to try to keep the number below 10 and that would have made it hard for Marner camp to ask for 10+; and that mistake stems from them jumping the gun and signing Tavares to 11+ mil. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoquitlamDave Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 Trading away Linden and having Messier run the show was tough to enjoy. I love Bo now - when he is gone it may be tough. But if we can drop down and get the North Van prodigy then it may be worth it. This is painful. At least we have EP40 to watch still Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSVII Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 1 hour ago, HKSR said: Y'know, you sit back and think about it and you wonder if JR/PA did little to address the biggest weakness on this team to NOT give the tools Boudreau needed to win games. Easy way to get the guy outta here and bring in Tocchet (who they wanted here all along). Just reiterating, it was blatantly obvious we needed defensive upgrades, but instead we brought in more wingers. Makes you think... Aside from the fact that it's ridiculous to waste half a season and ruin the orgs reputation and passive-aggressively tank all just to make a minor coaching adjustment. You're conferring to this management group an adeptness at PR perception and manipulation that they've yet to show or frankly even care about. Occams razor. They want to compete in two years and will do anything, PR and rebuild be damned, to achieve it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Heffy Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, DSVII said: Aside from the fact that it's ridiculous to waste half a season and ruin the orgs reputation and passive-aggressively tank all just to make a minor coaching adjustment. You're conferring to this management group an adeptness at PR perception and manipulation that they've yet to show or frankly even care about. Occams razor. They want to compete in two years and will do anything, PR and rebuild be damned, to achieve it We finally agree. Allowing Rutherford to disgrace the franchise with this kind of misconduct is ridiculous. Edited January 23, 2023 by King Heffy 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goal:thecup Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 6 hours ago, Timråfan said: A GM should handle situations in a good manner and I can’t tell what JR done wrong since I don’t read the Canucks news in media. The situations Benning created on his own was way more bad than anything I heard of JR and PA. Par example Miller… If they didn’t sign him they would have been executed by the fans that loved Miller.You know there were a lot of them here, some willing to pay up to ten mill for his ”moral”. Boeser can be discussed but I don’t know how much money the Canucks make of him. He’s a poster boy and may sell a lot of clothes… The defence have three players with much cap and they can’t go and get another expensive D without moving one of them out. Wich means when Myers is off the cap. BB wasn’t a choice by JR and PA so why should they care about what Aquilini did? So when BB can’t adapt and continue his style they had to do something to speed up the rebuild or retool or whatever. Have BB til the seaseon ends means they can’t use the TDL as they should. So what had JR and PA done wrong? Well we could start with deceit. Caught lying multiple times. No time for liars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goal:thecup Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 1 hour ago, DSVII said: Aside from the fact that it's ridiculous to waste half a season and ruin the orgs reputation and passive-aggressively tank all just to make a minor coaching adjustment. You're conferring to this management group an adeptness at PR perception and manipulation that they've yet to show or frankly even care about. Occams razor. They want to compete in two years and will do anything, PR and rebuild be damned, to achieve it Yeah, if they had just come right out and said, "We're tearing this thing down to build it back up properly" we wouldn't have had all this horrible bumbling. Asking PA to 'read the room', and have him spouting off what the Vancouver market needs/wants/etc is like asking your dog to explain quantum physics. They want a banner. We want honest management and a hard-working team. This lying 10 pounds of Marchand in a 5 pound bag is not what the Vancouver market wants PA. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSVII Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 35 minutes ago, King Heffy said: We finally agree. Allowing Rutherford to disgrace the franchise with this kind of misconduct is ridiculous. I'm adding Aqua to the pile. The fish rots at the head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred65 Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 Remember this not so subtle point. Vcr is currently 27 O/A in the league ie they have the 6th pick in the draft. Mark it on your calendar and the let the chips fall where they will Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boudrias Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 43 minutes ago, King Heffy said: We finally agree. Allowing Rutherford to disgrace the franchise with this kind of misconduct is ridiculous. Heffy in some respects I admire your strong convictions. Yesterday you were leaving the site and I assume that you cooled down a bit and decided to stay. Rutherford and Allvin aren't vermin. Firing Boudreau should have been done better. Let's see what Tocchet can do. I admit that I like the idea of Tocchet-Foote-Gonchar as coaches. That is a lot of winning hockey in those 3 players. Hopefully it can be transferred to this roster. Still want major player trades before the TDL. I don't want a surge. Want to draft #5 or lower. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Heffy Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 Just now, Boudrias said: Heffy in some respects I admire your strong convictions. Yesterday you were leaving the site and I assume that you cooled down a bit and decided to stay. Rutherford and Allvin aren't vermin. Firing Boudreau should have been done better. Let's see what Tocchet can do. I admit that I like the idea of Tocchet-Foote-Gonchar as coaches. That is a lot of winning hockey in those 3 players. Hopefully it can be transferred to this roster. Still want major player trades before the TDL. I don't want a surge. Want to draft #5 or lower. I'm staying for the Ukraine thread. I still can't support the team until Rutherford and the rest of the parasites he brought in are all gone. Go Kraken. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spook007 Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 3 hours ago, stawns said: With the cost of RFA contracts for high draft picks, that might not end up being as great as you think it is. Of you have enough superstars in you side you can always use them as trading chips... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HKSR Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 55 minutes ago, Fred65 said: Remember this not so subtle point. Vcr is currently 27 O/A in the league ie they have the 6th pick in the draft. Mark it on your calendar and the let the chips fall where they will If there is a coach's bump and they move up the standings, it'll be the most Canuck thing for whoever finishes 27th OA in the standings to win the draft lottery and pick Bedard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Please sign in to comment
You will be able to leave a comment after signing in
Sign In Now