Gurn Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 13 minutes ago, Alflives said: Benning, for sure New guys, but you knew that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 7 minutes ago, Gurn said: New guys, but you knew that. Benning bad; new guys good. Like Gillis "The Great" the new guys are building us a winning club. They will sign Petey to an 8 year deal. Smart new guys. The opposite of Benning. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gurn Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 6 minutes ago, Alflives said: Benning bad; new guys good. Like Gillis "The Great" the new guys are building us a winning club. They will sign Petey to an 8 year deal. Smart new guys. The opposite of Benning. Benning bad, new guys not great., not really even good. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrJockitch Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 20 minutes ago, Alflives said: Benning, for sure. The new group is more like Gillis. They are building us a great club. The Benning stain is deep though, and will take more time to completely remove. Imagine if Benning was smart enough to have the cap available to sign both Quinn and Petey to 8 year deals. Benning There is such limited evidence to support this. Overspending on wing, filling bottom 6 with UFAs, age gap trades for terrible players. Question is am I talking about Benning or Allvin because it applies to both. Allvin just had more to work with when took over. So, Benning terrible, Allvin hasn’t proven to be anything different yet though the team did perform worse this year than last. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 2 minutes ago, DrJockitch said: There is such limited evidence to support this. Overspending on wing, filling bottom 6 with UFAs, age gap trades for terrible players. Question is am I talking about Benning or Allvin because it applies to both. Allvin just had more to work with when took over. So, Benning terrible, Allvin hasn’t proven to be anything different yet though the team did perform worse this year than last. Let old Alf have a bit more scotch before posting such funny stuff. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdgarM Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 Judging from their last signings(Miller,Kuzmenko) and how they dealt with Horvat, I am confident that Petterson will sign an appropriate contract. Boeser was an issue they inherited and I think they did the best they could from the short time they had to assess his situation. The biggest issue for them, I believe, is that Benning left them with little to work with and they won't be able to fully accomplish what they want to do until they start with a more clean slate. The last thing we need is a GM who will throw money out to its star players like its candy like what they did in Toronto. Its a pretty simple concept, you usually look to see if you can get the maximum amount of money out of your contract or you want to win at all costs. They typically don't usually go "hand in hand" its usually "one or the other". 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewbieCanuckFan Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, DrJockitch said: There is such limited evidence to support this. Overspending on wing, filling bottom 6 with UFAs, age gap trades for terrible players. Question is am I talking about Benning or Allvin because it applies to both. Allvin just had more to work with when took over. So, Benning terrible, Allvin hasn’t proven to be anything different yet though the team did perform worse this year than last. After 7 years of Jim Benning & high picks/in lottery contention, I should hope so. (In truth, the farm system Alvin inherited was no better than under the horrible drafting under Gillis that Benning inherited. That should tell you something). Edited June 2, 2023 by NewbieCanuckFan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spook007 Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 2 hours ago, Gurn said: Management has also shown they are able to sign over value contracts as well. Which one are you referring to? Miller? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spook007 Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 2 hours ago, Gurn said: Benning bad, new guys not great., not really even good. Is that because of the path they've chosen, or the contracts they've signed? Some may not agree on the chosen path forward, but I think the contracts signed up to now are pretty decent. The big qurstion will be answered over the next year with Peteys contract, but Mika, Kiz and JTM are pretty good and close to market value. And the bottom 6 has been signed to cheap contracts... it remains to be seen, if they have to pay the piper for spending to the cap, but until we see them screwing up, I will give them an above average grade. It was always going to be hard and perhaps painful to sort the mess out. Big decisions had to be made, and it remains to be seen, if it was the right direction, but I remain optimistic until proven differently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spook007 Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 2 hours ago, DrJockitch said: There is such limited evidence to support this. Overspending on wing, filling bottom 6 with UFAs, age gap trades for terrible players. Question is am I talking about Benning or Allvin because it applies to both. Allvin just had more to work with when took over. So, Benning terrible, Allvin hasn’t proven to be anything different yet though the team did perform worse this year than last. Age gap trades for terrible players by Allvin. Please explain? Which players are you talking about? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdgarM Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 36 minutes ago, spook007 said: Which one are you referring to? Miller? 23 minutes ago, spook007 said: Is that because of the path they've chosen, or the contracts they've signed? Some may not agree on the chosen path forward, but I think the contracts signed up to now are pretty decent. The big qurstion will be answered over the next year with Peteys contract, but Mika, Kiz and JTM are pretty good and close to market value. And the bottom 6 has been signed to cheap contracts... it remains to be seen, if they have to pay the piper for spending to the cap, but until we see them screwing up, I will give them an above average grade. It was always going to be hard and perhaps painful to sort the mess out. Big decisions had to be made, and it remains to be seen, if it was the right direction, but I remain optimistic until proven differently. 19 minutes ago, spook007 said: Age gap trades for terrible players by Allvin. Please explain? Which players are you talking about? I think you are scratching your head just like I am. Reasonable contracts, not backing down from stars demands, not going after older, over paid players I am not sure what the complaint is about really. I am sure the team is not how they would like it to look but some changes have to wait.(i.e. contracts run out or players get traded for reasonable offers etc.). 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spook007 Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 7 minutes ago, EdgarM said: I think you are scratching your head just like I am. Reasonable contracts, not backing down from stars demands, not going after older, over paid players I am not sure what the complaint is about really. I am sure the team is not how they would like it to look but some changes have to wait.(i.e. contracts run out or players get traded for reasonable offers etc.). Yeah, I think the contracts given out has been one of the positive changes by the new management team. They will be making mistakes, everyone does, but so far I struggle to find a real negative. And as you rightly say, Rome wasn't built in one day...if some contracts can't be shifted, they will just have to run out and we will just have to live them until that happens. JR/PA are managers not magicians... 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gawdzukes Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 3 hours ago, Gurn said: Benning bad, new guys not great., not really even good. I'm waiting to see what happens with Bear. If they give him a multi year deal I'm going into semi-retirement. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 2 minutes ago, Gawdzukes said: I'm waiting to see what happens with Bear. If they give him a multi year deal I'm going into semi-retirement. Likely Bear gets a one year deal. But what if it's a multi year deal for 2 per? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdgarM Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 8 minutes ago, spook007 said: Yeah, I think the contracts given out has been one of the positive changes by the new management team. They will be making mistakes, everyone does, but so far I struggle to find a real negative. And as you rightly say, Rome wasn't built in one day...if some contracts can't be shifted, they will just have to run out and we will just have to live them until that happens. JR/PA are managers not magicians... Exactly, it's not like they turned down a 10 Million per year offer or traded Petey straight up for Mitch Marner or something ridiculous like that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ted Lasso Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 18 hours ago, wai_lai416 said: matthews current contract that's set to expire is somewhat of a closer comparable.. if matthew ends up at 13 13.5mil which is very realistic.. it can be a ballpark figure for EP.. obviously he won't get 13 13.5mil.. but is matthew 2-3mil better than EP?? Can matthews hit those numbers without a 10million+ playmaking winger? if EP have a playmaking winger like a marner what kind of number stat wise can he hit? so far in his tenure.. i don't think there's another player on this team that played with more different linemates than EP and i don't think it's even close.. and other than that 1 season with Miller.. i don't think we can legitimately say EP have played with any elite linemates.. 95% of them are average to just good enough.. the 5% being Miller and maybe Kuz but i don't think hes at the elite level yet.. so really we don't know what EP is actually capable of if put together with a legitimate winger that compliments him.. like marner to matthew.. draisital to mcdavid mackinnon to rantanen etc.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gurn Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 2 hours ago, spook007 said: Which one are you referring to? Miller? Brock. And in my view Miller's deal is a bit too much, for a bit too old a guy, for more than a bit too long; at the wrong time for a deal like that to be signed, in the first place. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gurn Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 1 hour ago, spook007 said: Is that because of the path they've chosen, or the contracts they've signed? some of the signings, the brutal way they handled Bruce's dismissal. Not even knowing that Bruce had an extra year. All completely bush league. Getting fined for breaking the CBA- so much for 'super star' management. Hiring and firing Rachel Dorrie. New guys have already burned through a lot of good will, and they are early into their tenure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostsof1915 Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 17 minutes ago, Gurn said: some of the signings, the brutal way they handled Bruce's dismissal. Not even knowing that Bruce had an extra year. All completely bush league. Getting fined for breaking the CBA- so much for 'super star' management. Hiring and firing Rachel Dorrie. New guys have already burned through a lot of good will, and they are early into their tenure. So every company has a perfect track record of hiring and firing? Sounded to me Rachel had some baggage of her own that she brought. Maybe Rachel shouldn't have been hired in the first place? As for the CBA, Arizona did far worse. Coaches and teams have done stupid stuff and been fined. You'd have an argument if the team kept getting fined for violating the CBA for the same infraction over and over. Yes the Bruce issue was bad optics. I would have liked to have seen it handled differently and more respectfully. However it looked to me, management should have started talks with Ric, and advised they'd hire him in the offseason. But maybe Vancouver wasn't the only suitor? We don't know the whole story. Has the new management made deals like Benning in the OEL trade? Nope. Maybe give it another season before you lop off managements heads. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gurn Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 6 minutes ago, Ghostsof1915 said: So every company has a perfect track record of hiring and firing? Now, just where did I say that? 6 minutes ago, Ghostsof1915 said: As for the CBA, Arizona did far worse. 2 wrongs do not make a right, or do they in today's world? 7 minutes ago, Ghostsof1915 said: Maybe Rachel shouldn't have been hired in the first place? Probably not, looks like a failure of due diligence. 8 minutes ago, Ghostsof1915 said: Maybe give it another season before you lop off managements heads Maybe give it another season, before defending their decisions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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