[Report/Rumour] Elias Pettersson Contract Talks

[IBatch]

8 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said:

There already is a limit. The maximum salary for any player is 20% of the total salary cap. For 2023 that is $16,700,000. 
 

http://www.puckreport.com/2009/07/nhl-minimum-wage-maximum-wage-by-year.html?m=1

Yep and so far believe Sundin is the only player to be offered the max or very close to it 10 x 2.   Lucky for us he only took what that was prorated for the games he played.   All that Burke cap finally shed and Nonis was fired before he could use it lol. 

 

3 hours ago, Ballisticsports. said:

Back around when the Canucks were League President winners, didn't the Sedins,Kesler,Burrows  etc all sign under $6 million while a guy like Gomez made $8 million?

 

I agree with your take on EP (but maybe he will only  want  a 4-5 yr contract  to keep his option open though, and risk he has no injuries)?

At the same time, giving up a guaranteed $30 million (for 3 more years) is hard to pass on at a young age (when is enough enough)?

 

But then again counting what he has made so far, and if signing $50 for 5 yrs (as an example) he won't be living in a tent homeless and could afford to take a chance to keep that option out, (if he no longer likes what he sees) and even an option to make more in those 3 yrs with cap increases over the years

The Sedins signed a few years before that, got exactly what they should have after their 3 year bridge which was also very decent.  8.13% of the cap after one 70 point season, post lockout.   Then 10.74% of the cap each for five years .. those were their best seasons, aside from one year each, about what you should get paid for around or close to a PPG player.    Burrows was the only guy that wasn't paid well during that period, but did get a boffo payday after his bridge.   So did Bieksa.   Kesler's was also a fair deal, and Luongo's of course was massive, but paid in a way to lower the cap hit somewhat.    All front loaded so he could invest the money and watch it grow.   Sedins final contract, at 33 was 10.89% of the cap (each) which more then made up for their boffo seasons. 

 

Edit:  The reality was, paying the Sedins, Kesler and Luongo, cost close to 40% of the cap during that era.   It's why Kesler never had a great winger to play with.   The D was very good, but also we paid for that as well.   Garrison's deal was virtually identical to the one Myers got for example (that was on the other side of peak years, he got Salo's money really).   We did get great value though.   Almost won a cup! 

 

Edit: For reference, after 3 PGP and Canucks leading scorer for 3 years, including 99 points, JT Millers starting cap hit is 9.7%.   Back when the Sedins signed their five year deal flat cap existed too.  That's very good value.   Sedins just had one 70 point season.   Miller just had 3 much better seasons (two with Hart votes). and followed it up with another PGP campaign so he's now at 4.    Of course decline is a concern.   His cap hit is 11% less though, then the Sedins, and by the time he's 33, it will be around 8% not almost 11, or around 1/3 less then the Sedins made their final deal. 

Edited July 14, 2023 by IBatch

[hammertime]

I'd like to see Pete around 12% cap any more I think is diminishing returns as we will also need to pay people to play with him. My $.02 I understand maybe he doesn't sign long term 8 years for that but that's probably not the worst thing he can re negotiate in 5 years or so. 

[kloubek]

14 minutes ago, hammertime said:

I'd like to see Pete around 12% cap any more I think is diminishing returns as we will also need to pay people to play with him. My $.02 I understand maybe he doesn't sign long term 8 years for that but that's probably not the worst thing he can re negotiate in 5 years or so. 

That'd likely put him around 10.5. Frankly, that's not unreasonable given how he's developed his all-around game. 

 

But somehow, in my head, I really hoped he'd sign at 10 or a little bit under. I think 9.9 would make a statement that we all know he could have pushed for more, but opted to not hamstring the club to squeeze every last bit he could.

[AnthonyG]

12 hours ago, hammertime said:

Would it really be a shocker to anyone if Pete held Alvin over a Barrel for max cap or demanded a trade to a tax haven? 

 

How much faith do you think he has that we are actually going to build a contender here?

 

Would you take a discount if you were him based on what you've seen from this franchise so far?

He was a foundational core piece, I doubt he thinks this shit happens over night. He’s going into his 6th season, he’s been to the playoffs once, We narrowly missed due to COVID and then poor goaltending the last 2 seasons. This team is a lot closer than a lot of you are willing to believe. Just go look at our record against playoff teams this past season. You’ll be shocked how many games were decided by 1 goal and thats with league’s worst goaltending.

 

If you think our situation is messed up and we havent found the major needs for a contender….

Go look at Edmonton and Toronto. Do you see a stable cap situation? One that is sustainable? Do you see legit top 4 dpairings? Do you see anything elite on their blueline at all? Do you see cup winning goaltending? No. They rely on a few star players who have to continually outscore the problem and as we all saw, McDavid and the Coilers cant win without PPs. As soon as the officiating tightened up, they were hooped, Same for Toronto.

 

Petey is entering his 6th, I repeat SIXTH….. season. Just chill on the panic

Edited July 14, 2023 by AnthonyG

[TFerguson]

17 hours ago, hammertime said:

Would it really be a shocker to anyone if Pete held Alvin over a Barrel for max cap or demanded a trade to a tax haven? 

 

How much faith do you think he has that we are actually going to build a contender here?

 

Would you take a discount if you were him based on what you've seen from this franchise so far?

Sekeres, is that you?

[IBatch]

7 hours ago, AnthonyG said:

He was a foundational core piece, I doubt he thinks this shit happens over night. He’s going into his 6th season, he’s been to the playoffs once, We narrowly missed due to COVID and then poor goaltending the last 2 seasons. This team is a lot closer than a lot of you are willing to believe. Just go look at our record against playoff teams this past season. You’ll be shocked how many games were decided by 1 goal and thats with league’s worst goaltending.

 

If you think our situation is messed up and we havent found the major needs for a contender….

Go look at Edmonton and Toronto. Do you see a stable cap situation? One that is sustainable? Do you see legit top 4 dpairings? Do you see anything elite on their blueline at all? Do you see cup winning goaltending? No. They rely on a few star players who have to continually outscore the problem and as we all saw, McDavid and the Coilers cant win without PPs. As soon as the officiating tightened up, they were hooped, Same for Toronto.

 

Petey is entering his 6th, I repeat SIXTH….. season. Just chill on the panic

Not sure who's panicking.   Don't think it's an unreasonable thread to discuss his next contract.   It for sure will matter.   Cap world is one they live in, and salary disclosure made them way richer than the guys who paved the way for them.   Even with inflation etc.   Go look at McDavids ridiculous house that he was happy to share with his girlfriend.   Gretzky didn't have anything like that when he was the same age.   Not even close.    EP is entering his sixth season,  that's fine.  Just like when the Sedins did.   He's already way ahead of the game compared to JT Miller.   Who's still scored more points then he has the last four years, making 5.35.  Less than Brock...on both his last deals.  Way less than QHs and EP.   Personally agree with Hansen.  How did all theses guys, get paid so much, to do very little aside from a bubble that likely would never have happened for them (Tanev and Brock were out, TT didn't at all stop the bleeding).    

 

Look at the peak Sedin era and compare it to TO.   Same thing.  4 guys taking up 40% of the cap.   Difference was, we were in the weakest division in the league back then.   And had one miracle run.    There isn't a lot of difference cap wise.   Sure maybe we had more depth.  But we also only had one TB/Boston to deal with in SJ.   And that was it.     If we are going to be honest let's be honest.   EDM is a better them right now then we are.   Vegas too.  CAL maybe.   How close to being a contender?   Not very.  And once EP signs and is making an extra 3-4 million, that doesn't make us closer does it?      You can't make fun of teams that are routinely in the playoffs, when we are not.  And then question their makeup.   Especially TO given we kind of had the same thing going on except instead of a winger, we had a goalie. 

 

Edit:  As an aside just want to say I do think we are on the right track.  But our D is just plain bad and has been since the Sedin era.    Demko is promising, that's it.   Our best chance is maybe some miracle's, good health, and some seas parting.   We are close.  To making the playoffs.   Parity gives every team hope.   Why not LA?   Or even ANA?  Until we've made the show for a couple years in a row, we haven't proved anything.   

Edited July 14, 2023 by IBatch

[Alflives]

Petey will sign with us and for likely 11 (or so) times 8 years. But with all the signing league wide (like Horvat getting 8.5 times 8) the Miller deal looks friggin’ phenomenal for us! Thank you JTM for signing such a team friendly contract. Time for Petey to put pen to paper. 

[bishopshodan]

1 hour ago, Alflives said:

Petey will sign with us and for likely 11 (or so) times 8 years. But with all the signing league wide (like Horvat getting 8.5 times 8) the Miller deal looks friggin’ phenomenal for us! Thank you JTM for signing such a team friendly contract. Time for Petey to put pen to paper. 

Sometimes we drink the same melmacian ale. 

 

 

[AnthonyG]

3 minutes ago, IBatch said:

Not sure who's panicking.

The guy I quoted. Just read what he said, its a little overboard

[bishopshodan]

14 minutes ago, AnthonyG said:

The guy I quoted. Just read what he said, its a little overboard

I dont think so.

I have similar concerns. I dont see it as panic. 

Petey seems like an awesome person, however he is also an awesome player and many will be telling him what he could make. It make sense that some fans have concerns that he might be wooed away by dollars and a better chance to win.

 

Though I agree with you that we have a good squad. 

[Ballisticsports.]

17 hours ago, IBatch said:

Yep and so far believe Sundin is the only player to be offered the max or very close to it 10 x 2.   Lucky for us he only took what that was prorated for the games he played.   All that Burke cap finally shed and Nonis was fired before he could use it lol. 

 

The Sedins signed a few years before that, got exactly what they should have after their 3 year bridge which was also very decent.  8.13% of the cap after one 70 point season, post lockout.   Then 10.74% of the cap each for five years .. those were their best seasons, aside from one year each, about what you should get paid for around or close to a PPG player.    Burrows was the only guy that wasn't paid well during that period, but did get a boffo payday after his bridge.   So did Bieksa.   Kesler's was also a fair deal, and Luongo's of course was massive, but paid in a way to lower the cap hit somewhat.    All front loaded so he could invest the money and watch it grow.   Sedins final contract, at 33 was 10.89% of the cap (each) which more then made up for their boffo seasons. 

 

Edit:  The reality was, paying the Sedins, Kesler and Luongo, cost close to 40% of the cap during that era.   It's why Kesler never had a great winger to play with.   The D was very good, but also we paid for that as well.   Garrison's deal was virtually identical to the one Myers got for example (that was on the other side of peak years, he got Salo's money really).   We did get great value though.   Almost won a cup! 

 

Edit: For reference, after 3 PGP and Canucks leading scorer for 3 years, including 99 points, JT Millers starting cap hit is 9.7%.   Back when the Sedins signed their five year deal flat cap existed too.  That's very good value.   Sedins just had one 70 point season.   Miller just had 3 much better seasons (two with Hart votes). and followed it up with another PGP campaign so he's now at 4.    Of course decline is a concern.   His cap hit is 11% less though, then the Sedins, and by the time he's 33, it will be around 8% not almost 11, or around 1/3 less then the Sedins made their final deal. 

Yeah for winning Leagues Art Ross, Hart, leading league assists,1st team all stars, HHOF, Ironmen (reliable) the Sedins were good value

[bishopshodan]

16 minutes ago, Ballisticsports. said:

Yeah for winning Leagues Art Ross, Hart, leading league assists,1st team all stars, HHOF, Ironmen (reliable) the Sedins were good value

Sure, I guess, if you're into that kind of thing. 

 

[IBatch]

On 7/14/2023 at 1:21 AM, Ballisticsports. said:

Defence was a Canuck killer and in only 1 year, we only have Hughes (maybe Meyers) from the starting lineup  last year 

He probably understands it will take time to unravel the mess they are in, but sees the more positive changes taking place

EP is a very cerebral young man.  Anyone who personally identifies 21 things wrong with his shot after getting drafted, then works on each one individually during that summer, until he's satisfied is special.   It's also apparent in some of his interviews (all-star game one), that he's got a lot going on upstairs.    I'm sure he's got enough at the arithmetic to understand what he signs for matters to the team, as well as who on the team is underperforming.    He point out said "our defense needs work", a polite way of saying it too.   He's mindful of what he says.   It also shows in his game.  Hockey IQ is top tier.    Pretty sure he's aware we have a solid forward group, and what trading Horvat meant.    Like that he's not gleefully going after the captaincy.   Kids got a lot of character.    Says he will sign with Vancouver.   Don't see any reason not to believe that.   And pretty sure he recognizes it's going to take a little time to sort the D out.  

 

This team is close.   To making the playoffs.   Really curious to see what they can manage once they get there.   They know they can beat EDM, and put up a much better effort against Vegas already.   

[hammertime]

14 hours ago, AnthonyG said:

The guy I quoted. Just read what he said, its a little overboard

I don't think it's overboard. The org has been a shit show the entire 6 years he has been here. He's entering his prime we have the OEL buyout looming no D, flooded wings and zero grit. Would you look at this team and think if I just take a mill less we will be contenders? 

 

JR PA won't be able to fix this overnight. If we aren't able to compete this year with Hughes and Pete on sweet heart deals and no OEL penalty, Hronek at 4.4 Demko at 5m it doesn't take Alfs crystal ball to see where things are headed. 

[spook007]

1 hour ago, hammertime said:

I don't think it's overboard. The org has been a shit show the entire 6 years he has been here. He's entering his prime we have the OEL buyout looming no D, flooded wings and zero grit. Would you look at this team and think if I just take a mill less we will be contenders? 

 

JR PA won't be able to fix this overnight. If we aren't able to compete this year with Hughes and Pete on sweet heart deals and no OEL penalty, Hronek at 4.4 Demko at 5m it doesn't take Alfs crystal ball to see where things are headed. 

Agree 100%...

They need to show they are able to compete and at worst a few tweaks away from being relevant...

[mll]

On 7/14/2023 at 5:14 AM, Elias Pettersson said:

I guess Tampa could trade for him. Half the team have NTC however. Point would have to come back. Maybe Cernak too. Cap wise it doesn’t work. 
 

I guess Florida could trade Barkov for Petey. Again, he has a NMC. These guys aren’t gonna want to come to Vancouver. 
 

New Jersey maybe. The Hughes brothers for Petey?  Hischier and Siegenthaler?
 

There are very few trade options for Petey. 

Vancouver would be trying to do the best out of a bad situation.  The only reason to trade Pettersson is if he refuses to extend and wants to go to free agency.   Winnipeg did well with Dubois but it could also turn into an Ottawa/DeBrincat situation.  

 

There's no reason for NJD or Florida or even Tampa to mess with what they have going - it's not because Vancouver would be forced to trade Pettersson vs lose him for nothing that these teams have to bid when they already have a direction and their core defined.

 

Would think there would be quite the list of interested teams.  He's the elite C1 that Trotz sees as a crucial need.  Minnesota is going to have those buyouts coming off their books when he hits UFA - Kaprizov going to need someone to play with as Zuccarello is not getting any younger.  St Louis was trying to acquire Meier as they are going for a quick re-tool.  San Jose, Montreal, Carolina if Aho walks, Pittsburgh where Dubas wants to reduce the gap to the next era, Boston has a need at C.  There are enough teams that would bid and Vancouver would need to find the best deal - it's that or nothing if he wants out.

 

[Junkyard Dog]

14 hours ago, bishopshodan said:

Sure, I guess, if you're into that kind of thing. 

 

To be fair having those things on your roster probably boosts Cup/Playoff chances. 
 

At the same time it require luck to acquire these sort of players since drafting/developing is the main way to require. 

[Elias Pettersson]

 

[Strawbone]

1 hour ago, Elias Pettersson said:

 

Toss up for me between Makar and Pettersson. I have a hunch Petey still has significant untapped potential. 
 

And Elias, could you spend less time posting here and more time signing a long term team-friendly deal? 8x10m is more than anyone could ever want or need, right? 

[Provost]

2 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said:

 

Fan vote… meaningless