Jake Virtanen | #18 | RW

[stawns]

13 minutes ago, Hutton Wink said:

Don't think there's ever really been a doubt that he'd become an NHL player -- his raw skills are NHL-calibre.  The question's been how far he'd develop, whether into a top-line player or a bottom-6.  Worst-case his skating, shot, and physical presence are very usable.  It's not like he's a turnover machine or penalty magnet that hurts the team when he's out there.

the opposite.......he creates turnovers and draws penalties like mad.  I love watching him skate.  They just need to put him on lw and I think he blossoms

[aGENT]

1 minute ago, stawns said:

the opposite.......he creates turnovers and draws penalties like mad.  I love watching him skate.  They just need to put him on lw and I think he blossoms

Better D to transition the puck (coming), agree on LW and hopefully a couple other 'primary' skilled forwards for him to play with (use his speed/size to create space, turnovers etc, bang in pucks) 

[R35Godz1lla]

3 hours ago, Ojibwa72 said:

This is the reason one might say get what you can for him and move on. If his development is faltering he just might miss the bus completely and never pan out.

That would be somewhat akin to selling of stocks in a precious gem mine that has yet to get their soil samples analysed  .

[BCNate]

14 hours ago, terrible.dee said:

What are you guys talking about?

 

You're acting like some big barrier was crossed or something accomplished

 

All I see are no results a lot of excuses and A LOT of hot air

 

There is no substance to support this "Strong 2-way game" he developed, you're just parroting soundbites you've heard in the media, he's the same player that was sent down last fall

 

And as for this prediction that he will slot in to the line up next year, do you really think they are going to keep a bottom 6 player they drafted 6th overall?

 

Why doesn't Benning just wear a dunce cap to games from now on?  He might as well if Jake is going to be plodding away in the bottom 6 which for a guy who couldn't crack 20 Pt.s in the AHL is about all you can expect, he is going to look like an idiot everytime Jake is on the ice.

 

Jake needed to start SCORING this year in Utica, he 100% failed to do that or show any sign of being an offensive talent in ANY level of pro hockey, 

 

Virtanen will be gone by the fall, hopefully with Tanev and a pick for Reinhart most likely for someone else's 1st round blunder, in the hopes that switching problems will help people  forget who's fault the problem was. Regaurdless, he needs to be dumped fast, because unless he were to start scoring right off the bat next year, his worth is about to take a major nosedive, there are still people who will gamble on him, and with his physical tools he probably can play on someones 4th line in the NHL, but there's still going to be hope on some GM's part that he might be more.

 

Are St. Louis sick of Yakopov yet? Because that's a deal that would make sense, Lazar would have made sense as well, but that ship has sailed

 

 

So dumping him for little to no return is your ideal strategy?  He is 20 years old.  He has size, speed and skill.  Not all players hit the ground running in the NHL, sometimes you have to be patient and let them develop.   As I said, let him play an offensive role in Utica next year and see where it goes.  He has a ton of potential, you don't give up on that with a 20 year old.

[gameburn2]

12 hours ago, N4ZZY said:

To be honest. I think Jake needed to be in Utica. It was good for him. Too many distractions for Jake in Vancouver last year, and had he been up in Van all year, I'm not sure he makes as much progress and growth as he does in Utica. So sending him down was the right decision by management, one of the few good decisions they've made this past season. And Jake, honestly, probably needs another half season at least in Utica. I'm curious to see what he brings to training camp with so many young players, he needs to compete really hard to earn a roster spot, and I don't think that's a bad thing for him, and for the franchise. I still believe Virtanen's going to be a good player for us. He may not be an elite player, but I can see him producing 20 goals several seasons. I think he tops at a 50-55 point player, but he'll be averaging (my guess) about 40 points. If he does, I'd consider that a win, considering how so many on these boards consider him a bust already at 20 years old. Ridiculous. 

 

I agree.  Good for him to see what the value is in hard work.  V. has such natural skating and physicality, I suspect he needs to learn the game; he may have had it too easy for him up to the last year.

[gameburn2]

3 hours ago, Boudrias said:

Does Green bring Virtanen up or vice versa?

Good question.  If Green has been good for enough younger players... and his judgment is trusted, then he could be the coach they hire. Given the value of Virtanen to this team... a rebuilt Virtanen would be a huge credit to Green.   We lost Kassian because of discipline issues... can you imagine if V. goes the same way?  Yikes.

[Alflives]

1 hour ago, gameburn2 said:

Good question.  If Green has been good for enough younger players... and his judgment is trusted, then he could be the coach they hire. Given the value of Virtanen to this team... a rebuilt Virtanen would be a huge credit to Green.   We lost Kassian because of discipline issues... can you imagine if V. goes the same way?  Yikes.

Green will (most likely) be our next head coach.  He will bring Virtanen along, and some of the other younger players too.

Edited April 13, 2017 by b3.

[tyhee]

5 hours ago, Boudrias said:

Does Green bring Virtanen up or vice versa?

Regardless of who the coach is it seems at least possible that Jake might be a better future player with more time to figure out the game at the AHL level to a greater extent before progressing to the NHL again.  If he is ready by the time training camp rolls around that would be great but there's really nothing to indicate he's there right now.  Obviously he'll be given another shot, but his development needn't be rushed.  

 

[Rob_Zepp]

On 4/6/2017 at 8:28 AM, GoBoGo53 said:

This is a good post. Dangling someone at your own blue line is the most risky play in hockey. It's a breakaway if it doesn't work out. That's why Nylander is so special, he has the confidence and skill to make the play. 

 

And I completely agree with the bolded. My video post wasn't intended to troll. It was just to counter the point that you can find players like Nylander in every draft. It's not possible

Nylander is not "so special" and after through the league once now, expect him to struggle.  Come back next season and see how he struggles - betting he will and some of the players you have crapped on will not.   

[Alflives]

Just now, Rob_Zepp said:

Nylander is not "so special" and after through the league once now, expect him to struggle.  Come back next season and see how he struggles - betting he will and some of the players you have crapped on will not.   

Watching the "Pink Double Flamingo" tonight against the Caps.  The kid is a total perimeter player, and a McSofty.  Hate the Leafs, and hate that little pretty boy.  

[Pepe Silvia]

54 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Watching the "Pink Double Flamingo" tonight against the Caps.  The kid is a total perimeter player, and a McSofty.  Hate the Leafs, and hate that little pretty boy.  

I'm curious to know what you would be saying if he was on the Canucks. 

[CanucksJay]

One of the things I used to love watching was Virtanen laying big hits. 

Does anyone know why he stopped doing that? Or is he still playing with some edge  in Utica? 

My personal guess is that he had made some predatory hits and was on both the NHL and players watch list and making a bad name for himself and toned  it down when he started to take some cheap shots as well. 

Some think it was a lingering shoulder issue. 

 

Will we see Virtanen amp up his physical play once he learns the complete game? 

[Butters Stoch]

5 hours ago, Pepe Silvia said:

I'm curious to know what you would be saying if he was on the Canucks. 

Boeser is also a highly skilled player who doesn't provide much grit/toughness, guess he's really disappointed we wasted our pick on such a "soft" player.

[Phat Fingers]

3 hours ago, Butters Stoch said:

Boeser is also a highly skilled player who doesn't provide much grit/toughness, guess he's really disappointed we wasted our pick on such a "soft" player.

Where does Boeser have a rep as a perimeter player?  Or a soft player.  Are you defensive cause WN had a pretty brutal game?  You know Nylander is a maple leaf, right?  Maple leaf player has a bad game, it is pointed out and you have to throw a Canucks player under the bus to somehow compensate for WN clear inability to play a two way game. 

 

 

 

Nylander has always had questions about how he would do when the game get tight.  That was one reason he dropped in his draft year.  

 

That's not news, he is a regular season player, like his father, but will have to do a lot to show that he can play in the playoffs. Give him a mulligan for game one, but it isn't a good sign. 

 

Nylander has had some

concusions, doesn't play physical and in a contact sport that will force a non physical player to either be shifty and sneaky (Johnny Hockey) or you get forced to the outside. 

 

 

[Scruffy05]

7 hours ago, CanucksJay said:

One of the things I used to love watching was Virtanen laying big hits. 

Does anyone know why he stopped doing that? Or is he still playing with some edge  in Utica? 

My personal guess is that he had made some predatory hits and was on both the NHL and players watch list and making a bad name for himself and toned  it down when he started to take some cheap shots as well. 

Some think it was a lingering shoulder issue. 

 

Will we see Virtanen amp up his physical play once he learns the complete game? 

The shoulder may have been part of it, however I noticed a step change before and after the suspension. This was just an unscientific eye test though.

 

Most of his thundering hits were in junior where the players are obviously not as big and strong. He had a few when he first came up but guys in the NHL are so much more solid on their skates. Whereas before he could probably check directly through players it probably takes more of a toll on him against men, hence thoughts about the shoulder issue.

[Boeser6]

6 hours ago, Butters Stoch said:

Boeser is also a highly skilled player who doesn't provide much grit/toughness, guess he's really disappointed we wasted our pick on such a "soft" player.

Boeser scores alot of goals (if you look at his highlights) from the dirty areas and drives the net - Nylander is soft - effective so far but soft - this playoffs will be interesting to watch him (though he  is playing with Matthews) and see how he performs.

 

He is very much a permiter player there is no doubt if you have watched him and he would not have been as close to effective on the Canucks or any team without the offensive depth of the leafs - ie having to drive the bus vs support it would does not work well for permiter players. He may learn from this playoffs but in terms of what it takes to score at this time of the year - he doesn't have it (unless its PP / paired with a guy like Matthews)

 

Your argument would be better served with Ehlers v Virtanen as at least Ehlers goes hard to the net, even with limited size

 

Personally, I prefer Virtanen with this group now (assuming we can develop him properly), as what he "may" bring will be much more valuable come playoff time. And to note, at the draft I wanted Ehlers as he reminded me alot of Nazzy.

Edited April 14, 2017 by Boeser6

[Boeser6]

8 minutes ago, Scruffy05 said:

The shoulder may have been part of it, however I noticed a step change before and after the suspension. This was just an unscientific eye test though.

 

Most of his thundering hits were in junior where the players are obviously not as big and strong. He had a few when he first came up but guys in the NHL are so much more solid on their skates. Whereas before he could probably check directly through players it probably takes more of a toll on him against men, hence thoughts about the shoulder issue.

I think it was shoulder, he seemed to stop hitting completely this year, something was wrong with him. 

 

[Scruffy05]

6 hours ago, Butters Stoch said:

Boeser is also a highly skilled player who doesn't provide much grit/toughness, guess he's really disappointed we wasted our pick on such a "soft" player.

Boeser is soft? He's not huge but he is far from soft. He had 4 goals while he was here and outside of one sneaky one from the face off circle through traffic he was only a couple feet out right in the thick of it.

 

This playoffs will be an interesting litmus test for Nylander. We will see how he handles super tight checking and nasty series.

[stawns]

4 hours ago, Eastcoast meets Westcoast said:

Where does Boeser have a rep as a perimeter player?  Or a soft player.  Are you defensive cause WN had a pretty brutal game?  You know Nylander is a maple leaf, right?  Maple leaf player has a bad game, it is pointed out and you have to throw a Canucks player under the bus to somehow compensate for WN clear inability to play a two way game. 

 

 

 

Nylander has always had questions about how he would do when the game get tight.  That was one reason he dropped in his draft year.  

 

That's not news, he is a regular season player, like his father, but will have to do a lot to show that he can play in the playoffs. Give him a mulligan for game one, but it isn't a good sign. 

 

Nylander has had some

concusions, doesn't play physical and in a contact sport that will force a non physical player to either be shifty and sneaky (Johnny Hockey) or you get forced to the outside. 

 

 

I actually thought Nylander was good last night, the best of the three young guys.  Mathews is obviously a solid offensive player and decent in his own end, but I find he's invisible a lot of the time and is not a driver of the play.

[stawns]

50 minutes ago, Boeser6 said:

I think it was shoulder, he seemed to stop hitting completely this year, something was wrong with him. 

 

He's still playing physical, but in the pros you don't lay out those huge hits very often