[PGT] Vancouver Canucks at Boston Bruins | Feb. 04, 2020

[Kushman]

1 minute ago, SILLY GOOSE said:

 

Also FTR, I competed as an amateur boxer for 10+ years. Provincial tournies etc.  Loved it when I got to train/work with the mma guys from other gyms

 

 

 

FTR I'm a second degree black belt in tapout and affliction. So watchout your future comments bro or i might have to throw you into a Hungarian neck crank 

[Angry Goose]

1 minute ago, Kushman said:

 

FTR I'm a second degree black belt in tapout and affliction. So watchout your future comments bro or i might have to throw you into a Hungarian neck crank 

Still trying to be intimidating lol.....the loud guys like you were always so insecure, and usually not very good!

 

Go take a nap big shot.

[Kushman]

1 minute ago, SILLY GOOSE said:

Still trying to be intimidating lol.....the loud guys like you were always so insecure, and usually not very good!

 

Go take a nap big shot.

I dont think I could of made my post anymore obvious of a troll... At least you confirmed you must have boxed for 10 years as it clearly flew right past your head.

 

 

[Angry Goose]

2 minutes ago, Kushman said:

I dont think I could of made my post anymore obvious of a troll... At least you confirmed you must have boxed for 10 years as it clearly flew right past your head.

 

 

You are a troll, bit hey, gotta give benefit of the doubt sometimes.  

[189lb enforcers?]

7 hours ago, SILLY GOOSE said:

People complaining about lack of push back on Petey need to relax and stop being keyboard warriors.

 

 

ANYONE that has played competitive contact team sports know that you are always going to play the other teams best players hard.   Players dont get mad about that- its part of whatever sport you play.  However, if someone is playing dirty THEN that pisses off teammates.  the hit on Petey wasn't dirty- it was late.

 

Honestly, 99% of the crap canuck fans complain about isnt dirty.  Demanding after the whistle 'push back' in a competitive sport is fan obsession more than anything that doesnt reflect whats happening  btw players.  

 

 

Agree, kinda, but not in this context. 

 

It wasn’t one borderline hit on EP that the Canucks seemed to just shrug off which caught my attention, this is like #4, maybe more. 

 

Its a pattern. 

These behaviours show a culture. 

 

The discussion and disenchantment is not about one play or one hit. 

Its not coming from someone misunderstanding the games within the game nuances that lead to specialty teams, good or bad. 

 

What I agree with is simply the complex about the refs and the hockey-mothering that seems to go with the forum’s approach to defending their team’s indefensible play. I think that aspect of the community is the bad press part; the victim culture creed is embarrassing, agreed. 

 

Stick up for EP. 

End of. 

 

 

Edit PS

To the bolded in your comment...

Semantics, or what kind of illusion is this? 

Dirty. Late hit. Dirty hit. Dirty. All the same thing, no? 

Since when is a late hit, and on a skinny, young star, NOT dirty? 

 

 

Edited February 6, 2020 by 189lb enforcers?

[dougieL]

I'm still a bit confused about the offside/onside call. Are they ruling that McAvoy basically did a mini dump-in because he wasn't touching the puck? If so, did he not put himself offside when he was straddling the blue line without touching the puck, then touching it while still straddling, since be would have technically lost control? It seems like the people who say it's onside are trying to have it both ways.

[spook007]

7 hours ago, oldnews said:

(intangibles)

 

Work hard - always - in/on all parts of the game.

Practice a standard, push that standard.  Question himself first - accountability starts there.

Pull for his team-mates, help them make themselves better.  Recognize that they make him better. 

Don't always "lead".  Allow others to 'lead'.  Don't be threatened by the strength of others, don't waste time or energy in 'relativism' in that sense / measuring oneself, needing to 'lead.'  Receive leadership.  Don't 'possess' the captaincy.  Be a captain.   No player is always 'the leader '-  believing so is not necessarily leadership (it's ego/title/status).  The key (imo) is to empower.  No player is more or less important than another - every player can make the difference.

Build the team.  It's not your team, it's the team.

 

Be like Linden.  Don't be like Messier.

Good post ON....

[spook007]

Is really the chicken/egg situation... 

If they retaliate to some plug, they’ll get hammered and Bruins got, what they wanted... If they don’t...

Whatever we do, our star player will always be targeted. Crosby, McDavid, McKinnon, etc etc are all being targeted... and now and again the gloves are dropped, but we haven’t had a player consistently playing for us since Dorsett, who would be willing/able to both play and drop the gloves...

We need a player or two like that... would give a Kings ransom for a player like Torres or Wilson... Let them worry about their star players... 

Regardless, even players like that won’t deter any Bruin (or other scum sucking rodents) from targeting EP or QH. 
Fact is we are not able to play Bruins game, or players don’t seem to possess the pack mentality of the Bruins so we need to find a way to out score them instead.
 

They played a play offs game against us, and we couldn’t handle it on the night. 
 

And for starters we need our heavies to play heavy... Schaller is a mouse...

Edited February 6, 2020 by spook007

[IBatch]

2 hours ago, spook007 said:

Is really the chicken/egg situation... 

If they retaliate to some plug, they’ll get hammered and Bruins got, what they wanted... If they don’t...

Whatever we do, our star player will always be targeted. Crosby, McDavid, McKinnon, etc etc are all being targeted... and now and again the gloves are dropped, but we haven’t had a player consistently playing for us since Dorsett, who would be willing/able to both play and drop the gloves...

We need a player or two like that... would give a Kings ransom for a player like Torres or Wilson... Let them worry about their star players... 

Regardless, even players like that won’t deter any Bruin (or other scum sucking rodents) from targeting EP or QH. 
Fact is we are not able to play Bruins game, or players don’t seem to possess the pack mentality of the Bruins so we need to find a way to out score them instead.
 

They played a play offs game against us, and we couldn’t handle it on the night. 
 

And for starters we need our heavies to play heavy... Schaller is a mouse...

Both you and 189lns bring up good points.   We don't know to what lengths our "heavies" are willing to go (Schaller isn't playing the type of game that will keep him in this league, like he did in Boston, but then maybe that's because he doesn't have a Chara in his corner either - enforcers - and Chara knows that role tend to give everyone and extra couple inches and twenty pounds in the bravery area) willing to come playoff time - hope whatever it takes. 

 

As far as culture goes is league wide and has been around since pretty much Crosby's generation of players stepped in.  He's been murdered and cheap shotted most of his career - at least he's figured out how to protect himself with liberal use of lumber and some dirty tricks himself from time to time.    

 

I know dirty plays existed before the enforcers left too, so it wasn't perfect either - especially given 5 min goons became the way of things (and the bigger the better)...but at one point the balancing act worked, and worked well for a couple decades (and who really doesn't enjoy a good fight).    Concussion optics and the need for speed all but eliminated policemen from teams, right away slashing penalties got so bad (to the hands) that the league had to "crack-down" on it  with the same vigour as they did with obstruction when the cap came in.   Lack of respect - and the code for sure.   Would EP be safer if other teams knew they'd have to answer for it both from the refs and the other teams big brother?  I believe so, absolutely.     When Gretzky credits his records to guys like Sememko and then McSorely who had his back in his book he's not just blowing smoke or being too modest ... because on the flip side guys like Gillies (the same guy nobody wanted a piece of)  on camera saying things like he had Gretzky lined up several times and he just wouldn't hit him, because then he'd FIRST have to deal with Semenko, then Messier, then the rest of the team.   If a guy like that is scared, imagine what a kid like McAvoy would think. 

[theo5789]

10 hours ago, Devron44 said:

I keep telling people Virtanen smoked him twice and nailed him in the back. Next shift. I don’t know why anyone else didn’t see that.

So you're saying people only see what they want to see and form a conclusion? That never happens on CDC. Get real man.

[theo5789]

12 hours ago, oldnews said:

(intangibles)

 

Work hard - always - in/on all parts of the game.

Practice a standard, push that standard.  Question himself first - accountability starts there.

Pull for his team-mates, help them make themselves better.  Recognize that they make him better. 

Don't always "lead".  Allow others to 'lead'.  Don't be threatened by the strength of others, don't waste time or energy in 'relativism' in that sense / measuring oneself, needing to 'lead.'  Receive leadership.  Don't 'possess' the captaincy.  Be a captain.   No player is always 'the leader '-  believing so is not necessarily leadership (it's ego/title/status).  The key (imo) is to empower.  No player is more or less important than another - every player can make the difference.

Build the team.  It's not your team, it's the team.

 

Be like Linden.  Don't be like Messier.

[-DLC-]

10 hours ago, Devron44 said:

I keep telling people Virtanen smoked him twice and nailed him in the back. Next shift. I don’t know why anyone else didn’t see that.

I didn't see that...good on Jake.  Got home a little late but glad to hear someone let him know.  

 

Doesn't have to be a fight...although I'd like to see a bit of a swarming and maybe, who know, a good shot or two.  But at least "targeting" him afterward with some good, solid hits into the boards...something.  Thatta boy, Jake.

[spook007]

1 hour ago, IBatch said:

Both you and 189lns bring up good points.   We don't know to what lengths our "heavies" are willing to go (Schaller isn't playing the type of game that will keep him in this league, like he did in Boston, but then maybe that's because he doesn't have a Chara in his corner either - enforcers - and Chara knows that role tend to give everyone and extra couple inches and twenty pounds in the bravery area) willing to come playoff time - hope whatever it takes. 

 

As far as culture goes is league wide and has been around since pretty much Crosby's generation of players stepped in.  He's been murdered and cheap shotted most of his career - at least he's figured out how to protect himself with liberal use of lumber and some dirty tricks himself from time to time.    

 

I know dirty plays existed before the enforcers left too, so it wasn't perfect either - especially given 5 min goons became the way of things (and the bigger the better)...but at one point the balancing act worked, and worked well for a couple decades (and who really doesn't enjoy a good fight).    Concussion optics and the need for speed all but eliminated policemen from teams, right away slashing penalties got so bad (to the hands) that the league had to "crack-down" on it  with the same vigour as they did with obstruction when the cap came in.   Lack of respect - and the code for sure.   Would EP be safer if other teams knew they'd have to answer for it both from the refs and the other teams big brother?  I believe so, absolutely.     When Gretzky credits his records to guys like Sememko and then McSorely who had his back in his book he's not just blowing smoke or being too modest ... because on the flip side guys like Gillies (the same guy nobody wanted a piece of)  on camera saying things like he had Gretzky lined up several times and he just wouldn't hit him, because then he'd FIRST have to deal with Semenko, then Messier, then the rest of the team.   If a guy like that is scared, imagine what a kid like McAvoy would think. 

Cheers IBatch...

 

Agree 100%... I don't think we have the personal to play the style of hockey Bruins are playing, but regardless its easier to be tough, when you have your corner covered.

The issue is finding players that are tough, while still able to play. Dorsett was willing, but still only a light weight, Guddy unfortunately sunk as a player here, and the Kassian saga we all know...

We have a few that can play a heavy game, but they are not really the type that puts fear into players... JV, Horvat, Pearson, Motte, Miller, Beagle Roussel can all play a heavy game, but besides Roussel (Gravovac, MacEwan, Ferland not available) none of them really fights, and the few fights I've seen them in, wouldn't have any tough NHL player shiver with fear... I would love to have a player that could drop them in the heavy devision, and not just a type of punch bag like Sestito... 

However, everyone want these  players... And I agree, the whole team plays bigger, when your mate can take on anyone... I say again I would dance with joy if we could have a few Torres/Wilson type of players, that will have the oppositions head on a swivel...Caps has Wilson, but Ovi is very capable himself... our star are definitely not... Its one of the weaknesses I see in having BB together with EP. It gets to easy to take liberties with our top players, when they are on the same line.

Anyway, this season was about reaching the play offs. I'm sure JB and Green are watching the same as us, and will know they eventually need to address it...  Speed and skill isn't enough to win....

Edited February 6, 2020 by spook007

[spur1]

On 2/4/2020 at 9:26 PM, TNucks1 said:

if you can show a full replay of all of the stick handling of him bringing it into the blue zone without touching the offside because he's skate was on the onside side of it, before, the panel made a pretty good video of it, even shorty and garrett agreed after the full reveiw?

EDIT: You have to have contact on puck before you cross the blue, which he didnt, he did before.

He absolutely had contact and control of the puck. He pushed the puck forward from just outside the blue line to just across the blue line. He moved the puck all of a foot if that. He moved the puck into the zone while the Boston player was still inside. 

[Ronning4center]

21 hours ago, 73 Percent said:

Did hank ever do that?

Lu?

Crosby?

Gretzky?

 

I think you hit the nail on the head when you said it's not one person's job. That being said you cant single out one player.

Yes,....Crosby has fought quite a few times..  The others well...simply not physical players.  I was just so frustrated when this went down.  

I played hockey and even in bantom if a smaller skilled player was hit with a cheap shot we didnt even think about it.  You went to his defence

immediately unless....you specifically told not too by the coach.  This is a coaching philosophy that will simply not work in thee playoffs. 

[73 Percent]

1 hour ago, Ronning4center said:

Yes,....Crosby has fought quite a few times..  The others well...simply not physical players.  I was just so frustrated when this went down.  

I played hockey and even in bantom if a smaller skilled player was hit with a cheap shot we didnt even think about it.  You went to his defence

immediately unless....you specifically told not too by the coach.  This is a coaching philosophy that will simply not work in thee playoffs. 

And bo has fought in the past too. 

 

Y'all need to stop calling out players. This is a team mentality problem.

[-Vintage Canuck-]

 

[IBatch]

4 hours ago, spook007 said:

Cheers IBatch...

 

Agree 100%... I don't think we have the personal to play the style of hockey Bruins are playing, but regardless its easier to be tough, when you have your corner covered.

The issue is finding players that are tough, while still able to play. Dorsett was willing, but still only a light weight, Guddy unfortunately sunk as a player here, and the Kassian saga we all know...

We have a few that can play a heavy game, but they are not really the type that puts fear into players... JV, Horvat, Pearson, Motte, Miller, Beagle Roussel can all play a heavy game, but besides Roussel (Gravovac, MacEwan, Ferland not available) none of them really fights, and the few fights I've seen them in, wouldn't have any tough NHL player shiver with fear... I would love to have a player that could drop them in the heavy devision, and not just a type of punch bag like Sestito... 

However, everyone want these  players... And I agree, the whole team plays bigger, when your mate can take on anyone... I say again I would dance with joy if we could have a few Torres/Wilson type of players, that will have the oppositions head on a swivel...Caps has Wilson, but Ovi is very capable himself... our star are definitely not... Its one of the weaknesses I see in having BB together with EP. It gets to easy to take liberties with our top players, when they are on the same line.

Anyway, this season was about reaching the play offs. I'm sure JB and Green are watching the same as us, and will know they eventually need to address it...  Speed and skill isn't enough to win....

Amen.   Adding Miller was necessary,  and I can understand why JB signed Ferland also - really too bad that one hasn't worked out (yet).   Pearson and Leivo both have some size and are well balanced guys too.  

 

Why is Boston so tough?  How can Marchand get away with his antics - really almost Cook or Torres like in riding and going over the edge?  Because they have a 6'9" behemoth 43ish old top 100 player all-time with a history or destroying guys while barely breaking a sweat.  He himself had admitted several times that he holds back when he fights because he doesnt want to hurt guys.  I'd bet my bank account that the "big bad Bruins" and there's swagger goes down the toilet as soon as he retires.   Who's going to be scary then?  Debrusk?  Well maybe if he had his Dads physique and used it.   The will become as soft as most other teams.

 

Personally I think once all this concussion stuff is done - and a GM decides they've seen enough, they will ice a real policeman.   Reaves (the consensus heavyweight right now) wouldn't crack the top 25 fighters back in 1994.  And that wasn't even the peak of their reign yet.   Most enforcers back then would have fed him and Wilson their lunch.   There was 50 or so enforcers back then in a much smaller league - plus at least that number that could play and fight.  Guys like May, Clark, Stevens and Stevens, Mommesso, Tochett, Neely etc. 

 

It's really a shame.   The game isn't as fun to watch anymore / sure it's a bit faster (not by much - nobody including McDavid has beat Garnters old record - now they get to start moving before the clock even starts - stupid) but it's lost part of its heart.   Why can't Horvat send a message?  Scared of losing? Who cares.   Same with JV, Miller, or anyone - anyone that's on the ice when the dirty stuff happens.  Bring up McEwen and if he won't do it find someone that will.   What happened to power forwards in the game too?  Lose their jam?  How many truly even exist in the league anymore ... Wilson?  Milbf

[Angry Goose]

14 hours ago, 189lb enforcers? said:

 

 

 

 

Edit PS

To the bolded in your comment...

Semantics, or what kind of illusion is this? 

Dirty. Late hit. Dirty hit. Dirty. All the same thing, no? 

Since when is a late hit, and on a skinny, young star, NOT dirty? 

 

 

Intention matters. I don't play play against the guy, the Canucks do.  It's up to them to determine how the guy plays.  I'm guessing Gryz isn't known for taking cheap shots.

 

So thats why I take issue for fans wanting payback.  Most have no clue what the read is on the ice.  

[alt kilgore]

I miss Tryamkin. 

I can't back it up with advanced stats, only the eye test, but I swear whenever he had a shift, the other team had a visceral response. And whoever was on the ice on our side seemed to play with a lot more bravado.  And its not that Tram was mean, like a Pronger, but it sure seemed like the other team always played a little tentative when Tram was patrolling the D zone.  Ask Jamie Benn or Ryan Getzlaf. He has the ability to throw off the other team's game. And that ability would only get better once he gets a couple of full seasons experience in the NHL.

I really hope Benning's assurances about keeping in contact with Nikita, and he is open to returning, are truthful.  I also hope Benning doesn't dump his rights for a 5th round pick or something either.  It seems that in the sport of hockey at least, GMs seem to hold grudges as much as CDC fans do. I hope Benning and Aquilini can put Tram's past decisions and attitude behind them and give him an honest shot again. Because we need him now.  Of course it would have to be reciprocal.  I would hope Tram would have matured more by now too.