Kole Lind | RW

[RetroCanuck]

1 hour ago, Derp... said:

Will he get to 100? That's usually the mark people look at as elite for junior. 

He would need 9p in 3 games. So unlikely but possible. If he hadn’t missed some games though I think he would have reached that mark or very close! All in all a very good season for him!

[bp79]

15 hours ago, Rob_Zepp said:

I am still unsure where this comes from.

Maybe he meant more goals? Without checking ill go out on a limb and say wingers win the Rocket more often then centres as centres win the art ross more than wingers I think.

[bp79]

14 hours ago, Rob_Zepp said:

To me, this puts Lind's numbers versus those for Glass (who I was very high on, and frankly wanted Canucks to draft....was I wrong in terms of him versus EP) into even more favourable perspective for Lind.   Quite impressive the season this kid is putting together.

I was quite impressed to see that Lind has a better PPg and only 4 less points fewer points 4 more goals in 4 fewer games while on A weaker club not playing on the first line. Throw in EP and wow JB nailed it.

[SingleThorn]

Like most posters, I'm more than happy with the Lind ( and Gadjovich ) pick. On draft day, I was rooting for 2x d-men from the 2nd round. Maybe this year ?

 

Off topic, I think we exaggerate how 'down' other GMs are re not getting EP. The top 12++ picks are all wins at the moment. Everyone is happy !

[Noble 6]

I'm very happy with Lind and his progression this year.

 

But imagine if we landed Tolvanen (30th overall). We would have the top 2 prospects outside of the NHL with both of them breaking records in the SHL and KHL respectively. THAT would've been insane. 

[Fanuck]

11 hours ago, Derp... said:

100?  That's usually the mark people look at as elite for junior. 

Don't get me wrong,  100pts in the WHL is an accomplishment any player should be proud of.   That said,  plenty of players that are not considered 'elite' as far as pro-potential get 100pts each year.  I think a far better milestone  (if just judging by points which scouts will tell you is often misleading to do) is the 100pt mark in your draft year - now that is a far less achievable milestone and more befitting of 'elite' consideration imo.

[Dixon Ward]

I was at the game last night and thought Kole looked light years ahead of his teammates in terms of skill and vision.  If that is how his linemates have played all year, it is amazing that he has 90 pts.  They were clueless!

Edited March 12, 2018 by Dixon Ward

[Ihatetomatoes]

19 minutes ago, Fanuck said:

Don't get me wrong,  100pts in the WHL is an accomplishment any player should be proud of.   That said,  plenty of players that are not considered 'elite' as far as pro-potential get 100pts each year.  I think a far better milestone  (if just judging by points which scouts will tell you is often misleading to do) is the 100pt mark in your draft year - now that is a far less achievable milestone and more befitting of 'elite' consideration imo.

The WHL is a strange league for developing forwards.  A tonne of defenseman have come out the the W but it seems there is a lot less forwards and it is hard to find comparables for Kole Lind.  I did a bit of digging and this is what I found looking for top 6 forwards.   I ignored the older generation of guys like Getzlaf and Marleau.

 

Eberle - Drafted #11   Didn't hit 100pts until his D+2

Jaime Benn - Drafted #125  Didn't ever hit 100pts.  Scored 82pts in 56 games in his D+2.  He's a late bloomer though

Ryan Nugent-Hopkins - Drafted #1 106pts in 69 games in Draft year

Sam Reinhardt - Drafted #2. 105pts in 60 games in draft year

Brayden Schenn - Drafted #5. Scored 99pts in 59 games in his D+1. 

Brendan Gallagher - 5th round pick and never much of a point producer

Jake Debrusk - Drafted #14.  D+1 he put up 65pts in 61 games.  He's looking like a pretty good NHL player.  

Oliver Bjorkstrand - Drafted #89  Put up 109pts in 69 games in D+1 and 118pts in 59 games in D+2.  Played on a stacked Winterhawks team though.

Leon Draisaitl - Drated #3. Put up 105pts in 64 games in draft year and 52pts in 32 games in D+1.  He's a beast though.

Nino Niederreiter - Drafted #5. Put up 70 in 55 games in D+1

Ryan Johansen - Drafted #4. Put up 92pts in 63 games in D+1

Matthew  Barzal - Drafted #16. Put up 88pts in 58 games in D+1

Mark Stone - Drafted #178. Put up 106pts in 71 games in D+1 

Brayden Point - Drafted #79. Put up 87pts in 60 games in D+1

Sven Baertchi - Drafted #13. Put up 94pts in 47 games in D+1 Again that Stacked Portland team

Evander Kane - Drafted #4. Put up 97pts in 64 games in Draft year

 

 

Going back to 2008 these are players that have hit 100pts in their D+1 seasons and haven't had much NHL success.

 

Petan 113pts in 63 games. Tiny guy and stacked Portland

Rattie 121pts in 69 games.  Stacked Portland

Leipsic 120pts in 68 games. Tiny Guy and Stacked Portland. (Yes I know he's looked good but he was a throwaway on an expansion team)

Weal 102pts in 72 games in his draft year actually. I wonder what scouts saw in him that made him a 3rd round pick.

Kozun 108pts in 65 Tiny guy

Michael St. Croix 105pts in 72 games

Colin Smith 106pts in 72 games (May have been an overager in the draft?)

 

What I've deduced from all of this is that Kole is looking like a bit of a stud.  The only guy that has put up points like him and didn't have NHL success that wasn't on an absolutely stacked team or wasn't a tiny guy is Michael St. Croix.  He put up 105pts in 72 games and led his team by 20pts.  

 

Closest comparable with NHL success seems to be Mark Stone.  106 points in 71 games.  Plays wing, wasn't playing on a stacked team and led his team in points. 

 

The one question mark on all this is that Kole is 19 while most of these guys were 18 in Their D+1 years.  An absolute $&!# tonne of players has put up over 100pts in their D+2 years at 19 years old.  However since Kole is only in his 3rd full WHL season at 19 while most other guys were in their 4th full season at 19 it swings in back toward being optimistic about Koles chance of success.  

 

 

 

 

[Ihatetomatoes]

So I got curious about how many guys have put up 100pts in the WHL as 19 year olds or older.  There has been a lot. I made note of how many seasons they have played in the WHL as experience is also a major factor as well as age.  I also added in a NHL few notables.

 

 

Colin Long - 100pts in 72 games.  Age 21

Mark Santorelli - 101pts in 72 games. Age 19 / 2nd season but player 2 in the BCHL

Brandon Kozun - 107pts in 65 games Age 19 / 2nd full season

Bett Sonne - 100pts in 62 games Age 19 / 4th full season

Casey Pierro-Zabatel - 115pts in 72 games Age 19 (Played with Evander Kane)

Jordan Eberle - 106pts in 57 games Age 19 / 4th full season

Linden Vey - 116pts in 69 games Age 19 / 4th Full season

Tyler Johnson - 115pts in 71 games Age 20 

Brendan Shinniman - 134pts in 69 games Age 20

Adam Hughesman - 116pts in 72 games Age 20

Patrick Holland - 109pts in 72 games Age 19 / 3rd full season

Jordan Weal - 116pth in 70 games Age 19 / 2nd full season

Emerson Etem - 107pts in 65 games Age 19 / 3rd full season

Mark Stone - 123pts in 66 games Age 19 / 4th full season

Michael Ferland - 96pts in 68 games Age 19 / 3rd full season

Ty Rattie - 110pts in 62 games Age 19 / 4th full season (Did put up 100pts in 3rd full season

Colin Smith - 106pts in 72 games Age 19 / 4 season (1st season was a half season)

Justin Feser - 106pts in 72 games Age 20

Mitch Holmberg - 118pts in 72 games Age 20

Oliver Bjorkstrand - 118pts in 59 games Age 19 / 3rd full season

*Nic Petan - 89pts in 54 games Age 19 / 4th full season.  * His ppg was too high to not include him here

Trevor Cox - 109pts in 69 games Age 19 / 4th full season

Tim McGauley - 105pts in 72 games Age 19 / 3rd full season

Adam Brooks - 120pts in 72 games Age 19 / 4th full season

Drayden Hunt - 116pts in 72 games Age 19 / 5th season (How young did this guy start playing in the league)

*Brayden Point - 88pts in 48 games Age 19 / 4th full season

Jayce Hawryluk - 106pts in 58 games Age 19 / 4th full season

 

 

Looking at all this definitely makes what Kole is doing this year less impressive if you go by age rather than draft year.  There is a lot of players that have had monster season that haven't gone onto NHL success.  

 

 

Also I just realized that Kole only has 3 games left in the season so he might not even hit 100pts.  He's at 91 in 56 games.  That said he'd have easily made it if he had hit it if he had played more games and it's just an arbitrary number anyhow. 

 

Looking at what players that played in the WHL in their 19 year old seasons and have gone onto NHL success and what they have did in their 19 year old seasons

 

Matt Barzal - 79pts in 41 games 1.92ppg

Brayden Point - 88pts in 48 games 1.83ppg

Mark Stone - 123pts in 66 games 1.86ppg

Oliver Bjorkstrand - 118pts in 59 games 2ppg

Brayden Schenn - 53pts in 27 games 1.96ppg

Jamie Benn - 82pts in 56 games 1.46ppg

Jordan Eberle - 106pts in 57 games 1.85ppg

Brendan Gallagher - 77pts in 56 games 1.375ppg

 

Right now Kole is at 1.63 ppg.  Going by ppg and age he definitely seems a tier below most of these guys that have gone onto being top 6 forwards in the NHL.  A lot of these guys are 1st line forwards though so if I were to deduce anything from this Kole isn't likely to develop into a 1st line forward and his production in his 19 year old season projects him to be a 2nd or 3rd line forward or a not an NHL player, if we're going by age.  Some people think it should just go by draft year, I'm not sure how I feel about that as if he was born a few weeks earlier he would have been drafted a year earlier.  Also should be noted that Kole doesn't really have much help and quite a few of the players on this list had other excellent players to play with and boost up their ppg.

 

 

[JeremyCuddles]

If reading all these numbers has taught me anything it’s you can’t predict a guy’s future by reading these numbers. There is a good chunk of nobodies and top 6ers. Watching him play though, he has a good motor and is solid in all 3 zones. I am excited to see how he develops. Hopefully he becomes a pretty good player for us. Possibly a taller Eberle? 

[Ihatetomatoes]

37 minutes ago, N7Nucks said:

If reading all these numbers has taught me anything it’s you can’t predict a guy’s future by reading these numbers. There is a good chunk of nobodies and top 6ers. Watching him play though, he has a good motor and is solid in all 3 zones. I am excited to see how he develops. Hopefully he becomes a pretty good player for us. Possibly a taller Eberle? 

For sure. I think numbers can tell a lot but they obviously aren't a rule and there are obviously always outliers.

 

Unfortunately I don't get to watch Lind play other than highlights so I just got curious on how his season is stacking up statistically against players of the past that have or have not made the NHL

[Rob_Zepp]

3 hours ago, Ihatetomatoes said:

So I got curious about how many guys have put up 100pts in the WHL as 19 year olds or older.  There has been a lot. I made note of how many seasons they have played in the WHL as experience is also a major factor as well as age.  I also added in a NHL few notables.

 

 

Colin Long - 100pts in 72 games.  Age 21

Mark Santorelli - 101pts in 72 games. Age 19 / 2nd season but player 2 in the BCHL

Brandon Kozun - 107pts in 65 games Age 19 / 2nd full season

Bett Sonne - 100pts in 62 games Age 19 / 4th full season

Casey Pierro-Zabatel - 115pts in 72 games Age 19 (Played with Evander Kane)

Jordan Eberle - 106pts in 57 games Age 19 / 4th full season

Linden Vey - 116pts in 69 games Age 19 / 4th Full season

Tyler Johnson - 115pts in 71 games Age 20 

Brendan Shinniman - 134pts in 69 games Age 20

Adam Hughesman - 116pts in 72 games Age 20

Patrick Holland - 109pts in 72 games Age 19 / 3rd full season

Jordan Weal - 116pth in 70 games Age 19 / 2nd full season

Emerson Etem - 107pts in 65 games Age 19 / 3rd full season

Mark Stone - 123pts in 66 games Age 19 / 4th full season

Michael Ferland - 96pts in 68 games Age 19 / 3rd full season

Ty Rattie - 110pts in 62 games Age 19 / 4th full season (Did put up 100pts in 3rd full season

Colin Smith - 106pts in 72 games Age 19 / 4 season (1st season was a half season)

Justin Feser - 106pts in 72 games Age 20

Mitch Holmberg - 118pts in 72 games Age 20

Oliver Bjorkstrand - 118pts in 59 games Age 19 / 3rd full season

*Nic Petan - 89pts in 54 games Age 19 / 4th full season.  * His ppg was too high to not include him here

Trevor Cox - 109pts in 69 games Age 19 / 4th full season

Tim McGauley - 105pts in 72 games Age 19 / 3rd full season

Adam Brooks - 120pts in 72 games Age 19 / 4th full season

Drayden Hunt - 116pts in 72 games Age 19 / 5th season (How young did this guy start playing in the league)

*Brayden Point - 88pts in 48 games Age 19 / 4th full season

Jayce Hawryluk - 106pts in 58 games Age 19 / 4th full season

 

 

Looking at all this definitely makes what Kole is doing this year less impressive if you go by age rather than draft year.  There is a lot of players that have had monster season that haven't gone onto NHL success.  

 

 

Also I just realized that Kole only has 3 games left in the season so he might not even hit 100pts.  He's at 91 in 56 games.  That said he'd have easily made it if he had hit it if he had played more games and it's just an arbitrary number anyhow. 

 

Looking at what players that played in the WHL in their 19 year old seasons and have gone onto NHL success and what they have did in their 19 year old seasons

 

Matt Barzal - 79pts in 41 games 1.92ppg

Brayden Point - 88pts in 48 games 1.83ppg

Mark Stone - 123pts in 66 games 1.86ppg

Oliver Bjorkstrand - 118pts in 59 games 2ppg

Brayden Schenn - 53pts in 27 games 1.96ppg

Jamie Benn - 82pts in 56 games 1.46ppg

Jordan Eberle - 106pts in 57 games 1.85ppg

Brendan Gallagher - 77pts in 56 games 1.375ppg

 

Right now Kole is at 1.63 ppg.  Going by ppg and age he definitely seems a tier below most of these guys that have gone onto being top 6 forwards in the NHL.  A lot of these guys are 1st line forwards though so if I were to deduce anything from this Kole isn't likely to develop into a 1st line forward and his production in his 19 year old season projects him to be a 2nd or 3rd line forward or a not an NHL player, if we're going by age.  Some people think it should just go by draft year, I'm not sure how I feel about that as if he was born a few weeks earlier he would have been drafted a year earlier.  Also should be noted that Kole doesn't really have much help and quite a few of the players on this list had other excellent players to play with and boost up their ppg.

 

 

There is a 59.3% probability that 1/2 of your ppg numbers are 2/3 of their projection value minus 4/7th of the Kole Lind's numbers which leads one to conclude he will score somewhere between 0 and 99 goals in his rookie season in the NHL.    

[alfstonker]

Strange thing looking at that list - I still think Vey would be good in our team right now. He never really got a fair crack of the whip.

[SingleThorn]

2 hours ago, alfstonker said:

Strange thing looking at that list - I still think Vey would be good in our team right now. He never really got a fair crack of the whip.

Agree. I was at a home game when Vey played for LA. He had one superb shift. I remember noting his name for the first time and was not unhappy when we traded for him.

 

We had LV at his lowest. The stars were not lined up in anyone's favour. I'd be happy to see him back in the NHL. Our current forward depth, prospect wise, means not with us. If he did return here, it would be day of emotional gnashing of teeth on CDC. It would be a fun day !

Edited March 12, 2018 by SingleThorn

[Boudrias]

1 hour ago, SingleThorn said:

Agree. I was at a home game when Vey played for LA. He had one superb shift. I remember noting his name for the first time and was not unhappy when we traded for him.

 

We had LV at his lowest. The stars were not lined up in anyone's favour. I'd be happy to see him back in the NHL. Our current forward depth, prospect wise, means not with us. It he did return here, it would be day of emotional gnashing of teeth on CDC. It would be a fun day !

While I do not expect Vey back in Van I do which him well. I would take a Linden Vey over a Gagner. 

[SergioMomesso]

4 hours ago, Boudrias said:

While I do not expect Vey back in Van I do which him well. I would take a Linden Vey over a Gagner. 

There are a lot of players not in the NHL that I would take over Gags at this point in his career.

[aGENT]

7 hours ago, alfstonker said:

Strange thing looking at that list - I still think Vey would be good in our team right now. He never really got a fair crack of the whip.

 

5 hours ago, SingleThorn said:

Agree. I was at a home game when Vey played for LA. He had one superb shift. I remember noting his name for the first time and was not unhappy when we traded for him.

 

We had LV at his lowest. The stars were not lined up in anyone's favour. I'd be happy to see him back in the NHL. Our current forward depth, prospect wise, means not with us. If he did return here, it would be day of emotional gnashing of teeth on CDC. It would be a fun day !

 

5 hours ago, Boudrias said:

While I do not expect Vey back in Van I do which him well. I would take a Linden Vey over a Gagner. 

 

Yeah, it rankles me a bit when I see people post about that being a 'mistake' still. Vey's a decent hockey player who had a LOT of personal stuff going on while he was here and still managed to be better than competent on a bad team. 

 

Excrement happens. Doesn't mean he was a bad player or that trading for him was a 'mistake'. It didn't work out. Not everything does.

[DeNiro]

Anyone know why Lind didn't play tonight?

[SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME]

11 minutes ago, DeNiro said:

Anyone know why Lind didn't play tonight?

Resting vets. They already clinched the BC Division.

 

EDIT: more like resting “stars” since these are kids and “vets” just sounds weird. Wrote it out of habit but you get the idea.

 

Dube and both Feete (lol, now I’m just being silly—had a few tonight) were also scratched. 

Edited March 17, 2018 by SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME

[The Great Canucks]

When do playoffs start for the CHL?