[Rumour] J.T. Miller Trade/Contract Talks

[aliboy]

21 minutes ago, mll said:

Dates are pushed back this year.  13 July for free agency with the draft 7-8 July.

 

They are technically not allowed to according to some.  Even his agent hints at it when he says they can't talk extension before the summer.  

 

 

So here it is, I am surprised, would have thought a club can negotiate with their own player then sign after the appropriate date, but no.

 

RENEGOTIATION OF CONTRACTS

Will Clubs be able to renegotiate contracts with players?

No. Player contracts will not be renegotiated (upward or downward) during their term. Extensions may be negotiated but only in the final year of the contract and only if such extension is for an amount that can be accommodated in a Club's upper limit for the current year or as computed for future years.

[mll]

Just now, aliboy said:

So here it is, I am surprised, would have thought a club can negotiate with their own player then sign after the appropriate date, but no.

 

RENEGOTIATION OF CONTRACTS

Will Clubs be able to renegotiate contracts with players?

No. Player contracts will not be renegotiated (upward or downward) during their term. Extensions may be negotiated but only in the final year of the contract and only if such extension is for an amount that can be accommodated in a Club's upper limit for the current year or as computed for future years.

Thanks.  

 

So they also can't allow other teams to talk to him before free agency.  If he is traded at the draft, it would be as a 1-year rental.  Wonder if they wait until free agency opens up to give teams the opportunity to talk to him about an extension.

 

[Steve84]

Not sure if this has been covered yet, but here are my ideal trade destinations for Miller:

Calgary:
Key piece is Rasmus Andersson.  25YO RD signed for 4.5m.  Probably need to involve a few other pieces as Calgary needs cap space to sign Gaudreau & Tkachuk.  Could see Toffoli coming back (could always flip him for a pick at the trade deadline) or Lucic (I know he's useless, but we can flip him for a pick at the trade deadline too, or request a higher pick from Calgary to compensate).
Maybe something like Miller + x for Rasmus Andersson + Toffoli/Lucic + high pick.

Florida:
They have 1 more year before they have to re-sign Huberdeau so they have one more year to go all in. Key piece would be Verhaeghe.  I could also see Hornqvist coming back (flip for a pick + have florida send a higher pick to compensate).  I would love Lundell but Florida would be dumb to trade him.
Miller + x for Verhaeghe + Hornqvist + high pick.  

Carolina:
Not sure what they are going to do, but I wouldn't mind Necas via a sign & trade over to the canucks (assuming he signs a favorable contract).
Miller for Necas.  

Edited May 31, 2022 by Steve84

[Me_]

1 hour ago, I.Am.Ironman said:

He's not resigning here.

Did he say it? Did management say it? Who said Miller isn’t re-signing here? Your personal valet?

[Captain Canuck #12]

53 minutes ago, Steve84 said:

Not sure if this has been covered yet, but here are my ideal trade destinations for Miller:

Calgary:
Key piece is Rasmus Andersson.  25YO RD signed for 4.5m.  Probably need to involve a few other pieces as Calgary needs cap space to sign Gaudreau & Tkachuk.  Could see Toffoli coming back (could always flip him for a pick at the trade deadline) or Lucic (I know he's useless, but we can flip him for a pick at the trade deadline too, or request a higher pick from Calgary to compensate).
Maybe something like Miller + x for Rasmus Andersson + Toffoli/Lucic + high pick.

Florida:
They have 1 more year before they have to re-sign Huberdeau so they have one more year to go all in. Key piece would be Verhaeghe.  I could also see Hornqvist coming back (flip for a pick + have florida send a higher pick to compensate).  I would love Lundell but Florida would be dumb to trade him.
Miller + x for Verhaeghe + Hornqvist + high pick.  

Carolina:
Not sure what they are going to do, but I wouldn't mind Necas via a sign & trade over to the canucks (assuming he signs a favorable contract).
Miller for Necas.  

It's been covered.

[I.Am.Ironman]

7 hours ago, Me_ said:

Did he say it? Did management say it? Who said Miller isn’t re-signing here? Your personal valet?

My opinion, no need to get your knickers in a knot. If he does sign here it is for an overpayment which, imo, will hurt the team in the long run. He does not play a style that will transition well into his 30s which is the age range the whole of his new contract will be played.

 

How old is Miller when the Canucks have acquired/developed their top pair RHD, another top line winger, 3C etc? Certainly not within the next 2-3 years when Miller is likely to be the most effective.

[JM_]

9 hours ago, mll said:

Dates are pushed back this year.  13 July for free agency with the draft 7-8 July.

 

They are technically not allowed to according to some.  Even his agent hints at it when he says they can't talk extension before the summer.  

 

 

I have a hard time believing that there wouldn't be general discussions over interest in staying. You don't have to "negotiate" hard numbers but you could have a lot of discussion over intentions on staying, general contract length (e.g., looking for a short or long term) and certainly the yearly exit interviews would be informative. 

[JM_]

12 minutes ago, I.Am.Ironman said:

My opinion, no need to get your knickers in a knot. If he does sign here it is for an overpayment which, imo, will hurt the team in the long run. He does not play a style that will transition well into his 30s which is the age range the whole of his new contract will be played.

 

How old is Miller when the Canucks have acquired/developed their top pair RHD, another top line winger, 3C etc? Certainly not within the next 2-3 years when Miller is likely to be the most effective.

we may never have a true top pair RHD, not sure I want to make that the requirement to sign Miller or not. We may end up with three offensive players on the left side (Hughes, OEL, Rathbone) and more stay at home types on the right side. 

 

Another winger can come via free agency after next season when our dead cap is gone. 

 

Edited May 31, 2022 by JM_

[aGENT]

9 hours ago, aliboy said:

So here it is, I am surprised, would have thought a club can negotiate with their own player then sign after the appropriate date, but no.

 

RENEGOTIATION OF CONTRACTS

Will Clubs be able to renegotiate contracts with players?

No. Player contracts will not be renegotiated (upward or downward) during their term. Extensions may be negotiated but only in the final year of the contract and only if such extension is for an amount that can be accommodated in a Club's upper limit for the current year or as computed for future years.

 

30 minutes ago, JM_ said:

I have a hard time believing that there wouldn't be general discussions over interest in staying. You don't have to "negotiate" hard numbers but you could have a lot of discussion over intentions on staying, general contract length (e.g., looking for a short or long term) and certainly the yearly exit interviews would be informative. 

Exactly. Strictly, they're not allowed to "negotiate" but they can certainly have "discussions". 

 

There's a reason so many deals (with highly complicated structures, bonuses, trade clauses etc) are signed literally minutes after free agency opens. They didn't just magically sort through all of that in 20 minutes...

Edited May 31, 2022 by aGENT

[JM_]

2 minutes ago, aGENT said:

 

Exactly. Strictly, they're not allowed to "negotiate" but they can certainly have "discussions". 

 

There's a reason so many deals (with highly complicated structures, bonuses trade clauses etc) are signed literally minutes after free agency opens. They didn't just magically sort through all of that in 20 minutes...

its kind of a stupid rule. If a player wants to negotiate, let them. 

[Warhippy]

11 hours ago, higgyfan said:

Don't know what you mean about being 'smug'.  You said that Bo would be 30yrs by the time the Canucks would have a  team that could actually beat any of the 3 top teams in the West.  Then it would take time to meet the next level in the east.  Your projection is 4 yrs minimum and now you are talking about most of the other teams in the west are ahead of

the Canucks in the building team race.  That seems like a long way from 2025.

 

 

Smug...was douchey on my part.  So my apologies as I probably read or deciphered that wrong.

 

Bo is now just 27 years old.  We already see and have teams that dominated the west aging out.  LA and Anaheim being the teams on the up and Dallas, Minnesota, San Jose, Winnipeg on their way down.  Arizona, Chicago, Seattle, Rebuilding and we haven't picked a direction yet.

 

Vancouver has the ability due to their age and assets right now to do what LA did over 3 years or what Anaheim is doing.  Retool and rebuild FAST.  In 2 years Bo will be almost 30.  That's where that statement is.

[Warhippy]

10 hours ago, mll said:

 

They can't extend him before the draft as he won't yet be in the last year of his deal - at the draft he's a 1-year rental.  Anyone know if teams are even allowed to talk to him about an extension before.

 

There's expected to be plenty of teams interested in Miller.  He's one year to UFA and has leverage to decide where he signs.  He can't prevent Vancouver from trading him as a 1-year rental but he's not forced to extend with anyone.  

He's nearing 30 and has yet to win a Cup.  NJD finished near bottom in the standings and have a pretty large question mark in goal.  The players and the team are still very inconsistent as their young players try and figure out the league.  They look to be several years away from being competitive and able to win multiple playoff rounds. 

 

So why would he want to go on a rebuilding team like NJD when there should be competitive teams interested in him.

 

NJ is one goalie and a decent bottom pairing defense away from being a serious threat in the east.  They have absolutely raked in the assets over the last 6 years.  They are essentially where we need to be.  Ready to take that next step and they can do that quite easily in free agency especially with Subbans cap coming off the books.

 

$25 million in space to end this year

$56 million in space by next year

 

Jack Hughes and Hischier locked in for a decade.  Almost ALL of their youth on the team RFAs to end next year or the following.  A deep prospect pool.  Ya man, you might say rebuilding but we see that team differently.  Especially with Florida hitting the wall in terms of cap and assets/youth.  Pens aging out.  Rangers going to be uber tight to the cap.  Boston aging out and no youth.    NJ is exactly where LA and Anaheim are but with less holes to fill.  I'd say playoff bubble next year even without a goalie to speak of; absolutely in the playoffs the following year and beyond.

[Warhippy]

10 hours ago, Me_ said:

So bent on trading our best player.

 

You guys will never win a Cup.

Still chuckling if you think keeping Miller is the difference between winning a cup with this core or not with the holes we have.

 

We have a better chance of watching him Tavares/Bobrovsky/Panarin us than we do of re-signing him

Edited May 31, 2022 by Warhippy

[Gurn]

10 hours ago, Me_ said:

So bent on trading our best player.

 

You guys will never win a Cup.

Oh I see how this works

 

Some people, so bent on keeping an aging super expensive player; hosing our future cap.

Those people will never make the playoffs again.

 

 

Fun stuff.

[Alflives]

6 minutes ago, Warhippy said:

NJ is one goalie and a decent bottom pairing defense away from being a serious threat in the east.  They have absolutely raked in the assets over the last 6 years.  They are essentially where we need to be.  Ready to take that next step and they can do that quite easily in free agency especially with Subbans cap coming off the books.

 

$25 million in space to end this year

$56 million in space by next year

 

Jack Hughes and Hischier locked in for a decade.  Almost ALL of their youth on the team RFAs to end next year or the following.  A deep prospect pool.  Ya man, you might say rebuilding but we see that team differently.  Especially with Florida hitting the wall in terms of cap and assets/youth.  Pens aging out.  Rangers going to be uber tight to the cap.  Boston aging out and no youth.    NJ is exactly where LA and Anaheim are but with less holes to fill.  I'd say playoff bubble next year even without a goalie to speak of; absolutely in the playoffs the following year and beyond.

Jersey needs a heavy center, who can play top six minutes and in all situations and brings leadership and some nasty.  Miller would be a perfect fit.  

[Gawdzukes]

21 minutes ago, Warhippy said:

NJ is one goalie and a decent bottom pairing defense away from being a serious threat in the east.  They have absolutely raked in the assets over the last 6 years.  They are essentially where we need to be.  Ready to take that next step and they can do that quite easily in free agency especially with Subbans cap coming off the books.

 

$25 million in space to end this year

$56 million in space by next year

 

Jack Hughes and Hischier locked in for a decade.  Almost ALL of their youth on the team RFAs to end next year or the following.  A deep prospect pool.  Ya man, you might say rebuilding but we see that team differently.  Especially with Florida hitting the wall in terms of cap and assets/youth.  Pens aging out.  Rangers going to be uber tight to the cap.  Boston aging out and no youth.    NJ is exactly where LA and Anaheim are but with less holes to fill.  I'd say playoff bubble next year even without a goalie to speak of; absolutely in the playoffs the following year and beyond.

Yeah I agree. He likes to shut every possible trade idea down if possible, especially if there is some vague tweet he can bend to his viewpoint. I like you see a team in a huge market area with crazy talent (insane talent actually) on the team and on the horizon, and insane amounts of cap space and future promise. No one but JT knows what motivates him but 7 years building with that team would look mighty attractive to me as far as options go. He would jump right into a team with arguably the best building blocks in the league as the defacto 'go to guy'?

Edited May 31, 2022 by Gawdzukes

[JM_]

5 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Jersey needs a heavy center, who can play top six minutes and in all situations and brings leadership and some nasty.  Miller would be a perfect fit.  

Zacha is their only C with any size and they don't seem all that keen on keeping him. Miller (or someone like him) is something they need for sure. 

 

If 'lil Jonny sticks with Calgary then paying Miller might make sense for them, but if they continue to pick up small skill we'd have to look elsewhere for a Miller deal.

 

 

Edited May 31, 2022 by JM_

[stawns]

2 minutes ago, JM_ said:

Zacha is their only C with any size and they don't seem all that keen on keeping him. Miller (or someone like him) is something they need for sure. 

 

If 'lil Jonny sticks with Calgary then paying Miller might make sense for them, but if they continue to pick up small skill we'd have to look elsewhere for a Miller deal.

 

 

That's why, as much as I like them, I'm hoping the Avs lose........a Miller deal with them makes a lot of sense

[mll]

5 minutes ago, Warhippy said:

NJ is one goalie and a decent bottom pairing defense away from being a serious threat in the east.  They have absolutely raked in the assets over the last 6 years.  They are essentially where we need to be.  Ready to take that next step and they can do that quite easily in free agency especially with Subbans cap coming off the books.

 

$25 million in space to end this year

$56 million in space by next year

 

Jack Hughes and Hischier locked in for a decade.  Almost ALL of their youth on the team RFAs to end next year or the following.  A deep prospect pool.  Ya man, you might say rebuilding but we see that team differently.  Especially with Florida hitting the wall in terms of cap and assets/youth.  Pens aging out.  Rangers going to be uber tight to the cap.  Boston aging out and no youth.    NJ is exactly where LA and Anaheim are but with less holes to fill.  I'd say playoff bubble next year even without a goalie to speak of; absolutely in the playoffs the following year and beyond.

 

You really think that to chose between Pittsburgh/NYR/Boston or NJD - Miller choses the rebuilding team?  He doesn't have his full career ahead of him.  Making the playoffs is just the initial step.  Their team barely has any playoff experience.   Both McLellan and Armstrong listed a core weathered by playoff experience among the 5 reasons they believe their team finally won.  It took them so many years to get there.  NJD is just at the start.  They were 37 points out of a playoff spot.  

 

[JM_]

1 minute ago, stawns said:

That's why, as much as I like them, I'm hoping the Avs lose........a Miller deal with them makes a lot of sense

I guess it depends on their negotiations with Nate M? If he's looking to 10+ after next season, and he should be, that makes a Miller extension tough to make given all the UFAs on their roster - 9 UFAs, 2 RFA's this offseason. That's a lot of salary to throw around.

 

Miller might be better as a rental for them?