[Trade] Canucks trade Jay Beagle, Loui Eriksson, Antoine Roussel, 2021 1st-round pick, 2022 2nd-round pick, 2023 7th-round pick to Coyotes for Oliver Ekman-Larsson, Conor Garland

[dougieL]

It boggles my mind that some are still unable to see this trade for the absolute disaster that it was. OELs contract was an anchor the second we acquired it.

 

Think about how much it costed the Leafs to unload Marleau's 6m for just one season. Then consider the fact that we sent 12m for one season to ARZ while they sent us Garland and 6 seasons of OEL at 7.26m. Who do you think should have paid extra assets to make the trade work? Obviously it's ARZ.

 

We put the 9th overall on the table, which is ridiculous. Then ARZ asked for an ADDITIONAL second round pick, which is even more ridiculous. Then the Sedins convinced Benning to pay it, which is just absurd.

[dougieL]

It might be crazy to say this but we might have actually been able to use Eriksson and Beagle last year on the PK, especially early in the season when it was getting torched.

[combover]

3 minutes ago, dougieL said:

It boggles my mind that some are still unable to see this trade for the absolute disaster that it was. OELs contract was an anchor the second we acquired it.

 

Think about how much it costed the Leafs to unload Marleau's 6m for just one season. Then consider the fact that we sent 12m for one season to ARZ while they sent us Garland and 6 seasons of OEL at 7.26m. Who do you think should have paid extra assets to make the trade work? Obviously it's ARZ.

 

We put the 9th overall on the table, which is ridiculous. Then ARZ asked for an ADDITIONAL second round pick, which is even more ridiculous. Then the Sedins convinced Benning to pay it, which is just absurd.

I agree with everything. trade was a shortsighted and Ill conceived hall marks of the JB and Francesco era. 

 

However 

I’d like to see where and how ( any media story or report) 

the sedins convinced jim who was a perineal over spender.

he tried and failed a year earlier zona knew they had that idiot on  the hook and he was in job saving mode after yet another disaster season.

 

 

[dougieL]

Just now, combover said:

I agree with everything. trade was a shortsighted and Ill conceived hall marks of the JB and Francesco era. 

 

However 

I’d like to see where and how ( any media story or report) 

the sedins convinced jim who was a perineal over spender.

he tried and failed a year earlier zona knew they had that idiot on  the hook and he was in job saving mode after yet another disaster season.

 

 

It was during an interview Benning did on SN650.

[combover]

Just now, dougieL said:

It was during an interview Benning did on SN650.

So Benning said it. The so called GM said that the newly hired zero experience  sedins convinced him to add more to get him. 

[dougieL]

3 minutes ago, combover said:

I agree with everything. trade was a shortsighted and Ill conceived hall marks of the JB and Francesco era. 

 

However 

I’d like to see where and how ( any media story or report) 

the sedins convinced jim who was a perineal over spender.

he tried and failed a year earlier zona knew they had that idiot on  the hook and he was in job saving mode after yet another disaster season.

 

 

He talked about how Arizona came back to ask for a second round pick and the Sedins convinced him to add it because of just how much they believed in OEL.

[dougieL]

2 minutes ago, combover said:

So Benning said it. The so called GM said that the newly hired zero experience  sedins convinced him to add more to get him. 

Yes. I'm not saying Benning is blameless, but he was counting on the Sedins familiarity with OEL and their assessment of him as a player. They were clearly wrong, but I agree - Benning holds the ultimate responsibility.

[Alflives]

3 minutes ago, combover said:

So Benning said it. The so called GM said that the newly hired zero experience  sedins convinced him to add more to get him. 

I remember the interview too.  Benning said he like OEL from when he managed Boston and felt if OEL played in the east he'd have won a Norris or two.  Benning loved OEL and thought the guy had actual value.  There were rumors galore that Benning tried to get OEL the summer previous too, but OEL wouldn't waive his NTC, or something like that.  

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, dougieL said:

Yes. I'm not saying Benning is blameless, but he was counting on the Sedins familiarity with OEL and their assessment of him as a player. They were clearly wrong, but I agree - Benning holds the ultimate responsibility.

I think if OEL had a very stout, smart, hard to play against partner he'd be a top four guy.  I wonder how OEL would do with Schenn?

[canuck73_3]

44 minutes ago, Alflives said:

I remember the interview too.  Benning said he like OEL from when he managed Boston and felt if OEL played in the east he'd have won a Norris or two.  Benning loved OEL and thought the guy had actual value.  There were rumors galore that Benning tried to get OEL the summer previous too, but OEL wouldn't waive his NTC, or something like that.  

Deal fell through, only teams he waived for were Boston and Van. 

[jyu]

On 12/2/2022 at 6:11 PM, dougieL said:

It boggles my mind that some are still unable to see this trade for the absolute disaster that it was. OELs contract was an anchor the second we acquired it.

 

Think about how much it costed the Leafs to unload Marleau's 6m for just one season. Then consider the fact that we sent 12m for one season to ARZ while they sent us Garland and 6 seasons of OEL at 7.26m. Who do you think should have paid extra assets to make the trade work? Obviously it's ARZ.

 

We put the 9th overall on the table, which is ridiculous. Then ARZ asked for an ADDITIONAL second round pick, which is even more ridiculous. Then the Sedins convinced Benning to pay it, which is just absurd.

Let's compare to Marleau + 1st as cap dump.

 

To dump 6 mil, they gave up 1st rounder, at the time it was considered 20th overall or lower. No one saw the COVID and Leafs to burn out of the play-in round and end up giving up 13th overall.

 

To dump Beagle, Roussel, and Eriksson's 12 mil, the cost of 9th overall + 2nd sort of makes sense in that regard. Although, why we gave up the 9th overall pick when we weren't cap crunched like the Leafs with Marleau is questionable. Could've just ride out the contracts.

 

And if we look at OEL as a cap dump (6 times 7.2 mil = 42 mil), then they should have sent us way more than Garland or retained far more than 1 mil.

 

So, yeah that deal was bad for us. My gut feeling say that they didn't scout OEL all that much. If they did, they should have known that his skating has deteriorated significantly.

 

One caveat is that OEL is not purely a cap dump in the way Marleau was. He is still a roster player, capable of playing in the top 4, just not as effectively as he once did. So not all of 42 mil is a cap dump.

 

If the Coyotes retained 3 mil to bring down OEL's cap numbers to around 5 mil, I think we can stomach it even if he declines over the next few years.

 

Benning made a lot of questionable decisions post the bubble run. 

 

 

[jyu]

On 12/2/2022 at 6:29 PM, Alflives said:

I think if OEL had a very stout, smart, hard to play against partner he'd be a top four guy.  I wonder how OEL would do with Schenn?

OEL's weakness is that he isn't quick to the puck. NHL is getting younger and fresh legs are coming in every season so it's going to get worse.

 

Schenn is also slow footed but he makes the forecheckers cringe and look behind their shoulders as they go into the corners to retrieve the puck. Schenn doesn't go for the puck, he knows he's getting beat. He just takes the body. And that's pretty effective I'd say.

 

So, yeah it could work out. But then, the teams will dump the puck on OEL's side almost all the time and Schenn, who isn't quick, will not be able to help OEL retrieve the puck.

 

To cover up OEL's weakness, Bear is the right type of defenceman. It would be good if the guy brouhg some physicality as well, maybe a player that is an amalgamation of Schenn and Bear? I'd say Pronger would be a great partner for OEL 

 

[jyu]

On 12/2/2022 at 6:24 PM, dougieL said:

He talked about how Arizona came back to ask for a second round pick and the Sedins convinced him to add it because of just how much they believed in OEL.

If Benning made a decision to add a 2nd based on the Sedins, then he should have been fired right there.

 

Sedins have retired in 2017, that's when OEL was still good. Obviously, they would only have good things to say.

 

When you make a deal like that, you better send scouts and go through proper evaluation. 

 

[dougieL]

We gave up years of cap flexibility and paid to get an anchor contract just so we could do what? Not suck for a single season? Well guess what...we still sucked that season.

 

Now Arz is laughing with all their available cap space while we'll be in cap hell for years on end. Imagine what we could do right now with 12m in cap space. 

 

I'll never get over the outright stupidity of this trade.

[coryberg]

13 hours ago, dougieL said:

Now Arz is laughing

Yep! All 3000 fans in their tiny little arena, watching their 31st place team lose night in and night out while any player who shows a pulse is sent packing. They are most certainly laughing.

[rekker]

On 12/7/2022 at 6:33 PM, dougieL said:

We gave up years of cap flexibility and paid to get an anchor contract just so we could do what? Not suck for a single season? Well guess what...we still sucked that season.

 

Now Arz is laughing with all their available cap space while we'll be in cap hell for years on end. Imagine what we could do right now with 12m in cap space. 

 

I'll never get over the outright stupidity of this trade.

Was it a smart trade? No. It is what it is, but I'm not willing to call it a total loss yet. Team D is a total mess. I still say find OEL the right partner, a stay at home steady D like Schen, and OEL will stabilize. 

Edited December 9, 2022 by rekker

[HKSR]

Not gonna lie, I supported Benning all along, but this trade even had me baffled.

 

We could have waited 1 more year.  1 more year and we would have had all the flexibility we needed. 

[DeNiro]

56 minutes ago, HKSR said:

Not gonna lie, I supported Benning all along, but this trade even had me baffled.

 

We could have waited 1 more year.  1 more year and we would have had all the flexibility we needed. 

Benning was so obviously just making it up as he went. 
 

Like every free agent signing or trade was made because the player wanted to be in Vancouver. Yet he still overpaid every time.

 

OEL said he only wanted to come here or Boston. So Benning became obsessed with acquiring him.

 

Eriksson was another one who clearly wanted to play with the Sedins, yet he still gave him a ridiculous deal.

 

Same thing with Myers too. We were clearly his number 1 choice yet again we paid market value.

 

Its like he had none of his own targets in mind he just waited for players to say they wanted to come here.

 

Edited December 8, 2022 by DeNiro

[ilduce39]

1 hour ago, rekker said:

Was it a smart trade? No. It is what it is but I'm not willing to call it a total loss yet. Team D is a total mess. I still say find OEL the right partner, a stay at home steady D like Schen, and OEL will stabilize. 

I was certainly on team “take your medicine” regarding the Eriksson crew’s contracts.   I wouldn’t have done this deal.  

 

But I agree - I don’t think it’s the disaster some paint it as.  OEL is producing at about a 40 point pace despite being PP2.  Plus despite some more limited minutes the past few weeks is still #2 in ice time.  
 

People get hung up on his contract but you’re going to be paying *someone* around that much to play those minutes and put up those points.  It could always be more efficient but I don’t think flopping to the ground and giving up on the next 5 years is the answer.

 

[BC_Hawk]

5 minutes ago, ilduce39 said:

I was certainly on team “take your medicine” regarding the Eriksson crew’s contracts.   I wouldn’t have done this deal.  

 

But I agree - I don’t think it’s the disaster some paint it as.  OEL is producing at about a 40 point pace despite being PP2.  Plus despite some more limited minutes the past few weeks is still #2 in ice time.  
 

People get hung up on his contract but you’re going to be paying *someone* around that much to play those minutes and put up those points.  It could always be more efficient but I don’t think flopping to the ground and giving up on the next 5 years is the answer.

 

I agree; we will only get a sense of where we are at with OEL once the defense has been rebuilt. At this point, we are just watching a unit that is lacking a system, proper coaching, and the right personnel.