Elias Pettersson | Quinn Hughes - Contract Discussion Thread

[McBackup]

Just now, spook007 said:

It was more due to the cherry picking from Combover...

Its all very nice and easy to say, you should pay the the stars first, and then the rest later, but there may not be anyone you like later.

And more importantly, even the best players have to be kept within a certain price range... 

 

 

Not to mention if you have control over the stars rights, you're not going to be nearly as worried about missing out on signing them as players who can openly talk to other teams with no recompense coming your way.

[JM_]

20 minutes ago, wai_lai416 said:

who's going to trade you any asset for a player that they don't even know if they'll sign with you or not? unless there's an agreement they are going to sign no one will give you anything of significant. it's not like you can say well i'll dump him to buffalo or wherever bottom feeding team for so and so and see how he likes that. 

the agents will already have that sorted. 

[spook007]

7 hours ago, Timråfan said:

Loui gave Horvat stability and look what happened to him. 

If Loui nhad been putting the puck into the net more frequently, nobody would have been complaining. He was still a good defensive forward, just not 6M good....

[JM_]

Lets pull back a bit here on the Petey and Quinn anger. If you're 22, and your agent tells you to wait a week and I'll make you another 5 or 10 million, you'd wait too. 

 

 

[-DLC-]

23 minutes ago, Zhukini said:

You can defend the team, I just think it’s a little confusing because as Jack defends his brother saying that he was on a bad team last year and that he’s better than what he showed…

 

 

Thing is....when you're demanding to be paid top dollar you have to show it.  We've learned, firsthand, how it's important to budget and, moving forward, we'll have many with star potential who'll want to get paid.   

 

Don't get me wrong...love Quinn and his offensive flair.  Would hate to lose this kid.

 

But, at this point, maybe one of the reasons we've been "bad" (according to the observers on the Devils, lol) is that size and strength do matter on D?  That the point of a good d is...defending  (defence wins championships).   I do agree that Quinn was better when he had Tanev and putting the right supporting cast in place is important.  But if you're a top guy demanding top dollar it's important that you've proven why you've earned that.  Quinn is super agile and has offensive flair....but his size is becoming relevant in all of this to me.  You have to count on your d to....defend.  To clear the crease and battle for puck possession in order to get it out of your zone.  To be able to carry the puck without getting easily knocked off it.  He's been elusive and his skating can make up for some of his lack of strength/size...but is it enough?

 

I've defended Quinn but let's face it...if the team is "bad" according to his family camp's standards, he's part of that.  

I thought we're homers if we just totally defend all our players all the time?  Here I'm finally open to the fact that they may not be immune to criticism and all of a sudden, that's a bad thing?   Pick a side.

[kloubek]

22 minutes ago, FaninMex said:

Who signed the agent?

While not an invalid statement, virtually every player signs with an agent, and virtually every agent's job is to get their client the most favourable deal.

[KoreanHockeyFan]

This thread is turning into another classic indictment of our toxic fanbase - on both sides of the argument for these contract talks. 

 

Y'all need to relax. This type of behaviour (which is incredibly worse on anything Canucks-related for Twitter) is a big reason as to why players either outright don't want to play in the Vancouver market or demand more money because they know they're going to have their feet put to the fire when they play here.

 

Listen to Jason Dickinson's recent interview on the 31 Thoughts Podcast with Friedman and Marek, or even this week's interview with Travis Green on the Ray & Dregs podcast. Both Dickinson and Green "joke" about how "passionate" the Canucks fanbase is and how tough of a market it is. Brian Burke's been on the record multiple times talking about how the Canucks fanbase is borderline insane. Remember how we almost drove the Sedins out of town during the early 2000s? And that was before social media. We were lucky that they had the personalities of absolute angels. 

 

Take a day off from CDC and just let the negotiations run their course. I'd rather have these negotiations drag on for as long as they need rather than waste my time bashing Benning for how incompetent of a GM he is or criticizing Petey/Hughes for how greedy they're allegedly being - no solid source for this accusation either, all speculation. 

 

And don't even get me started on our media. My god. 

 

Relax people. 

[-DLC-]

4 minutes ago, KoreanHockeyFan said:

 

Y'all need to relax. This type of behaviour (which is incredibly worse on anything Canucks-related for Twitter) is a big reason as to why players either outright don't want to play in the Vancouver market or demand more money because they know they're going to have their feet put to the fire when they play here.

 

If players are using the pulse of the fanbase to "decide", that's on them not us.   

 

This fire was lit by a comment that likely shouldn't have been made, considering.  The fans here reacting to it aren't to blame for discussing it....I, for one, will defend this team for last year's "performance" and anyone not using facts to adequately assess the season is a little suspect to me.  

 

Yes, the team was bad last year.  But, under the circumstances.....

 

 

[McBackup]

1 minute ago, KoreanHockeyFan said:

This thread is turning into another classic indictment of our toxic fanbase - on both sides of the argument for these contract talks. 

 

Y'all need to relax. This type of behaviour (which is incredibly worse on anything Canucks-related for Twitter) is a big reason as to why players either outright don't want to play in the Vancouver market or demand more money because they know they're going to have their feet put to the fire when they play here.

 

Listen to Jason Dickinson's recent interview on the 31 Thoughts Podcast with Friedman and Marek, or even this week's interview with Travis Green on the Ray & Dregs podcast. Both Dickinson and Green "joke" about how "passionate" the Canucks fanbase is and how tough of a market it is. Brian Burke's been on the record multiple times talking about how the Canucks fanbase is borderline insane. Remember how we almost drove the Sedins out of town during the early 2000s? And that was before social media. We were lucky that they had the personalities of absolute angels. 

 

Take a day off from CDC and just let the negotiations run their course. I'd rather have these negotiations drag on for as long as they need rather than waste my time bashing Benning for how incompetent of a GM he is or criticizing Petey/Hughes for how greedy they're allegedly being - no solid source for this accusation either, all speculation. 

 

And don't even get me started on our media. My god. 

 

Relax people. 

Thanks for the sanctimony. 

 

 

[spook007]

10 hours ago, VancouverHabitant said:

Exactly, we somehow shot up from Barzal's 7x3 to these ridiculous numbers.  

 

This is mainly the fault of Rick Dhaliwal being such a mouthpiece for the agents, but now they are putting it in the public discourse that somehow Kiril Kaprizov's contract would be a comparable.  A contract that's not even signed.  

 

Logically, this is not a comparable as it's an event that hasn't happened.  They are trying to pump up Kaprizov's value and using all these players as leverage against each other and mostly against the teams.  

 

JP Barry is a slimeball.  This is the same guy that went on air last season and just laughed when asked about Loui's contract and how he has performed.  

He is a slimy agent... But I blame the players more than him. After all he is working for them, and not the other way around. 

Paul Pogba has a similar agent in football... Mino Raiola... Talk about the worst slime you can find. Hope Utd never sign another player from his stable...

 

[Provost]

4 minutes ago, KoreanHockeyFan said:

This thread is turning into another classic indictment of our toxic fanbase - on both sides of the argument for these contract talks. 

 

Y'all need to relax. This type of behaviour (which is incredibly worse on anything Canucks-related for Twitter) is a big reason as to why players either outright don't want to play in the Vancouver market or demand more money because they know they're going to have their feet put to the fire when they play here.

 

Listen to Jason Dickinson's recent interview on the 31 Thoughts Podcast with Friedman and Marek, or even this week's interview with Travis Green on the Ray & Dregs podcast. Both Dickinson and Green "joke" about how "passionate" the Canucks fanbase is and how tough of a market it is. Brian Burke's been on the record multiple times talking about how the Canucks fanbase is borderline insane. Remember how we almost drove the Sedins out of town during the early 2000s? And that was before social media. We were lucky that they had the personalities of absolute angels. 

 

Take a day off from CDC and just let the negotiations run their course. I'd rather have these negotiations drag on for as long as they need rather than waste my time bashing Benning for how incompetent of a GM he is or criticizing Petey/Hughes for how greedy they're allegedly being - no solid source for this accusation either, all speculation. 

 

And don't even get me started on our media. My god. 

 

Relax people. 

....or folks can feel free to discuss hockey stuff on a forum literally created and dedicated to discussing hockey stuff.


Relax dude.

[KoreanHockeyFan]

1 minute ago, -DLC- said:

If players are using the pulse of the fanbase to "decide", that's on them not us.   

 

 

I'd rather think of it from the point of view of how we as a fanbase have an impact on players' decisions to play here or their impression of Vancouver. Might as well get rid of the toxicity that we contribute to do our part to help attract the best players to Vancouver. 

[-DLC-]

10 minutes ago, KoreanHockeyFan said:

I'd rather think of it from the point of view of how we as a fanbase have an impact on players' decisions to play here or their impression of Vancouver. Might as well get rid of the toxicity that we contribute to do our part to help attract the best players to Vancouver. 

I don't want players who need coddling.  My personal opinion but, no player is bigger than the team.  The message I've sent all along.

If family members suggest the team is bad, there's not putting yourself above/outside of that.  You're part of that 'bad' team and accept some responsibility in that.  It's alienating to suggest otherwise.  In or out.

 

Not directing this at Quinn or Petey specifically...but more to the comments that we have to somehow use kid gloves.  They're men, they should decide on where they want to play mostly based on the team.  Their brothers in the trenches.  That stuff.  If they feel the team is trash...don't let the door hit ya.  This team deserves more respect than that.

[KoreanHockeyFan]

2 minutes ago, Provost said:

....or folks can feel free to discuss hockey stuff on a forum literally created and dedicated to discussing hockey stuff.


Relax dude.

I'm not saying you can't but I'm also pointing out how the discussion gets quite toxic at times, which is evidence of our fanbase's tendency to be.....well, quite hyperbolic. 

[JM_]

6 minutes ago, KoreanHockeyFan said:

This thread is turning into another classic indictment of our toxic fanbase - on both sides of the argument for these contract talks. 

 

Y'all need to relax. This type of behaviour (which is incredibly worse on anything Canucks-related for Twitter) is a big reason as to why players either outright don't want to play in the Vancouver market or demand more money because they know they're going to have their feet put to the fire when they play here.

 

is there a fan base outside of Toronto that's OK with overpaid mediocrity? there's nothing wrong with holding people to account for their salaries. 

 

But we also need to look at reality as well, if both player are demanding too much beyond their likely value you do have to look at some moves. 

 

Quinn is a special player, but he isn't worth 10 million aav. Neither is Petey. Can they be some day? sure, maybe. Its a risk. 

 

But lets not get mad at them, they are allowed to go try to get what they think they're worth. And conversely, the team needs to also shop that around if it looks like its overpriced. No one has to be the asshole in this, it can come to this honestly. 

[KoreanHockeyFan]

Just now, -DLC- said:

I don't want players who need coddling.  My personal opinion but, no player is bigger than the team.  The message I've sent all along.

It's not coddling. Whether you like it or not, players have leverage, so the burden is also on the team to make their market look as attractive as possible. 

 

This is nothing compared to the true coddling NBA and NFL teams have to do to attract superstars in their respective leagues. 

[Ghostsof1915]

Part of me totally understands, the angst, and fan's being anxious. These are two important pieces on the team. It's natural to get frustrated. Especially close to training camp. 

I don't think it helps when Hughes brother seems to add fuel to the fire. 

 

I think the fans just want this done. And get back to enjoying hockey. 

 

[KoreanHockeyFan]

6 minutes ago, McBackup said:

Thanks for the sanctimony. 

 

 

Snide comments don't help. 

 

Happy to debate this further, if you'd like.

[spook007]

9 hours ago, stawns said:

Why?  This is on Petey and Hughes.  I'd say most fans want to see JB stand his ground........no one wants this team to go down the TO path if possible.

 

To me, this looks bad on #40 and #43, not on JB

Thank you Stawns.... Spot on...

 

Unless it comes out that Benning offered them £2.50 and a soda pop, I don't see any reason to blame this on Benning... 

 

[thrago]

1 minute ago, Ghostsof1915 said:

Part of me totally understands, the angst, and fan's being anxious. These are two important pieces on the team. It's natural to get frustrated. Especially close to training camp. 

I don't think it helps when Hughes brother seems to add fuel to the fire. 

 

I think the fans just want this done. And get back to enjoying hockey. 

 

I think a big part of it is the scope of the money we are talking about.  It's hard for me to have sympathy for players who are likely to make 4x in 1 year what the average Canadian will make in a 40 year working career.