Honky Cat Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 In hindsight..I wish that JB had cleared the decks after we lost the Calgary playoff series...It would have been hard slogging for the fans,but we would more than likely be seeing a lot more future benefits right now...I feel like we wasted a year....It was obvious that the Sedins were declining,but management waited until this late in the day to unload the veteran support group. Next year we may really start seeing JB's draft picks...but looking at our forwards tonight...and take away the twins and the plugs,....there's a lot of roster spots to fill..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-AJ- Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 2 hours ago, Pete M said: 2-3 years seems like a long time, considering he is in year 3, but the age structure and skill level of the team is poor and he needs to get younger, faster, stronger, skilled players through the draft. When there is a player like Tkachuk available, he needs to pick him rather than pass on him. After Eriksson, who is 31, there are only three players older and all are significant outliers. According to this site: http://mirtle.blogspot.ca/2016/10/2016-17-nhl-teams-by-height-weight-and.html, we stared right around the middle of the pack in terms of age and have since added 22-year old Stecher, 24-year old Cramarossa, 23-year old Boucher, and 21-year old Goldobin to our roster. Not only that, but we've lost 35-year old (nearly 36) Burrows and 31-year old Hansen. That site has the average starting roster age at 27.3 and keep in mind that many teams have young guys for their 9 games to start the season. Our current average age is 26, dead even, 1.3 years younger than the average. On top of that, our average is skewed by having three players much older than the rest. To solve that issue (somewhat), we can find the median, which is a mere 25 years of age. Claiming we need to get younger at this point is ridiculous. We are already an extremely young team. Looking at the data above (all taken from hockey-reference.com), it's clear that we aren't terribly far from the "super young" teams of the Maple Leafs and the Oilers. Once you correct for the skewing by using the median, we are tied with them. The Canucks have already begun rebuilding and are a younger-than-average team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baggins Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 2 hours ago, Pete M said: As it stands today, JB not picking Tkachuk doesn't look good. OJ needs to be a top #2 D man to make JB look good. LE signing, to date, is bad. He needs to get assets for a dman that might be lost for nothing in the ED This is short term judgement, what I see today. However, time will tell. Give him 2 to 3 years, it will be interesting to see how he handles the Sedins retirement/ extension. 2-3 years seems like a long time, considering he is in year 3, but the age structure and skill level of the team is poor and he needs to get younger, faster, stronger, skilled players through the draft. When there is a player like Tkachuk available, he needs to pick him rather than pass on him. Instant gratification. D-men tend to take longer to develop. High end d-men are harder to acquire and have far more value than high end forwards. This was a good risk on Bennings part. I think worst case we have a good d-man. best case we have a great d-man. Patience Grasshopper. Btw, all 30 teams will lose an asset in the expansion draft. Accept it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sedinyoureyesontheprize Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 Happy with All jb has done except the hiring of this sad excuse of a coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grind Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 Past gm's brought us to the cup finals, so the bar is to win at least once. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanuckleHorse Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 5 hours ago, VancouverHabitant said: Canucks are one of the worst teams in the league, looking at the players. Willie is not a miracle worker. His system sucks he would make the top team in the league look average he truly is in way over his head nice guy but that don't make a good coach! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete M Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 5 hours ago, ajhockey said: After Eriksson, who is 31, there are only three players older and all are significant outliers. According to this site: http://mirtle.blogspot.ca/2016/10/2016-17-nhl-teams-by-height-weight-and.html, we stared right around the middle of the pack in terms of age and have since added 22-year old Stecher, 24-year old Cramarossa, 23-year old Boucher, and 21-year old Goldobin to our roster. Not only that, but we've lost 35-year old (nearly 36) Burrows and 31-year old Hansen. That site has the average starting roster age at 27.3 and keep in mind that many teams have young guys for their 9 games to start the season. Our current average age is 26, dead even, 1.3 years younger than the average. On top of that, our average is skewed by having three players much older than the rest. To solve that issue (somewhat), we can find the median, which is a mere 25 years of age. Claiming we need to get younger at this point is ridiculous. We are already an extremely young team. Looking at the data above (all taken from hockey-reference.com), it's clear that we aren't terribly far from the "super young" teams of the Maple Leafs and the Oilers. Once you correct for the skewing by using the median, we are tied with them. The Canucks have already begun rebuilding and are a younger-than-average team. I see your point, however, younger with speed skill, and strength all put together. Good way to get this is through the draft picking in top 3 to 4. Evaluating the players is not merely on age alone. Quality over quantity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSVII Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 We'll see in a year or two when the fruits of the 15/16 drafts hit NHL ice. Because right now we aren't comparing that favourably considering the players we've passed and the amount of time we picked there. In order to pay for NHL ready players to fill that "age gap". Benning gambled on being able to keep up with our rivals talent pools by hitting good players with fewer, low quality picks. I'm not convinced it's paid off yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Where'd Luongo? Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 When Benning got here I said I'd give him the seasons to prove what he could do. He blew it the first two in my opinion by not taking action, but made a couple good moves which proved to pay off. This season he did what I believe was a good decision and began transitioning, though the trades he made are harder to evaluate until a couple years from now. Benning won't be the best, that goes to Burke, who pulled off the Sedins or maybe Quinn who got Bure. Third being Mike Gillis, the man got us one game away. Fourth being Jake Milford. Benning might prove to be top 5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kloubek Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 I think he has done a fine job. A few misses here and there, but some were simply not his fault. Misses: People bitched about him not getting anything at last year's deadline but he didn't really have a lot of options. Who would have guessed that Eriksson would lost his game? He got what he could for Kesler. Vey was a guessing game which we lost on, but was worth a try. Kassian had to go, and Prust should have been able to add some of that grit we were missing. Larsen was a good try for minimal cost, and Jensen didn't amount to anything which is good because either did Etem. Vrbata as a miss due to his uninterested play in his last year, but did well in his first year. I think pretty much most of his other moves and signings have been sound. His drafting has also been better than average. He came to a team laden with (aging) veteran contracts and very few prospects. We all have to remember what he was up against. It is easy to look at missing the playoffs two years in a row and figure that he isn't doing a good job. The fact is, he has cut most of the fat (so to speak) and built a solid complimentary team that has excellent defensive depth, solid goaltending for the future, and several promising prospects. No matter who the GM is, a team who is rebuilding (or retooling as I suppose we've done) is going to have times of hurt, and that is what we are experiencing now. What will come out of it in one to three years is a far better team overall. The only part that still scares me is that I don't feel we have much elite talent either playing or in our prospect pool. Yes, Horvat is looking to be a #1 center which is great - but if you look around the league, most teams have exceptional 1st line centers. McDavid, Crosby, Malkin, Scheifele, Backstrom, Seguin, Granlund, Taveres, Draisaitl, Getzlaf, Toews, Matthews, Marner all seem to project or are higher than him, so as great as it is that he is shaping up to be a #1 center, he isn't likely to be considered quite elite in that kind of company. But then, I always projected him as a #2 center and he is clearly still getting better so who knows. Even still, we have to worry about having a good 2nd line center, which we simply don't have and Sutter isn't going to cut it. Players like Baertschi and Granlund are likely to be 2nd line players. Now we have Goldobin and Dahlen who may amount to something and Boeser who likely will, but we still don't know what level any of these players will reach, if they even amount to solid NHL players at all. Even if they do pan out, it is relatively unlikely that they are going to be elite NHL players. So as I see it, we are heading towards a solid team, but not a team that is likely to compete for the cup unless we can bring in at least one if not two true elite players. And I'm not really sure where we are going to get those players in relatively short order. We might be able to package a good prospect with a good defenseman to get one of them, and even still we need our best prospects to hit and hit rather big. Still, considering that only a couple of years ago we had little in the way of a future, I'd say it looks a lot brighter these days. And if we are lucky enough to have the Sedins sign with us again after their contract is up, they can be placed in a 3rd line role to both be mentors and supply secondary scoring. That would be ideal. Exciting times ahead, if all goes as planned.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Team Bagues Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 It's hard to beat Quinn at this point. According to this old article, http://ottawacitizen.com/sports/hockey/nhl/senatorsextra/the-most-lopsided-trade-deadline-deals-ever , he pulled off two of the most lopsided trades ever. 1. Quinn and Butcher for Courtnall, Dirk, Ronning, Momesso & futures. 2. Stojanov for Naslund Throw in the below as well... "After the installation of former Canucks defenceman Pat Quinn as general manager in the summer of 1987,[28] the team underwent an immediate rebuilding process, trading away core veterans for younger prospects and players. Among the more key transactions was a deal with the New Jersey Devils, in which Sundstrom was traded away in exchange for winger Greg Adams and goaltender Kirk McLean. In addition to Quinn's trades, the team improved through the draft route with two selections, in particular. With the second overall selection in the 1988 NHL Entry Draft, the Canucks chose winger Trevor Linden from the Western Hockey League (WHL). The following year, the team made a controversial selection by choosing Russian winger Pavel Bure 113th overall. Bure was believed by most teams to be ineligible for selection that year. Consequently, his draft by the Canucks took a year to be verified by the league as team management went about procuring documents to prove his eligibility." - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vancouver_Canucks The strange thing is how the Canucks then went downhill after the 94' run, under Quinn's reign. Some blame that on extensive injuries to Bure and Linden. --- fast forward, former Canucks defencemen Benning --- history repeats??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 9 hours ago, Honky Cat said: In hindsight..I wish that JB had cleared the decks after we lost the Calgary playoff series...It would have been hard slogging for the fans,but we would more than likely be seeing a lot more future benefits right now...I feel like we wasted a year....It was obvious that the Sedins were declining,but management waited until this late in the day to unload the veteran support group. Next year we may really start seeing JB's draft picks...but looking at our forwards tonight...and take away the twins and the plugs,....there's a lot of roster spots to fill..... The way I look at it is there obviously weren't deals for guys that he thought made sense for the future and the team had no young guys to fill roster spots if he cleaned house. Hard to argue with what he got for Burr and Hansen this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davathor Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 How does OP have +30?? we are one of the worst teams in the league, competing for a lottery spot AGAIN, anemic offence and special teams, as well as confusing moves like signing Eriksson and trading for Gudbranson. We don't have legitimate replacements for the Sedins... and yet because of the (admittedly) promising youth corps, you are suggesting he may be our BEST GM in the HISTORY of this team? Jesus. Burkie is easily above him for his draft day magic to draft the 2 best players to put on a Canucks uniform... how in the hell does some unproven rookies and Bo Horvat make him even mentioned in the same breath as "best ever" Get a grip people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruilin96 Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 I think Jim is one of the more underrated GM in the league and I think he has done fairly well given the cards he was dealt with when he first took over. I think he was mainly hamstring by the owners of making the playoffs every year and couldn't do a proper rebuild in his first 2 years here, and I believe once the Sedins retire and Jim has a fresh group of guys of his own, he can build this team to a contender. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Rattler Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 3 GM's built teams that got us to the finals. Of those three, one built a team that got us to game 7 of the SCF. JB needs to get us a cup before we crown him as the best ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimberWolf Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 At best he's mediocre. Burke orchestrated a trade the got us a top 3 pick landing us a Sedin, Gillis a top 10 pick that got us Bo. Quinn built a team so beloved it lost and is still worshiped. Hell, even Nonis picked up Luongo Benning will have to do more than just finally not failing a trade deadline to fill shoes like the above. Trading for players that have high floors but low ceilings won't get it done. Gaurenteed NHL players can be non elite plugs. Though I do appreciate the Tryamkin pick. That's the only move that I give an A. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davathor Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 11 minutes ago, The Rattler said: 3 GM's built teams that got us to the finals. Of those three, one built a team that got us to game 7 of the SCF. JB needs to get us a cup before we crown him as the best ever. 2 got us to game 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Rattler Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 1 minute ago, Davathor said: 2 got us to game 7 Yes, that is correct. The memory of Nathan LaFayette hitting the post caused such trauma that I've had to force myself to erase that game from my memory. Ugh, now its back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobbyg43 Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 If JB can land one Bure type game breaker in the draft or trade this would suffice for me to have optimism for a future run at another finals . it alludes me as to who , where or how he will find this player? If JB can do this he will be trending to the top of a short list of gM's who have found some short to medium term success here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Where'd Luongo? Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 6 minutes ago, bobbyg43 said: If JB can land one Bure type game breaker in the draft or trade this would suffice for me to have optimism for a future run at another finals . it alludes me as to who , where or how he will find this player? If JB can do this he will be trending to the top of a short list of gM's who have found some short to medium term success here. Johnny Gaudreau, picked in the fourth round. He needs to strike gold with later picks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.