hammertime Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 13 minutes ago, Alflives said: The longer JB waits to trade one of Tanev/Edler/Sbisa the lower the return. Does JB have a plan other than losing Sbisa to expansion? As I stated earlier in this thread there will be a ton of #4 d with better track records and better contracts than Sbisa available I highly doubt Vegas takes Sbisa if Granlund is available. Though I am very much in agreement Tanevs value is only going to drop as injuries pile up I think the best move is to sell high on him. Gumby is getting brittle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coryberg Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 10 minutes ago, Alflives said: The longer JB waits to trade one of Tanev/Edler/Sbisa the lower the return. Does JB have a plan other than losing Sbisa to expansion? Actually closer to the trade deadline it gets easier to make a big deal. Teams have more cap space, they are bidding against each other and they become desperate as other contenders load up (ie Erat for forsberg). Waiting for the market to peak increases the return. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldnews Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 1 hour ago, SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME said: Nearly 600 5v5 minutes played this season and Sbisa is in the top-30 NHL defensemen in GF%RelTM, top-60 in points/60, and just slightly outside the top-60 in GF%. And going back since last season, Sbisa has played 1200+ 5v5 minutes and ranks top-60 among NHL defensemen in GF% and top-10 in GF%RelTM (minimum 1000 minutes sample). The samples are large enough at this point to say that the version of Sbisa we've seen since 2015-16 is one who demonstrably aids his team when he's playing. Simply put, the Canucks are winning the game, by a significant margin, when Sbisa is on the ice. His on-ice goals effect has actually been at a "first pairing" rate for more than 1000 minutes played over two consecutive NHL seasons. Eye test wise, I think he's really cleaned up his mistakes and now plays quite a steady game most nights. But how good he's been isn't necessarily obvious until you start looking at the numbers (which are nothing short of "great" IMO). but, but "delta-corsiz" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhillipBlunt Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 8 minutes ago, coryberg said: Actually closer to the trade deadline it gets easier to make a big deal. Teams have more cap space, they are bidding against each other and they become desperate as other contenders load up (ie Erat for forsberg). Waiting for the market to peak increases the return. Get out of here with that common sense! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhillipBlunt Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 3 minutes ago, oldnews said: but, but "delta-corsiz" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldnews Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 27 minutes ago, hammertime said: As I stated earlier in this thread there will be a ton of #4 d with better track records and better contracts than Sbisa available I highly doubt Vegas takes Sbisa if Granlund is available. Though I am very much in agreement Tanevs value is only going to drop as injuries pile up I think the best move is to sell high on him. Gumby is getting brittle. First of all, nice story about Tanev. Second, I'd be interested to hear you name a couple "top 4 with a better contracts" than Sbisa that will be available - no need to name "a ton", just one or two would do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhillipBlunt Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 2 minutes ago, oldnews said: First of all, nice story about Tanev. Second, I'd be interested to hear you name a couple "top 4 with a better contracts" than Sbisa that will be available - no need to name "a ton", just one or two would do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammertime Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 23 minutes ago, oldnews said: First of all, nice story about Tanev. Second, I'd be interested to hear you name a couple "top 4 with a better contracts" than Sbisa that will be available - no need to name "a ton", just one or two would do. Trouba, Fowler/Stoner, Dumba, Hickey, Forbort Chi can't protect everyone either so there will likely be a gem there too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iceman64 Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 It took us this long to have "decent" but not elite "depth" at D position... why on earth trade anyone at D at all, it's the forward position that can be suspect if we get injuries and that will be addressed next season with some more cap space available so even as we might lose a bottom D at worst if our top D is protected but we also lose the salary as well and can sign someone else so what's the big deal? Plus there's 29 other teams that Vegas will be going over for D as well so with roughly 270 other D they can choose from, i hardly think we need to be concerned anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldnews Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 3 minutes ago, hammertime said: Trouba, Fowler/Stoner, Dumba, Hickey, Forbort Chi can't protect everyone either so there will likely be a gem there too. I think you're getting carried away tbh. Why would Minnesotat move Dumba at the trade deadline for example? I think you're trying too hard there. Likewise with Trouba - he's retracted his trade demand, and I highly doubt you'll find Winnipeg selling him in a buyer's market. Most of the guys you've named there are younger - not deadline rentals - and on top of that, the assumption that contenders like Chicago, Anaheim, Minnesota, LA will be sellers at the deadline is a stretch to say the least, let alone selling young defensemen. People get carried away with "asset management" assumpitons and forget that the goal is the Cup, not dwelling on a single expansion asset loss. Of that list, Hickey may be one comparable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hlinkas wrister Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 Probably covered elsewhere but relative to the topic- If Vegas takes Miller doesn't that still count as a Canuck player even though he's a FA? The way he's played the last 2 years they would be foolish not to take him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coryberg Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 11 minutes ago, hammertime said: Trouba, Fowler/Stoner, Dumba, Hickey, Forbort Chi can't protect everyone either so there will likely be a gem there too. No way trouba, dumba or fowler will be left exposed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coryberg Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 3 minutes ago, hlinkas wrister said: Probably covered elsewhere but relative to the topic- If Vegas takes Miller doesn't that still count as a Canuck player even though he's a FA? The way he's played the last 2 years they would be foolish not to take him. Miller being UFA would have to sign with Las Vegas during the 3 day window before the draft. If he did that would count as their selection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 1 hour ago, S'all Good Man said: I like Landeskog... it sounds like COL is willing to move him but I think Benning wouldn't do that 1 for 1 and would also want a pick. But man would Tanev ever solidify that crap D. GL would give our top 6 some nifty options and might be the piece that moves the Sedins to the 2nd line next year. GL-Bo-Loui? GL-Bo-Boeser? GL-Bo-Jake? Lots of things to try out. I don't buy that any top young players out of Col are in play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 18 minutes ago, hammertime said: Trouba, Fowler/Stoner, Dumba, Hickey, Forbort Chi can't protect everyone either so there will likely be a gem there too. Vegas will take Sbisa if he's exposed. They do need to reach the Cap floor, so he's perfect for them: he can play, and he gets paid a decent Cap hit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 1 minute ago, stawns said: I don't buy that any top young players out of Col are in play. They need to shore up their leaking defensive game. To get a top shut down guy like Tanev, who makes whomever he plays with better, will cost them one of their young (so called) elite forwards. I think they would love a guy like Sutter too, but they can't have him unless McKinnon is coming back this way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hlinkas wrister Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 3 minutes ago, coryberg said: Miller being UFA would have to sign with Las Vegas during the 3 day window before the draft. If he did that would count as their selection. He's been brilliant but would solve this problem for the Canucks and he could be closer to his wife. Win-win imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CeeBee51 Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 What other goalies would be available? Fleury/Murray from the pens unless they make a trade but who else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldnews Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 6 minutes ago, stawns said: I don't buy that any top young players out of Col are in play. Yeah, me either. Sakic is no idiot. He knows that moving key cornerstone pieces isn't necessarily the answer. And doing so when there's blood in the water and a tight sellers market doesn't make sense either. He's only going to make a move if it's a hockey trade of value for value - and dealing forwards for defensemen has been a negative sum market recently. Their roster is better than their record - it's somewhat puzzling how they could be so bad - but that's the ebb and flow of the NHL - most teams go through it. I think he likely just waits it out - maybe listens - maybe dumps a few underperforming supporting cast - but I doubt he's particularly motivated to start selling the types of pieces people are speculating about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
riffraff Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 3 minutes ago, oldnews said: Yeah, me either. Sakic is no idiot. He knows that moving key cornerstone pieces isn't necessarily the answer. And doing so when there's blood in the water and a tight sellers market doesn't make sense either. He's only going to make a move if it's a hockey trade of value for value - and dealing forwards for defensemen has been a negative sum market recently. Their roster is better than their record - it's somewhat puzzling how they could be so bad - but that's the ebb and flow of the NHL - most teams go through it. I think he likely just waits it out - maybe listens - maybe dumps a few underperforming supporting cast - but I doubt he's particularly motivated to start selling the types of pieces people are speculating about. hockey mind Colby Armstrong said last night that its in their best interest to wait it out. i agree. their D does need some improvement though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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