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Jake Virtanen | #18 | RW


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8 minutes ago, Alflives said:

So you're kind of saying that we have yet to see a fit (proper weight too) Jake.  Heck, he might really be a very good player, when fit and 200 pounds?  

It seems to me that he got some bad advice or ignored advice about what would make him successful at the next level.

 

Some players seem to think that if they simply pack on the pounds to get as heavy as possible that it will give them a better chance of handling the physicality of the NHL. They fail to realize though that they've got to be able to have the cardio and stamina to carry around that extra weight. And that extra weight doesn't necessarily mean that they're going to be stronger.

 

I think he understands now that being 215-220 of solid muscle is better than being 240-245 of body fat, especially when he doesn't have the proper cardio to skate for a minute and a half with that weight. I think anyone who watched him closely would notice that he'd skate hard for about 20 seconds before he got burnt out, and that's when he would get caught not making the proper defensive plays. It's not that he didn't know where to be all the time, but rather he didn't have the stamina to get there in time.

 

Not uncommon for guys his age to find this balance. Less focus on weight and more focus on strength and stamina will do wonders for him.

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3 minutes ago, DeNiro said:

It seems to me that he got some bad advice or ignored advice about what would make him successful at the next level.

 

Some players seem to think that if they simply pack on the pounds to get as heavy as possible that it will give them a better chance of handling the physicality of the NHL. They fail to realize though that they've got to be able to have the cardio and stamina to carry around that extra weight. And that extra weight doesn't necessarily mean that they're going to be stronger.

 

I think he understands now that being 215-220 of solid muscle is better than being 240-245 of body fat, especially when he doesn't have the proper cardio to skate for a minute and a half with that weight. I think anyone who watched him closely would notice that he'd skate hard for about 20 seconds before he got burnt out, and that's when he would get caught not making the proper defensive plays. It's not that he didn't know where to be all the time, but rather he didn't have the stamina to get there in time.

 

Not uncommon for guys his age to find this balance. Less focus on weight and more focus on strength and stamina will do wonders for him.

I think it is far simpler than all of that.   He is a local guy to your in Vancouver - right?   When you are away from home, you have a smaller circle of friends and family in immediate reach and the temptations are far fewer on your down time.   He was 18, flush with cash and living large in his background while still Grade 12 age.   Should he have been able to avoid all of that and take his fitness more seriously?   In my opinion absolutely but I have seen it happen and he isn't first guy to succumb to hometown issues like that but many get over it and come out other side even better.   Let's see what guy shows up at camp before proclaiming either way.

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13 minutes ago, Freeridebc said:

He looks fat and lazy here.

Pfft he isn't even lifting it over his head. Maybe dangle a meatball sub above his head and he will show you what he can really do!

 

I honestly think for Virtanen it's a coaching issue. If they would reward his good performances with Subway gift cards so that he could get his meatball fix, he'd score 40 goals a season!

Edited by Where'd Luongo?
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2 minutes ago, Rob_Zepp said:

I think it is far simpler than all of that.   He is a local guy to your in Vancouver - right?   When you are away from home, you have a smaller circle of friends and family in immediate reach and the temptations are far fewer on your down time.   He was 18, flush with cash and living large in his background while still Grade 12 age.   Should he have been able to avoid all of that and take his fitness more seriously?   In my opinion absolutely but I have seen it happen and he isn't first guy to succumb to hometown issues like that but many get over it and come out other side even better.   Let's see what guy shows up at camp before proclaiming either way.

It could definitely be a big part of it.

 

But to me it seemed like his goal was to get to a playing weight of 240-245ish. He wouldn't be the first player to think that getting to this weight is the key to being a powerforward in the NHL.

 

I don't think that he wasn't working out, just working out in an ineffective way.

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12 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Wow!  How much weight is he squatting?  It looks like A LOT.

That is 8 total plates - probably Olympic weights (judging by bar) so likely 20 kgs (45s) and the bar will be 20 kg is standards which means he is squatting about 400 lbs - not bad at all but not insane either for a bigger dude.   It looks like there are some little weights there too - perhaps 420ish then.   Most on CDC would struggle for sure.

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16 minutes ago, Rob_Zepp said:

I think it is far simpler than all of that.   He is a local guy to your in Vancouver - right?   When you are away from home, you have a smaller circle of friends and family in immediate reach and the temptations are far fewer on your down time.   He was 18, flush with cash and living large in his background while still Grade 12 age.   Should he have been able to avoid all of that and take his fitness more seriously?   In my opinion absolutely but I have seen it happen and he isn't first guy to succumb to hometown issues like that but many get over it and come out other side even better.   Let's see what guy shows up at camp before proclaiming either way.

Agree

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1 hour ago, LimitedEdition said:

Tyler Seguin is a ripped beast.  

He is an odd duck too.   He made some brutally lame comments about Sedins and posts stuff like this:

 

BOir5lnCIAITftX.jpg

...on a relatively frequent basis.   Ripped or not, his brain seems be missing the work he is putting in on the abs and additives.

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4 minutes ago, LimitedEdition said:

You got me there.  Well played.

Haha well its easier when you have time to think.  I know that you do want Jake to succeed so I hope that he proves to all of us that he's determined and in excellent shape for training camp.  If he can put it all together we have another piece to lead this team back to the playoffs . 

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16 hours ago, ohmy said:

Haha well its easier when you have time to think.  I know that you do want Jake to succeed so I hope that he proves to all of us that he's determined and in excellent shape for training camp.  If he can put it all together we have another piece to lead this team back to the playoffs . 

 

Everyone wants that, it's why I roll my eyes when someone posts how they'll be the ones that told us so and blah blah blah. Jake has not trended well so far and if he was drafted by another team he wouldn't be considered. If he pulls it off in the end and exceeds my expectations (I think he max's out as a raffi Torres) then I won't accept posters that try to rub my nose in it because blind faith being rewarded doesn't deserve applause. 

 

It's completely understandable that some may not be confident that Jake becomes elite because it's completely observable, 

Edited by TimberWolf
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1 minute ago, TimberWolf said:

 

Everyone wants that, it's why I roll my eyes when someone posts how they'll be the ones that told us so and blah blah blah. Jake has mot trended well so far and if he was drafted be another team he wouldn't be considered. If he pulls it off in the end and exceeds my expectations (I think he max's out as a raffi Torres) then I won't accept posters that try to rub my nose in it because blind faith being rewarded doesn't deserve applause. 

 

It's completely understandable that some may not be confident that Jake becomes elite because it's completely observable, 

Except we've never seen Jake at weight, and in proper shape.  A 30 pound lighter and finally properly fit Jake could certainly be a much much improved player.  His ceiling could be a lot higher than predicted for a fat out of shape Jake.

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3 minutes ago, TimberWolf said:

 

Everyone wants that, it's why I roll my eyes when someone posts how they'll be the ones that told us so and blah blah blah. Jake has mot trended well so far and if he was drafted be another team he wouldn't be considered. If he pulls it off in the end and exceeds my expectations (I think he max's out as a raffi Torres) then I won't accept posters that try to rub my nose in it because blind faith being rewarded doesn't deserve applause. 

 

It's completely understandable that some may not be confident that Jake becomes elite because it's completely observable, 

Completely agree that nobody should attempt to rub it in anyone else's face. To me that's just bashing someone else for having a different opinion. We're all gonna think differently because some of us are optimists, some of us are pessimists, and some of us are just realists. Unfortunately there are some trolls out there as well and that opinion I don't respect because not even they believe the position there stating. It'll be interesting to see what progression Jake makes this year. If he does turn into solid 3rd liner popping 15-20 goals I'll be happy with that.  My optimism is aiming a little higher but I have always been a glass almost full guy lol. Which means I'll be wrong as many times as I am right. 

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11 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Except we've never seen Jake at weight, and in proper shape.  A 30 pound lighter and finally properly fit Jake could certainly be a much much improved player.  His ceiling could be a lot higher than predicted for a fat out of shape Jake.

 

 

That's right. Until we have something else that is observable we only have what we've observed to go on and so far it's not elite. 

 

Nothing wrong with hoping but that doesn't erase the current trend, the only that can do that is an actual change to the current trend. 

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4 minutes ago, TimberWolf said:

 

 

That's right. Until we have something else that is observable we only have what we've observed to go on and so far it's not elite. 

 

Nothing wrong with hoping but that doesn't erase the current trend, the only that can do that is an actual change to the current trend. 

You know who is elite?  Tyler Seguin.

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23 minutes ago, TimberWolf said:

 

Benning didn't think so in Boston

Benning didn't think he had the maturity to be an NHLer.

 

Same thing as a the Kassian situation. Sometimes a player just needs a change of scenery.

 

The player he became in Dallas playing with Benn, is likely not the level of player he would have become if he had stayed in Boston.

Edited by DeNiro
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11 minutes ago, DeNiro said:

Benning didn't think he had the maturity to be an NHLer.

 

Same thing as a the Kassian situation. Sometimes a player just needs a change of scenery.

 

The player he became in Dallas playing with Benn, is likely not the level of player he would have become if he had stayed in Boston.

I sure hope it doesn't take Jake a "change of scenery" to become a top nine forward:(

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