So do you want Horvat to captain this team, or do you want to draft a generational player?

[189lb enforcers?]

9 hours ago, Adarsh Sant said:

Not disagreeing with you. I think Horvat is the right guy.

 

But saying the Sedins/Naslund weren't captain or playoff material is ignorant. So many former coaches, teammates, management were gushing about their leadership abilities when Sedins retired. Just go listen to Hank or Danny talk about Naslund. Or go listen to one of the 100+ former teammates talk about how the Sedins treated new/incoming players.

I find that the only ignorance here lies within the imaginings of those in here who are claiming that Naslund and the Sedins were playoff warrior types. 

 

Agree to disagree. I have my preferences, feel free to enjoy yours. 

 

[spur1]

1 hour ago, 189lb enforcers? said:

I find that the only ignorance here lies within the imaginings of those in here who are claiming that Naslund and the Sedins were playoff warrior types. 

 

Agree to disagree. I have my preferences, feel free to enjoy yours. 

 

FYI ...Your bias is showing. 

[189lb enforcers?]

4 minutes ago, spur1 said:

FYI ...Your bias is showing. 

Is this a site for impartial commentary?

 

 

[NHTyrany]

The team should always have a Captain.

 

Should it be Bo? Only those much closer to the team can offer true perspective on the question.

 

Aside from game play, everything we see and hear is coloured by the media and/or spin doctors. It would be repugnant and foolish for a team to chose a Captain as a marketing ploy or contract concession. I think teams have (Phany, McJesus, Crosby) and it's not always disastrous. But the right choice is not always obvious to the fans. Small example: did Brock decide to be a prom date or was it the advice of an "image consultant"? I don't know as this is the illusory world of stardom. Captaincy is deeper than public image and stats.

 

My preference would be to have the Captain hand back the C at the end of each year for reconsideration and lessened media controversy/hype.  

[spook007]

On 17/04/2018 at 6:21 AM, Nuxfanabroad said:

Let's give Bo a K. This might spark rumours that Van is pondering to join the KHL. Bettmang will panic, & grant us two straight #1 OA's. It's clever.

Actually...best plan in a long time...

We need a new way of thinking.... 

[Rob_Zepp]

[alt kilgore]

On 2018-04-16 at 8:50 PM, tas said:

At face value, the obvious answer to that question is, "how are those two things related and yes to both." Normally, the only two things pretty much universally agreed upon here are that Horvat is the captain in waiting and that the Canucks would benefit (duh) from drafting a generational talent. Here's a little food for thought: those things can't really go together. 

 

In 2018, the captain is almost always the team's best, highest paid, most marketable player. The days of having a less heralded, character guy as captain are pretty much entirely gone. This is especially true with generational players. They captain their teams. Even the ones you wouldn't expect to end up  captaining their teams (Ovechkin, Erik Karlsson).

 

Which leads us to Horvat. If you name him captain, the only way that'll change is if he retires, signs elsewhere, or gets traded. There is no scenario where you make the guy captain, take it away, and have him stay with the team. What happens when you name him captain and then the team sucks again next year and wins the 1st overall?

 

That's why the best plan is to go with no captain next year. You draft in June, play the year, draft again NEXT June. and then see what you have in the system. If you have a guy that is going to be the face of the franchise, you throw the C on Sutter or Gudbranson until the kid is ready and give Bo an A. If you don't, you give Bo the C and you better stop building and start winning. 

Although not always true, and examples have been listed, IMO using the "most marketable player" to be your captain is just another form of marketing by the team. It has less impact on the room itself. The captain just has to have great character, be consistent, a hard worker every night, who leads by example, and sticks up for his team mates. Also is required to do things like talk to the refs if needed, and the press even if not needed.  Bo fulfills all of those requirements.  My gawd if some are saying that Bo is too young to be captain, but they also want some as yet mystery 'generational player', then how much longer do we have to wait until we do get another superstar rookie to grow up and take that on? 

 

The other alternative is to give it to a more veteran player on the team. But right now, IMO, we have no veterans that are worthy of that honour and responsibility and/or do not have the temperment. And also, any plan that involves some kind of "bridge" captain is doomed to fail. Because then your point about how difficult it is to take it away kicks in.

 

I have full confidence that Bo is the most captain material guy on the team. His age is perfect IMO. Young enough to grow with the team,  but experienced enough that has been around long enough to gain mentoring from Henrik, shown he has great character, is competitive, and a productive points producer as well.

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, kilgore said:

Although not always true, and examples have been listed, IMO using the "most marketable player" to be your captain is just another form of marketing by the team. It has less impact on the room itself. The captain just has to have great character, be consistent, a hard worker every night, who leads by example, and sticks up for his team mates. Also is required to do things like talk to the refs if needed, and the press even if not needed.  Bo fulfills all of those requirements.  My gawd if some are saying that Bo is too young to be captain, but they also want some as yet mystery 'generational player', then how much longer do we have to wait until we do get another superstar rookie to grow up and take that on? 

 

The other alternative is to give it to a more veteran player on the team. But right now, IMO, we have no veterans that are worthy of that honour and responsibility and/or do not have the temperment. And also, any plan that involves some kind of "bridge" captain is doomed to fail. Because then your point about how difficult it is to take it away kicks in.

 

I have full confidence that Bo is the most captain material guy on the team. His age is perfect IMO. Young enough to grow with the team,  but experienced enough that has been around long enough to gain mentoring from Henrik, shown he has great character, is competitive, and a productive points producer as well.

Bo will be our next Captain; he's perfect for that role.  However, our team will (likely) suck badly for another season or two, until Demko is ready to take over as our starter.  So, maybe the organization will not have a Captain, but have 4 assistants instead to shelter Bo from the losing questions, when it's just crappy goal tending?

[alt kilgore]

27 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Bo will be our next Captain; he's perfect for that role.  However, our team will (likely) suck badly for another season or two, until Demko is ready to take over as our starter.  So, maybe the organization will not have a Captain, but have 4 assistants instead to shelter Bo from the losing questions, when it's just crappy goal tending?

IMO, I think having a captain helps with creating the identity of the team. Consolidating it sooner. And the sooner the better. The greatest captains in the NHL have all mostly been named relatively young.  I have confidence that Bo has the character to deal with any questions after losing games next season.  I think we will be better next year, anyways, especially as the season progresses, so that will help.

 

When you suggested 4 assistants I had an image of 4 players all standing in a row after a bad game and the first saying "Do you want to take this one?" to the second, who says to the third "Do you want to take this one?", who says to the fourth, "Do you want to take this one?".

[Nuxfanabroad]

1 hour ago, Rob_Zepp said:

Might be the 2018 story good feel?

[Alflives]

25 minutes ago, kilgore said:

IMO, I think having a captain helps with creating the identity of the team. Consolidating it sooner. And the sooner the better. The greatest captains in the NHL have all mostly been named relatively young.  I have confidence that Bo has the character to deal with any questions after losing games next season.  I think we will be better next year, anyways, especially as the season progresses, so that will help.

 

When you suggested 4 assistants I had an image of 4 players all standing in a row after a bad game and the first saying "Do you want to take this one?" to the second, who says to the third "Do you want to take this one?", who says to the fourth, "Do you want to take this one?".

Good point.  What does it say about Management's and TG's feelings about Bo as a leader if they don't choose him next season?  

[alt kilgore]

1 hour ago, Alflives said:

Good point.  What does it say about Management's and TG's feelings about Bo as a leader if they don't choose him next season?  

Meh, I think its all but been decided anyways, so debate about it is moot. TG and company just don't want to look like they are just gifting him the C.

I'd be shocked if it is anyone else. And I'd also be shocked if they went with no captain. If he is not named by training camp, its because he has privately told them he doesn't want it. Which I doubt.  Think of another scenerio, if it is someone else named C. Some underproducing vet forward or Edler and he falls back to his last season's playing standard, who then will be a lame duck captain on his way out.  And then Bo, with a healthy year, shines, especially with a Burr under his saddle because of the rejection. People thought 1040 was negative on the team now! We have enough on this team to worry about without a drawn out captaincy controversy.  

[apollo]

On 4/16/2018 at 9:06 PM, Master Mind said:

That's already happened with Luongo, Brown, Marleau, and Thornton, and they've been fine since.

True... they've been "Fine" ... but it could be noted that the move hasn't led to success. None won a cup after being stripped. Had to double check when Brown lost it... and yup he was captain for both cups.

 

Although it could be argued Vancouver won the cup in 2011 so Lui stepping down in 2010 was a direct factor of having less pressure. Also that was a goalie.

 

TBH not sure where I'm going with this post now... was trying to make a point but then the I remembered we really were the better team in 2011 and had the cup had the Old Boys Club not interfered

 

[Master Mind]

5 hours ago, apollo said:

True... they've been "Fine" ... but it could be noted that the move hasn't led to success. None won a cup after being stripped. Had to double check when Brown lost it... and yup he was captain for both cups.

 

Although it could be argued Vancouver won the cup in 2011 so Lui stepping down in 2010 was a direct factor of having less pressure. Also that was a goalie.

 

TBH not sure where I'm going with this post now... was trying to make a point but then the I remembered we really were the better team in 2011 and had the cup had the Old Boys Club not interfered

 

None won cups, but 3 of them went to the finals after stepping down from the C. And Brown just had a pretty solid season.

 

My point is that none of them just faded away because they weren't captain anymore. So there's no need to worry about giving it to Horvat in fear that we could never take it off him (not that we'd ever need to anyway).

 

 

[Baggins]

On 18/04/2018 at 11:51 AM, Rob_Zepp said:

[Rush17]

On 2018-04-18 at 12:20 PM, Alflives said:

Bo will be our next Captain; he's perfect for that role.  However, our team will (likely) suck badly for another season or two, until Demko is ready to take over as our starter.  So, maybe the organization will not have a Captain, but have 4 assistants instead to shelter Bo from the losing questions, when it's just crappy goal tending?

What about this kid Alf?

 

 

^^ just sayin 

[Rush17]

Elias Pettersson

Bo Horvat

Adam Gaudette

 

Down the middle long term gives me goosebumps.

[Alflives]

2 minutes ago, Rush17 said:

What about this kid Alf?

 

 

^^ just sayin 

The kid is crazy good, that's for sure.  He's driven to be the best too.  He sounds like Bo, when it comes to being internally motivated.  With the leadership of our team be in these guys' hands.  I think we will be fine.  I doubt anyone will outwork Bo and Pettersson on and off the ice.  Future is BRIGHT!!

[Rush17]

7 minutes ago, Alflives said:

The kid is crazy good, that's for sure.  He's driven to be the best too.  He sounds like Bo, when it comes to being internally motivated.  With the leadership of our team be in these guys' hands.  I think we will be fine.  I doubt anyone will outwork Bo and Pettersson on and off the ice.  Future is BRIGHT!!

As bright as this top shelf!

 

 

[189lb enforcers?]

Whether Bo gets the C this season or next is all there is to discuss in here, and it’s beyond us to say, so, end of.