Pears Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 Jeff Frazee, Al Montoya, Pascal LeClaire all had elite upside, but none of them really panned out. Are you willing to take that risk, when Miller's contract expires, and Markstrom doesn't reach his potential? Ben Bishop didn't become a starter until just last season. Just saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Me_ Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 Media driven speculation enhanced over time by gossiping fans. But whatever, we're talking a proven NHLer who has only ever been humble, whose own GM calls him a "good soldier" in dealing with the adverse (and toxic) situation of last season, and an entirely new Canuck management - one that includes a GM who doesn't exactly shy from trading for young offense projects with two-way issues and needing a new home. Bonino is whatever. Sedin followed by Horvat & Hodgson, depending on the game, which line is hot, etc. would give the Canucks genuine secondary scoring + capacity to take harder minutes. By trade deadline Canucks are flipping the freshly improved trade value in Hodgson for a 2nd in next draft just as Horvat is well into his sophomore year and has been properly seasoned (not rushed along ala Hodgson/Buffalo to the detriment of the player). I really think Kesler effed it up for Hodgson. For the right price, I'd welcome him back. Vancouver would tear him apart because of his contract though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mustapha Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 I disgree with a majority of things Woodley says. But the hard work can make you a franchies goalie thing made me LOL. You CAN'T work your way to become an Elite/Franchise player you either have it or you don't. Lack doesn't have it, Schnieder did have it The question is, which one of you two are more likely to have a more informed opinion when assessing goaltenders? Woodley has backed up all of his points with reason and evidence. I have found him to be one of the more knowledgable personalities in sports media, especially when dealing with assessing the potential of goaltenders. If you disagree with him, fine, but let's see some evidence. By the way, to counter your second point, I have heard both Joe Sakic and Theoren Fleury state that the hardest working goaltender they ever met, on and off the ice was Patrick Roy. I think there might be something to that talent + hard work = success mantra. Look at what Devan Dubnyk did this last season. He worked hard at reinventing his game, and he went from a fringe backup goaltender to possibly the most coveted free agent this summer. He had the talent all along, but it was his hard work that made the difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canorth Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coryberg Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 Lack doesn't have it, Schneider did have it 2015 season Lack .921 sv% Schneider .925 sv% So "it" is 4 more saves on 1000 shots? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greetingsfrombrazil Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 I disgree with a majority of things Woodley says. But the hard work can make you a franchies goalie thing made me LOL. You CAN'T work your way to become an Elite/Franchise player you either have it or you don't. Lack doesn't have it, Schneider did have it He never said Lack would join the elite goalies group. He did say that he could be at the level of Ben Bishop and Corey Crawford, including statistics, if his development continues, a group of solid starters. Work ethic does take you there, just see the upgrades Dubnyk did before joining the Coyotes last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gstank29 Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 The question is, which one of you two are more likely to have a more informed opinion when assessing goaltenders? Woodley has backed up all of his points with reason and evidence. I have found him to be one of the more knowledgable personalities in sports media, especially when dealing with assessing the potential of goaltenders. If you disagree with him, fine, but let's see some evidence. By the way, to counter your second point, I have heard both Joe Sakic and Theoren Fleury state that the hardest working goaltender they ever met, on and off the ice was Patrick Roy. I think there might be something to that talent + hard work = success mantra. Look at what Devan Dubnyk did this last season. He worked hard at reinventing his game, and he went from a fringe backup goaltender to possibly the most coveted free agent this summer. He had the talent all along, but it was his hard work that made the difference. First off if you calling Dubnyk Elite, then there is no point in arguing with you because you are delusional. As Woodley he even admits he is baised in his assesments and projecting goalies is hard even if you are an "expert". As i have stated before I have worked/trainned w with goalies who are on either playing NCAA div 1 or are playing in the WHL. To the average person Woodley opinion seems knowledgable but to goalie it comes off as baised and sometimes just plain insanity. But i doubt many people in the media are able to pick apart what he says because A they don't know any better B Goaltending is a position where the only people who can understand and analyze it to the point that Woodley has are goalies. No player understands how pickicular they position is and all the little things that make a goalie good/elite 2015 season Lack .921 sv% Schneider .925 sv% So "it" is 4 more saves on 1000 shots? Lack=Playoff team Schnieder= 7th worst team in the NHL /end of story Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gstank29 Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 He never said Lack would join the elite goalies group. He did say that he could be at the level of Ben Bishop and Corey Crawford, including statistics, if his development continues, a group of solid starters. Work ethic does take you there, just see the upgrades Dubnyk did before joining the Coyotes last season. DO you guys even read what i write?I said HARD WORK CAN'T MAKE YOU A FRANCHISE GOALIE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuxfanabroad Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 Glad we're sending past 'tenders East: NJ, Flo, & maybe Buff..If we could just get a couple more bidders(Car, Philly) to drive price. If Markstrom pans out, we'll be in good shape. In 2016-17, Eddie can justifiably command a higher raise then Jacob, so I guess it washes from the $ viewpoint too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonMexico Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 31st for the future franchise goalie ... doesn't sound that good. Kevin Weekes was the goalie of the future too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shiznak Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 Ben Bishop didn't become a starter until just last season. Just saying. You take the safe route. It's uncertain if Markstrom will ever become a number one goalie. At least with Lack, we know what we're getting with him in net. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pears Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 First off if you calling Dubnyk Elite, then there is no point in arguing with you because you are delusional. As Woodley he even admits he is baised in his assesments and projecting goalies is hard even if you are an "expert". As i have stated before I have worked/trainned w with goalies who are on either playing NCAA div 1 or are playing in the WHL. To the average person Woodley opinion seems knowledgable but to goalie it comes off as baised and sometimes just plain insanity. But i doubt many people in the media are able to pick apart what he says because A they don't know any better B Goaltending is a position where the only people who can understand and analyze it to the point that Woodley has are goalies. No player understands how pickicular they position is and all the little things that make a goalie good/elite Lack=Playoff team Schnieder= 7th worst team in the NHL /end of story Look at the goal support Schneider got/gets in New Jersey then take a look at his numbers. His are more than good enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junkyard Dog Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 You take the safe route. It's uncertain if Markstrom will ever become a number one goalie. At least with Lack, we know what we're getting with him in net. We okay with 1 season with about 10M cap taken up by our goalies? Lack will get paid next off-season. That's the catch. You could argue that we did go through seasons with a lot of money tied up in our goalies with Luongo and Schneider. Take it how you see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canorth Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 You take the safe route. It's uncertain if Markstrom will ever become a number one goalie. At least with Lack, we know what we're getting with him in net. Safest way to never win a cup is to always take the safe route. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gstank29 Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 Look at the goal support Schneider got/gets in New Jersey then take a look at his numbers. His are more than good enough. If you are honestly saying Lack=Schnieder you really need to learn a lot before even forming an opinion on goalies... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pears Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 If you are honestly saying Lack=Schnieder you really need to learn a lot before even forming an opinion on goalies... I never said Lack is as good as Schneider...I said if New Jersey was able to score a few more goals here and there they'd be a playoff team with Schneider in net. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gstank29 Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 I never said Lack is as good as Schneider...I said if New Jersey was able to score a few more goals here and there they'd be a playoff team with Schneider in net. OK I agree with that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shiznak Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 We okay with 1 season with about 10M cap taken up by our goalies? Lack will get paid next off-season. That's the catch. You could argue that we did go through seasons with a lot of money tied up in our goalies with Luongo and Schneider. Take it how you see it. Why not? Vrbata's, Hamhuis', and Bieksa's contracts are all expires by then. That's 14M in cap space. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coryberg Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 Lack=Playoff team Schnieder= 7th worst team in the NHL /end of storyBy that logic lack is worth more than talbot. Luongo put up godly numbers on a horible Florida team but never came close to them on Vancouver. #endofstory? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shiznak Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 Safest way to never win a cup is to always take the safe route. Chicago says otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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