I actually feel like the 5/6/7 D are actually developing under Boudreau

[*Buzzsaw*]

When I watched the 5/6/7 defensemen on this team under Green, I found it hard to see any progress in their play.

 

They all seemed to be stuck in the mud as far as their development was going.

 

But under Boudreau I really feel each of these low time guys has been given a better opportunity to show their strong points and develop them.

 

Maybe this group doesn't have the gold plated credentials, but each of them has something to give.

 

So for example, Brad Hunt is given the opportunity to QB the 2nd Unit, Burroughs is generally matched up against the other team's tough guys where his consistent hitting is always a factor. 

 

And for the newest guy... I am seeing a lot more out of Noah Juulsen... this game he made some good hits, and also carried the puck well and made some excellent passes including a great one to Garland to start the scoring and ended with two assists to his credit.  He is exactly what this team needs... a decent size, 6'2''/200+ lb D who can be offensively creative when called on.

 

Sure all these guys make mistakes and they are all prone to the typical gaffes from the low time guys, but generally I feel there is forward progress in their play.

 

Obviously Hunt won't be a long term member of the roster, but both Burroughs and Juulsen could end up being valuable parts of the puzzle... in the 6/7 places.

 

Team still needs two new 4/5 D's... I am not sure Poolman can really deliver what is needed... and also I think the Canucks need more size in the mid pairing.... and Schenn won't be there forever.

[eeeeergh]

11 minutes ago, *Buzzsaw* said:

When I watched the 5/6/7 defensemen on this team under Green, I found it hard to see any progress in their play.

 

They all seemed to be stuck in the mud as far as their development was going.

 

But under Boudreau I really feel each of these low time guys has been given a better opportunity to show their strong points and develop them.

 

Maybe this group doesn't have the gold plated credentials, but each of them has something to give.

 

So for example, Brad Hunt is given the opportunity to QB the 2nd Unit, Burroughs is generally matched up against the other team's tough guys where his consistent hitting is always a factor. 

 

And for the newest guy... I am seeing a lot more out of Noah Juulsen... this game he made some good hits, and also carried the puck well and made some excellent passes including a great one to Garland to start the scoring and ended with two assists to his credit.  He is exactly what this team needs... a decent size, 6'2''/200+ lb D who can be offensively creative when called on.

 

Sure all these guys make mistakes and they are all prone to the typical gaffes from the low time guys, but generally I feel there is forward progress in their play.

 

Obviously Hunt won't be a long term member of the roster, but both Burroughs and Juulsen could end up being valuable parts of the puzzle... in the 6/7 places.

 

Team still needs two new 4/5 D's... I am not sure Poolman can really deliver what is needed... and also I think the Canucks need more size in the mid pairing.... and Schenn won't be there forever.

Noah Juulsen has genuinely been really good. Hes also only 24, I think he makes the jump to full time NHL d-man next year. His WHL numbers were mindblowingly good, but he got ruined by injury, excited to see his progression if he can stay healthy. 

[DownUndaCanuck]

I always thought Juulsen was an interesting prospect on the other teams he was on, he just never got a proper chance. Tonight against a rubbish Arizona team and with Hughes out, he made the most of his opportunities with 2 assists and some nice play. He's been pretty good under Bruce, I hope he keeps it up. As long as he doesn't make any stupid plays or mistakes, he's a really good option for our bottom pairing.

 

Burroughs, Hunt and Juulsen are basically all AHLers on just about any other NHL team but because we're so thin on defence, one injury ends up with these guys playing top-4 minutes so it's good to see them a bit more comfortable under Boudreau. To be honest I think it's just the system we play now, before the forwards gambled a lot and didn't help out defensively so we'd end up with so many odd-man rushes against our defencemen, whereas under Bruce it seems as though we forecheck and defend better as a unit so our defencemen are better protected on the rush.

[Putgolzin]

Yup, say what you want about Benning, but if you sign 30 guys to league minimum one or two of them are bound to be able to play on the third pairing.

I think we have literally 5-6 guys for the third RHD spot. It's a pretty hilarious strategy.

 

[Boudrias]

5 hours ago, DownUndaCanuck said:

I always thought Juulsen was an interesting prospect on the other teams he was on, he just never got a proper chance. Tonight against a rubbish Arizona team and with Hughes out, he made the most of his opportunities with 2 assists and some nice play. He's been pretty good under Bruce, I hope he keeps it up. As long as he doesn't make any stupid plays or mistakes, he's a really good option for our bottom pairing.

 

Burroughs, Hunt and Juulsen are basically all AHLers on just about any other NHL team but because we're so thin on defence, one injury ends up with these guys playing top-4 minutes so it's good to see them a bit more comfortable under Boudreau. To be honest I think it's just the system we play now, before the forwards gambled a lot and didn't help out defensively so we'd end up with so many odd-man rushes against our defencemen, whereas under Bruce it seems as though we forecheck and defend better as a unit so our defencemen are better protected on the rush.

I am not a big fan of Hunt getting TOI but understand that he has done well enough when called on. Burroughs loses position at times but I love his physicality. He needs TOI and a routine. Juulson looks like a 3rd pairing player now, with upside. Even if Hamonic and Poolman make it back Juulson can finish his season in Abby and make a real claim to 3RD next fall. Juulson appears to be a complete package. Physical, throws a nice pass and has some offensive upside. Meanwhile in Florida Ollie is out again.

 

Likely Schenn gets dealt if the offer is good enough. That said he has been a gem for the Canucks this season. Just imagine how much Juulson and Burroughs are learning from Schenn this season. He is a real team guy. If JR is offered a 3rd for Schenn does he take it? 

[Putgolzin]

20 minutes ago, Boudrias said:

 

Likely Schenn gets dealt if the offer is good enough. That said he has been a gem for the Canucks this season. Just imagine how much Juulson and Burroughs are learning from Schenn this season. He is a real team guy. If JR is offered a 3rd for Schenn does he take it? 

Agreed on Juulson and Burroughs learning from Schenn.
I wouldn't let Schenn go for a 3rd if it were up to me.

[IBatch]

34 minutes ago, Boudrias said:

I am not a big fan of Hunt getting TOI but understand that he has done well enough when called on. Burroughs loses position at times but I love his physicality. He needs TOI and a routine. Juulson looks like a 3rd pairing player now, with upside. Even if Hamonic and Poolman make it back Juulson can finish his season in Abby and make a real claim to 3RD next fall. Juulson appears to be a complete package. Physical, throws a nice pass and has some offensive upside. Meanwhile in Florida Ollie is out again.

 

Likely Schenn gets dealt if the offer is good enough. That said he has been a gem for the Canucks this season. Just imagine how much Juulson and Burroughs are learning from Schenn this season. He is a real team guy. If JR is offered a 3rd for Schenn does he take it? 

No Schenn isn't worth a 3rd to us unless we are going to blow it up.   Last 3rd we had that became a real player was Edler.   

 

JB had more hits after the 3rd then the third round lol.   So no thanks.    Same staff still.   Unless we use it for a trade i suppose that might work.   12.5% odds are slim right?   Also the same odds as the entire draft past the third round combined to find a roster player.   In plain English - that means on average you get one 3rd rounder every 12.5 years that sticks and one player in rounds 4-7 that stick.    Not talking about tweeners who play 50-150 games.   Talking about guys that have at least two contracts.    Schenn playing out this season with us and the next one at his cap hit is absolutely way better odds then a 3rd.   Also a second but at least most of those play a couple games. 

 

Schenn would be tough to lose.   Right now he's playing himself into another contract, and feel the time to trade him is maybe next TDL (not this one).   Unless the return is just too good. 

 

Edit:  Also think that we've got high odds of trading Miller, Schenn and Motte this season.   

Edited February 9, 2022 by IBatch

[Attila Umbrus]

 Bruce seems to just have this innate ability to see what each player can do and get the best he can out of each player. Not to beat a dead horse but Travis Green just couldn’t seem to do that. You can start to see why Bruce has had so many winning teams. He can literally use any pro player you throw at him and he will turn a diamond outta coal. Wizardry!

[Boudrias]

2 minutes ago, IBatch said:

No Schenn isn't worth a 3rd to us unless we are going to blow it up.   Last 3rd we had that became a real player was Edler.   

 

JB had more hits after the 3rd then the third round lol.   So no thanks.    Same staff still.   Unless we use it for a trade i suppose that might work.   12.5% odds are slim right?   Also the same odds as the entire draft past the third round combined to find a roster player.   In plain English - that means on average you get one 3rd rounder every 12.5 years that sticks and one player in rounds 4-7 that stick.    Not talking about tweeners who play 50-150 games.   Talking about guys that have at least two contracts.    Schenn playing out this season with us and the next one at his cap hit is absolutely way better odds then a 3rd.   Also a second but at least most of those play a couple games. 

 

Schenn would be tough to lose.   Right now he's playing himself into another contract.     

I wouldn't argue Schenn's value that's for sure. He is having a great season and showing what vet depth can do. He obviously loves playing for the Canucks. My reason for throwing the name out was JR's desire to get younger and the possible log jam at RD if Hamonic and Poolman get healthy. Top that with the impressive play of Juulson to date. Yes, a 3rd doesn't make it but can be combined into future deals. 

[IBatch]

5 minutes ago, Boudrias said:

I wouldn't argue Schenn's value that's for sure. He is having a great season and showing what vet depth can do. He obviously loves playing for the Canucks. My reason for throwing the name out was JR's desire to get younger and the possible log jam at RD if Hamonic and Poolman get healthy. Top that with the impressive play of Juulson to date. Yes, a 3rd doesn't make it but can be combined into future deals. 

Teams are for sure interested in him.  TO writers are drooling at the thought of him right now.   Funny how the players we don't want to trade, other teams want.   Cap.   Money.  Schenn and Motte both punch well above their pay scale.  So does Miller.   Garland hasn't entered his prime years yet and already looks good. 

Edited February 9, 2022 by IBatch

[NUCKER67]

Impressed with these guys too. Burroughs taking on the bigger Crouse and doing really well. Juulsen has also done well, two assists last night?  He makes smart plays and has a bit of size, enough to play physical, and he's only 24 and a RD.  The only thing with Juulsen is he needs to work on his skating a bit (edges/turns).  He could be a good #6/7 next season, he's cheap. Funny, watching Juulsen and Chychrun, I'm not sure who was better in the game. I think Noah was actually. Chychrun can't skate either and he looks like a jerk. LOVED it when Podkolzin pushed back, shoving Chychrun into the boards and battling.

 

What about Schenn?  A lot of talk about trading this guy, but he's so solid, such a good team mate, a veteran mentor who's won the Cup twice, a physical presence. He only makes $850K and has an extra year left on his contract. Keep this guy!

 

IMO, Poolman could be dealt.

 

Ekman-Larsson - Myers

Hughes - Schenn

?? - Hamonic

Juulsen

Burroughs

Rathbone

 

I keep forgetting about Hamonic, but if he can return and be a solid physical player again, it doesn't look so bad. 

[EternalCanuckFan]

Juulsen didn't have quite the hype that Schenn did and has had very different challenges finding his footing in the NHL, but I hope Juulsen can find a place in the NHL like Schenn has.  Juulsen is still much younger than Schenn was when his NHL career was starting to look like it was nearly over, but he's also at an age where young D are running out of track.  It's been good to see Juulsen get a chance to play in the NHL and hopefully this is a good start for him carving out regular playing time.

 

I'm curious if we'll see some unexpected roster changes as management starts to form conclusions about the roster.  I know there was a report about management giving the roster February to get in the playoff race, but even if they do, I wonder if we'll see some tweaks in areas that aren't as obvious as doing something like trading Miller.

[Maniwaki Canuck]

I like Schenn, Burroughs and Juulsen a lot too.  We actually have incredible depth at RD, despite the tired narrative to the contrary.  Juulsen looked great last night except for getting walked by Keller, but that's something Keller does.  Burroughs is a keeper.  Not at all sure about dealing Schenn.  For a second, sure, but I doubt that's on offer.  Would rather move Hamonic or Poolman at this stage.  We need to get our cap hit down on D and these mid-range salaries might be the best option.

[VancouverHabitant]

7 minutes ago, Maniwaki Canuck said:

I like Schenn, Burroughs and Juulsen a lot too.  We actually have incredible depth at RD, despite the tired narrative to the contrary.  Juulsen looked great last night except for getting walked by Keller, but that's something Keller does.  Burroughs is a keeper.  Not at all sure about dealing Schenn.  For a second, sure, but I doubt that's on offer.  Would rather move Hamonic or Poolman at this stage.  We need to get our cap hit down on D and these mid-range salaries might be the best option.

The best case scenario might be starting to play out in front of us, which would be Hamonic coming back to full health and playing well.  If he plays himself into our top 4, then I could definitely see a team biting on him at the trade deadline. 

[Maniwaki Canuck]

1 minute ago, VancouverHabitant said:

The best case scenario might be starting to play out in front of us, which would be Hamonic coming back to full health and playing well.  If he plays himself into our top 4, then I could definitely see a team biting on him at the trade deadline. 

That would be good for us, definitely.  I've supported Hamonic during his time here and he had stretches of good play for us, but his commitment has been shaky this year and it's time to move on if we can.  Capfriendly shows an 8 team no-trade clause, so it should be possible.

[Dazzle]

Green just wasn't a good NHL coach. He's had so many seasons, and every season, his teams are always below .500. This is not a sign of a winning coach. At some point in time, he has to show that he is making progress as a coach (regardless of the roster).

[brownky]

3 hours ago, Attila Umbrus said:

 Bruce seems to just have this innate ability to see what each player can do and get the best he can out of each player. Not to beat a dead horse but Travis Green just couldn’t seem to do that. You can start to see why Bruce has had so many winning teams. He can literally use any pro player you throw at him and he will turn a diamond outta coal. Wizardry!

The guys who need to play simple, play simple.

 

What was the first thing he did in drills? Get guys putting the puck off the glass/boards and out. Simple plays.

 

Other team can't realistically score from outside the blue line, so if you're hemmed in and getting thrashed, get the puck out on an easy play. Don't try to be a hero.

 

What are our 'simple play' guys doing? Looking like rock stars because they're staying in their lane, doing exactly what they are good at. Example: Burroughs is good at being in the way and hitting people. So he's not trying to deke through 4 guys to score... he's short-passing to a puck 'mover' or just chipping it out if there's nobody open, and hitting guys himself. Simple plays to stop goals against. 

 

I think sometimes it gets lost that a great shift can be one that you 'just don't get scored on'. Tie up their top players for a minute or two, hit them, and get off the ice. They get worn down, and your scorers get their chance to shine too.

[VegasCanuck]

10 hours ago, eeeeergh said:

Noah Juulsen has genuinely been really good. Hes also only 24, I think he makes the jump to full time NHL d-man next year. His WHL numbers were mindblowingly good, but he got ruined by injury, excited to see his progression if he can stay healthy. 

I've said directly on his profile, this kid projected as a top 4 in his draft class, he got off track with injuries. If he can get stability, all that talent can come out. He has good size and definitely isn't afraid to hit.

 

[eeeeergh]

7 minutes ago, VegasCanuck said:

I've said directly on his profile, this kid projected as a top 4 in his draft class, he got off track with injuries. If he can get stability, all that talent can come out. He has good size and definitely isn't afraid to hit.

 

I've already liked him more than Juolevi, and we got Lamikko in that trade too. I guess that's what happens when you trade with a team that's too deep to give their depth players a real chance. 

[IBatch]

1 hour ago, Dazzle said:

Green just wasn't a good NHL coach. He's had so many seasons, and every season, his teams are always below .500. This is not a sign of a winning coach. At some point in time, he has to show that he is making progress as a coach (regardless of the roster).

Green actually started out well.   Last year was meh - massive roster changes and still a lot of complaining about no money to re-sign any of those guys from the bubble and tailings from the last core (Markstrom and Tanev).   Demko was only ok last season...who knows what could of happened over an 82 game season, the team did claw their way back 8-2-1 or something before covid decimated them again.   Cherry picking a terrible roster and using that (a teams down cycle) to claim someone was a bad coach is a bit of a joke.     Green didn't lose me until this pre-season.    Didn't get why he was so interested in figuring out which tweeners to choose from, another summer, another massive roster change .... and choosing to waive Jonah Gadjovich didn't at all sit well with me.    

 

Would Bruce have done much better?   Probably not really (overall).    The reason why Brock and EP and QHs are getting massive pay cheques have everything to do with Greens useage too.   To JB was the worse of the two.  

 

Edit:   The PK, EP and BB killed the TG and JB era this year.   For those who were paying attention, 5 x 5 from the very first game we were an entirely different team ... top 5 with possession stats, haven't done that since the peak Sedin era.   The peak only too.  Thats systems - and as some informed writers who made the effort during our winning streak after the change, the way guys plays doesn't just flip a switch - Bruce unleashed them and they responded from the D game TG was trying to beat into them.  Green also tried to fit square pegs in round holes - but Bruce is also having challenges with some of these guys - like what the heck to do with Dickinson.   Aside from last night and one other game - we still aren't scoring much.   Those defensive lessons don't just disappear over night.   And Bruce also didn't have an easy go for a ten game stretch when guys were out with covid...9 out of 20 points was still a little better though.   

 

I'm sure Green will get another chance (if he wants one) with another rebuilding team.   

 

And i'm loving Bruce's systems - thank the lord for no more five man boxes.   

Edited February 9, 2022 by IBatch