Jake Virtanen | #18 | RW

[Gaudette Celly]

59 minutes ago, Hortankin said:

Why was his other thread closed? Did VC close it because he knows there's a trade happening? 

Almost 900 pages of incessantly crucifying Jake was enough, apparently.

[Mathew Barzal]

On 4/7/2017 at 4:25 PM, BCNate said:

Agreed.  He spent this year developing a strong 2 way game, next year will be focused on developing the offensive side of his game.  Virt, Boesser, Dahlen should bring a high level of skill to Utica next year.

Boeser should be playing in Utica, but knowing management they'll use his hot streak to end this year as a PR move to motivate season ticket holders to buy. Hopefully they'll realize soon enough that he should be in Utica if they actually care about this 'winning environment' motto they hold so dear. We are not going to be able to provide that for at least two years.

[JamesB]

1 hour ago, Hortankin said:

Why was his other thread closed? Did VC close it because he knows there's a trade happening? 

 

34 minutes ago, ajhockey said:

Got derailed again. I expect it will be re-opened relatively soon.

Yes, I was wondering what happened to the Virtanen prospect thread. I guess it does make sense to just have one thread instead of one "prospect" thread and one "player" thread. I would favour merging the threads. But I would have said that Jake is still a prospect.

[-AJ-]

14 minutes ago, JamesB said:

 

Yes, I was wondering what happened to the Virtanen prospect thread. I guess it does make sense to just have one thread instead of one "prospect" thread and one "player" thread. I would favour merging the threads. But I would have said that Jake is still a prospect.

'tis the problem that arises when a player goes from the NHL back to the AHL. It's why I'm generally slow to create new threads in the Player Discussion Forum to be sure that they're here to stay.

 

That said, I would've created one for Virtanen anyway given how much he did play in Vancouver.

[BananaMash]

On 4/5/2017 at 10:17 AM, c00kies said:

Some of his weight loss is countered by muscle gain though, so losing 20 pounds could= losing 40 pounds of fat and gaining 20 pounds of muscle (as just an example).

You would be hard pressed to gain 20 pounds of muscle in the time he's been in Utica even without cutting fat and playing hockey. It'll be all fat loss, and some muscle loss. In general you can't gain muscle and lose fat at the same time unless you're a relative beginner in fitness and weight training (and have a ton of fat to lose with very little muscle under it).

[SilentSam]

4 hours ago, Mathew Barzal said:

Boeser should be playing in Utica, but knowing management they'll use his hot streak to end this year as a PR move to motivate season ticket holders to buy. Hopefully they'll realize soon enough that he should be in Utica if they actually care about this 'winning environment' motto they hold so dear. We are not going to be able to provide that for at least two years.

Boeser is at an age where he will highly benefit from Summer training,.  He has just peeled out of the baby fat.

Prepare him for the 82 game season, and how to manage that, and Brock will be fine.. same as Jake, bring that new attitude.

Edited April 13, 2017 by SilentSam

[numb3r 16]

6 hours ago, Hortankin said:

Why was his other thread closed? Did VC close it because he knows there's a trade happening? 

its because the thread is basically a bunch of morons whining who also dont know when to shut the &^@# up.

[b3.]

This is the last warning for all the participants in this thread.

 

You're more than welcome to have a debate, but taking direct or indirect shots at other posters is not acceptable. 

 

There will be a zero tolerance from now on, if you can not fully abide by the board guidelines (http://forum.canucks.com/guidelines/), you will be suspended.

[Alflives]

6 hours ago, Hortankin said:

Why was his other thread closed? Did VC close it because he knows there's a trade happening? 

Are their rumours of a Jake trade?  Do tell:)

[Sean Monahan]

1 hour ago, b3. said:

This is the last warning for all the participants in this thread.

 

You're more than welcome to have a debate, but taking direct or indirect shots at other posters is not acceptable. 

 

There will be a zero tolerance from now on, if you can not fully abide by the board guidelines (http://forum.canucks.com/guidelines/), you will be suspended.

It's the US Election thread of the prospects subforum.

[Jiggs50]

1 hour ago, b3. said:

This is the last warning for all the participants in this thread.

 

You're more than welcome to have a debate, but taking direct or indirect shots at other posters is not acceptable. 

 

There will be a zero tolerance from now on, if you can not fully abide by the board guidelines (http://forum.canucks.com/guidelines/), you will be suspended.

Finally. Thank you. 

[canucklehead44]

14 hours ago, RetroCanuck said:

I wonder if the Canucks could/would loan Virtanen to a team in Europe? Might be really good for his development and maturity

I suggested they send him to the Finnish league last year, as it would enable him to play physical against men but in a lower league than the NHL (as he couldn't play in the AHL). The AHL is the best spot for him next season. 

[terrible.dee]

On 4/7/2017 at 4:25 PM, BCNate said:

Agreed.  He spent this year developing a strong 2 way game, next year will be focused on developing the offensive side of his game.  Virt, Boesser, Dahlen should bring a high level of skill to Utica next year.

 

What are you guys talking about?

 

You're acting like some big barrier was crossed or something accomplished

 

All I see are no results a lot of excuses and A LOT of hot air

 

There is no substance to support this "Strong 2-way game" he developed, you're just parroting soundbites you've heard in the media, he's the same player that was sent down last fall

 

And as for this prediction that he will slot in to the line up next year, do you really think they are going to keep a bottom 6 player they drafted 6th overall?

 

Why doesn't Benning just wear a dunce cap to games from now on?  He might as well if Jake is going to be plodding away in the bottom 6 which for a guy who couldn't crack 20 Pt.s in the AHL is about all you can expect, he is going to look like an idiot everytime Jake is on the ice.

 

Jake needed to start SCORING this year in Utica, he 100% failed to do that or show any sign of being an offensive talent in ANY level of pro hockey, 

 

Virtanen will be gone by the fall, hopefully with Tanev and a pick for Reinhart most likely for someone else's 1st round blunder, in the hopes that switching problems will help people  forget who's fault the problem was. Regaurdless, he needs to be dumped fast, because unless he were to start scoring right off the bat next year, his worth is about to take a major nosedive, there are still people who will gamble on him, and with his physical tools he probably can play on someones 4th line in the NHL, but there's still going to be hope on some GM's part that he might be more.

 

Are St. Louis sick of Yakopov yet? Because that's a deal that would make sense, Lazar would have made sense as well, but that ship has sailed

 

 

[Canuck Surfer]

32 minutes ago, terrible.dee said:

What are you guys talking about?

 

You're acting like some big barrier was crossed or something accomplished

 

All I see are no results a lot of excuses and A LOT of hot air

 

There is no substance to support this "Strong 2-way game" he developed, you're just parroting soundbites you've heard in the media, he's the same player that was sent down last fall

 

And as for this prediction that he will slot in to the line up next year, do you really think they are going to keep a bottom 6 player they drafted 6th overall?

 

Why doesn't Benning just wear a dunce cap to games from now on?  He might as well if Jake is going to be plodding away in the bottom 6 which for a guy who couldn't crack 20 Pt.s in the AHL is about all you can expect, he is going to look like an idiot everytime Jake is on the ice.

 

Jake needed to start SCORING this year in Utica, he 100% failed to do that or show any sign of being an offensive talent in ANY level of pro hockey, 

 

Virtanen will be gone by the fall, hopefully with Tanev and a pick for Reinhart most likely for someone else's 1st round blunder, in the hopes that switching problems will help people  forget who's fault the problem was. Regaurdless, he needs to be dumped fast, because unless he were to start scoring right off the bat next year, his worth is about to take a major nosedive, there are still people who will gamble on him, and with his physical tools he probably can play on someones 4th line in the NHL, but there's still going to be hope on some GM's part that he might be more.

 

Are St. Louis sick of Yakopov yet? Because that's a deal that would make sense, Lazar would have made sense as well, but that ship has sailed

 

 

7

Boy, you're lots of fun at a party? 

 

Yes, yes, yes, guys have proven a better pick than Jake.  It is still too early to write him off. Or proving your conviction by creating a Raymond, Ballard and a first proposal to solve all...

[gameburn2]

On ‎3‎/‎28‎/‎2017 at 2:32 AM, LM11 said:

I don't know if people remember when Todd Bertuzzi was 23 years old.  They used to say that Bert was lazy and wasn't trying hard even though he had the toughness and skill to be a top power forward in the NHL.  We traded for him and he found the right linemate and he suddenly was hard working and trying hard on every shift.  What i'm trying to say is that Jake will not show us what he will turn out to be until he is 24-26.  He plays a type of game that needs maturing.  It requires hard skating for a big kid like him, which needs lots of effort and commitment to training.  That's where his youth is still behind in.  He isn't a mature old soul like Bo and Brock, but a lot of kids at that age aren't.  Bo and Brock are the exception.  With the right coaching and right amount of tough love, Jake will perfect his training and off ice programming and that will translate to his on ice game. 

 

I have no doubt Jake will be fine.  He isn't going to be a 80 point high skilled player, but I know that when this team is gonna have future big game battles in playoffs, we're gonna be so glad to have Jake as one of the main keys to our abilities to win those playoff games.  He is going to be a very impactful player.  It doesn't have to be high scoring numbers, but it's a combo of hard hitting, closing down the opposition defense and pushing the defense back with his high speed in the neutral zone.  Include those things with good share of points and he will be one of the main reasons we will win majority of our games.

Hutton, Stecher, Boeser: all came in mature and ready to go, made the team without much if any time in Utica.  What do they have that Jake doesn't have?: they are older than Jake was last September-October (when he failed, partly due to poor preparation.)   Tryamkin had major seasoning in the KHL. 

 

That year or two is significant.   We are seeing that with Griffin Molino too.  I'm not sure any of these guys are going to be as impactful as Jake will be -- with the exception of Boeser -- who has it easier as a sniper and pp guy.  Jake is expected to have something akin to Boeser's scoring touch AND hit like a truck.  This is asking a lot, probably too much in fact.  I hope Utica has taught him to concentrate on the defensive side of the game and on goal scoring/play-making.  The hitting doesn't require teaching, at least not in the same way.  Jake seems to use the rush to score a lot of his goals.  That's not enough, he has to learn more about the forecheck and cycle parts of the game too.  He has made some nice passes with the Canucks (presumably he has done this in Utica too) and will probably develop this further.  I worry about his judgment and discipline, but again: a lot of men don't mature til their mid-20s.  As long as he is impactful for 6 or 7 good years, this will be all we can ask for.  From 24 to 31 years of age: not bad. But I think he makes the team next Fall, and puts up 30 to 35 points. So maybe 8 impactful years.  A new coach won't hurt his chances either.

[N4ZZY]

57 minutes ago, terrible.dee said:

What are you guys talking about?

 

You're acting like some big barrier was crossed or something accomplished

 

All I see are no results a lot of excuses and A LOT of hot air

 

There is no substance to support this "Strong 2-way game" he developed, you're just parroting soundbites you've heard in the media, he's the same player that was sent down last fall

 

And as for this prediction that he will slot in to the line up next year, do you really think they are going to keep a bottom 6 player they drafted 6th overall?

 

Why doesn't Benning just wear a dunce cap to games from now on?  He might as well if Jake is going to be plodding away in the bottom 6 which for a guy who couldn't crack 20 Pt.s in the AHL is about all you can expect, he is going to look like an idiot everytime Jake is on the ice.

 

Jake needed to start SCORING this year in Utica, he 100% failed to do that or show any sign of being an offensive talent in ANY level of pro hockey, 

 

Virtanen will be gone by the fall, hopefully with Tanev and a pick for Reinhart most likely for someone else's 1st round blunder, in the hopes that switching problems will help people  forget who's fault the problem was. Regaurdless, he needs to be dumped fast, because unless he were to start scoring right off the bat next year, his worth is about to take a major nosedive, there are still people who will gamble on him, and with his physical tools he probably can play on someones 4th line in the NHL, but there's still going to be hope on some GM's part that he might be more.

 

Are St. Louis sick of Yakopov yet? Because that's a deal that would make sense, Lazar would have made sense as well, but that ship has sailed

 

 

are you serious? 

jake isn't the same player that was sent down at the beginning of the year. he's made strides. 

it really is frustrating to call jake a bust when he's only 20 years old. is he elite? not in all aspects of his game, but that's why it's called development. he will become the best player he can be with some coaching down in Utica. 

he's not a Stamkos, or even a Nylander (and yes, I know we had the opportunity to draft him, we didn't, let's move on from that, pls). 

I'm happy with Jake's progress from the start of the year to now. jake has never been bad defensively, and he's learning to think the pro game better, that's development. that's growth, and the kid, well, in all areas needs to grow up, and understand what it means to be a pro. from all accounts, he seems to be turning a corner. 

as a canucks fan, i'm going to support this kid until he proves he's a bust. he hasn't done that quite yet. 

 

[N4ZZY]

9 minutes ago, gameburn2 said:

Hutton, Stecher, Boeser: all came in mature and ready to go, made the team without much if any time in Utica.  What do they have that Jake doesn't have?: they are older than Jake was last September-October (when he failed, partly due to poor preparation.)   Tryamkin had major seasoning in the KHL. 

 

That year or two is significant.   We are seeing that with Griffin Molino too.  I'm not sure any of these guys are going to be as impactful as Jake will be -- with the exception of Boeser -- who has it easier as a sniper and pp guy.  Jake is expected to have something akin to Boeser's scoring touch AND hit like a truck.  This is asking a lot, probably too much in fact.  I hope Utica has taught him to concentrate on the defensive side of the game and on goal scoring/play-making.  The hitting doesn't require teaching, at least not in the same way.  Jake seems to use the rush to score a lot of his goals.  That's not enough, he has to learn more about the forecheck and cycle parts of the game too.  He has made some nice passes with the Canucks (presumably he has done this in Utica too) and will probably develop this further.  I worry about his judgment and discipline, but again: a lot of men don't mature til their mid-20s.  As long as he is impactful for 6 or 7 good years, this will be all we can ask for.  From 24 to 31 years of age: not bad. But I think he makes the team next Fall, and puts up 30 to 35 points. So maybe 8 impactful years.  A new coach won't hurt his chances either.

i think that's important that Willie is no longer the coach. didn't seem like Jake would have thrived under Desjardins, because of the relationship before. 

The assumption is that Green is the next head coach, and if that's true, I can see Green giving Jake a fair shake to prove himself. Might even be good for Jake to have a coach who he knows cares for him as a player and person. Could help his game too knowing the coach has confidence in you. 

 

[gameburn2]

On ‎4‎/‎2‎/‎2017 at 1:10 AM, khay said:

Wow. JV's skating ability, that ability to drive the play forward in a rush is already at the NHL level.  Drive the play, get the puck to the playmaker, get the puck back, shoot. 

 

I think Baertschi and Virtanen or Granlund and Virtanen will be a good duo once JV is ready to join the team full time.

 

 

 

And put him on the left wing.  A lot of his goals seem to come from that side, as do some of his best passes.  I think he has the ability to get the space you need to play on the off wing.

[N4ZZY]

12 minutes ago, gameburn2 said:

And put him on the left wing.  A lot of his goals seem to come from that side, as do some of his best passes.  I think he has the ability to get the space you need to play on the off wing.

interesting that he seems to play better in his off-wing, rather than his natural wing. 

 

[gameburn2]

15 minutes ago, N4ZZY said:

i think that's important that Willie is no longer the coach. didn't seem like Jake would have thrived under Desjardins, because of the relationship before. 

The assumption is that Green is the next head coach, and if that's true, I can see Green giving Jake a fair shake to prove himself. Might even be good for Jake to have a coach who he knows cares for him as a player and person. Could help his game too knowing the coach has confidence in you. 

 

Wouldn't be the first time a coach has been good for the players he knew from earlier teams.  Virtanen was expected to give the team something it didn't have last year (or the year before that): a physical forecheck. And some swagger.  That's asking too little of a player, they should have asked for more: put him on the pp, put him in important minutes.  Talked to him about patience, maybe gave him some assignments as a defensive specialist.  Maybe he needed Utica, but maybe not.  A different coach might have got it to work out for V without the need for Utica. 

 

It's frustrating for a fan, because you can see plugs like Megna and to some extent Skille and Chaput playing in the NHL, getting practically no points, and you wonder why someone like V. isn't in the lineup.  But development is a process that fans -- including myself -- have little sure knowledge of.  Could V. learn while in the NHL?  Or is he better to have uninterrupted opportunity in Utica, a full year or even more?