Rex425 Posted August 14, 2014 Share Posted August 14, 2014 You cannot teach skating like that, nor can you successfully bet on how big he's gonna get. He's NHL size + right now with skill to spare. But what about when he's 22? 25? 6 foot 3 or 6 foot 4 and 225 pounds is not out of the question and as he'll have time tog row into it it should not affect his skating abilities at all. I keep going over the first 10 pages of this thread and I plan on bumping some of the better "he's a bust" quotes when he is in his 3rd or 4th year. Kids a stud You're right. He's a stud and in my opinion has tools to possibly be better than 2 or 3 top 5 picks in the draft. At worst he's a pretty good 3rd liner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted August 14, 2014 Share Posted August 14, 2014 I just want to point out that this 17 year old kid is 6 foot 1 inch tall 210 pounds and was considered possibly the fastest and best skater in the draft. Food for thought And one of the better shots as well. I'm still a touch baffled on those who feel it was a bad pick. When I read he was the top 10 player who played most like a junkyard dog, it pretty much confirmed he was our pick for me. Seems like JUST the type of player new management wants to build from. Big, mean, hard working PITA to play against players. We may not have THE most skilled team moving forward but we'll be a decently skilled team who will out work, out hit and generally mash the opposition to their will while putting pucks in at the other end with some still pretty decent skill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dasein Posted August 14, 2014 Share Posted August 14, 2014 Shinkaruk - Horvat - Virtanen has more potential as a line IMO. Shinkaruk - Horvat - Virtanen McCann/_____ - Vey - Kassian I wouldn't mind packaging McCann and/or Jensen for either defence like you suggested or an upgrade at LW. I put Kassian there because he's a great playmaker and Shinkaruk is trigger happy and Virtanen with Vey because Vey's also a great playmaker. A lot can happen between now and when these guys hit their prime, and some of them won't be playing for us. Ideally, I'd like to keep the 2013 pairing and the 2014 pairing together. I think this is plausible if McCann takes the next step in his development and breaks out offensively in the OHL. I like Horvat because he's a sure thing as a 2/3C, but I think McCann has a higher upside of 1/2/3C because of his offensive potential. ________ - McCann - Virtanen Shinkaruk - Horvat - Kassian/Vey Is what I actually want to see 5-6 years from now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustABandwagoner Posted August 14, 2014 Share Posted August 14, 2014 (edited) I'm going with Shinkaruk - Horvat - Kassian McCann - Vey - Virtanen I feel like one of Jensen or Shinkaruk are gone in the future to bring in help on defense. Shinkaruk is gonna be an elite scoring winger. Just watch, Edited August 14, 2014 by DontMessMe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dasein Posted August 14, 2014 Share Posted August 14, 2014 Shinkaruk is gonna be an elite scoring winger. Just watch, Well as you can see I got rid of Jensen not Shinkaruk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pears Posted August 15, 2014 Share Posted August 15, 2014 (edited) I put Kassian there because he's a great playmaker and Shinkaruk is trigger happy and Virtanen with Vey because Vey's also a great playmaker. A lot can happen between now and when these guys hit their prime, and some of them won't be playing for us. Ideally, I'd like to keep the 2013 pairing and the 2014 pairing together. I think this is plausible if McCann takes the next step in his development and breaks out offensively in the OHL. I like Horvat because he's a sure thing as a 2/3C, but I think McCann has a higher upside of 1/2/3C because of his offensive potential. ________ - McCann - Virtanen Shinkaruk - Horvat - Kassian/Vey Is what I actually want to see 5-6 years from now.I agree with this also. Shinkaruk and Kassian could be the perfect combo of size (Kassian), speed, sniping and playmaking. If McCann and Virtanen reach their potential we have a filthy top six of the future, just need to find that top line LW. Edited August 15, 2014 by Pears Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex425 Posted August 15, 2014 Share Posted August 15, 2014 I agree with this also. Shinkaruk and Kassian could be the perfect combo of size (Kassian), speed, sniping and playmaking. If McCann and Virtanen reach their potential we have a filthy top six of the future, just need to find that top line LW. I don't know if Shinkaruk is good enough for the first line but he can be in the 1st line for the future if he reaches his potential. Jensen can be 2 LW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yogolol Posted August 15, 2014 Share Posted August 15, 2014 People easily mix up "selfish" and "shoot first" mentality. Virtanen was described as a north-south type of player who will look to shoot first than pass. Not because he is selfish, but as a sniper you would think he would think to shoot first. He likes to make plays off the rush and drive to the net...pretty simple meat and potatoes player. If he can't blaze by you he will drive right through you. Nylander as described by Bob Mckenzie and others scouts that Nylander has a tendency to play a more individual game rather than a team game. Although lots of flash, his inability to stick within the confines of the team mentality game hurt his reputation with a few teams when he was considered a top 5 talent. I thought Nylander was suppose to be a guy with great vision and playmaking abilities? i dont know much though so im probably wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canucks1219 Posted August 16, 2014 Share Posted August 16, 2014 I thought Nylander was suppose to be a guy with great vision and playmaking abilities? i dont know much though so im probably wrong. I think Bob Mackenzie and/or others said at the draft that Nylander does have solid playmaking skills. It's just that he sometimes feels, rightly or wrongly, that he is the best option so he does it all himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BanTSN Posted August 16, 2014 Share Posted August 16, 2014 I think both prospects like to do as much as they can on their own, because really, what young player doesn't like to score? But while Jake scored at a .61 goals per game pace last season, Nylander scored at a .44 goals per game pace. Both are fairly good offensive players, but it's quite clear who the better goal-scorer is. Considering Jake's size, speed and decent two-way play compared to Nylander's relative lack of interest in defense, I think it's quite clear who the better prospect overall is. But if Nylander starts off as a center in Toronto and feeds pucks to a guy like Kessel, he'll pick up a ton of assists. He had WAY more assists last season than Virtanen. Not even close. So it's clear who the playmaker is. I think both players went to the appropiate conferences. Nylander would be crushed in the west. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canucks1219 Posted August 16, 2014 Share Posted August 16, 2014 (edited) I think both prospects like to do as much as they can on their own, because really, what young player doesn't like to score? But while Jake scored at a .61 goals per game pace last season, Nylander scored at a .44 goals per game pace. Both are fairly good offensive players, but it's quite clear who the better goal-scorer is. Considering Jake's size, speed and decent two-way play compared to Nylander's relative lack of interest in defense, I think it's quite clear who the better prospect overall is. But if Nylander starts off as a center in Toronto and feeds pucks to a guy like Kessel, he'll pick up a ton of assists. He had WAY more assists last season than Virtanen. Not even close. So it's clear who the playmaker is. I think both players went to the appropiate conferences. Nylander would be crushed in the west. Nylander was already playing professionally against men much older than him. Jake was dealing with, for the most part, teenagers. EDIT: Typo. Edited August 16, 2014 by Canucks1219 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Off_The_Schneid! Posted August 16, 2014 Share Posted August 16, 2014 Nylander fits into Toronto perfectly Take that as you wish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WonderTwinPowers Posted August 16, 2014 Share Posted August 16, 2014 Nylander was already playing professionally against men much older than him. Jake was dealing with, for the most part, teenagers. EDIT: Typo. He played 22 games in the men's league for all of 6 points for a struggling MODO. and played nearly 60 games against U20 where he actually showcased himself. Its not like he was dominant against older compitetion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canucks1219 Posted August 16, 2014 Share Posted August 16, 2014 He played 22 games in the men's league for all of 6 points for a struggling MODO. and played nearly 60 games against U20 where he actually showcased himself. Its not like he was dominant against older compitetion. I never implied he was dominant against older players. The point I was making was that he was comparing goal per games using players under relatively significant circumstances (junior vs. professional). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boudrias Posted August 16, 2014 Share Posted August 16, 2014 Jensen played more games than Nylander in the SEL, so what. I consider his season there almost a wash compared to more games and TOI in the OHL. Obviously I'm not a big Euro fan. Still think Jensen needs at least half a season in Utica putting up consistant points. Nylander should fit in well in Laffer land where the back check is a passing whim. Shanny's nightmares have not even began to start! Yup, Dion and Phil are a back bone that can be built upon! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted August 16, 2014 Share Posted August 16, 2014 Nylander was already playing professionally against men much older than him. Jake was dealing with, for the most part, teenagers. EDIT: Typo. At this note, Nylander is also older and has a hockey father grooming him where as Jake was barely 17 and doing this against kids 2 years older than him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BanTSN Posted August 16, 2014 Share Posted August 16, 2014 Nylander was already playing professionally against men much older than him. Jake was dealing with, for the most part, teenagers. EDIT: Typo. Not that it's relevant because we don't know how good these professional 'men' are, but he managed 1 goal in 22 games during that time and was then loaned out because his development wasn't progressing. I guess the men were good enough to shut Nylander down. That being said, Nylander's a pass-first winger. Saw some of that wizardry already in the Leafs prospects warmup coverage. He can skate and he can pass. Meanwhile Virtanen's out. So no hype-building opportunity at the moment. Oh well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BanTSN Posted August 16, 2014 Share Posted August 16, 2014 Jensen played more games than Nylander in the SEL, so what. I consider his season there almost a wash compared to more games and TOI in the OHL. Obviously I'm not a big Euro fan. Still think Jensen needs at least half a season in Utica putting up consistant points. Nylander should fit in well in Laffer land where the back check is a passing whim. Shanny's nightmares have not even began to start! Yup, Dion and Phil are a back bone that can be built upon! Agreed. But he was at least doing that for a few games before they called him up last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NEON.KNEE Posted August 16, 2014 Share Posted August 16, 2014 the Nylander Vs. Virtanen argument is very silly. They are 2 completely different players. And at the end of the day Virtanen is fast and strong enough to just skate right through Nylander if he has the puck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex425 Posted August 16, 2014 Share Posted August 16, 2014 (edited) I think Virtanen is the best goal scorer in the draft. He put up 45 goals while 6 less minutes than Ehlers(ES) and had little Powerplay minutes(tied for most even strength goals among draft eligible players of the CHL). We could perhaps get a top line center for him and wait if Shinkaruk turns out good. Edited August 16, 2014 by Rex425 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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