Canuckfanforlife82 Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 1 minute ago, AlphaNuck said: This team has not been the same with out Sutter Ya and we should have had a prospect at this point to fill that role. We might with Linus Karlsson next year. He’s been great this year and is 22. So that’s a good thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HKSR Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 5 minutes ago, Canuckfanforlife82 said: Well the hard part is the unloading of contracts where they aren’t getting their value out of them. It’s being so far up against the cap and trying to figure out who to move to escape this problem. Teams have to want to take on these horrible contracts. If they are seeing what we are seeing why would they? They need to free up money to surround those players. That’s the toughest task. I don’t know how they do it. It will be amazing if they can. Which guys are you thinking of? I assume Poolman, Dickinson, Pearson? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuckfanforlife82 Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 (edited) 3 minutes ago, HKSR said: Which guys are you thinking of? I assume Poolman, Dickinson, Pearson? Myers, OEL- later in his contract. It’s also why I am afraid if they sign Miller long term. Will that be another bad contract that will haunt us because of his age? Edited February 20, 2022 by Canuckfanforlife82 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 12 minutes ago, Odd. said: Yes which is the equivalent of the Toffoli trade How so? There were no blue chip prospects or young stud D men involved in that trade… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guntrix Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 I was cautiously optimistic about the Canucks sneaking into the playoffs after that early winning streak, but it just may be time for JR and co to start planning based on the scenario where we don’t make it in. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaimito Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 26 minutes ago, AlphaNuck said: This team has not been the same with out Sutter Can't win without a solid foundation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilentSam Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 2 hours ago, DeNiro said: The problem is we have no one to fight him that’s a good trade off. He’s looking to take a guy like Schenn off for 5 minutes which would have put us down to 4 D. We need someone in the bottom 6 that can take on guys like him. If they go in the box we’re not at a bigger disadvantage. No we need more players that play Physically.. The trade off will come soon.. Bo. 0 hits Brock. 0 hits ^ this will speak volumes to management. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilentSam Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 40 minutes ago, AlphaNuck said: This team has not been the same with out Sutter Sutter is , and was a ghost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gawdzukes Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 33 minutes ago, BPA said: JR/PA prior assessment of the team that Canucks are maxed cap not close contenders seems to be correct. They say retool instead of rebuild but come on. Fans were sold this BS 8yrs ago. What did it bring us…mediocrity. JB tried to shortcut the pain but instead prolonged it. Fix the PP and PK. It’s killing the team. Canucks have a few pieces to build around with that shortens the rebuild time by having EP, QH, and Demko. Keep the 4th line in tact if possible. Cheap, effective, and pots a few goals. Trade Motte if he wants $2M+ cuz need to keep cap down. Replace with Lockwood? This trade deadline… Sorry but Miller needs to be traded to get a massive return. 1st + top prospect + young top 6F or top 4D. No retention. Trade Boeser if he won’t sign a team friendly deal ($6M). Should return a 1st + top prospect. Offseason… Trade Bo if he doesn’t sign a team friendly deal ($6M). Should net a 1st + top prospect + young bottom 6 F/D. Trade Myers (50% retention). I would argue that at $3M for 2yrs, some teams would be interested. Should net a 2nd + B prospect. Next season trade deadline… Trade Pearson. Should net a 2nd + low prospect. Ride out crap contracts of Ferland, Hamonic, Dickinson, and Poolman. Can’t see how to trade them. Team gets younger and cap space. Canucks need everything…speed, skill, and grit. Meh…just need to blow off steam. Hey, big difference between now and the last rebuild. No old Sedin's just eating up cap as their careers dwindle down. Our best young players were Bo, Virtanen, Tryamkin. Now we have Petterson, Hughes, Podkolzin, Hoglander, Boeser. We have a great young goaltender entering his prime. A couple of moves could really change the complexion of this team moving forward. I agree JR and co. need to make their stamp on this team and give it some new life and direction. Oh yeah. Also no Ericksson to pair with aging Sedin's. X-Petterson-X Hoglander-Bo-Garland Dickinson-X-Podkolzin X-Lammikko-Highmore Hughes Hamonic OEL Myers X-Schenn Burroughs Poolman Demko Martin I tried to give Dickinson a fair shake but he hasn't been a success so far. Sometimes it takes a player a full year to gel with a team. We can only hope but I can't see anyone wanting him either ... but you never know. Also I like Garland but I'm not sure where he fits in. He hasn't seemed to gel with anyone yet. Hopefully Miller and Boeser trades would fill an X or two in and then we sign a couple of UFA's next year. Trading Myers sure would help the cap situation. Considering we have 5 RD's it's a loss we could theoretically handle. He's got two years after this one but he showed how valuable he could be in the playoffs during the bubble. He might be desirable to the right team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boudrias Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 (edited) Signing Miller if solid offers are thrown JR's way smacks of the same direction Benning was committed too. It suggests that the club is only a player or two away from serious contention. I don't see it. On any given night the firehouse drill in the d-zone takes place. Sure Meyers and OEL are OK as 2nd pairing d-men but they can be brutal at times. The clock is not their friend. Up front the inconsistency of those counted on to deliver just isn't there are many nights. When hte Av's made their push 4-5 seasons ago and then collapsed they had more talent upfront than what the Canucks have now. A inconsistent top 9 that lacks depth. I have more confidence that JR & BB are not fooled by current circumstances. There will be serious changes coming especially as the club is fading. I am sure there is a growing lineup of GM's thinking they will pick the Canuck carcus. Hoping that won't be the case. In any event Canuck fans who expect a quick turn around will be disappointed. Edited February 20, 2022 by Boudrias 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuckfanforlife82 Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 (edited) 29 minutes ago, Boudrias said: Signing Miller if solid offers are thrown JR's way smacks of the same direction Benning was committed too. It suggests that the club is only a player or two away from serious contention. I don't see it. On any given night the firehouse drill in the d-zone takes place. Sure Meyers and OEL are OK as 2nd pairing d-men but they can be brutal at times. The clock is not their friend. Up front the inconsistency of those counted on to deliver just isn't there are many nights. When hte Av's made their push 4-5 seasons ago and then collapsed they had more talent upfront than what the Canucks have now. A inconsistent top 9 that lacks depth. I have more confidence that JR & BB are not fooled by current circumstances. There will be serious changes coming especially as the club is fading. I am sure there is a growing lineup of GM's thinking they will pick the Canuck carcus. Hoping that won't be the case. In any event Canuck fans who expect a quick turn around will be disappointed. Yes and if you sign Miller what change is really coming? People are talking about signing Boeser. Ok so again, what changes do you make if you just keep the core the same. It’s a core that has proved that does not work well together or at least consistently enough. You can’t just keep everyone and expect the different results. That’s insanity is it not. I kind of laugh when some fans say keep Boeser, sign him now. Keep Miller, sign him now when the team has been so up and down with a bad pk and pp. Not to mention we are sitting 20th in the league in the standings. Edited February 20, 2022 by Canuckfanforlife82 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 What's up with Horvat this year? He's been pretty bad and invisible all year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bad alice french Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 1 hour ago, Rick Blight said: Carolina Toronto Vegas St. Louis Florida Pittsburgh New York Washington Los Angeles Edmonton Those are just some of the teams that have dropped the mitts LESS than us this year. Of those teams listed above, these are ones with FEWER hits as well. Carolina Edmonton Los Angeles Vegas St. Louis Toronto Seems to me that there are a lot of pretty good teams out there that hit a lot less than us and fight a lot less than us. I think JR may be right when he says he is focused on adding speed and skill as opposed to the toughness that so many on here are advocating. Wow bud. Thanks for posting that list. Haven’t checked recently but I believe all those teams are currently in the playoffs. That is a sobering breakdown right there. You can’t just ice players running around looking for big hits and scrapping. Rutherford is on track. we have a chemistry issue. There is plenty of talent on this team not worth giving up on. We lack experienced leadership that knows how to win. Sounds like I’m zeroing in on Bo but this team just doesn’t know how to play for each other yet. Our stars are still super young lanky and lack bravado at this stage. Let’s see what Petey looks like in two more years closer to 190-195 pounds. Same with Huggy. His skating will always improve and he’ll start adding lower body muscle and strength as well. We have studs in this lineup they’re just not there yet And they are being mentored. seasoned and led by players that don’t know how to win. Even more challenging to this is the fact that our leadership core aren’t mean abd tough. They’re just nice polite young professional athletes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuckfanforlife82 Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 (edited) 7 minutes ago, bad alice french said: Wow bud. Thanks for posting that list. Haven’t checked recently but I believe all those teams are currently in the playoffs. That is a sobering breakdown right there. You can’t just ice players running around looking for big hits and scrapping. Rutherford is on track. we have a chemistry issue. There is plenty of talent on this team not worth giving up on. We lack experienced leadership that knows how to win. Sounds like I’m zeroing in on Bo but this team just doesn’t know how to play for each other yet. Our stars are still super young lanky and lack bravado at this stage. Let’s see what Petey looks like in two more years closer to 190-195 pounds. Same with Huggy. His skating will always improve and he’ll start adding lower body muscle and strength as well. We have studs in this lineup they’re just not there yet And they are being mentored. seasoned and led by players that don’t know how to win. Even more challenging to this is the fact that our leadership core aren’t mean abd tough. They’re just nice polite young professional athletes. Ya and with all these hits and no reaction or players sticking up for each other you can only imagine on the bench what they are saying or thinking. “I ain’t fighting anyone. I can’t fight.” Lol. It’s not even the fighting it’s the atitude we can’t let teams come in here and take advantage of us being a small, weak team. Edited February 20, 2022 by Canuckfanforlife82 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coconuts Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 2 hours ago, SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME said: I really think the bolded is true for many (possibly all) of the players up and down this lineup. My feeling with this team is that the events of the past couple years have added up and created a systemic issue, when it comes to team culture, buy-in, willingness to give their all, trust/confidence is the organization, etc. It’s a combination of many things. The departure of team leaders and “culture carriers,” combined with the sense that many well-liked and respected players were disrespected on the way out; management and ownership going MIA during the Covid outbreak and the Virtanen scandal, poor overall messaging and communication by the previous regime, and a lack of support and “togetherness,” from the top down. Combine this with a lot of losing (and losing badly), a lack of direction, changes obviously needing to happen, players waiting for ownership to act, finger pointing and the forming of “factions,” and you had a real sickness that crept into this team, building over two years (or more, arguably). The team responded to the coaching change, and the fresh air Bruce’s arrival brought to a suffocating group, but that was always going to be a short term boost. Rebuilding the culture and identity of this team, organization wide, is a long term process, especially when issues were allowed to fester as long as they did, and there was a leadership void, from management and ownership, which clearly led to players tuning out and no longer buying in. It’s going to take some time. The team right now seems only able to elevate their game on an individual level. Players can have strong individual performances, which are enough to win games, especially when it’s guys like Demmer or JT having big games. But those performances are inconsistent and we never seem to see this group firing on all cylinders. We never really get that full team effort. And this IMO is because these guys haven’t really felt like a “team” for a long time. There hasn’t been that group identity. Don’t get me wrong. The boys still play for each other and there are close relationships in the room. It’s just that at some point, a disconnect happened, due to the players feeling unsupported by this organization, because of a number of key failures, particularly at the management level. I do think we have the people in place now to start to heal and rebuild the culture. But it’s a process and there’s a lot of work to be done. Right now it’s still a waiting game because the players know roster changes are coming, but they don’t know who’s going and who’s staying. There’s still a lot of uncertainty. And there’s still carryover from the malaise that had built up under the old regime. And that “sickness” probably won’t be “cured” until at least next season, with a true fresh start and everyone building in a new direction, under this new regime. But when you have this many players underachieving, lacking consistency, showing shattered confidence, failing to pull together, only sporadically elevating their games, displaying fragility, lacking focus, poor preparation (especially when it comes to having bad starts/first periods in key games), seeming to lack pride in the jersey, and just not looking like the same players they used to be, it’s rarely about the players themselves, but points to systemic issues within an organization. These problems don’t happen overnight. And, unfortunately, they also don’t go away overnight. It’s going to take time. And JR, Allvin, and the rest of the management group really have some work to to. But I’m optimistic they’re up for the task. I’m just not expecting significant results (at least sustainable ones) until at least next season. Great post, we're going to have to be patient because the kind of change this organization needs doesn't simply take place over the span of a few months. We've got a great management team in place and some good building blocks on the team. We'll see what happens, but we'll need to be patient. Always enjoy your takes. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coconuts Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, AlphaNuck said: This team has not been the same with out Sutter Not just Sutter, but Beagle too. They brought Sutter back (or they thought they did, didn't work out) but never replaced what Beagle brought. I like Lammikko and that line's been great, but he's not the defensive player Beagle's been over his career. Edited February 20, 2022 by Coconuts 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Attila Umbrus Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 3 hours ago, Alflives said: And that's the non measurable we are very much lacking. We are a soft team, and way too easy to play against. We need a Bobby Clarke led Flyers' type club. Bring in guys who will try to do serious damage to the other team. This for sure! Also I am so tied to see our power play sit around on the perimeter and play pass the puck…so many times we have NO ONE in front of the goalie, they are all on the outside…If they want the power play to be successful they need to get in front of the net. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PuckYa Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 13 hours ago, igorwasgreat said: Do we have anyone capable of pushback not named Schenn ? Anyone having pushback that is a regular part of their skill set. ? We gave away Macewan... 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Attila Umbrus Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 2 hours ago, SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME said: I really think the bolded is true for many (possibly all) of the players up and down this lineup. My feeling with this team is that the events of the past couple years have added up and created a systemic issue, when it comes to team culture, buy-in, willingness to give their all, trust/confidence is the organization, etc. It’s a combination of many things. The departure of team leaders and “culture carriers,” combined with the sense that many well-liked and respected players were disrespected on the way out; management and ownership going MIA during the Covid outbreak and the Virtanen scandal, poor overall messaging and communication by the previous regime, and a lack of support and “togetherness,” from the top down. Combine this with a lot of losing (and losing badly), a lack of direction, changes obviously needing to happen, players waiting for ownership to act, finger pointing and the forming of “factions,” and you had a real sickness that crept into this team, building over two years (or more, arguably). The team responded to the coaching change, and the fresh air Bruce’s arrival brought to a suffocating group, but that was always going to be a short term boost. Rebuilding the culture and identity of this team, organization wide, is a long term process, especially when issues were allowed to fester as long as they did, and there was a leadership void, from management and ownership, which clearly led to players tuning out and no longer buying in. It’s going to take some time. The team right now seems only able to elevate their game on an individual level. Players can have strong individual performances, which are enough to win games, especially when it’s guys like Demmer or JT having big games. But those performances are inconsistent and we never seem to see this group firing on all cylinders. We never really get that full team effort. And this IMO is because these guys haven’t really felt like a “team” for a long time. There hasn’t been that group identity. Don’t get me wrong. The boys still play for each other and there are close relationships in the room. It’s just that at some point, a disconnect happened, due to the players feeling unsupported by this organization, because of a number of key failures, particularly at the management level. I do think we have the people in place now to start to heal and rebuild the culture. But it’s a process and there’s a lot of work to be done. Right now it’s still a waiting game because the players know roster changes are coming, but they don’t know who’s going and who’s staying. There’s still a lot of uncertainty. And there’s still carryover from the malaise that had built up under the old regime. And that “sickness” probably won’t be “cured” until at least next season, with a true fresh start and everyone building in a new direction, under this new regime. But when you have this many players underachieving, lacking consistency, showing shattered confidence, failing to pull together, only sporadically elevating their games, displaying fragility, lacking focus, poor preparation (especially when it comes to having bad starts/first periods in key games), seeming to lack pride in the jersey, and just not looking like the same players they used to be, it’s rarely about the players themselves, but points to systemic issues within an organization. These problems don’t happen overnight. And, unfortunately, they also don’t go away overnight. It’s going to take time. And JR, Allvin, and the rest of the management group really have some work to to. But I’m optimistic they’re up for the task. I’m just not expecting significant results (at least sustainable ones) until at least next season. Very good points. I also have been wondering to add to this, is if we are seeing a Luongo type situation where being the captain severely hampered his performance. After he gave the C up he come back strong the following season…I love what Bo brings to this team. I wonder if he would accept a role change next season and allow Miller to take the C if he is re signed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UnkNuk Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 7 minutes ago, Coconuts said: Great post, we're going to have to be patient because the kind of change this organization needs doesn't simply take place over the span of a few months. We've got a great management team in place and some good building blocks on the team. We'll see what happens, but we'll need to be patient. Always enjoy your takes. So what have we been for the last ten years? (Sorry Coco. I know you mean we have to continue to be patient. We really have no choice. But I just couldn't resist.) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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