[Speculation] Lucic says he would like to play here

[oldnews]

On 5/28/2019 at 10:37 PM, Smashian Kassian said:

It doesn't matter what he does offensively, that's now why we'd bring him in. I don't want to watch this young group be pushed around. Gudbranson while not fighting alot (I'd argue b/c of his position) does leave a hole in our lineup.

 

And again, everyone responding seems to conveniently ignore the part where I (clearly) said they'd have to add something else. And by that I mean a younger player/asset that can grow with our young group.

 

 

It absolutely matters - if you're taking on that cap hit over an additional year, a player that lacks the versatility that Lucic does - not getting pushed around is simply not enough from/out of Lucic - and debatable whether he even has that effect at this point.  I agree that ideally your toughest player would be a forward as opposed to defenseman, but the infrequency with which almost all NHLers fight nowadays, it's not really as much of an issue as it was in the past, but still a few reasons why it's better to have a forward being the bottom line.

 

I very clearly said that moving up two spots - which is what you were proposing - is not even close to enough compensation - so no, not 'everyone is conveniently ignoring' the part - I specifically responded to your proposal.

[Alflives]

8 minutes ago, oldnews said:

It absolutely matters - if you're taking on that cap hit over an additional year, a player that lacks the versatility that Lucic does - not getting pushed around is simply not enough from/out of Lucic - and debatable whether he even has that effect at this point.  I agree that ideally your toughest player would be a forward as opposed to defenseman, but the infrequency with which almost all NHLers fight nowadays, it's not really as much of an issue as it was in the past, but still a few reasons why it's better to have a forward being the bottom line.

 

I very clearly said that moving up two spots - which is what you were proposing - is not even close to enough compensation - so no, not 'everyone is conveniently ignoring' the part - I specifically responded to your proposal.

For the Oilers to dump Lucic they will need to add that 8 OA pick.  His contract has a full NMC.  He takes up a protected spot for the Seattle expansion!  That's a huge negative.

For us to take Milan (who I don't mind as a knuckle dragger) would cost a lot.  

[Freeridebc]

18 minutes ago, Alflives said:

For the Oilers to dump Lucic they will need to add that 8 OA pick.  His contract has a full NMC.  He takes up a protected spot for the Seattle expansion!  That's a huge negative.

For us to take Milan (who I don't mind as a knuckle dragger) would cost a lot.  

Totally agree alfy

[KKnight]

23 minutes ago, Alflives said:

For the Oilers to dump Lucic they will need to add that 8 OA pick.  His contract has a full NMC.  He takes up a protected spot for the Seattle expansion!  That's a huge negative.

For us to take Milan (who I don't mind as a knuckle dragger) would cost a lot.  

I think it would really stem on that nmc being waved once he's traded. If he can be put up for the expansion draft, I wouldn't be against it. They would definitely have to sweeten the package though. 

[aGENT]

5 minutes ago, KKnight said:

I think it would really stem on that nmc being waved once he's traded. If he can be put up for the expansion draft, I wouldn't be against it. They would definitely have to sweeten the package though. 

It's still leverage against EDM in any deal even if it would be permanently waived in a trade. Either they pay up with added assets in trade or be forced to keep him and waste an ED protection spot, a roster spot and tens of millions of dollars.

 

It also helps that he can basically dictate where he'll move to, further subtracting EDM leverage (and he has mentioned VAN as a place he'd like to play...it could even be his only/one of the few places).

 

I really don't think some CDC members quite grasp how over the barrel EDM is with any potential deal and how much leverage any potential acquiring team has or how much of a negative asset his contract is considered (NVM what anyone thinks of the actual player or person). They're going to have to pay A LOT to get rid of his contract. And even MORE than that if they don't want comparable salary coming back.

[Alflives]

4 minutes ago, aGENT said:

It's still leverage against EDM in any deal even if it would be permanently waived in a trade. Either they pay up with added assets in trade or be forced to keep him and waste an ED protection spot, a roster spot and tens of millions of dollars.

 

It also helps that he can basically dictate where he'll move to, further subtracting EDM leverage (and he has mentioned VAN as a place he'd like to play...it could even be his only/one of the few places).

 

I really don't think some CDC members quite grasp how over the barrel EDM is with any potential deal and how much leverage any potential acquiring team has or how much of a negative asset his contract is considered (NVM what anyone thinks of the actual player or person). They're going to have to pay A LOT to get rid of his contract. And even MORE than that if they don't want comparable salary coming back.

Exactly.  It's like the Kesler deal we had to make, only way worse, because Kesler was a top Selke player, and Lucic is not even an NHL player any more.  

If we do take Lucic the Oilers would have to add 8 OA and Poolparty.  Or, take back Loui, and take out Poolparty.  

[Provost]

7 hours ago, shiznak said:

I’m talking about fans on this particular forum, who have a strong disdain for Lucic.

They will realize that he isn’t as bad as their imagination has invented.

 

A couple hockey analysts have said he isn’t that slow and still tests at the top of the team in conditioning.  He was just handling the puck like a grenade last season.  That is a solveable issue and more likely to be reversed than losing his legs would be.

 

We have a long history of liking tough players and embracing them.  The first face he punches after someone runs Hughes will make them forget everything before that moment.

 

 

[grandmaster]

The more I think about this, the more this trade makes sense for everyone involved. 

 

I had had my reservations before but I now think this is a no brainer. 

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, grandmaster said:

The more I think about this, the more this trade makes sense for everyone involved. 

 

I had had my reservations before but I now think this is a no brainer. 

What do the Oilers have to add though, for us to take Milan?

[dpn1]

Would it be a good deal for us if LE and our 10th pick for ML and their 8th pick.  Just curious. 

Edited May 30, 2019 by dpn1

[erkayloomeh]

13 minutes ago, Alflives said:

What do the Oilers have to add though, for us to take Milan?

How does him coming to us affect the expansion draft spots for us.  Who do we stand to lose if we have Lucic vs. who we may lose if we don't have him? It's one more player we can't protect. Who might that be? Take the worst case scenario and an equivalent player needs to be added to the trade coming our way in addition to the player we get for taking on the contract. 

So 8th overall plus a roster player or an additional pick worth the value of what we might lose. 

Does that make sense ?

[dpn1]

1 minute ago, erkayloomeh said:

How does him coming to us affect the expansion draft spots for us.  Who do we stand to lose if we have Lucic vs. who we may lose if we don't have him? It's one more player we can't protect. Who might that be? Take the worst case scenario and an equivalent player needs to be added to the trade coming our way in addition to the player we get for taking on the contract. 

So 8th overall plus a roster player or an additional pick worth the value of what we might lose. 

Does that make sense ?

My understanding is that his his NMC is gone if he is traded and thus will be eligible for the expansion draft. 

[KKnight]

49 minutes ago, aGENT said:

It's still leverage against EDM in any deal even if it would be permanently waived in a trade. Either they pay up with added assets in trade or be forced to keep him and waste an ED protection spot, a roster spot and tens of millions of dollars.

 

It also helps that he can basically dictate where he'll move to, further subtracting EDM leverage (and he has mentioned VAN as a place he'd like to play...it could even be his only/one of the few places).

 

I really don't think some CDC members quite grasp how over the barrel EDM is with any potential deal and how much leverage any potential acquiring team has or how much of a negative asset his contract is considered (NVM what anyone thinks of the actual player or person). They're going to have to pay A LOT to get rid of his contract. And even MORE than that if they don't want comparable salary coming back.

I definitely agree theyre in a bad place. 

[aGENT]

8 minutes ago, erkayloomeh said:

How does him coming to us affect the expansion draft spots for us.  Who do we stand to lose if we have Lucic vs. who we may lose if we don't have him? It's one more player we can't protect. Who might that be? Take the worst case scenario and an equivalent player needs to be added to the trade coming our way in addition to the player we get for taking on the contract. 

So 8th overall plus a roster player or an additional pick worth the value of what we might lose. 

Does that make sense ?

You've got it backwards, his NMC would be waived IF MOVED. The cost will be to EDM on what they would lose in the ED if they don't pay up to move him and are forced to protect him.

 

(Plus the opportunity loss/cost on having a $6m 4th liner and no cap space to put a competitive team around McD/Drai).

[mll]

Re the NMC.

 

The expansion draft is a movement.  A demotion to the AHL is also a movement.  A NMC protects from both.  Lucic saw Benning not hesitate to waive Gagner and send him to the AHL.  He might only waive on the condition that the NMC gets re-instated - not because of the expansion draft but to prevent from a demotion to the AHL.  Come expansion he could then still agree to waive his NMC but only for expansion.  

[aGENT]

13 minutes ago, dpn1 said:

Would it be a good deal for us if LE and our 10th pick for ML and their 8th pick.  Just curious. 

 

On 5/28/2019 at 1:11 PM, aGENT said:

Rather keep 10th and gain another asset. There's pretty minimal value difference between the 8 and 10 picks.

 

I'm in no hurry to see us do EDM a favour, certainly not for peanuts.

 

On 5/28/2019 at 3:30 PM, theo5789 said:

These factors suggest to me that they would have to give up quite a bit in return even if LE is headed back the other way. Swapping 8 and 10 means nothing really, but swapping their 8 for our 40 is more reasonable. Even then I think I'd prefer more to be added simply because of what they will be gaining by moving Lucic.

 

On 5/28/2019 at 11:05 PM, theo5789 said:

There's value from going to 8 to 10, but not enough value for me to make this deal. What is the add? It would still take quite a bit more because you have to consider what Edmonton is gaining here by dumping Lucic. Getting a get out of jail free card should not come cheap.

 

On 5/29/2019 at 6:50 AM, aGENT said:

 

I see Theo largely covered what I was going to write.

 

Boldy could be gone by 8 or make it to ten anyway. And if he's gone, there's a good chance someone we had ranked higher has fallen. I'm not saying there's no value, there's just not a LOT of value. And that value would depend heavily on who's still available at 8.

 

[aGENT]

5 minutes ago, mll said:

Re the NMC.

 

The expansion draft is a movement.  A demotion to the AHL is also a movement.  A NMC protects from both.  Lucic saw Benning not hesitate to waive Gagner and send him to the AHL.  He might only waive on the condition that the NMC gets re-instated - not because of the expansion draft but to prevent from a demotion to the AHL.  Come expansion he could then still agree to waive his NMC but only for expansion.  

And Benning politely says 'no thanks' and calls the deal off.

[PhillipBlunt]

2 minutes ago, aGENT said:

And Benning politely says 'no thanks' and calls the deal off.

At this stage in the game, Lucic would be silly to make a demand that any clause waived as part of a trade be reinstated by the team receiving him in a trade.

 

His focus should be solely on doing whatever he can to stay relevant in the league. Demanding that a clause be reinstated would make him come off as tone deaf to the reality of the situation.

[Wolfgang Durst]

 

Not an overly interesting discussion from a fantasy perspective, but Jason Gregor was on TSN1040 on Tuesday and revealed that he has a source who confirmed that the Canucks had strongly considered moving Loui Eriksson to Edmonton for Milan Lucic. I'm not exactly sure why this would be the case as Lucic has an additional year on his terrible contract. Additionally, after a July 1st bonus is paid out, Eriksson's real money owed will be substantially lower than his cap hit – something floor-reaching teams are often interested in. 

 

I am so relieved that this discussion apparently came to an end in the Canucks front office. Sounds like they are no longer considering this swap (Lucic / Eriksson). Would have liked:

to VAN: Lucic + Edmonton's 1st 2019 + Edmonton's 2nd 2019.

[aGENT]

5 minutes ago, Wolfgang Durst said:

I'm not exactly sure why this would be the case as Lucic has an additional year on his terrible contract. Additionally, after a July 1st bonus is paid out, Eriksson's real money owed will be substantially lower than his cap hit – something floor-reaching teams are often interested in.

Because it wouldn't be a straight swap of contracts. VAN would have been looking for some serious sweetener, even with LE going the other way.