This is Getting Harder to Ignore

[aGENT]

1 minute ago, Hutton Wink said:

And I'm going to again point to the new goalie equipment.  Have yet to see how long it takes for them to adapt, and certainly some will better and more quickly than others.  Could well force some right out of the league, those who relied too heavily on their gear.

Just as much (or more) to do with speed and skill of the game and the increase in calls on hooking, holding etc IMO.

[oldnews]

4 minutes ago, aGENT said:

There isn't really a basis to make either claim.

 

Actually there's a basis to both the idea that shooting % would 'return to the mean" and likewise, the sv% also would.

 

 

What there isn't a basis to = expecting that the team will be unable to remain competitive.   There's no real basis for that.

 

The reverse claim - that they will sustain this - is not being made.

 

There's only one claim there.

 

That sport is unpredictable refutes that.

 

[Gaudette Celly]

1 minute ago, aGENT said:

Just as much (or more) to do with speed and skill of the game and the increase in calls on hooking, holding etc IMO.

That's part too, but we've seen an awful lot of goals going "through" goalies like never before, especially between their arms and bodies.

[oldnews]

5 minutes ago, Hutton Wink said:

And speaking of, it appears he will be joining EP's line tomorrow morning.  Hopefully this helps somewhat with the "brutal IQ" pejorative some continue to berate him with, because even in limited time yesterday he didn't look out of place with him.

 

And I'm going to again point to the new goalie equipment.  Have yet to see how long it will take for them to adapt, and certainly some will better and more quickly than others.  Could well force some right out of the league, those who relied too heavily on their gear.

goalie equipment is one factor - another is the tendency for early season scoring that tightens up as the season progresses.

 

the positive there is that Toronto had their scoring bursts earlier in the season - so the Canucks is thereby more sustainable lol.

[Isam]

Just now, oldnews said:

goalie equipment is one factor - another is the tendency for early season scoring that tightens up as the season progresses.

 

the positive there is that Toronto had their scoring bursts earlier in the season - so the Canucks is thereby more sustainable lol.

We shall se though. We might into some horrid injuries man.

[Davathor]

18 hours ago, Nuxfanabroad said:

Also calculate their goaltending could improve, when Nilsson returns.

 

[EdgarM]

54 minutes ago, Hutton Wink said:

Based on what, exactly?  It's not like they're getting superstar goaltending that's holding them in, or getting flukey goals to luck-out wins.  It's like saying the trapping 90's Lemieux Devils play was "unsustainable".  It's about the way they're playing, not lucky bounces.

 

And they won because of work ethic and determination.  How is that not sustainable, unless players decide "Hey, I'm tired of working hard and winning.  Let's ease up and stop that nonsense."

 

If we don't have the depth, then why are the results still there despite the injuries to key players?  How are we "surviving"?  Again, there's no flukes, lucky bounces, or Vezina goaltending bailing us out.  And as for "crap division", 5 of the top 10 and 7 of the top 12 teams in the conference are from the Pacific.  Every division has 5 or more teams .500 or better.

Its odd that people are not seeing the main reason we are more successful this year. We lost a lot of our "hard work ethic" and "character" and "leadership" last year when Dorsett went down and then Bo got injured. What were we left with? Other key leadership players went down too such as Sutter.

With Bo and other character players still playing, we have been able to stay afloat even with a lot of key injuries. Back in the 90's, this team won a lot of games just by sheer determination alone. This bodes well when you are decimated by key injuries or when you play key games in the playoffs like the SCF!

Things are definitely looking better in the near future for this team.

[Phat Fingers]

19 hours ago, debluvscanucks said:

You lost me here:

 

There is no question the Canucks are not ready to be consistently competitive in the March/April sense and will fall short of the playoffs this yearI

 

 

 

 

I feel like people who say this are just covering their bases.  If we don't, they say "I told you so".  If we do, they get to be pleasantly surprised. 

 

Of course there's "question".

 

Why not just let it be?  Watch, enjoy and not have to project?  I have faith in this group and can honestly see them exceeding all expectations...they already are.  Let's leave it at that? 

 

I feel it does them a disservice to do this.  They believe so let's just give them that.

 

I do like what you go on to say, but just don't understand why people have to make proclamations of what we will or won't do.  No one knows, that's the beauty of it all.

There will be a slump/slow down at some point but I like your moxie.  

 

This team is fearless of losing. They also believe they can compete.  There are some gaps in the lineup that will only

be filled by untested rookies by season’s end unless a significant roster move or two. 

 

JB already identified the hole RHD PP or really just a PPQB.  So will Hughes or OJ be able to play at a playoff level in the NHL...?  Will the current team come back to earth, or are we witnessing a new powerhouse in Vancouver? 

 

Its not impossible, the confidence and mix on the roster is really good otherwise. They will only get better as a group, baring injuries. 

 

As for depth, that’s there atm. Center depth.  Check. (Horvat. EP40, Sutter, Beagle, Gaudette, Gaunce and Granlund.)

 

Top six forward depth.  Check. (Leading the NHL in goals with our top scoring player from last year still getting going) 

 

Defensive Depth.  Check. 

I know I will get slagged for

this but we have depth. We still played a decently with Tanev and Edler out. We do lack top end offensive guys at the NHL level. 

 

If JB can find a way to get a PPQB, why couldn’t this team find itself in the mix? 

 

This team has has already weathered injuries and found ways to win.  Horvat has elevated his game to a whole other level.  He has shown an ability to put this team on his back when EP40 or Brock is out or not firing on all cylinders.  Clutch and a cross between Rod Brind’a’mour and Trevour Linden. 

 

EP40, he is the real deal. A generational talent that will be the best player in club history. 

 

Brock, Mr Fabulous himself. This guy just got his moxie going prior to the injury. He will be fine when he returns.  

 

That’s three first line guys.  Each will be a threat every game hey play and teams won’t be able to shut them all down easily. 

 

Top six guys,

Virtannen has pushed himself into this conversation.  Every time he scores, he gains confidence.  The puck luck seems to have found him and the bounces are going his way. 

 

Goldy, Becoming a good setup guy. The skill is there, he has had some looks, but hasn’t found his range yet. Still improving and will get better with his current minutes. 

 

I would really like to see a trial line of Goldy, EP40 and Virtannen.  Or sub Granlund in for Goldy and put Goldy with Bo and Brock until Baer returns. 

 

Baer, he has produced at a second line rate, injuries have been racking up too though. 

 

Will the real Granlund please step forward.  This year, Granlund has cemented his X factor. Playing like he did 2 years ago.  Doing everything he is asked. I see a guy that can play up and down the lineup and not hurt the team. 

 

Eriksson???  Is that last game a sign of things to come??  Could the 6 million dollar man have a comeback or is he done until the next game against Boston?

 

Depth, role playing forwards. 

 

Beagle, Sutter, Gaudette, Schaller, Rousel, Gaunce Lespic and Motte are doing a good job. 

 

We need to get Beagle and Sutter back, but if healthy, this forward group is good enough to make the playoffs. 

 

Defence. 

 

Edler is able to log big minutes.

 

Tanev is a shot suppression machine.  Last night he looked a bit rusty. 

 

Gudbranson, Bronson is tough and has the league thinking twice about tangling with him. 

 

Hutton.  After the last two years, I had written him off. Glad he has made a fool out of me. 

 

Stecher.  He has the potential to have a bigger impact on the team. Clearly a heart and soul guy that bleeds Canucks colours. 

 

Pouliot. He is the Hutton of this year. Can he put it together?  

 

MDZ depth guy that is maligned, but would get 3rd from any team in the league at the TDL as a depth player. 

 

Beiga.  Prefect 7/8 guy. 

 

X Factor.  Could Hughes be like adding a Shattenkirk at the TDL?  

 

Can OJ be a roster player by the TDL, or a relief guy?  

 

The wild card.  Will that crazy Russian pull another Ivan and use a late season run to setup contract talks next year. 

 

With the way Markstrom and Nielsen have played this year, can they keep it up, we are legit if they do. If they return to last season’s form, lotto here we come. 

 

[Me_]

19 hours ago, debluvscanucks said:

You lost me here:

 

There is no question the Canucks are not ready to be consistently competitive in the March/April sense and will fall short of the playoffs this yearI

 

 

 

 

I feel like people who say this are just covering their bases.  If we don't, they say "I told you so".  If we do, they get to be pleasantly surprised. 

 

Of course there's "question".

 

Why not just let it be?  Watch, enjoy and not have to project?  I have faith in this group and can honestly see them exceeding all expectations...they already are.  Let's leave it at that? 

 

I feel it does them a disservice to do this.  They believe so let's just give them that.

 

I do like what you go on to say, but just don't understand why people have to make proclamations of what we will or won't do.  No one knows, that's the beauty of it all.

Didn’t know how to feel or even answer the OP.

 

This.

[Bertuzzi44ever]

2 hours ago, Hutton Wink said:

Based on what, exactly?  It's not like they're getting superstar goaltending that's holding them in, or getting flukey goals to luck-out wins.  It's like saying the trapping 90's Lemieux Devils play was "unsustainable".  It's about the way they're playing, not lucky bounces.

 

And they won because of work ethic and determination.  How is that not sustainable, unless players decide "Hey, I'm tired of working hard and winning.  Let's ease up and stop that nonsense."

 

If we don't have the depth, then why are the results still there despite the injuries to key players?  How are we "surviving"?  Again, there's no flukes, lucky bounces, or Vezina goaltending bailing us out.  And as for "crap division", 5 of the top 10 and 7 of the top 12 teams in the conference are from the Pacific.  Every division has 5 or more teams .500 or better.

I’m not the one that said it there basing it on the fact vancouvers defensemen and goaltending were both bottom five coming in and there has to be at least one year of transition from the Sedins. Even if Petterson scores more which barring injury he will that doesent leave us offensively even in the greatest position. 

 

Im not saying we will definitely lose

im not saying tank for Hughes I’m just saying this team is playing better then they actually are as of now. We have all the makings of a contender in the future, don’t vilify me for agreeing with them as a realist. I also won’t fisagree with you either and based on it’s been five weeks. That’s it. There’s many stretches and the flames haven’t been getting goaltending the sharks have the fitnesses Jones and Karlsson going and the the oilers management is ridiculous not giving snipers a chance. Neal and puujivairy as in top two lines m, forget earning it if they have a chance to make team better they should. The coyotes aren’t ready either but them and the Canucks are a nice story.

 

With the ducks and kings and maybe vegas having all regressed that being in this division could help our playoff hopes and I most certainly wish we get there but don’t bash me for having this opinion that isn’t all rainbows and butterfly’s the same way I won’t bash you for thinking that way either.

 

 

[riffraff]

2 hours ago, oldnews said:

yes - teams like Boston simply no longer have a grit/toughness edge over this team the way they used to.

few teams actually do.

Gud, Schaller, Archibald, Horvat, Roussel, Virtanen....is about as tough/heavy as any team that wants to get in their face.

So that element has been somewhat balanced imo - while at the same time remaining focused on players that can skate, that are effective shutdown players/can defend and play the game - and those tougher elements do not reduce the tempo the team plays at, while making them harder to play against. 

In addition - a bit of a side point - but I'd argue that Sutter, Granlund, Beagle - these guys may not be 'tough', or stereotypical grit/bottom six players - but they are hard to play against / suffocating / frustrating - and that can also lead to an edge in other areas of the game.

Probably not lost on you but, we haven’t mentioned yet in the theme of the last couple posts is, two players: gaudette and motte who do not shy away from any battle.  I know you’re a big motte supporter and I have to say his game last night was very impressive.  I don’t think he got on the score sheet but his forecheck/puck pursuit was inspiring.  Man, when he hurt his arm on that play and just kept going - gutsy as it gets.

 

gaudette is due.  Really liked him last night.  His detail and willingness to finish checks is commendable at this level at his age.  Kind of makes me wish he was a winger right now as l, nothing against Sven but, this kid has skill to go along with the grit required if we are talking playoffs.  

[GreyHatnDart]

46 minutes ago, Phat Fingers said:

There will be a slump/slow down at some point but I like your moxie.  

 

This team is fearless of losing. They also believe they can compete.  There are some gaps in the lineup that will only

be filled by untested rookies by season’s end unless a significant roster move or two. 

 

JB already identified the hole RHD PP or really just a PPQB.  So will Hughes or OJ be able to play at a playoff level in the NHL...?  Will the current team come back to earth, or are we witnessing a new powerhouse in Vancouver? 

 

Its not impossible, the confidence and mix on the roster is really good otherwise. They will only get better as a group, baring injuries. 

 

As for depth, that’s there atm. Center depth.  Check. (Horvat. EP40, Sutter, Beagle, Gaudette, Gaunce and Granlund.)

 

Top six forward depth.  Check. (Leading the NHL in goals with our top scoring player from last year still getting going) 

 

Defensive Depth.  Check. 

I know I will get slagged for

this but we have depth. We still played a decently with Tanev and Edler out. We do lack top end offensive guys at the NHL level. 

 

If JB can find a way to get a PPQB, why couldn’t this team find itself in the mix? 

 

This team has has already weathered injuries and found ways to win.  Horvat has elevated his game to a whole other level.  He has shown an ability to put this team on his back when EP40 or Brock is out or not firing on all cylinders.  Clutch and a cross between Rod Brind’a’mour and Trevour Linden. 

 

EP40, he is the real deal. A generational talent that will be the best player in club history. 

 

Brock, Mr Fabulous himself. This guy just got his moxie going prior to the injury. He will be fine when he returns.  

 

That’s three first line guys.  Each will be a threat every game hey play and teams won’t be able to shut them all down easily. 

 

Top six guys,

Virtannen has pushed himself into this conversation.  Every time he scores, he gains confidence.  The puck luck seems to have found him and the bounces are going his way. 

 

Goldy, Becoming a good setup guy. The skill is there, he has had some looks, but hasn’t found his range yet. Still improving and will get better with his current minutes. 

 

I would really like to see a trial line of Goldy, EP40 and Virtannen.  Or sub Granlund in for Goldy and put Goldy with Bo and Brock until Baer returns. 

 

Baer, he has produced at a second line rate, injuries have been racking up too though. 

 

Will the real Granlund please step forward.  This year, Granlund has cemented his X factor. Playing like he did 2 years ago.  Doing everything he is asked. I see a guy that can play up and down the lineup and not hurt the team. 

 

Eriksson???  Is that last game a sign of things to come??  Could the 6 million dollar man have a comeback or is he done until the next game against Boston?

 

Depth, role playing forwards. 

 

Beagle, Sutter, Gaudette, Schaller, Rousel, Gaunce Lespic and Motte are doing a good job. 

 

We need to get Beagle and Sutter back, but if healthy, this forward group is good enough to make the playoffs. 

 

Defence. 

 

Edler is able to log big minutes.

 

Tanev is a shot suppression machine.  Last night he looked a bit rusty. 

 

Gudbranson, Bronson is tough and has the league thinking twice about tangling with him. 

 

Hutton.  After the last two years, I had written him off. Glad he has made a fool out of me. 

 

Stecher.  He has the potential to have a bigger impact on the team. Clearly a heart and soul guy that bleeds Canucks colours. 

 

Pouliot. He is the Hutton of this year. Can he put it together?  

 

MDZ depth guy that is maligned, but would get 3rd from any team in the league at the TDL as a depth player. 

 

Beiga.  Prefect 7/8 guy. 

 

X Factor.  Could Hughes be like adding a Shattenkirk at the TDL?  

 

Can OJ be a roster player by the TDL, or a relief guy?  

 

The wild card.  Will that crazy Russian pull another Ivan and use a late season run to setup contract talks next year. 

 

With the way Markstrom and Nielsen have played this year, can they keep it up, we are legit if they do. If they return to last season’s form, lotto here we come. 

 

Solid Hunt for Red October reference!

 

Edit: my apologies I didn’t realize this post was as long as it was, I’ll delete next time rather than bold lol

[Toyotasfan]

It seems every year has a team that defies the odds and takes the league by storm. All to often that team flounders the year after . Vegas was last year, Edmonton was the year before, Colorado before that, Calgary before that and on and on. Sometimes things just mesh perfect. Sometimes those teams go right to the finals, sometimes they fizzle first round. Then the tinkering begins, you might have a Gm that knows exactly what the team needs , or you might have a GM that just pays top dollar for the

biggest name on the market . If you’ve read about the latest NHL/MGM gambling deal they claim they have the most advanced computer generated plyometric statistics ever assembled to create the ultimate gambling experience. 

Yet I don’t think there’s any way to bet on this years Canucks. I can’t even decide on their next game never mind playoffs. 

Its exciting though

[stawns]

27 minutes ago, riffraff said:

Probably not lost on you but, we haven’t mentioned yet in the theme of the last couple posts is, two players: gaudette and motte who do not shy away from any battle.  I know you’re a big motte supporter and I have to say his game last night was very impressive.  I don’t think he got on the score sheet but his forecheck/puck pursuit was inspiring.  Man, when he hurt his arm on that play and just kept going - gutsy as it gets.

 

gaudette is due.  Really liked him last night.  His detail and willingness to finish checks is commendable at this level at his age.  Kind of makes me wish he was a winger right now as l, nothing against Sven but, this kid has skill to go along with the grit required if we are talking playoffs.  

Utica is still the best spot for Gaud once everyone is healthy though.  He needs to refine his offensive skills at this level and the A is the place to do it

[riffraff]

8 minutes ago, stawns said:

Utica is still the best spot for Gaud once everyone is healthy though.  He needs to refine his offensive skills at this level and the A is the place to do it

Who is on his line down there?

[GreyHatnDart]

8 minutes ago, riffraff said:

Who is on his line down there?

I’d assume Boucher, for one. 

[oldnews]

2 hours ago, riffraff said:

Probably not lost on you but, we haven’t mentioned yet in the theme of the last couple posts is, two players: gaudette and motte who do not shy away from any battle.  I know you’re a big motte supporter and I have to say his game last night was very impressive.  I don’t think he got on the score sheet but his forecheck/puck pursuit was inspiring.  Man, when he hurt his arm on that play and just kept going - gutsy as it gets.

 

gaudette is due.  Really liked him last night.  His detail and willingness to finish checks is commendable at this level at his age.  Kind of makes me wish he was a winger right now as l, nothing against Sven but, this kid has skill to go along with the grit required if we are talking playoffs.  

Definitely love the way Motte always attacks the heart of the play - and has the hockey intelligence / ability to read the play to do so very effectively (imo in a class with the great puck hounds like Hansen, Higgins and Burrows).   The thing about Motte though - he's this player at 21, 22, 23 yrs of age - very impressive imo - not often you see that quality of shutdown game at the NHL level that early in a career.   Big fan of the fact this team is targetting acquiring players like this (and Granlund) - and producing prospects like Virtanen, Gaunce within.  I think that's fundamental to developing an edge in the evolving game.

 

Leads the team in hits - slightly ahead of Gudbranson and Virtanen.

11 takeaways (3 giveaways, +8)

 

Gaudette likewise - and who knows what his potential will be.   He's playing a slightly bigger game each night it seems - and his minutes are growing from 8 to 10 in the beginning, to where he's at 15 minutes last night - and looking great.  It's funny all the talk about EP's size, but Gaudette is listed at 6'1" and 170 lbs in multiple places, including NHL.com - and just turned 22 - after being a college late-bloomer.  The fact that EP, Boeser get so much attention might be a positive for Gaudette - there's not a lot of pressure/spotlight (not such a desperate for youth fanbase at this point), while at the same time he probably nevertheless has the drive to join that bluechip group - which may be really good conditions to develop in.    You can see the two way hockey intelligence already for sure - and looks like he'll be a good faceoff guy at the NHL level.  From my take he's NHL ready - with a small sample thus far that is not ideal as he's stepping into relatively depleted lineups that are already heavy in youth and light in experience, but it doesn't seem to phase any of Green's guys.  Real luxury that the team has worked hard to build to - to have these kinds of guys on the edge of their roster, a player like this that they can freely move between Utica and Van and he fits in somewhat seemlessly - coming out of the 16/17ish spot on the depth chart.   Great depth relative to previous years.

[Westcoasting]

7 hours ago, Isam said:

&^@# it rob. Going on 96 points and being a bubble team. I think we can sustain the pace until late january early febuary. I wouldnt be too surprised though if this team pulled off a festivus miracle.

Francesco, i hear your team stinks! Now for the feats of strength... lol

[canucksnihilist]

23 hours ago, Rob_Zepp said:

There is no question the Canucks are not ready to be consistently competitive in the March/April sense and will fall short of the playoffs this year but the game in and game out effort, style of play and general growth of their young players is beyond anyone's expectation I am certain.   I would say, without doubt, they are the surprise of the league and if Green isn't seen as being the best coach out of the gate in the entire league, then someone isn't paying enough attention to what is happening out of west coast of Canada.

 

What is remarkable is that NO other team in the NHL, let alone the teams near them in the standings in the West like Calgary and Edmonton, are:

• Without arguable their best Dman who is also (for better or worse) their PP QB - he has only played in 10 or 17 games so far this year
• Without arguably their best goal scorer who isn't a freak of nature Swedish rookie - he has played 13 of 17 games this year and arguably many of them hampered
• Without arguably their most important free agent signing and one of the best face-off and PK specialists in the entire league and who has only played only 5 of 17 games
• Have had their other best Dman play in 13 of 17 games
• Have their third line center, and huge presence on PK, missing for past four games and counting
• Have their first line left winger only in 10 games so far this and likely gone for quite a while longer
• Their only NHL ready other goalie gone for several weeks already
• 10 of their first 17 games on the road and included on that would be against teams like Tampa, Pittsburgh, Winnipeg, Boston.....

 

IF you took those items above and said that was going to happen over the first 17 games, after coming off the one win exhibition season where goals were harder to come by than decorum at a White House press gathering, who would have projected this team to be four games over 500 and scoring at a rate they haven't done since winning President's trophies.    

 

I think this is getting harder to ignore.   I know they will hit a wall soon - they have to.   However, anyone who thinks this is not a team on the rise is nuts.   Watching players like Virtanen emerge, Hutton's resurrection, Horvat become part of the league's elite (in Boston he goes 14-16 in the dot and has 4 points....not star, SUPERstar), Guddy returning to the form they traded for and so forth is so inspiring but when you add in the very phenomena that is EP40 and know what is still coming from Utica and US College etc. - I guess "impossible to ignore" is more the right thing to say.

Really good points.  I would add that when something is rolling and working - don’t try to fix it.  There will be ups and downs and the team is up right now.   This is part of the learning process - they learn how to win, and how that feels.  And how to slack off and stilll win.  And how to suddenly not win anymore.  Then do everything to get it back.  Not sure where they will be at the end of the season but there will be mini cycles throughout the season.  Depends how short the lows are are, and how long the highs are.  Enjoy this stretch while we can!

 

/peace

[Westcoasting]

6 hours ago, stawns said:

The biggest thing for me is their ability to play a variety of styles and still outplay their opponents.  When they've played teams that play a tight, defensive style, they've been able to tighten up their games as well.  When they've managed to put up a cpl early goals and the other team is forced to open up the game, to try and get back in it, the Canucks have feasted on them.

 

I really don't see the way they are playing as an anomaly.  I think this is the way they've been built and the way that Benning wants Green to coach.

Honestly this is the best comment this season on how the Canucks are currently playing