[Signing] Canucks sign Tucker Poolman

[aGENT]

15 minutes ago, VancouverHabitant said:

Exactly, his fair market value is about 4.5 million given that he plays the second most minutes on our team and is a staple of our special teams (PK).  

 

Salary cap was supposed to be approaching and surpassing 90 million next year before covid struck.  This is one of many slightly overinflated contracts signed two years ago. 

$4.5m is for defensive oriented guys like Larsson or Tanev who play about 19-20 minutes a night and don't create a lot of offense. Valuable players certainly, but simply not the same value.

 

22 min/night guys brushing up against .5PPG get paid more. Myers is easily worth at least $5.5m on even a 'very good value' deal. The $6m we're paying him is hardly an overpay if you could even consider it one at all.

 

UFA aged D men who are legit first pair, are making between $7m-$12m dollars. People seem to quickly forget the rumours of 7x$7m the media was throwing around/expecting when we signed Myers. THAT would have been an overpay. We're well under that in both term and dollars.

Edited August 21, 2021 by aGENT

[Bure_Pavel]

On 8/21/2021 at 4:03 PM, aGENT said:

$4.5m is for defensive oriented guys like Larsson or Tanev who play about 19-20 minutes a night and don't create a lot of offense. Valuable players certainly, but simply not the same value.

 

22 min/night guys brushing up against .5PPG get paid more. Myers is easily worth at least $5.5m on even a 'very good value' deal. The $6m we're paying him is hardly an overpay if you could even consider it one at all.

 

UFA aged D men who are legit first pair, are making between $7m-$12m dollars. People seem to quickly forget the rumours of 7x$7m the media was throwing around/expecting when we signed Myers. THAT would have been an overpay. We're well under that in both term and dollars.

I would argue he is a bit over paid and should be making between 4.5 -5 million. Currently Myers is the 33rd highest paid Dman in the league. Meaning he should be performing a as a legit top pairing D man, but is more of a 3-4 Dman. Like most FA's though you have to overpay them to land them. Not like we have drafted any stud RD's in a while. 

 

The top 62 Dmen in the league (top pairing money) make between 11.5 - 4.875 million dollars.

Edited August 23, 2021 by Bure_Pavel

[aGENT]

2 hours ago, Bure_Pavel said:

I would argue he is a bit over paid and should be making between 4.5 -5 million. Currently Myers is the 33rd highest paid Dman in the league. Meaning he should be performing a as a legit top pairing D man, but is more of a 3-4 Dman. Like most FA's though you have to overpay them to land them. Not like we have drafted any stud RD's in a while. 

 

The top 62 Dmen in the league (top pairing money) make between 11.5 - 4.875 million dollars.

Not remotely how that works. RFA vs UFA years. He's paid right in the wheel house of a UFA aged, 2nd pair D.

[Bure_Pavel]

52 minutes ago, aGENT said:

Not remotely how that works. RFA vs UFA years. He's paid right in the wheel house of a UFA aged, 2nd pair D.

Still can be considered over payed relative to performance, the cap doesnt care about age or contact statuses. Its just a number, and you better hope players are performing close to their caps. The fact is after the Hughes Signing the Canucks will likely have one of the top 5 most expensive D corps in the league, and if they cant perform as such Canucks will have a hard time competing for the cup. In the cap era you need to have players outperforming their contracts to be successful. I also like Myers as a player and what he brings to the team, especially when we were playing in the bubble.  

Edited August 23, 2021 by Bure_Pavel

[aGENT]

1 hour ago, Bure_Pavel said:

Still can be considered over payed relative to performance, the cap doesnt care about age or contact statuses. 

The cap doesn't care about anything. As you pointed out, it's just a number. Players and their agents sure do care about age and contract status though and whether you like it or not, those things directly impact how much cap a player takes up. Myers, at $6m, as a UFA, is not remotely close to overpaid for a +/-22 minute, 2nd pair, +/-35 point RD with size who can skate.

 

You're living in a fantasy land if you're attempting to directly compare that with ELC and RFA contracted players (which you were). McAvoy isn't 'outplaying' his current $4.9m contract, he simply an RFA that couldn't demand as much money because of it. You better bet he'll be getting north of $8m on his next deal as well.

[Bure_Pavel]

39 minutes ago, aGENT said:

The cap doesn't care about anything. As you pointed out, it's just a number. Players and their agents sure do care about age and contract status though and whether you like it or not, those things directly impact how much cap a player takes up. Myers, at $6m, as a UFA, is not remotely close to overpaid for a +/-22 minute, 2nd pair, +/-35 point RD with size who can skate.

 

You're living in a fantasy land if you're attempting to directly compare that with ELC and RFA contracted players (which you were). McAvoy isn't 'outplaying' his current $4.9m contract, he simply an RFA that couldn't demand as much money because of it. You better bet he'll be getting north of $8m on his next deal as well.

Yeah so for McAvoy he is currently outplaying his cap hit and when he signs his next deal he probably wont be. I look at it as strictly production vs cap hit. A great time to make a good playoff push is when star players are on the last year of their ELC as they are pretty much guaranteed to out perform their contract. Unfortunately we had to much dead cap last year to take advantage of it. 

[CanucksJay]

2 hours ago, Bure_Pavel said:

Yeah so for McAvoy he is currently outplaying his cap hit and when he signs his next deal he probably wont be. I look at it as strictly production vs cap hit. A great time to make a good playoff push is when star players are on the last year of their ELC as they are pretty much guaranteed to out perform their contract. Unfortunately we had to much dead cap last year to take advantage of it. 

I think this begs the question, who from our roster will outperform their caphits? 

For me, it's Horvat, Boeser, Miller, Demko, Podz, Hogz, Sutter

It's kind of scary that I don't see many on defence that can outperform their cap hit besides maybe Rathbone and Juolevi. Best outcome for OEL is to be worth his cap hit. 

Hughes and Petterson will be either fair market value or slightly overpaid (but will hopefully outplay their contract during the later years of their contracts) 

[Alflives]

13 minutes ago, CanucksJay said:

I think this begs the question, who from our roster will outperform their caphits? 

For me, it's Horvat, Boeser, Miller, Demko, Podz, Hogz, Sutter

It's kind of scary that I don't see many on defence that can outperform their cap hit besides maybe Rathbone and Juolevi. Best outcome for OEL is to be worth his cap hit. 

Hughes and Petterson will be either fair market value or slightly overpaid (but will hopefully outplay their contract during the later years of their contracts) 

This is exactly why the Loser Leafs Lose in the first round all the time.  Their three to paid forwards are Losers in hard nosed playoff hockey.  Fortunately our guys aren’t Losers like that.  Marner is maybe the worst contact in the league during the playoffs.  Or Maybe it’s Tavares?  It’s close.  

[Makaramel MacKhiato]

9 hours ago, Bure_Pavel said:

I would argue he is a bit over paid and should be making between 4.5 -5 million. Currently Myers is the 33rd highest paid Dman in the league. Meaning he should be performing a as a legit top pairing D man, but is more of a 3-4 Dman. Like most FA's though you have to overpay them to land them. Not like we have drafted any stud RD's in a while. 

 

The top 62 Dmen in the league (top pairing money) make between 11.5 - 4.875 million dollars.

We also have to realize that RHD are getting paid more than LHD because of the severe need for them. Further, Myers is a big body, which is rare as well. He may be overpayed, but I'd hate to lose him. He's such a key part of our lineup. 

[Me_]

56 minutes ago, Alflives said:

This is exactly why the Loser Leafs Lose in the first round all the time.  Their three to paid forwards are Losers in hard nosed playoff hockey.  Fortunately our guys aren’t Losers like that.  Marner is maybe the worst contact in the league during the playoffs.  Or Maybe it’s Tavares?  It’s close.  

Actually no. It’s still Eriksson.

 

[canucklehead44]

On 8/21/2021 at 7:03 PM, aGENT said:

$4.5m is for defensive oriented guys like Larsson or Tanev who play about 19-20 minutes a night and don't create a lot of offense. Valuable players certainly, but simply not the same value.

 

22 min/night guys brushing up against .5PPG get paid more. Myers is easily worth at least $5.5m on even a 'very good value' deal. The $6m we're paying him is hardly an overpay if you could even consider it one at all.

 

UFA aged D men who are legit first pair, are making between $7m-$12m dollars. People seem to quickly forget the rumours of 7x$7m the media was throwing around/expecting when we signed Myers. THAT would have been an overpay. We're well under that in both term and dollars.

Tanev was one of the best defenseman in the NHL last season overall, and the best in the league defensively. Tanev at 6 million would be far better value than Myers at 4.5. Larsson was very good as well, he is also much more valuable than Myers. 
 

Myers is pretty skilled and has some offensive talent but is not a high end offensive guy. Defensively he struggles 

Edited August 25, 2021 by canucklehead44

[Me_]

8 minutes ago, canucklehead44 said:

Tanev was one of the best defenseman in the NHL last season overall, and the best in the league defensively. Tanev at 6 million would be far better value than Myers at 4.5. Larsson was very good as well, he is also much more valuable than Myers. 
 

Myers is pretty skilled and has some offensive talent but is not a high end offensive guy. Defensively he struggles 

What a homer.

And then to put Larsson in to cover for your homerism…

 

Myers is worth his money hands down.

[canucklehead44]

16 minutes ago, Me_ said:

What a homer.

And then to put Larsson in to cover for your homerism…

 

Myers is worth his money hands down.

Who is a homer ? I am just going by advanced stats, articles from sports writers, and whatever I saw on TV plus talking to local fans on forums. If anything I am being a homer for not being harder on Myers 

 

https://thehockeywriters.com/canucks-2020-21-report-card-tyler-myers/

 

https://thehockeywriters.com/flames-2020-21-report-cards-chris-tanev/

 

Please share a source I’d love to read more into it 

Edited August 25, 2021 by canucklehead44

[aGENT]

24 minutes ago, canucklehead44 said:

Tanev was one of the best defenseman in the NHL last season overall, and the best in the league defensively. Tanev at 6 million would be far better value than Myers at 4.5. Larsson was very good as well, he is also much more valuable than Myers. 
 

Myers is pretty skilled and has some offensive talent but is not a high end offensive guy. Defensively he struggles 

The market disagrees with you. Guys who play more minutes, and score more points, make more money. 'Better defensively' (and I agree) or not.

[canucklehead44]

4 minutes ago, aGENT said:

The market disagrees with you. Guys who play more minutes, and score more points, make more money. 'Better defensively' (and I agree) or not.

I guess I would rather have a more valuable overall player who has a more positive net impact on winning than a guy who “puts up more points” but what do I know. Given Benning’s track record and the success of our team since he took over he obviously knows what he is doing . My guess is you are also a huge Tyson Barrie fan then?

Edited August 25, 2021 by canucklehead44

[Me_]

22 minutes ago, canucklehead44 said:

Who is a homer ? I am just going by advanced stats, articles from sports writers, and whatever I saw on TV plus talking to local fans on forums. If anything I am being a homer for not being harder on Myers 

 

https://thehockeywriters.com/canucks-2020-21-report-card-tyler-myers/

 

https://thehockeywriters.com/flames-2020-21-report-cards-chris-tanev/

 

Please share a source I’d love to read more into it 

Even worse post than your last one.

Get with the program bud.

[aGENT]

5 minutes ago, canucklehead44 said:

I guess I would rather have a more valuable overall player who has a more positive net impact on winning than a guy who “puts up more points” but what do I know. Given Benning’s track record and the success of our team since he took over he obviously knows what he is doing . My guess is you are also a huge Tyson Barrie fan then?

Defensive players always get paid less. Just how it is. Same goes with forwards... Floaters who put up points make cash more cash than shut down/PK guys. If you can do both you REALLY get paid.

 

Talk to GM's and agents and tell them to fix it.

[canucklehead44]

Just now, Me_ said:

Even worse post than your last one.

Get with the program bud.

Thanks for the insight! Vancouver has such nice people and knowledge hockey fans 

[canucklehead44]

2 minutes ago, aGENT said:

Defensive players always get paid less. Just how it is. Same goes with forwards... Floaters who put up points make cash more cash than shut down/PK guys. If you can do both you REALLY get paid.

 

Talk to GM's and agents and tell them to fix it.

I guess that is what separates the successful GMs from the less successful GMs 

[Me_]

4 minutes ago, canucklehead44 said:

Thanks for the insight! Vancouver has such nice people and knowledge hockey fans 

Yep, taking a dump on players is the official sport.

 

You’re obviously a great fan.

 

Keep it up. You’re gonna make it.

 

Edited August 25, 2021 by Me_