CDC Partially Responsible for Canuck Team (Discussion)

[kingofsurrey]

2 minutes ago, NewbieCanuckFan said:

Jordan Schroeder though was always a "boom or bust" prospect  (due to various issues like his size, etc.,) IMHO.

 

Given where he was selected though, I didn't have a problem with the pick (at that point in the draft, you often want to 'swing for the fences' in trying to get real offensive talent - course these guys often in the bottom half on the draft will have obvious holes in their game).

 

 

Pretty much all 18 yr olds are boom or bust.  Once you get past the top 3 picks..... who knows how they will pan out. 

[King Heffy]

3 hours ago, tyhee said:

1.   I agree nobody could have gotten value from Vrbata at the trade deadline.

 

But I didn't think that was the time to move him.  I was always of the opinion that the time to consider moving him was September, 2015, when he expressed concern about not knowing who he'd be playing with, after his center from the latter part of 2014-15, had been traded in the off-season.    Further, the time it became important to move him right away was when he was moved off Horvat's line and put with McCann and made no bones about being unhappy about it.

 

Remember, he'd come to Vancouver expecting to play with the twins.  He did for a while, then was moved to play with Bonino to spread the scoring.  Then Bonino was traded, Vrbata put with Horvat, then when they started slowly together he was put with McCann.  He was not a happy camper.

 

I thought it imperative the Canucks move him in the fall of 2015.  They didn't.  By the trade deadline he had no trade value at all.

 

To be honest, getting rid of Vrbata for free would have been a win.  As a last resort, he should have been suspended for his terrible attitude and extreme laziness.  You don'twant a locker-room cancer like that around your kids.

[kingofsurrey]

5 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

To be honest, getting rid of Vrbata for free would have been a win.  As a last resort, he should have been suspended for his terrible attitude and extreme laziness.  You don'twant a locker-room cancer like that around your kids.

 

JB and Willie drove Vrbata's value into the ground. 

 

Yes Vrbata takes alot of responsibility.   But  JB and WD  also can take alot of blame for how it unfolded.

 

Canucks have the worst coach and GM in the NHL 

 

Vrbata right now would be the highest points on our team. He has 22 points this season so far.......

[NewbieCanuckFan]

6 minutes ago, kingofsurrey said:

 

Pretty much all 18 yr olds are boom or bust.  Once you get past the top 3 picks..... who knows how they will pan out. 

That's true for the most part; but a guy like Schroeder...I just couldn't see how he'd be able to handle a 'bottom six' role at the NHL level.  Course, I never thought Grabner would make it as an NHLer in other than a top six role (wasn't too bad as a 3rd liner for a bit on the Islanders) - so what the heck do I know LOL.

[kingofsurrey]

Just now, NewbieCanuckFan said:

That's true for the most part; but a guy like Schroeder...I just couldn't see how he'd be able to handle a 'bottom six' role at the NHL level.  Course, I never thought Grabner would make it as an NHLer in other than a top six role (wasn't too bad as a 3rd liner for a bit on the Islanders) - so what the heck do I know LOL.

 

Yupp  . Thats the thing though.  Dealing with 18 yr olds..

 

Seems like a crap shoot so more picks / prospects the better.

 

People say to draft size and speed... then you see a guy like Johnny G excel  ...   so who knows eh ?

 

I can only ask that during a rebuild we gain extra picks.... 

[Davathor]

This is a forum for individual canuck fans to voice their opinions, bad and good... The idea that we should all somehow be one the same page to influence the owners is ludicrous. TV ratings and ticket sales influence ownership more than CDC ever will

[swizzey]

This forum is not about having a collective voice - that is for the team and organization. CDC is to entertain our own independent opinions and thoughts and converse about various subjects that are suppose to differ. Let's be honest... a place like this will never have a collective voice, but there is a beauty in the debate and measure of opinion.

 

cheers to that.

[J.I.A.H.N]

5 hours ago, Baggins said:

 

And replace him with who at that time? We were a team with nothing in the prospect pool. The team wasn't going to intentionally tank. It's simply not in the plans and hasn't been since Linden and Benning took over. That meant waiting until it was clear we weren't a playoff team to try and move expiring deals. I honestly think they intended to re-sign Hamhuis until the Guddy deal came along.

 

Vrbata saisd he would have been far more cooperative on being moved the previous summer. But why would we move a 30 goal scorer when we're trying to compete?

 

This is the whole point Baggins, we should not have been competing, our team was already in decline.....look at it. "IF" we would have moved Vrbata in the year he scored his 30 goals, what was the reward........a first round pick, and a much better Canuck draft pick as well. And not just Vrbata

 

This is why I say we hold some responsibility in this, the rebuild was coming, and anyone that knew hockey was saying it was, but most of CDC at the time, was grilling anyone that was suggesting it. 

 

This has been an obvious outcome. If we would have started talking about it with an open mind on here, it would have sent a message. A much better message than what is happening now, with our vets old, slow, and not showing a iota of leadership.

 

But there were way to many people that just made stupid comments, and never said an intelligent thing, just insults, sometime just pictures.....very childish

 

The trend has been we have been bad 3 of the last 4 years, and Benning and Linden are responsible to know that........we must hold the accountable......that is where we come in.

[NewbieCanuckFan]

I remember Charles Barkley saying  (don't know if he himself originated the line):

 

Quote

If you listen too much to the fans, you'll soon find yourself sitting with them.

 

 

[J.I.A.H.N]

6 hours ago, Warhippy said:

I personally think you're right

 

CDC IS partially at fault.

Especially this poster

 

http://forum.canucks.com/profile/85350-janisahockeynut/

 

WarHippy

 

You go for a cheap joke against me for pluses, but look at your bottom ribbon on you own post, what year did you put that on?

 

Come on man, help educate 

[Baggins]

9 minutes ago, janisahockeynut said:

 

This is the whole point Baggins, we should not have been competing, our team was already in decline.....look at it. "IF" we would have moved Vrbata in the year he scored his 30 goals, what was the reward........a first round pick, and a much better Canuck draft pick as well. And not just Vrbata

 

This is why I say we hold some responsibility in this, the rebuild was coming, and anyone that knew hockey was saying it was, but most of CDC at the time, was grilling anyone that was suggesting it. 

 

This has been an obvious outcome. If we would have started talking about it with an open mind on here, it would have sent a message. A much better message than what is happening now, with our vets old, slow, and not showing a iota of leadership.

 

But there were way to many people that just made stupid comments, and never said an intelligent thing, just insults, sometime just pictures.....very childish

 

The trend has been we have been bad 3 of the last 4 years, and Benning and Linden are responsible to know that........we must hold the accountable......that is where we come in.

 

You are certainly free to not spend your money. I'll continue to spend money as long as they put the best possible team on the ice. The moment they intentionally set the team up to lose they lose my dollar as well. I completely agree with the way they are rebuilding. Get younger through the draft and trades and stay as competitive as possible during the transition. I'll support the team through good and bad as long as they take that approach. Signing a ufa and then immediately trading him after a good season doesn't accomplish that and would make other ufa's less likely to sign here. Positive versus negative.

 

 

[King Heffy]

51 minutes ago, kingofsurrey said:

 

JB and Willie drove Vrbata's value into the ground. 

 

Yes Vrbata takes alot of responsibility.   But  JB and WD  also can take alot of blame for how it unfolded.

 

Canucks have the worst coach and GM in the NHL 

 

Vrbata right now would be the highest points on our team. He has 22 points this season so far.......

Willie's a bad coach but that's all on Vrbata.  He chose to play like complete trash and then whined about not being gifted unearned minutes,  WD should have thrown that lazy bum in the pressbox for the rest of the season to show that the way he was conducting himself on or off the ice was completely unacceptable. 

[Alflives]

Just now, King Heffy said:

Willie's a bad coach but that's all on Vrbata.  He chose to play like complete trash and then whined about not being gifted unearned minutes,  WD should have thrown that lazy bum in the pressbox for the rest of the season to show that the way he was conducting himself on or off the ice was completely unacceptable. 

That whining started in the preseason, when he still had A LOT of value.  That's all on JB for not trading him then.  It's like with Tanev and Hansen: both guys should have been traded BEFORE the last draft for picks.  We need prospects, which comes from having picks.  JB traded away 12 picks in his time here.  

[canuck73_3]

4 minutes ago, Alflives said:

That whining started in the preseason, when he still had A LOT of value.  That's all on JB for not trading him then.  It's like with Tanev and Hansen: both guys should have been traded BEFORE the last draft for picks.  We need prospects, which comes from having picks.  JB traded away 12 picks in his time here.  

 

And acquired 8 you broken record troll...

[Baggins]

4 minutes ago, Alflives said:

That whining started in the preseason, when he still had A LOT of value.  That's all on JB for not trading him then.  It's like with Tanev and Hansen: both guys should have been traded BEFORE the last draft for picks.  We need prospects, which comes from having picks.  JB traded away 12 picks in his time here.  

 

How many picks did he get in trades and what did he get by trading picks? Draft picks are moveable assets just like players.

[Alflives]

2 minutes ago, canuck73_3 said:

 

And acquired 8 you broken record troll...

So that's 20 total picks!  Look at all the prospects we could have had chomping at the bit.

 

I thought Troll was a proper noun, so should be capitalized.    

[Alflives]

3 minutes ago, Baggins said:

 

How many picks did he get in trades and what did he get by trading picks? Draft picks are moveable assets just like players.

Yes.  I heard LOU Lamerillo say he collected picks so he could use them to move up in rounds 2-7 if there were players he liked, and didn't want to miss. I gave him that flexibility. That's what rebuilding teams do.  They collect picks.  

[kingofsurrey]

14 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

Willie's a bad coach but that's all on Vrbata.  He chose to play like complete trash and then whined about not being gifted unearned minutes,  WD should have thrown that lazy bum in the pressbox for the rest of the season to show that the way he was conducting himself on or off the ice was completely unacceptable. 

 

The thing  is ....    this was a conflict between Vrbata and Free Willy that hurt our club long term by reducing his value.

 

A better coach would have mediated the situation . I would have loved to have seen Vrbata traded early last season...

[189lb enforcers?]

6 hours ago, S'all Good Man said:

 

 

Look at that sheen. He had every kind of specialist employed, EXCEPT a towel boy, I see.

I almost miss watching that man attempt to be arrogant while oozing slime instead.

 

Between him and Tickin' Wilbur, no wonder the media has its way with the franchise.

 

 

[Baggins]

6 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Yes.  I heard LOU Lamerillo say he collected picks so he could use them to move up in rounds 2-7 if there were players he liked, and didn't want to miss. I gave him that flexibility. That's what rebuilding teams do.  They collect picks.  

 

Trading picks for young NHL ready players is also rebuilding. There's just less wait time.