TDL Strategy; Think Now, or Look Ahead?

[Got the Babych]

25 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Do the Sabres currently have a decent goalie who is on a good contract?  If so, would you do (right now) Demko + Stecher for Risto + that goalie?  Or, is that Coyote level of getting Hall (during the season while they were in first) stupid?  

Don't know what the goalie contracts are , but yes I would do that right now.

[alt kilgore]

16 hours ago, mll said:

 

Only 16 games and 250 minutes tracked.  With that little sample size per 60 numbers can often be overestimated.  

Even if it is and overestimation, which this doesn't prove one way or another, even if Stech is in that ballpark, he is miles ahead of any other of our D, until recently, in that department.  Can't people see with the eye test how well he recovers the puck, and protects it, and then takes the half second to find a forward, that or he skates it out of the D zone, and many times carries it into the O zone himself?   He is also ferocious on puck recovery if he DOES get checked off the puck. And he will take a hit from  larger players to make a play. He's one of the toughest Canucks out there. He also has the "spirit of Burrows" in that he comes to play every game. 

 

I just think watching our team this year hounded in our own end for minutes at a time, giving the opposition the puck back over an over, the last D we should be thinking of moving is a value priced puck mover like Stecher. Those who fear how we'll fair in the playoffs being so defensively porous and still think its a good Idea to trade Stecher away should give their heads a shake.

.

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Edited February 15, 2020 by kilgore

[IBatch]

2 hours ago, Provost said:

Well since we have already done a bunch of work for you to correct your misunderstanding... why don’t you provide your sources that say he isn’t eligible for the playoffs.

 

Don’t bother to include the one that is already proven wrong by Tryamkin last own previous situation.

I already have quoted it.  If the writers are wrong then it's a mistake.  His contract is up April 30th that's almost four weeks after the regular season ends.   The information isn't hard to find.  Good grief - sure it's not impossible- I've stated that too, but the idea he's coming back before that is pretty thin.   Both Benning and his agent said they won't be taking until after that.  Just google his name and the Canucks, some of the writers stated he's not eligible to play in the playoffs - all the talk is about next season.  Can't find one that says he might be here this season, that's a fantasy that the CDC started and  has snowballed into quite a few scenarios.   

Edited February 15, 2020 by IBatch

[Provost]

1 hour ago, IBatch said:

I already have quoted it.  If the writers are wrong then it's a mistake.  His contract is up April 30th that's almost four weeks after the regular season ends.   The information isn't hard to find.  Good grief - sure it's not impossible- I've stated that too, but the idea he's coming back before that is pretty thin.   Both Benning and his agent said they won't be taking until after that.  Just google his name and the Canucks, some of the writers stated he's not eligible to play in the playoffs - all the talk is about next season.  Can't find one that says he might be here this season, that's a fantasy that the CDC started and  has snowballed into quite a few scenarios.   

Ok... so your plan is to keep moving the goalposts and making new arguments each time the previous ones are debunked?

 

Yes you said it was impossible for him to sign.  As a matter of fact, you keep referring to the one quote (including just now)  that says it is impossible for him to sign.

 

You smarmily demanded that people provide proof showing that you were wrong... several folks obliged and actually did the work to illustrate and provide examples for why it is not impossible and that one single article you keep referencing Saying that it is... is objectively wrong.

 

Then you said both JB and Tryamkin’s agent said that he wouldn’t be returning this season.  Neither of them said that and you didn’t bother to look or couldn’t find anything to support your claim about them ever saying that.

 

You are also claiming that a bunch of other writers are saying that it is not possible for him to sign and yet when asked, you haven’t provided any of those references to support your claim.  Are they some random fan page if they exist at all?

 

I provided you with the actual Most recent Benning quote about the plan to talk after the KHL season is done.  They didn’t say they would wait until April 30th.  Benning has also said that he has kept regular contact with Tryamkin’s agent all along.  There won’t be any point making any concrete plans until they know how long his KHL playoff run is.

 

It will take Tryamkin asking for the early termination of his KHL contract once his team is out of the playoffs (no issue there).  Then it will be for Benning to decide if he has the interest and space to add Tryamkin for the last few games of our season and playoffs.

 

If you just said that you don’t think he is going to sign, that is fine.  Continually saying here is ineligible... even now suggesting that a bunch of writers make that case... that is the problem because it just isn’t true.  It is made worse by you then trying to turn your errors around and suggest it is posters here that are wrong in making up “fantasies” about it.

 

Literally from the horse’s mouth (his agent).  Nothing about next season, he keeps saying as soon as his season is done.

 

Out of respect for his current team and their playoff hopes, we aren’t going to talk about it until that is done.  As soon as that is done, there is plenty of time to come to engage with the Canucks and work something out.

 

 

https://www.tsn.ca/radio/vancouver-1040/diamond-tryamkin-returning-to-the-canucks-is-definitely-on-the-table-his-goal-is-to-return-to-vancouver-1.1429648

Edited February 15, 2020 by Provost

[IBatch]

1 hour ago, Provost said:

AOk... so your plan is to keep moving the goalposts and making new arguments each time the previous ones are debunked?

 

Yes you said it was impossible for him to sign.  As a matter of fact, you keep referring to the one quote (including just now)  that says it is impossible for him to sign.

 

Several folks actually did the work to illustrate and provide examples for why it is not impossible and that one single article you keep referencing Saying that it is... is objectively wrong.

 

Then you said both JB and Tryamkin’s agent said that he wouldn’t be returning this season.  Neither of them said that and you didn’t bother to look or couldn’t find anything to support your claim about them ever saying that.

 

You are also claiming that a bunch of other writers are saying that it is not possible for him to sign and yet when asked, you haven’t provided any of those references to support your claim.  Are they some random fan page if they exist at all?

 

I provided you with the actual Most recent Benning quote about the plan to talk after the KHL season is done.  They didn’t say they would wait until April 30th.  Benning has also said that he has kept regular contact with Tryamkin’s agent all along.  There won’t be any point making any concrete plans until they know how long his KHL playoff run is.

 

It will take Tryamkin asking for the early termination of his KHL contract once his team is out of the playoffs (no issue there).  Then it will be for Benning to decide if he has the interest and space to add Tryamkin for the last few games of our season and playoffs.

 

If you just said that you don’t think he is going to sign, that is fine.  Continually saying here is ineligible... even now suggesting that a bunch of writers make that case... that is the problem because it just isn’t true.  It is made worse by you then trying to turn your errors around and suggest it is posters here that are wrong in making up “fantasies” about it.

 

Literally from the horse’s mouth (his agent).  Nothing about next season, he keeps saying as soon as his season is done.

 

Out of respect for his current team and their playoff hopes, we aren’t going to talk about it until that is done.  As soon as that is done, there is plenty of time to come to engage with the Canucks and work something out.

 

 

https://www.tsn.ca/radio/vancouver-1040/diamond-tryamkin-returning-to-the-canucks-is-definitely-on-the-table-his-goal-is-to-return-to-vancouver-1.1429648

Listen I like reading both yours Agents posts - not trying to move goalposts.  But the data available to read is contradictory to Tryamkin coming back for the playoffs.   I'm really finding it difficult to find any at all that states his wishes are to play this season.   Every one is next season.   A simple google search will find numerous quotes from both his agent and JB that they will talk in May, or after his contract is up...as for specific references I'm not tech savy enough to copy and paste links or the articles but have paraphrased a few times.  Jan 20 DailyHive did an article stating he's not eligible for the playoffs given his contract isn't done in time for a specific reference - there's about 8 on the subject that I could find - and in each one the quotes they use from JB and their agent is that next season is the focus.  Of course it's not impossible - never said it was - but the print media at least has painted a very clear picture it's not going to happen this year.  THN also did an article on him awhile ago - and also stated that he wouldn't be available until to 2020-2021 season, but I'm too lazy to look for it (magazine). 

 

I also participated in this "fantasy " in the past until another poster pointed out it's highly unlikely and since then have been paying closer attention.    Don't see how this is doing work ha ha - it's a fan site but I do appreciate others bringing some examples.  

 

Guess we will just wait and see.

[Lazurus]

6 hours ago, Viper007 said:

6 hours ago, Viper007 said:

Isn't there a rule in the NHL that says if a player isn't signed before Jan 1 they're ineligible to play in the playoffs or something like that?

Might be March 1. not Jan 1

This may help; It has already happened under this CBA

 

SKA was eliminated in the KHL conference finals by CSKA Moscow on Tuesday, and TSN reported Friday that Gusev received a contract release from SKA. It was set to expire at the end of April.

Gusev was a seventh-round pick (No. 202) in the 2012 NHL Draft by the Tampa Bay Lightning but has not played in the NHL.

Vegas acquired Gusev in a trade with Tampa Bay during the 2017 NHL Expansion Draft in correspondence with the Golden Knights then choosing defenseman Jason Garrison.

Gusev is the reigning MVP of the Kontinental Hockey League. The 26-year-old left wing has played with SKA St. Petersburg since 2015-16 and this season led the KHL with 82 points (17 goals, 65 assists).

"I don't know much about him," Vegas coach Gerard Gallant said Thursday. "[Golden Knights general manager] George [McPhee] mentioned it today. ... If he joins us, we'll see what's going to happen. Hopefully he does join us and gets some practice time in with us, but I have no idea where that's going."

Vegas trailed the San Jose Sharks in the best-of-7 Western Conference First Round with Game 2 on Friday at San Jose (10:30 p.m. ET; NBCSN, SN360, TVAS2, NBCSCA, ATTSN-RM).

 

 

 

Darren Dreger

@DarrenDreger

 

JP Barry of CAA Sports has confirmed that they have received Nikita Gusev’s contract release from the Deputy Chairman and Vice President of SKA HC Roman Rotenberg. Gusev is now eligible to sign a 1 yr deal with Vegas Golden Knights for the 18-19 playoffs.

1:36 PM · Apr 12, 2019·Twitter for iPhone

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This was during the playoffs so yes Tryamkin can play. Why might the KHL team end the contract a few weeks early, perception of being player friendly and if the player comes back they may want him to play there again.

 

 

Edited February 16, 2020 by Lazurus

[Viper007]

12 minutes ago, Lazurus said:

This may help;

 

SKA was eliminated in the KHL conference finals by CSKA Moscow on Tuesday, and TSN reported Friday that Gusev received a contract release from SKA. It was set to expire at the end of April.

Gusev was a seventh-round pick (No. 202) in the 2012 NHL Draft by the Tampa Bay Lightning but has not played in the NHL.

Vegas acquired Gusev in a trade with Tampa Bay during the 2017 NHL Expansion Draft in correspondence with the Golden Knights then choosing defenseman Jason Garrison.

This was during the playoffs so yes Tryamkin can play. Why might the KHL team end the contract a few weeks early, perception of being player friendly and if the player comes back they may want him to play there again.

 

 

Gusev never played for Vegas though.  Doesn't say the date either.  Doesn't even mention being allowed to play in the playoffs either.  I really don't know how this helps to be honest.

 

Edit: Nevermind about the date part I see it at the end.

Edited February 16, 2020 by Viper007

[Trebreh]

Rakell and Kane are non rental trade options for us if we want to upgrade our top 6.

 

 

[Lazurus]

4 minutes ago, Viper007 said:

Gusev never played for Vegas though.  Doesn't say the date either.  Doesn't even mention being allowed to play in the playoffs either.  I really don't know how this helps to be honest.

You think Dreger just tosses out any bit of info during the playoffs? With all those named it must be a conspiracy. It doesn't matter IF he played it matters that he could have and to tell the truth this took all of 40 seconds to find this ONE player, didn't Minnesota also have a past Russian do this?

In the past players who got of college were able to sign at any time.

And I think Tryamkin is on the Canucks reserve list still.

 

The Date is on the twitter account April 12, 2019

Edited February 16, 2020 by Lazurus

[Nuxfanabroad]

8 minutes ago, Trebreh said:

Rakell and Kane are non rental trade options for us if we want to upgrade our top 6.

 

 

Don't like adding the unpredictability of Kane's off-ice antics, with our young bunch. Further, give the eastern media plenty reason to hate-on our squad, as they love to do

[Viper007]

12 minutes ago, Lazurus said:

You think Dreger just tosses out any bit of info during the playoffs? With all those named it must be a conspiracy. It doesn't matter IF he played it matters that he could have and to tell the truth this took all of 40 seconds to find this ONE player, didn't Minnesota also have a past Russian do this?

In the past players who got of college were able to sign at any time.

And I think Tryamkin is on the Canucks reserve list still.

 

The Date is on the twitter account April 12, 2019

6 hours ago, Provost said:

Ya, loaned out wouldn’t be the right actual CBA term... 

 

He is eligible to play because he is on our reserve list.  NCAA players can too, even if they weren’t signed to NHL contracts before the deadline.

Yup already mentioned.

 

[Trebreh]

4 minutes ago, Nuxfanabroad said:

Don't like adding the unpredictability of Kane's off-ice antics, with our young bunch. Further, give the eastern media plenty reason to hate-on our squad, as they love to do

I welcome the hate 

 

He's like a younger Simmonds and we need an element of dirtiness in our lineup for the playoffs. our most successful team ever had Torres, Bur and Lappy in it. Kane and Rous would give us that edge.

[Phil_314]

4 hours ago, kilgore said:

Even if it is and overestimation, which this doesn't prove one way or another, even if Stech is in that ballpark, he is miles ahead of any other of our D, until recently, in that department.  Can't people see with the eye test how well he recovers the puck, and protects it, and then takes the half second to find a forward, that or he skates it out of the D zone, and many times carries it into the O zone himself?   He is also ferocious on puck recovery if he DOES get checked off the puck. And he will take a hit from  larger players to make a play. He's one of the toughest Canucks out there. He also has the "spirit of Burrows" in that he comes to play every game. 

 

I just think watching our team this year hounded in our own end for minutes at a time, giving the opposition the puck back over an over, the last D we should be thinking of moving is a value priced puck mover like Stecher. Those who fear how we'll fair in the playoffs being so defensively porous and still think its a good Idea to trade Stecher away should give their heads a shake.

Yeah I think in his own end he is underrated as a new-age transition D-man, even if his numbers don't reflect it.  For play driving purposes and two-way play I would value him above Myers, but too bad we couldn't trade Tyler given how we've saddled ourselves with a gargantuan 5 year deal.  With that it might be necesary to trade Troy if only to have cap space to bring back other important pieces of depth.  In an ideal world I'd trade Myers and get a PF in return with Ferland's likely retirement. 

[knucklehead91]

Well with Florida starting to fall back in the Race, there are 2 UFAs I would be interested in. They cant sign both Dadonov and Hoffman. One is going to be gone this summer.

Maybe something like Baer+Lockwood+4th for Dadonov?

We can shed some cap at the end of the season moving Baer out and letting Dadonov go. With Ferland out and likely done for the season, we can put him on LTIR and pick up a top 6 fwd.

Thoughts? Underpayment or overpayment?

[alt kilgore]

1 hour ago, Phil_314 said:

Yeah I think in his own end he is underrated as a new-age transition D-man, even if his numbers don't reflect it.  For play driving purposes and two-way play I would value him above Myers, but too bad we couldn't trade Tyler given how we've saddled ourselves with a gargantuan 5 year deal.  With that it might be necesary to trade Troy if only to have cap space to bring back other important pieces of depth.  In an ideal world I'd trade Myers and get a PF in return with Ferland's likely retirement. 

You may be right. In a perfect world it would be Eriksson, or Beagle, even Myers or Sutter that we could cull and improve on, for the cap hit they take. But in the real world it will be valuable players like Stecher and either Markstrom or Demko.  I hope JB can manage to keep Stecher though. In the playoffs, size is only one component for success in the D zone.

I'm hoping for a Louie retirement party this summer to make some room in the cap. 

[Alflives]

8 minutes ago, knucklehead91 said:

Well with Florida starting to fall back in the Race, there are 2 UFAs I would be interested in. They cant sign both Dadonov and Hoffman. One is going to be gone this summer.

Maybe something like Baer+Lockwood+4th for Dadonov?

We can shed some cap at the end of the season moving Baer out and letting Dadonov go. With Ferland out and likely done for the season, we can put him on LTIR and pick up a top 6 fwd.

Thoughts? Underpayment or overpayment?

Neither.  Dadinov os Russian, and we don’t treat them well enough to want them to live here.  Hoffman is a total and complete loser on every level as a human being.  He would destroy our locker room.  So I have to say a BIG NO to your Fla ideas.  

[knucklehead91]

1 minute ago, Alflives said:

Neither.  Dadinov os Russian, and we don’t treat them well enough to want them to live here.  Hoffman is a total and complete loser on every level as a human being.  He would destroy our locker room.  So I have to say a BIG NO to your Fla ideas.  

Yes Hoffman is a dbag, which is why Im suggesting Dadonov overall. which is a rental and if we could move out Baertschi’s contract and let Dadonov walk at the end of the season, we’ve given ourselves some cap relief.

Im not a big fan of Hoffman, but I am a fan of wanting to win a cup. 
Theres countless Dbags that have won cups, kinda like that rat in boston. Parayko in STL. I know some people who know him personally and said he was quite a piece of work. It would be nice to add a legit top 6 on Horvats line, I feel like Dadonov would really compliment him very well.

[spook007]

On 2/15/2020 at 4:13 AM, Lazurus said:

I don't know about that, wasn't there a TDL where he said afterwards nobody phoned him? I got the impression he didn't make any calls that year.

Ferland is probably done. But why trade away when Gaudette is playing good? He is a replacement player, he was assigned to Utica it was only a injury that got him to the big club. Wasn't the farm supposed to be where the team got new players too?

 

Markstom's value will never be higher than the next two weeks unfortunately Demko's gets higher the closer expansion gets.

 

Isn't this Benning's make it or break it year? So I do expect some big move, maybe trading away another pick to make cap space and more to get a rental.

 

I hope not Simmonds, his game has tanked, all those years have caught up to him.

 

I hope Benning does not trade away any player under 27.

 

This team is unproven and the way most of the media experts talk, it will not take much to make the playoffs, that is not a ringing endorsement for success. What is the face a revamped Edmonton? With McD injured they have lots of LTIR money and can trade for Krieder or Hall and Petry or Martinez, that would shift the balance of power in the last week when McD returns.

 

Stick with what is here, only the d can be upgraded and at that IMO they have to tighten up, the number of shots they give up will show up in the playoffs as losses, Chicago, a team not in the playoff picture schooled them.

 

Actually if this team was out of it now then trade Markstrom that takes care of the goalie problem and eases up the cap crunch, package Stecher up with Eriksson with retention and trade them as a package, consider a trade with Minnesota of Boeser and a 3rd for their 1rst and Greenway, that frees up more cap space and is a probable lottery pick, if  top 10 then there is a 97% chance the kid can play next year in a sheltered role if necessary.

Trade Tanev even if it is for some magic beans, lots of teams want a defensive dman and he has been injury free this season. Call up Rafferty, more millions saved.

Take advantage of TDL madness!!!

A Markstrom trade just reaffirms Benning saying Demko is the future, signing Markstrom means the opposite and costs the team millions more on the cap. Tanev moving leaves enough money to sign Tryamkin and play Rafferty and still save more millions.

 

Team comes away after the TDL with millions in cap space that can be used at the expansion draft, no goalie controversy, Demko and DiPetro or some other back up, Eriksson gone or at least some of his cap hit, Stecher gets a home, the big thing here is the cap savings, Boeser goes home to be close to family, the team saves more millions and gets a 6'6" forward telephone guy that likes to "reach out and touch someone" (old commercial).

 

There will only be maybe 10 teams competing with the Canucks as sellers instead of at the end of the season when there are 31 less supply make higher prices or what the market will bear, we know all about that in the gas pricing, as much as can be until sales drop off

Don't quite understand here... If its Bennings make or break year, why on earth would he trade away Markstrom and run with demo and DP? as well as moving Tanev? 

I get you want cap space, but I don't see has this will make or break Benning.

This would be saying we don't care if we miss the Play offs or get knocked out in round 1.

Think this is a bad signal to send to the youngsters in this team, who hopefully is about to try play offs hockey for the first time.

Edited February 16, 2020 by spook007

[DownUndaCanuck]

I think and hope JB sits tight on this one, it'd be tempting to load up, trade a prospect for a decent top-6 forward (eg. Juolevi for a scorer) or try and bulk up the 3rd or 4th line, but we've got to remember not to sacrifice our future and most importantly, with the expansion draft coming up, that will be another player we have to protect at the expense of a young guy we don't have to protect.

 

If anything, I'd like to see a nice lateral trade but really hope JB doesn't trade any of our defencemen away. Of course with Ferland out we could use some toughness but in all honesty I think this team has it hiding, and come playoff time our boys will get fired up and start throwing the body around. We've got "tough" forwards and big strong defencemen, we just aren't playing a tough game and personnel isn't necessarily going to change that but come playoff time, I think Green will get these guys playing a lot harder.

[spook007]

Leave it, as it is...

Would like some muscle but price would be too high....

 

In the off season get rid of deadweight. If ALF is right and LE retires after the season ends, there should be dollars available to pay, for the upgrades we crave.

Let the young ones get a glimpse of the play offs.... including the fringe players. After all they are hopefully going to replace the likes of Roussel, Sutter and Beagle over the next few years.... give them the hunger to want more...

Edited February 16, 2020 by spook007