“New World Order”

[Gurn]

15 minutes ago, erkayloomeh said:

. I never spanked my kid.

 

 

Proverbs 23:13

Do not hold back discipline from the child,
Although you strike him with the rod, he will not die.

 

Proverbs 23:14

You shall strike him with the rod
And rescue his soul from Sheol.

 

Proverbs 29:15

The rod and reproof give wisdom,
But a child who gets his own way brings shame to his mother.

 

Proverbs 22:15

Foolishness is bound up in the heart of a child;
The rod of discipline will remove it far from him.

 

Proverb 13:24

He who withholds his rod hates his son,
But he who loves him disciplines him diligently.

 

Proverbs 20:30

Stripes that wound scour away evil,
And strokes reach the innermost parts.

 

Since I  believe the Bible is a work of fiction, I don't have to worry about disobeying my God's instructions on child rearing.

 

 

 

 

 

[King Heffy]

42 minutes ago, erkayloomeh said:

I've spent alot of my years going to church. I would not say I was raised in a Christian home but a religious one. Big difference. 

I go by the same book my parents did but have a very different faith and a very different take on things that they did .  I raised my kid in a completely different way than they raised us. 

Jesus said, " beware the traditions of men" and they did not adhere to that

What I have observed is that alot of Christians bend the word to there own will instead of the other way around.   

Take the wives submitting to your husband thing.....taken way out of context. 

And prosperity (TV preachers)   using that for there own gain instead of helping other. 

Spare the rod spoil the child means beat the $&!# out of your kid. My parents were harsh. You do something wrong you don't sit for a week. We were a screwed up family. I never spanked my kid. She's a happy successful adult. Figure it out@!!!

And when your doing things like that "in the name of God" as you say, then it isn't a wonder when people don't believe in him or hate religion. 

I hate religion but believe in and love God. 

As an atheist, I can get on board with this.  You used your faith to help make yourself a better person and be a good father.  That's the important thing here.  Actions trump beliefs every time.

[Ilunga]

54 minutes ago, erkayloomeh said:

I've spent alot of my years going to church. I would not say I was raised in a Christian home but a religious one. Big difference. 

I go by the same book my parents did but have a very different faith and a very different take on things that they did .  I raised my kid in a completely different way than they raised us. 

Jesus said, " beware the traditions of men" and they did not adhere to that

What I have observed is that alot of Christians bend the word to there own will instead of the other way around.   

Take the wives submitting to your husband thing.....taken way out of context. 

And prosperity (TV preachers)   using that for there own gain instead of helping other. 

Spare the rod spoil the child means beat the $&!# out of your kid. My parents were harsh. You do something wrong you don't sit for a week. We were a screwed up family. I never spanked my kid. She's a happy successful adult. Figure it out@!!!

And when your doing things like that "in the name of God" as you say, then it isn't a wonder when people don't believe in him or hate religion. 

I hate religion but believe in and love God. 

You shouldn't hate anything apart from injustice mate.

And that is in a philosophical context.

 

Hate is such a pointless emotion that just damages the person feeling it.

[erkayloomeh]

26 minutes ago, gurn said:

 

 

Proverbs 23:13

Do not hold back discipline from the child,
Although you strike him with the rod, he will not die.

 

Proverbs 23:14

You shall strike him with the rod
And rescue his soul from Sheol.

 

Proverbs 29:15

The rod and reproof give wisdom,
But a child who gets his own way brings shame to his mother.

 

Proverbs 22:15

Foolishness is bound up in the heart of a child;
The rod of discipline will remove it far from him.

 

Proverb 13:24

He who withholds his rod hates his son,
But he who loves him disciplines him diligently.

 

Proverbs 20:30

Stripes that wound scour away evil,
And strokes reach the innermost parts.

 

Since I  believe the Bible is a work of fiction, I don't have to worry about disobeying my God's instructions on child rearing.

 

 

 

 

 

Hmmmm    you make some good points   

Funny thing is, I loved my kid, spent alot of time with, read her stories and said the bedtime prayers. I never spanked her because it wasn't necessary, whereas I got spanked alot when it wasn't warranted....imo. 

Big difference between discipline and abuse. 

[erkayloomeh]

20 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

As an atheist, I can get on board with this.  You used your faith to help make yourself a better person and be a good father.  That's the important thing here.  Actions trump beliefs every time.

Action don't Trump beliefs, they should line up with your beliefs. It's when your actions don't line up with your beliefs your living a lie. 

[King Heffy]

1 minute ago, erkayloomeh said:

Action don't Trump beliefs, they should line up with your beliefs. It's when your actions don't line up with your beliefs your living a lie. 

I'll take the atheist who's volunteering to help sick kids over the "Christian" who's abusing their kids because they took the Bible too literally. 

[drummer4now]

1 hour ago, gurn said:

 

 

Proverbs 23:13

Do not hold back discipline from the child,
Although you strike him with the rod, he will not die.

 

Proverbs 23:14

You shall strike him with the rod
And rescue his soul from Sheol.

 

Proverbs 29:15

The rod and reproof give wisdom,
But a child who gets his own way brings shame to his mother.

 

Proverbs 22:15

Foolishness is bound up in the heart of a child;
The rod of discipline will remove it far from him.

 

Proverb 13:24

He who withholds his rod hates his son,
But he who loves him disciplines him diligently.

 

Proverbs 20:30

Stripes that wound scour away evil,
And strokes reach the innermost parts.

 

Since I  believe the Bible is a work of fiction, I don't have to worry about disobeying my God's instructions on child rearing.

 

 

 

 

 

You have taken all of those verses completely out of context..

 

They are in regards to what a person can do to prevent their loved one from going to hell. 

 Now obviously this type of teaching would not work in modern times nor would it be allowed. 

 

Where is your proof that it is a work of fiction? Neil Degresse Tyson lol.

 

IF the Bible is a work of fiction then why is it used in courts and various governmental institutions? 

Surely the government would not put a Harry Potter book in court 

 

Wasn't the military founded on biblical principles..? 

 

I am starting to question all of your reasons for this type of thinking. 

Edited September 15, 2021 by drummer4now

[UnkNuk]

2 hours ago, Ilunga said:

 

I don't pretend to understand physics beyond a basic level however there are some physicists whose work I admire.

I simply admire the fact they are endeavouring to come up with answers to questions that ATM we do not have answers for.

 

https://www.space.com/amp/what-came-before-big-bang.html

 

 

From the article:

 

But to fully test this model, we'll have to wait for a new generation of cosmology experiments...

 

Or we could just wait until it happens again.

[King Heffy]

54 minutes ago, drummer4now said:

You have taken all of those verses completely out of context..

 

They are in regards to what a person can do to prevent their loved one from going to hell. 

 Now obviously this type of teaching would not work in modern times nor would it be allowed. 

So we all agree that the group of people taking the Bible too literally is a problem.  Good.

[Ilunga]

49 minutes ago, drummer4now said:

You have taken all of those verses completely out of context..

 

They are in regards to what a person can do to prevent their loved one from going to hell. 

 Now obviously this type of teaching would not work in modern times nor would it be allowed. 

 

Where is your proof that it is a work of fiction? Neil Degresse Tyson lol.

 

IF the Bible is a work of fiction then why is it used in courts and various governmental institutions? 

Surely the government would not put a Harry Potter book in court 

 

Wasn't the military founded on biblical principles..? 

 

I am starting to question all of your reasons for this type of thinking. 

 

More to the point where is your proof that the Bible isn't a work of fiction ?

 

The Bible is used in court out if social inertia.

You are offered 2 forms of "swearing" the evidence you provide is the truth in the Australian court system,an oath and an affirmation. 

 

The military founded on the Bible ?

 

More reason to despise it.

People were killing each other long before the Bible came along,this just increased the reasons for killing and the amount of killing that has been done.

[erkayloomeh]

9 hours ago, King Heffy said:

I'll take the atheist who's volunteering to help sick kids over the "Christian" who's abusing their kids because they took the Bible too literally. 

They didn't take it to literally.  They took it out of context. 

[JM_]

13 hours ago, erkayloomeh said:

I would ask this enthographer what the purpose of the ceremonies was in the first place. That's what lead to them seeing the spirits in the first place.  To the best of my knowledge those people had no bibles or formal "christian teaching".  Who am I to say that these ceremonies weren't there way of seeking God. 

The bible says we all have a built in knowledge of him .  It's why I struggle with atheism.  When you see people like these you mentioned doing ceremonies and having a spiritual experience seems to enforce that. 

 

Also, if more than one of them saw the same thing then that would seem to indicate they actually saw something?

As I recall, it was around naming children which was a very big deal, it was believed that the name given you had you share the soul of the person who had it before, which is a neat idea. So it wouldn't be surprising at all for multiple people to see "uncle Steve" or whoever's name was being transferred. There are many examples of groups of people having the same or similar visions at the same time, not sure that proves anything other than its a basic human capacity. 

 

[JM_]

12 hours ago, erkayloomeh said:

Action don't Trump beliefs, they should line up with your beliefs. It's when your actions don't line up with your beliefs your living a lie. 

So how does this allow for room for change? do you believe 100% of what you believed 10 or 20 years ago? 

[JM_]

12 hours ago, drummer4now said:

You have taken all of those verses completely out of context..

 

They are in regards to what a person can do to prevent their loved one from going to hell. 

 Now obviously this type of teaching would not work in modern times nor would it be allowed. 

 

says you. I think it says something else. And we're both right. 

[erkayloomeh]

2 minutes ago, JM_ said:

So how does this allow for room for change? do you believe 100% of what you believed 10 or 20 years ago? 

I don't understand what your saying. Wouldn't your actions change as your beliefs evolve. 

[JM_]

1 minute ago, erkayloomeh said:

I don't understand what your saying. Wouldn't your actions change as your beliefs evolve. 

but wouldn't your older self be a "lie" to your younger one? say e.g., you were very hard core against LGBTQ rights in your early 20's. But as you aged you realized the bible didn't really call for that, and you've expanded your thinking to not be as rigid. 

 

You're still claiming to follow the bible, but you're doing different things. 

 

Now think about making laws in Canada. Which one of you should we listen to? 

[erkayloomeh]

20 minutes ago, JM_ said:

but wouldn't your older self be a "lie" to your younger one? say e.g., you were very hard core against LGBTQ rights in your early 20's. But as you aged you realized the bible didn't really call for that, and you've expanded your thinking to not be as rigid. 

 

You're still claiming to follow the bible, but you're doing different things. 

 

Now think about making laws in Canada. Which one of you should we listen to? 

Alot of what a person believes comes from what they are taught. And sometimes that stuff is wrong. Especially when your younger and under the influence of your parents.

So for me I started questioning alot of stuff in my early 20s. From that point my beliefs have changed alot and so therefore so have my attitudes.  So I believed in the bible then, and I believe in the bible now. 

If you know the bible at all you will know you cant sit down and read it and just understand it all.  

Billy Graham for example died at 99 and read the Bible for over 70 years.  

It's written that way and the complexities reinforce it's validity for me whereas making it bunk for others. 

 

 

 

Edited September 15, 2021 by erkayloomeh

[JM_]

9 minutes ago, erkayloomeh said:

Alot of what a person believes comes from what they are taught. And sometimes that stuff is wrong. Especially when your younger and under the influence of your parents.

So for me I started questioning alot of stuff in my early 20s. From that point my beliefs have changed alot and so therefore so have my attitudes.  So I believed in the bible then, and I believe in the bible now. 

If you know the bible at all you will know you can sit down and read it and just understand it all.  

Billy Graham for example died at 99 and read the Bible for over 70 years.  

It's written that way and the complexities reinforce it's validity for me whereas making it bunk for others. 

 

 

 

exactly, and thats why we can't base our laws on it. Thats really the only issue I have with it, when people try to use it for that. 

 

So when people claim a religious exemption to a vaccine, and still demand to be able to go to work or school, it gets under my skin. 

 

Or this "new world order" conspiracy stuff that seems to have a link for some people to their religious beliefs. Its just impossible to take seriously. 

 

Edited September 15, 2021 by JM_

[erkayloomeh]

1 minute ago, JM_ said:

exactly, and thats why we can't base our laws on it. Thats really the only issue I have with it, when people try to use it for that. 

 

So when people claim a religious expedition to a vaccine, and still demand to be able to go to work or school, it gets under my skin. 

 

Or this "new world order" conspiracy stuff that seems to have a link for some people to their religious beliefs. Its just impossible to take seriously. 

 

So in the mind of a person who wants a religious exemption why do you suppose they are making a religious connection to the vaccine being bad. ? 

[JM_]

Just now, erkayloomeh said:

So in the mind of a person who wants a religious exemption why do you suppose they are making a religious connection to the vaccine being bad. ? 

honestly, I'm not sure. I don't know how people make the leap to science being "bad" based on something like the bible, thats never computed for me. 

 

I guess if they can prove a direct link to something like abortion then, OK I get that. But then you need to live the consequences of your personal choice and not expose other people to a virus when its only your personal ideology in the way of that. 

 

But others seem to just do the "Jesus will heal me" thing and don't seek medical attention at all for themselves or their kids. Thats just nuts.