spook007 Posted July 30, 2023 Share Posted July 30, 2023 12 minutes ago, IBatch said: NHL.com continues to report that the two sides are working on a deal ... hard to know for sure, but the intent seems to be there anyways from Allvin and EP's side. If the Canucks can sign EP to anything 10-11, would consider this off season a success. EP not signing also comes with risks. The sooner he signs the better... takes the stress out of the fan base if nothing else... 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IBatch Posted July 30, 2023 Share Posted July 30, 2023 (edited) 43 minutes ago, spook007 said: The sooner he signs the better... takes the stress out of the fan base if nothing else... It will sure be nice. For me anyways, EP next deal will be a pivot point for the club, they will have a clear idea of when this team is best set up to have their best "contention" window. Not that we will get there for sure, but it will be tactically important to arrange their spending around him. Playoffs are also a must before we get to that point. We will need to draft some good players as well to make it work. The first couple years won't matter as much, as the ones in the middle. Believe they have planned around that somewhat with the OEL buyout. And that their plan is to make the playoffs this year. Won't be easy. Navigating the cap. But we should be in a pretty decent position. I don't think the team will be doing much else this off season. And happy they stuck to just the Stillman trade as far as cap dumps go. Once the cap goes up, it will be easier to just play guys like Garland and Brock and or find a partner for them. Next year Beau and Myers gone. Don't mind acceptance with what we see is what we get. Soucy was the main prize this year. Exactly the guy I hoped we'd acquire and we did! The team will have a lot of flexibility even with OEL next year too. We don't have to re-sign Hronek. He's a let's see how it goes first trade. Raty ... adds something we needed in our pool. Don't mind at all that nothing crazy is happening. No JB deck chair stuff. The team will be better having more time to play with each other. Last year Kuzmenko. What a great add. And signed to a reasonable cap hit...not the 7-8 that some folks figured he'd get lol. Cole and Soucy >>> on the PK then OEL, QHs and Myers. Can see Miller and EP getting a chance to play PK, given they went on a crazy run once Horvat was traded together, but Tochett also has said he wants the stars to get less minutes on the PK, which I do believe will be better for the team as long Bleugar and whomever, are up to the task. Where i'm going with this, is, signing EP is more of a priority now, then anything else. Sure maybe a back-up goalie vet, a minor tweak or something. But the last major thing to do would be that. If they can manage it, to me they get an A this off season. Sometimes, often depending on where the teams at, doing nothing is better than something. Believe they did most of what they needed to do already, starting with the Horvat trade. OEL... well they did as much as they possibly could do so far with that. Willander was a solid pick. If he truly can become QHs long term partner, this off season going back to Horvat really, could be determined as a pivotal moment in completing the post Sedin team core number one. I'm pretty impressed with this group. Love that they got the guy they wanted in Tochett, but gave Bruce a chance even though he wasn't their guy. Tochett, Foote and Gonchar are teaching coaches. That's something a young team needs. Even veterans can learn from them, because they were all winners. Edit: The reason I think signing EP this off season is a big win for the club, is that there won't be any media interference all season and next off season until he does sign. We've already seen what a circus that was with Horvat. And how it even became a Horvat versus Miller thing right away with the media and the fans. Brock and Horvats second deals ... was also a painful time as a fan. Right to the bitter end, missing any time at camp isn't good. Would sure be great for us fans to get an announcement before this season with EP. Edited July 30, 2023 by IBatch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IBatch Posted August 1, 2023 Share Posted August 1, 2023 (edited) Barkov is actually one of EPs better comps. He signed for 12.27% of the cap. If EP takes the same deal and bases it on the cap going up to 88.5 (5 million bump), it puts him at 10.86...So 11 seems pretty accurate. He's also one of only a few centres making over 10 with RFA years in there too. And only Tavares and McKinnon so far, make over 10 strictly UFA year. Others are McDavid and Mathews. So that would put him paid as a top five center in this league, ahead of Barkov at 10 as well. If he scores 110-120... then McDavid's deal becomes a legit ask. Edited August 1, 2023 by IBatch 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted August 1, 2023 Share Posted August 1, 2023 49 minutes ago, IBatch said: Barkov is actually one of EPs better comps. He signed for 12.27% of the cap. If EP takes the same deal and bases it on the cap going up to 88.5 (5 million bump), it puts him at 10.86...So 11 seems pretty accurate. He's also one of only a few centres making over 10 with RFA years in there too. And only Tavares and McKinnon so far, make over 10 strictly UFA year. Others are McDavid and Mathews. So that would put him paid as a top five center in this league, ahead of Barkov at 10 as well. If he scores 110-120... then McDavid's deal becomes a legit ask. As these salaries climb that Miller deal looks even more team friendly than when he first signed it. Petey will get around what you’re suggesting. So with him at 11 and Miller at 8 that’s 19 mil cap allocated to our top two forwards, who just happen to both be elite. Then we sign Hronek to 6.5 and combine that with Hughes’ 7.5 and that’s 14 for our top two D, who are also both elite. We then add Demko and our core five (who are all elite) are signed for 38 mil total. That’s super good GMing. 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HKSR Posted August 1, 2023 Share Posted August 1, 2023 4 hours ago, IBatch said: Barkov is actually one of EPs better comps. He signed for 12.27% of the cap. If EP takes the same deal and bases it on the cap going up to 88.5 (5 million bump), it puts him at 10.86...So 11 seems pretty accurate. He's also one of only a few centres making over 10 with RFA years in there too. And only Tavares and McKinnon so far, make over 10 strictly UFA year. Others are McDavid and Mathews. So that would put him paid as a top five center in this league, ahead of Barkov at 10 as well. If he scores 110-120... then McDavid's deal becomes a legit ask. Yeah $11M is very fair and accurate IMO. Gotta remember Barkov is in Florida, one of the lowest, if not lowest taxed states in the entire NHL. If anything, $11M for Petey would be Petey leaving a few hundred thousand on the table. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted August 1, 2023 Share Posted August 1, 2023 4 hours ago, Alflives said: As these salaries climb that Miller deal looks even more team friendly than when he first signed it. Petey will get around what you’re suggesting. So with him at 11 and Miller at 8 that’s 19 mil cap allocated to our top two forwards, who just happen to both be elite. Then we sign Hronek to 6.5 and combine that with Hughes’ 7.5 and that’s 14 for our top two D, who are also both elite. We then add Demko and our core five (who are all elite) are signed for 38 mil total. That’s super good GMing. I agree. Plus Kuzmenko at $5.5 million for a 40 goal scorer. Another great contract. So you have the core 6 at $43.5 million which is just slightly less than 50% of next years cap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted August 1, 2023 Share Posted August 1, 2023 1 hour ago, HKSR said: Yeah $11M is very fair and accurate IMO. Gotta remember Barkov is in Florida, one of the lowest, if not lowest taxed states in the entire NHL. If anything, $11M for Petey would be Petey leaving a few hundred thousand on the table. Don’t think you can factor in no tax when using comparables. Barkov is a good comparable the Canucks will be looking at for sure. Wish Barzal was still a comparable but not after the season Petey had…Imagine Benning was competent and got Petey signed for 8.5x8 when he had the chance… 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HKSR Posted August 1, 2023 Share Posted August 1, 2023 8 minutes ago, DeNiro said: Don’t think you can factor in no tax when using comparables. Barkov is a good comparable the Canucks will be looking at for sure. Wish Barzal was still a comparable but not after the season Petey had…Imagine Benning was competent and got Petey signed for 8.5x8 when he had the chance… Why not? If you look at the low state tax teams, their top guys generally have lower cap hits. Primarily because they don't need as much gross income to net the same amount as other places. This is very common knowledge, but the league doesn't seem to care. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted August 1, 2023 Share Posted August 1, 2023 1 minute ago, HKSR said: Why not? If you look at the low state tax teams, their top guys generally have lower cap hits. Primarily because they don't need as much gross income to net the same amount as other places. This is very common knowledge, but the league doesn't seem to care. I’m not saying it’s not a factor but I don’t think Peteys agent can use that against Barkov being a direct comparable. Barkov was free to sign for whatever he wanted and didn’t need to take less because of lower taxes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coconuts Posted August 1, 2023 Share Posted August 1, 2023 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pears Posted August 1, 2023 Share Posted August 1, 2023 On 7/27/2023 at 9:35 AM, Gawdzukes said: Didn't we all babble on endlessly about Miller for 1000+ or was that some weird dream I had? Oh that’s nothing. The Luongo trade speculation back in 2012 reached multiple threads over a year and a half 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HKSR Posted August 1, 2023 Share Posted August 1, 2023 2 hours ago, DeNiro said: I’m not saying it’s not a factor but I don’t think Peteys agent can use that against Barkov being a direct comparable. Barkov was free to sign for whatever he wanted and didn’t need to take less because of lower taxes. I'm pretty sure if the Canucks offered Petey the Florida-equivalent comparable, the agent would be smart enough to bring up taxes and say how his client is gonna receive less due to taxes. If not, he's a pretty bad agent lol 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted August 1, 2023 Share Posted August 1, 2023 3 minutes ago, HKSR said: I'm pretty sure if the Canucks offered Petey the Florida-equivalent comparable, the agent would be smart enough to bring up taxes and say how his client is gonna receive less due to taxes. If not, he's a pretty bad agent lol Canadian dollar is 30% less. Guys are paid in US funds. I’m pretty sure Petey’s agent is well aware that 10 mil US is 13 mil for Petey in Vancouver. IMHAO this exchange rate was a factor in us getting Miller on such a team friendly deal. He’s getting 8 US but seeing 10+ Canadian after exchange. That’s a huge selling factor for Petey too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuck73_3 Posted August 1, 2023 Share Posted August 1, 2023 On 7/27/2023 at 9:35 AM, Gawdzukes said: Didn't we all babble on endlessly about Miller for 1000+ or was that some weird dream I had? The best part was King of Surrey calling me stupid celebrating the Canucks acquiring a "13 GOAL SCORER" 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HKSR Posted August 1, 2023 Share Posted August 1, 2023 1 hour ago, Alflives said: Canadian dollar is 30% less. Guys are paid in US funds. I’m pretty sure Petey’s agent is well aware that 10 mil US is 13 mil for Petey in Vancouver. IMHAO this exchange rate was a factor in us getting Miller on such a team friendly deal. He’s getting 8 US but seeing 10+ Canadian after exchange. That’s a huge selling factor for Petey too. The exchange rate generally works the same across the board for everything. It's no advantage whatsoever lol. The $1 item in the USA is gonna be about $1.30 in Canada, so $10M in the USA or $13M in Canada is basically the same thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted August 1, 2023 Share Posted August 1, 2023 3 minutes ago, HKSR said: The exchange rate generally works the same across the board for everything. It's no advantage whatsoever lol. The $1 item in the USA is gonna be about $1.30 in Canada, so $10M in the USA or $13M in Canada is basically the same thing. Not how it works. Petey signs for 10 and he’s sees 13+ mil Canadian. Miller is getting over 10 Canadian. Guys choose US cities because they want to be anonymous away from the rink. The money thing is just an excuse used so they don’t appear to be cowardly. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharpshooter Posted August 1, 2023 Share Posted August 1, 2023 1 hour ago, canuck73_3 said: The best part was King of Surrey calling me stupid celebrating the Canucks acquiring a "13 GOAL SCORER" KOS was entertaining 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted August 1, 2023 Share Posted August 1, 2023 1 hour ago, HKSR said: I'm pretty sure if the Canucks offered Petey the Florida-equivalent comparable, the agent would be smart enough to bring up taxes and say how his client is gonna receive less due to taxes. If not, he's a pretty bad agent lol He should get him a better accountant if he’s worried about taxes lol. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted August 1, 2023 Share Posted August 1, 2023 4 minutes ago, Sharpshooter said: KOS was entertaining KOS “was” (past tense) entertaining? KOS is great! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HKSR Posted August 1, 2023 Share Posted August 1, 2023 17 minutes ago, Alflives said: Not how it works. Petey signs for 10 and he’s sees 13+ mil Canadian. Miller is getting over 10 Canadian. Guys choose US cities because they want to be anonymous away from the rink. The money thing is just an excuse used so they don’t appear to be cowardly. If it's an exchange rate thing, there's no advantage to being paid USD. The world of forex is literally designed to eliminate that. $13M in Canada = $10M in the USA. A $1.00 item in the USA is generally $1.30 in Canada. So your buying power is the same. All else being equal. Guys choosing US cities to be anonymous is a separate issue altogether. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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