[Report] Maple Leafs part ways with GM Kyle Dubas

[hammertime]

1 hour ago, Slegr said:

Why is the thread called part ways? That sounds so friendly, like it was amicable. The guy was fired, canned, and Leafs are heading down hill. Let’s not be so polite with the title.

Have you met Jura Slager? No relation.

[Slegr]

15 minutes ago, hammertime said:

Have you met Jura Slager? No relation.

Who the heck is Jura Slager?

[hammertime]

5 minutes ago, Slegr said:

Who the heck is Jura Slager?

Practicing my dad jokes. 

[Slegr]

42 minutes ago, hammertime said:

Practicing my dad jokes. 

Wait, okay, did you hear that one from Amanda Hugnkiss?

[-DLC-]

 

[King Heffy]

5 hours ago, Alflives said:

That’s a very fair trade from both sides. LA is one city where Matthews might actually extend. Leafs get two high end young players. 

Leafs get one somewhat disappointing 2nd overall and yet another defenceman who can't play defence.  The 2nd rounder is the highlight of that package.

[King Heffy]

2 hours ago, -DLC- said:

 

That's hilarious.  This unqualified moron thought he could push out a guy who'd played the game at a high level, had won Cups, and experience, and was his boss?  Even I didn't think Dubas was so stupid that he'd add insubordination to his list of defects.

Edited May 23, 2023 by King Heffy

[Kevin Biestra]

3 hours ago, -DLC- said:

 

 

Lol Kyle Dubas pulled a Fredo.

 

[canuck73_3]

7 hours ago, King Heffy said:

That's hilarious.  This unqualified moron thought he could push out a guy who'd played the game at a high level, had won Cups, and experience, and was his boss?  Even I didn't think Dubas was so stupid that he'd add insubordination to his list of defects.

Not sure I’d be gloating so much, Dubas had a deal for Fleury, Shanahan vetoed it. Leafs are still looking for a goalie…

[Miss Korea Bob.Loblaw]

On 5/20/2023 at 12:58 AM, Elias Pettersson said:

Yes, there is a lot to unpack here as well.  But let's cut to the chase here.  You are calling me a homer, comparing me to Heffy and telling me that I am attacking you, when it's really the other way around.  But if you really are a lawyer then that makes perfect sense.  You are doing exactly what a lawyer typically does, spin the narrative to make it look like you're the good guy and I'm the criminal who needs to be locked up for 20 years.  I know alot of lawyers, so I know the deal.

 

In any event, I will come back with this so we can end this debate on friendly terms since I actually do like and respect you as a poster.  Firstly, I don't like Connor McDavid.  I have my reasons, but I was a kid watching Gretzky and Lemieux and followed them their entire careers.  Moving on to Crosby same thing.  McDavid is a different animal.  He has a huge ego, is a d*ck in interviews, and plays the game like he's looking to rack up the individual points.  That's my take on him and after watching the best players in history over a 35-year period that is how I feel and nothing you can say will change my opinion, so no point in even countering back on that.  He's the anti-Gretzky.  Having said all of that, I do believe he is a great player and will most likely finish his career in the top 10 players of all time.  So, I am acknowledging his greatness even though I think he is a d*ck.  I don't think he will ever win a cup until he and Draisaitl learn to play a team game and learn to play better 5 on 5.  I can't envision a team winning a cup based soley on their power play.  But hey, I could be wrong and if it happens, I will admit I'm wrong.

 

As for the Leafs, I also don't like Matthews and Marner either.  They also rack up the points in the regular season and do a no show in the playoffs.  At least McDavid and Draisaitl showed up to play against Vegas, so I will give them that.  But the Toronto M&M duo were absolutely shameful against Florida.  Tkachuk is twice the player and twice the man that the Toronto M&M duo are, and I don't even like Tkachuk.  As for the Leafs in general, I never said Rielly was an AHL defender, I said their defence as a whole.  Which it is. You can spin it any way you want, but Giordano is 5 years past him prime, McCabe is a 5-6 Dman at best.  Schenn was a Canuck for most of the year, so I am not even including him as I consider him a Canuck, but he is their second best Dman right now, so they should go all out to re-sign him.  I have a feeling he will come back to Vancouver though, as he has a new baby now and lives in Kelowna.  TJ Brodie was good 7 years ago.  Not sure what you see in him now.  The others I don't have much to say about.  If you think they are NHL worthy then that's great, we have a difference of opinion and I'll leave it at that.  As for their goaltending, Murray was supposed to be their starter.  He was great in Pittsburgh.  He is now worse than Delia, who is an AHL goaltender.  As for Samsonov, Washington let him go for free in the summer.  Usually, you don't pick up a starting NHL goalie for free in the summer.  Having said that, he did well to substitute for Murray in the regular season but couldn't pull it off in the playoffs.  I wouldn't be surprised if the Shanaplan consists of going for round 3 and trying to find a new starting goalie in the summer once again.

 

I won't get into any of the Canucks stuff as I don't really want to debate that any longer.  It's over.  If you want to continue to call me a homer and compare me to other posters, go right ahead as it doesn't actually bother me.  I got thick skin and I hang around lawyers all the time.  Some are actually fun to be around, others not so much, but I do learn alot from them which has helped me to develop thick skin...

I'm a bit late to the party but the media storm surrounding Toronto isn't going to go away over a long weekend.  It's like watching a galactic star implode on itself in real time, and everyone's here for the viewing party.

 

The way Dubas managed the blueline despite having so much money locked up front is a massive selling point for his next job.  I think you're being far too critical for him squeezing as much as he did out of the defencemen.  Mark Giordano is a contract any team should die for.  No doubt he is 4 years past his prime (which was a Norris-winning prime, btw), but he is getting paid minimum salary.  I think you hold a very negative perception of him simply because he did look tired in the playoffs.  Leafs fans were getting very frustrated with his play in the postseason, but he has been fantastic in the regular season.  And at $800K, that is one of the most team-friendly contracts in the entire league.  Jake McCabe was also putting up great numbers on a god-awful Blackhawks team and has regressed during a first stint in Toronto, in contrast to Schenn (brought in at the same time, so you can't consider one a Canuck and another not a Hawk) who has fit in with Rielly like a glove - probably because he was used to playing alongside such an aggressive offensive D-man.  TJ Brodie, like Giordano, has no more offensive upside but is still VERY good at defending.  You are not giving those players (and the GM that acquired them) the credit they deserve. 

 

I know you place little value in metrics (yes, I'm about to post JFresh cards), but the Leafs blueline put up insanely good numbers.  Did translate to playoff success?  No.  Did it translate to regular season success?  Not even.  The blueline wasn't getting the job done (while Samsonov was doing his) and the Leafs were underperforming leading up to the deadline.  That's why they made so many defensive changes - McCabe/Schenn in, Sandin out.  

 

 

I think we can all see now that the current Panthers squad are built to win the Cup.  They've had an unbelievable postseason.  But no team wants to qualify the way Florida did this year.  The Panthers qualified following a furious April campaign after Daddy Tkachuk ripped into them for being soft.  They still lost the last few games and only held onto the wildcard after Pittsburgh lost to... Chicago... and Columbus.  Had Pittsburgh won even one of those games, Florida doesn't make it and that front office probably goes through what Toronto is doing right now.  Relying on the league's worst team to win games is not a recipe for success but that is exactly what happened and got Florida through.

 

Teams want to qualify the way Florida did last year, where they nonetheless got bounced in the second round.  Teams want to qualify the way Toronto did over the Dubas years - comfortably.  For teams that have struggled to even make the playoffs (such as us), even getting the chance to compete in the postseason is still a huge plus.  More importantly, it just helps build your fanbase by winning regular season games (which was my point in the previous post).  The Canucks have probably lost a whole generation of casual fans because they've sucked every year (except the bubble year where viewership was at an all-time low).  At least Leafs fans got to be excited about their team year in, year out... even if their best chances to win the Cup were pissed away.

 

Maybe it's typical media spin, but Dubas is coming out of this as the victim.  This is not a good luck for Shanahan and the MLSE group at all.  More importantly, I have no doubt that a team will gladly sign Dubas based on his regular season success alone.

Edited May 23, 2023 by Bob.Loblaw

[-Vintage Canuck-]

 

[PhillipBlunt]

2 minutes ago, -Vintage Canuck- said:

 

Dubas rolling on. 

[D-Money]

4 hours ago, Bob.Loblaw said:

I think we can all see now that the current Panthers squad are built to win the Cup.  They've had an unbelievable postseason.  But no team wants to qualify the way Florida did this year.  The Panthers qualified following a furious April campaign after Daddy Tkachuk ripped into them for being soft.  They still lost the last few games and only held onto the wildcard after Pittsburgh lost to... Chicago... and Columbus.  Had Pittsburgh won even one of those games, Florida doesn't make it and that front office probably goes through what Toronto is doing right now.  Relying on the league's worst team to win games is not a recipe for success but that is exactly what happened and got Florida through.

 

Teams want to qualify the way Florida did last year, where they nonetheless got bounced in the second round.  Teams want to qualify the way Toronto did over the Dubas years - comfortably.  For teams that have struggled to even make the playoffs (such as us), even getting the chance to compete in the postseason is still a huge plus.  More importantly, it just helps build your fanbase by winning regular season games (which was my point in the previous post).  The Canucks have probably lost a whole generation of casual fans because they've sucked every year (except the bubble year where viewership was at an all-time low).  At least Leafs fans got to be excited about their team year in, year out... even if their best chances to win the Cup were pissed away.

 

Maybe it's typical media spin, but Dubas is coming out of this as the victim.  This is not a good luck for Shanahan and the MLSE group at all.  More importantly, I have no doubt that a team will gladly sign Dubas based on his regular season success alone.

Ummm, no. The current Panthers have been getting outplayed on a regular basis. But they are riding an absolutely insane heater by Bobrovsky. They are like the Canucks with bubble Demko, only the team in front of the brick wall is at least decent. It’s crazy to think that they couldn’t even trust Bob as starter as recently as end of the season. He looked headed for a buyout this summer. And then suddenly…magic.

 

We can all question the ability of the Leafs to succeed in the playoffs. But super-Bob and his band of merry men are doing the same thing they did to the Leafs to the Hurricanes, a proven playoff winner.

[mll]

18 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Yes, I don't think LA would trade their two top prospects without an extension in place.  LA doesn't have a 2023 1st so they could make it a 2024 1st.  Which wouldn't be a huge difference with the 2023 2nd.  LA with Matthews could win the Western Conference next season...

 

EDIT: LA would have to dumperoo Cal Petersen to make the cap work.  So TO would have to take his contract back.  So maybe the 2024 1st and TO gets Petersen as well in return.  With Kopitar coming off the books in 2024 that would be perfect for LA when Matthews extension kicks in...

LA still needs a starting goalie though.  Moving Petersen would allow them to upgrade in goal but it doesn't create the cap space to add Matthews.  They already have to clear cap space to be able to bring back their own players. 

 

What's your lineup and pairings?  Kopitar expects to sign an extension btw.

 

[NewbieCanuckFan]

36 minutes ago, D-Money said:

Ummm, no. The current Panthers have been getting outplayed on a regular basis. But they are riding an absolutely insane heater by Bobrovsky. They are like the Canucks with bubble Demko, only the team in front of the brick wall is at least decent. It’s crazy to think that they couldn’t even trust Bob as starter as recently as end of the season. He looked headed for a buyout this summer. And then suddenly…magic.

 

We can all question the ability of the Leafs to succeed in the playoffs. But super-Bob and his band of merry men are doing the same thing they did to the Leafs to the Hurricanes, a proven playoff winner.

I don't follow the Panthers but weren't they like 1st overall in the league the previous season?  Was that also as a result of riding on the back of Bobo?

 

I don't know thus hence my question.

[D-Money]

9 minutes ago, NewbieCanuckFan said:

I don't follow the Panthers but weren't they like 1st overall in the league the previous season?  Was that also as a result of riding on the back of Bobo?

 

I don't know thus hence my question.

Last season they had a lot of career years offensively, but it didn’t translate to playoff success. Then they lost a lot of depth in the offseason (Giroux, Marchment, Chiarot, etc.), and made the big Tkachuk deal.

 

They seem to be built better for the playoffs, with intense, physical players that elevate their game as the stakes raise. But the main reason for their success this postseason is far-and-away Bobrovsky. His save percentage this round is unreal, if it were even average they would be down 3-0 instead.

[Miss Korea Bob.Loblaw]

59 minutes ago, D-Money said:

Ummm, no. The current Panthers have been getting outplayed on a regular basis. But they are riding an absolutely insane heater by Bobrovsky. They are like the Canucks with bubble Demko, only the team in front of the brick wall is at least decent. It’s crazy to think that they couldn’t even trust Bob as starter as recently as end of the season. He looked headed for a buyout this summer. And then suddenly…magic.

 

We can all question the ability of the Leafs to succeed in the playoffs. But super-Bob and his band of merry men are doing the same thing they did to the Leafs to the Hurricanes, a proven playoff winner.

The Florida Panthers were the President's Trophy winners last year.  Other than one notable switch with Calgary, the core is very much intact.  So they were 100% a regular season team that underachieved this year, but are now enjoying some insane postseason success.  Hard not to make comparisons to the 2012 Kings and a red-hot Jonathan Quick.  People will forget how that Conn Smythe winner carried the team on his back.

 

I do agree with you on one thing.  This Bob-induced spanking of Carolina is definitely taking the sting off Bruins and Leafs fans.  And I'm sure it's caused some Leafs fans to treat the Dubas firing negatively.

Edited May 23, 2023 by Bob.Loblaw

[Kevin Biestra]

9 minutes ago, Bob.Loblaw said:

The Florida Panthers were the President's Trophy winners last year.  Other than one notable switch with Calgary, the core is very much intact.  So they were 100% a regular season team that underachieved this year, but are now enjoying some insane postseason success.  Hard not to make comparisons to the 2012 Kings and a red-hot Jonathan Quick.  People will forget how that Conn Smythe winner carried the team on his back.

 

I do agree with you on one thing.  This Bob-induced spanking of Carolina is definitely taking the sting off Bruins and Leafs fans.  And I'm sure it's caused some Leafs fans to treat the Dubas firing negatively.

 

Also kind of reminiscent of the 1993 (regular season division champion) Canucks and the 1994 version who were ordinary in the regular season and amazing in the playoffs.  The big difference being swapping out a regular season winner but mediocre playoff guy in Nedved who was kind of like the Huberdeau I guess.

[Mike Vanderhoek]

7 hours ago, canuck73_3 said:

Not sure I’d be gloating so much, Dubas had a deal for Fleury, Shanahan vetoed it. Leafs are still looking for a goalie…

Fleury is not the answer, smart move saying no to that one

[D-Money]

16 minutes ago, Bob.Loblaw said:

The Florida Panthers were the President's Trophy winners last year.  Other than one notable switch with Calgary, the core is very much intact.  So they were 100% a regular season team that underachieved this year, but are now enjoying some insane postseason success.  Hard not to make comparisons to the 2012 Kings and a red-hot Jonathan Quick.  People will forget how that Conn Smythe winner carried the team on his back.

 

I do agree with you on one thing.  This Bob-induced spanking of Carolina is definitely taking the sting off Bruins and Leafs fans.  And I'm sure it's caused some Leafs fans to treat the Dubas firing negatively.

The biggest difference between the current Panthers and the 2012 Kings is the defence. That Kings team had a stacked blueline behind Darryl Sutter’s stifling system. Quick was excellent, but most of the time he didn’t have to be, because the quality chances were few and far between.

 

The Panthers have a comparatively shallow blueline, a more loose team defence, and as such are giving up a lot of high quality scoring chances. But Bob is just in the zone, and stopping them at a ridiculous rate.