Geoff Courtnall to return to Canucks?

[Timråfan]

7 minutes ago, Westcoasting said:

He sounds like a mamas boy! Too scared to be away from home

A local boy maybe.

It seems you guys have a hard time understanding loyalty and what it feels to play for the club that raised you as a youngster.

 

In Sweden players can be in the same club all their playing career. From youth to SHL.

Mamas boy… Where do you guys come from.

[JM_]

28 minutes ago, Timråfan said:

Lol, you stepped up a notch.

 

I hope he stays away from NHL but the risk is Sharks want him back. 
 

all you have to do is compare Hoglander to Dahlen, and you have your answer as to why one is here an the other isn't. 

 

I doubt that JD would appreciate the victim you are portraying him as either.

[Westcoasting]

Just now, Timråfan said:

A local boy maybe.

It seems you guys have a hard time understanding loyalty and what it feels to play for the club that raised you as a youngster.

 

In Sweden players can be in the same club all their playing career. From youth to SHL.

Mamas boy… Where do you guys come from.

It’s not about loyalty... the dude isn’t good enough to make it to the NHL.

[oldnews]

8 hours ago, oldnews said:

I'll take Trevor Linden - and the job he did - all over again, in a heartbeat.

I'll take that a step further.

 

Manny Malhotra would be 100% welcome back behind our bench imo.

Burrows - would be a worthy candidate for a job.

Ryan Johnson, Stan Smyl, etc - lots of Canucks that have plenty of promise as professionals in the game post playing days.

 

And to be clear - none of that is an endorsement for - or against - Courtnall - I'm not going to prejudge the guy one way or the other.

 

But lots of franchises tap into their former players for executives - the Coilers may be a good example of 'why not to do that', or when it goes too far / with suffering results - but if we make 'categorical' decisions like that -  let a fear of Oilerizing, or an inferiority complex as if former Canucks shouldn't be considered/wouldn't be worthy  - that too could be just another 'Canuck' styled mistake - just as an Yzerman passes through the ranks, 'we' disqualify them based on an imperative that doesn't take homegrown candidates seriously.

Edited May 16, 2021 by oldnews

[Timråfan]

1 minute ago, Jimmy McGill said:

all you have to do is compare Hoglander to Dahlen, and you have your answer as to why one is here an the other isn't. 

 

I doubt that JD would appreciate the victim you are portraying him as either.

And I don’t have a problem with that.

Höglander fits NHL perfectly, Dahlen doesn’t.

 

Again, a GM should never talk about his current or ex player in that way. Benning should know that what he say can start a hatestorm on the net and therefor stay away from that.

 

So it hasn’t got a thing to do with Dahlen.

When you and others bring up Dahlen you try to take away the criticism from Benning.

 

[JM_]

1 minute ago, Timråfan said:

 

When you and others bring up Dahlen you try to take away the criticism from Benning.

 

how is Benning supposed to control what some anonymous person tweets? be realistic, a GM can't bother thinking about that kind of crap. 

[Timråfan]

23 minutes ago, Fred65 said:

I must say that is a dumb thing to say, for any one. Your chnaces of  negotiating  a contract is flushed as the words cross his lips

Well, if he only wants to play for Timrå in SHL, why care about that.

If the Sharks want him or if Timrå steps down it’s a new situation regarding contract.

And, not everything in life is money.

[Timråfan]

2 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

how is Benning supposed to control what some anonymous person tweets? be realistic, a GM can't bother thinking about that kind of crap. 

So why do you and others bring up Dahlen every time I talk about how bad Benning behaved? 
 

[Dazzle]

20 minutes ago, ShawnAntoski said:

Great points !   Those two (with there overall track record) has certainly shown that they are very good leaders by first becoming great students 

Kind of hilarious how a billionaire, among the top 25 in Canada, would be questioned for their business acumen by Canucks fans.

[ShawnAntoski]

3 minutes ago, Dazzle said:

Kind of hilarious how a billionaire, among the top 25 in Canada, would be questioned for their business acumen by Canucks fans.

Just seeing it from a pro hockey business point of view and  not questioning, Aquamans' accomplishment; two separate topics, imo.

Edited May 16, 2021 by ShawnAntoski

[Fred65]

23 minutes ago, Timråfan said:

A local boy maybe.

It seems you guys have a hard time understanding loyalty and what it feels to play for the club that raised you as a youngster.

 

In Sweden players can be in the same club all their playing career. From youth to SHL.

Mamas boy… Where do you guys come from.

Talking of Mamas boys 

 

Courtnall actually played 13 season on the east coast, Bruins, Washington  and St L. that's like a long way from home  ...  4800 kms I believe

[Fred65]

1 hour ago, Timråfan said:

Well, the way your coaches in NA thinks is a bit neanderthal.

Weisbroad called it as he is a ”hockey” kind of guy as a reason he stepped down from Orlando Magics.

so Weisbroad knows he’s a bit neanderthal in todays sport.

If that's what you want to call it, fine, me I call it successful  

[Dazzle]

1 hour ago, Fred65 said:

I'm not so sure about Courtnall knowing the game. If you recall the "building" of the likes of Sakic and Yzerman it took time, they became students of the management which included the roles of scouting in the back end of Saskabush in February or North Dakota and over time they learned the intrigue of management, Cap problems and the role of a Farm team, player development etc etc. Courtnall is ( like Linden ) property business which is not exactly a similar business. He will be better than FA but still sees the game through a players eyes. The loss of Gilman was a tragedy he had all the acumen of the required knowledge. The Canucks would not miss FA and this IMO is just another pathetic attempt to rally fan support for another season. By hiring Courtnall he displays his total lack of understanding, I believe FA thinks being an owner is like being super fan

 

So here's the thing.

 

Sakic and Yzerman have made a ton of mistakes during their tenure, as everyone inevitably does. While your point about the Courtnall/Linden hirings being akin to figureheads has some merit, the issue is that all teams have made internal hirings all the time. And there is nothing wrong with that. Alain Vigneault, for instance, was not a noted scorer, and yet he has crafted a lengthy coaching career (whether or not he has his flaws as a coach is beside the point). It's safe to say that former players UNDERSTAND the game, having played it. Vigneault was, I believe, promoted within Montreal. Eventually he made his way to Vancouver for a brief time, before going over to Philly.

 

Now, the most problematic parts of your post is about "He will be better than FA" - FA is the owner, not a general manager (not similar to Yzerman/Sakic, in other words). The closest comparison to what you're trying to say may be Mario Lemieux. And he's had his share of 'meddling' too, as every owner who has an interest in the team does.

 

Ultimately, it's safe to say that FA cares about this team equally as all of us fans, considering he is also a VERY vocal Canuck fan, as well as a business owner. He doesn't own any other teams to my knowledge, so the Canucks is his baby. We also know that FA has spent a lot of money in the past to improve the Canucks (whether this be by free agency, or through the upgrading of locker rooms/facilities, as suggested by Gillis). How soon do people forget about this. FA has gone through all the periods that we have enjoyed, as well as the suffering of the team.

 

 

[Timråfan]

2 minutes ago, Fred65 said:

If that's what you want to call it, fine, me I call it successful  

Do you think Weisbroad was successful with the Magics?

[Dazzle]

1 hour ago, oldnews said:

Patrick Johnston gets his information from a banana, so there's that.

I lost all respect for him when he judged Lind in the limited amount of games he has thus far in this season.

 

"Meh, he can play hockey".

 

This guy is dumb.

[Fred65]

2 minutes ago, Dazzle said:

So here's the thing.

 

Sakic and Yzerman have made a ton of mistakes during their tenure, as everyone inevitably does. While your point about the Courtnall/Linden hirings being akin to figureheads has some merit, the issue is that all teams have made internal hirings all the time. And there is nothing wrong with that. Alain Vigneault, for instance, was not a noted scorer, and yet he has crafted a lengthy coaching career (whether or not he has his flaws as a coach is beside the point). It's safe to say that former players UNDERSTAND the game, having played it. Vigneault was, I believe, promoted within Montreal. Eventually he made his way to Vancouver for a brief time, before going over to Philly.

 

Now, the most problematic parts of your post is about "He will be better than FA" - FA is the owner, not a general manager (not similar to Yzerman/Sakic, in other words). The closest comparison to what you're trying to say may be Mario Lemieux. And he's had his share of 'meddling' too, as every owner who has an interest in the team does.

 

Ultimately, it's safe to say that FA cares about this team equally as all of us fans, considering he is also a VERY vocal Canuck fan, as well as a business owner. He doesn't own any other teams to my knowledge, so the Canucks is his baby. We also know that FA has spent a lot of money in the past to improve the Canucks (whether this be by free agency, or through the upgrading of locker rooms/facilities, as suggested by Gillis). How soon do people forget about this. FA has gone through all the periods that we have enjoyed, as well as the suffering of the team.

 

 

Well between you and me I'd take Sakic or Yzerman over Benning  any day of the week. Both spent a couple of years learning the ropes and  apparently absorbed the building locks of management from some of the best. Unfortunately Benning sat at the knee of Peter Chiarelli, he of Oilers fame and no longer managing. There is a difference 

[Fred65]

5 minutes ago, Timråfan said:

Do you think Weisbroad was successful with the Magics?

No .... 

[shiznak]

4 hours ago, tas said:

I'm as much a linden fan as the next guy, but what can we conclusively say was "the job he did?" we all speculate and prognosticate and deduce and theorize, but we really don't have a goddamn clue what's going on behind the scenes, who or what is the impetus for which decisions and actions. 

 

we should let sleeping dogs lie with trevor. it didn't work out for reasons good or ill, let's leave it at that. 

Well, for one he revamped the scouting department, promoted Brackett and hired a GM with a scouting background. He brought in WD. While his coaching philosophies wasn’t well liked by fans. WD did improve the team’s record by 20+ points from the previous season and rejuvenated the Sedins’ career.

[Dazzle]

1 hour ago, Fred65 said:

Well between you and me I'd take Sakic or Yzerman over Benning  any day of the week. Both spent a couple of years learning the ropes and  apparently absorbed the building locks of management from some of the best. Unfortunately Benning sat at the knee of Peter Chiarelli, he of Oilers fame and no longer managing. There is a difference 

Ok.

 

Benning also established himself as one of the best scouters. For each Sakic or Yzerman story, there is a Markus Naslund one, who if I remember correctly, didn't stay for very long as a MODO Swedish hockey GM.

Dorion (Ottawa Sens GM) is also a famed scouter. He's made plenty of mistakes himself. In short, Sakic/Yzerman probably were set up for success better than Benning/Dorion. Look at the teams of Colorado and Tampa, but particularly Tampa.

[Dazzle]

1 hour ago, shiznak said:

Well, for one he revamped the scouting department, promoted Brackett and hired a GM with a scouting background. He brought in WD. While his coaching philosophies wasn’t well liked by fans. WD did improve the team’s record by 20+ points from the previous season and rejuvenated the Sedins’ career.

While it's true that WD did do some good things, he didn't end up being a winning NHL coach. This carried over to the LA Kings, who probably had a better roster than whatever Vancouver gave him. Ultimately, he never coached in the NHL again, at least not right now.

 

I feel like TG will end up going down this pathway, since his win/loss rate is not dissimilar to WD, despite having a much better roster overall than whatever WD had.

Edited May 16, 2021 by Dazzle