[Signing] Canucks re-sign J.T. Miller

[spook007]

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Edited September 9, 2022 by spook007

[Timråfan]

3 hours ago, IBatch said:

I saw some games where Horvat also stopped LE from getting points.   Or was that Willie!  Or Green.   I'm not sure. 

 

One reason both Miller and Petey produced later is that they were on separate lines. 
LE only played so Horvat could play a bit more relaxed… Green is tha mayor reason for almost everything 

 

3 hours ago, IBatch said:

As ive said in the posts you responded too, EP for sure is our most skilled forward.   And that what's he's achieved already is nothing like what Miller did at the same age.   My only issue with EP is actually his contract.   RFAs are supposed to be when the teams cap overall is at its strongest.    Any UFA that's scoring a point per every 100k is worth their weight in gold.    Look at what Miller has just done, and that's with some UFA years bought.   At close to 8 million, EP is getting paid to actually get at least 77-79 points per year.   Can he do it?   For sure he can.   But he wasn't the engine driving the machine last year, and like ive said the Lotto line was awful, and Miller (Horvat too) are still both insulating EP a lot.    I have serious doubts that if we traded Miller, EP would be ready to take the reigns and become the first line center we all want him to be.   

 

Petey is already there except the draws.

 

Did someone compare what quality our players faced? 

 

3 hours ago, IBatch said:

For sure he's going to get there, the same way Hank did.   Those guys also started their careers in the dead puck era, and couldn't do much until after the lockout.   That's when they got a big bump in points.    EP back then - if we want to talk about "old school" would likely not play more then 50-60 games a year.   But at least he'd have had a team that wouldn't put up with much abuse to a future star player.  

 

EP is one of the most skilled guys ive seen play.   He's not Bure or Mogilny level ... but he's his one man and could be better then say Nedved.    Or Gradin. Or whomever.    We all got excited his rookie year.   And i'm still excited, this kid has barely got his feet wet still.    23?  That's around where most players break out (22-24).     Hope he does for our sake.    Also expect he will at least make the par line in points, around 80.  

 

Goals for sure should be weighted higher then assists.   Even primary ones.   EP is going to be a consistent 30-40 goal center for us.   That's pretty darn good.   Maybe even have a 50 goal season in him at some point which would be great for us.    

 

I watched most of the games last year - EP was simply lost before the coaching change.   Was actually outright bad several games.     The guys i noticed the most upfront were Garland and Miller - Garland especially before the coaching change.   After?    It was a totally different ball of wax.   Brock looked more like North division bubble Brock (that season he was our best player),  EP was put on the third line and seemed to gain his confidence back,  and Miller just went next level.   27 points over 13 games or something at one point ... and he scored at a 120 point pace the second half.   

 

Get your a Swede and that these guys mean more to you which i truly enjoy Timra!    Also love that for a time anyways, only you and me seemed to have a correct understanding of how we locked on to him as a draft pick - people took JB comments about giving Delorme the credit as gospel which simply wasn't at all true other then he came to see him because he was asked too.   The grass root story was very different.  

 

EP could become a better player for us then the Sedins.    That's yet to be determined, and a pretty high bar level as well.    Bure and Mogilny ... those guys were next level.    I wonder what they'd have done with no redline and obstruction.   Going to guess make McDavid look rather ordinary.  

 

 

Edit:  One thing i will say that EP does equally or maybe even better then Bure is using his linemates.   And he doesn't cheat when it comes to the other side of the puck.   

Good post, thumbs up 

[Honky Cat]

4 hours ago, IBatch said:

I saw some games where Horvat also stopped LE from getting points.   Or was that Willie!  Or Green.   I'm not sure. 

 

As ive said in the posts you responded too, EP for sure is our most skilled forward.   And that what's he's achieved already is nothing like what Miller did at the same age.   My only issue with EP is actually his contract.   RFAs are supposed to be when the teams cap overall is at its strongest.    Any UFA that's scoring a point per every 100k is worth their weight in gold.    Look at what Miller has just done, and that's with some UFA years bought.   At close to 8 million, EP is getting paid to actually get at least 77-79 points per year.   Can he do it?   For sure he can.   But he wasn't the engine driving the machine last year, and like ive said the Lotto line was awful, and Miller (Horvat too) are still both insulating EP a lot.    I have serious doubts that if we traded Miller, EP would be ready to take the reigns and become the first line center we all want him to be.   

 

For sure he's going to get there, the same way Hank did.   Those guys also started their careers in the dead puck era, and couldn't do much until after the lockout.   That's when they got a big bump in points.    EP back then - if we want to talk about "old school" would likely not play more then 50-60 games a year.   But at least he'd have had a team that wouldn't put up with much abuse to a future star player.  

 

EP is one of the most skilled guys ive seen play.   He's not Bure or Mogilny level ... but he's his one man and could be better then say Nedved.    Or Gradin. Or whomever.    We all got excited his rookie year.   And i'm still excited, this kid has barely got his feet wet still.    23?  That's around where most players break out (22-24).     Hope he does for our sake.    Also expect he will at least make the par line in points, around 80.  

 

Goals for sure should be weighted higher then assists.   Even primary ones.   EP is going to be a consistent 30-40 goal center for us.   That's pretty darn good.   Maybe even have a 50 goal season in him at some point which would be great for us.    

 

EP.   Was actually outright bad several games.     The guys i noticed the most upfront were Garland and Miller - Garland especially before the coaching change.   After?    It was a totally different ball of wax.   Brock looked more like North division bubble Brock (that season he was our best player),  EP was put on the third line and seemed to gain his confidence back,  and Miller just went next level.   27 points over 13 games or something at one point ... and he scored at a 120 point pace the second half.   

 

Get your a Swede and that these guys mean more to you which i truly enjoy Timra!    Also love that for a time anyways, only you and me seemed to have a correct understanding of how we locked on to him as a draft pick - people took JB comments about giving Delorme the credit as gospel which simply wasn't at all true other then he came to see him because he was asked too.   The grass root story was very different.  

 

EP could become a better player for us then the Sedins.    That's yet to be determined, and a pretty high bar level as well.    Bure and Mogilny ... those guys were next level.    I wonder what they'd have done with no redline and obstruction.   Going to guess make McDavid look rather ordinary.  

 

 

Edit:  One thing i will say that EP does equally or maybe even better then Bure is using his linemates.   And he doesn't cheat when it comes to the other side of the puck.   

EP looked lost when Boudreau took over as well. It wasnt until the last quarter of the season that he started to resemble the 'alien' that we saw in the 2019-20 season.

 

He has had two consecutive terrible season starts, followed by the entire team swirling round the toilet bowl.

 

Defining season for him IMO.

[Jester13]

1 hour ago, spook007 said:

Don't think two 5'8" players and a pick will be enough for a top pair RHD...

I think it's important for me to clarify that I was originally responding to aGENT's comment that it would take a combination of Garland or Boeser plus Hoglander or Rathbone plus a pick or prospect to land what we need and that if that's the cost then sign me up. I think it's possible that a team makes a stupid trade to help us out, but I don't think it's likely, so I tend to agree with you and others who have said the same :D

[spook007]

25 minutes ago, Jester13 said:

I think it's important for me to clarify that I was originally responding to aGENT's comment that it would take a combination of Garland or Boeser plus Hoglander or Rathbone plus a pick or prospect to land what we need and that if that's the cost then sign me up. I think it's possible that a team makes a stupid trade to help us out, but I don't think it's likely, so I tend to agree with you and others who have said the same :D

Cheers Jester...

Yes if the offer came in, JR/PA probably bites their hands off... 

[hammertime]

3 hours ago, Jester13 said:

I don't disagree, but if the trade is angry elf, Hogs, and a 1st and a team bites then I'm in.

 

I'll predict we go with what we have this year and that management will sign Klingberg next year if they can move cap to make it work.

Or...... This may blow your mind..... We draft one. 

 

Realistically even for that package a team wouldn't be letting go of a young top RHD without major red flags

[Angry Goose]

3 hours ago, spook007 said:

So for that reason, I will not be disappointed if the make a big trade to get that elusive RHD...

 

In saying that, I won't mind if we just run with the horses we got and wait until we get a normal turnover of players, but think we will be decimated afterwards anyways.

Could happen if there’s a deal to be made, but it looks like the Canucks arnt going to (thankfully) force anything

 

 

[IBatch]

47 minutes ago, Angry Goose said:

Could happen if there’s a deal to be made, but it looks like the Canucks arnt going to (thankfully) force anything

 

 

Wow look at that, someone who feels like i do about this obsession over a right shot D.    QHs isn't going to score a bunch of goals on the left side anyways...as long as we add a quality top four D we've improved our D core.   Can't expect Schenn to keep it up.   Or QHs to get to the next level either.   He's already at a high level .... QHs OEL is intriguing.    Or vice versa.    We can afford to lose a forward .... finding a team might be tough ... it could come down to trading for futures next draft just so we can go after a free agent but that's not the end of the world.    Other teams obsess over not having center depth, or winger depth, or a number one goalie. 

 

Peak Sedin era team didn't have wingers.     Burrows!   That's about it.   Sure Higgins and Samuelson did their best ... same with Raymond.   But nothing like we've got now. 

[Jester13]

1 hour ago, hammertime said:

Or...... This may blow your mind..... We draft one. 

 

Realistically even for that package a team wouldn't be letting go of a young top RHD without major red flags

I'm also down for clearing cap and getting picks for the long term, if that's on the table at some point as a possible deal with someone. 

[Angry Goose]

28 minutes ago, IBatch said:

Wow look at that, someone who feels like i do about this obsession over a right shot D.    QHs isn't going to score a bunch of goals on the left side anyways...as long as we add a quality top four D we've improved our D core.   Can't expect Schenn to keep it up.   Or QHs to get to the next level either.   He's already at a high level .... QHs OEL is intriguing.    Or vice versa.    We can afford to lose a forward .... finding a team might be tough ... it could come down to trading for futures next draft just so we can go after a free agent but that's not the end of the world.    Other teams obsess over not having center depth, or winger depth, or a number one goalie. 

 

Peak Sedin era team didn't have wingers.     Burrows!   That's about it.   Sure Higgins and Samuelson did their best ... same with Raymond.   But nothing like we've got now. 

I think for this season at least see how things play out under Boudreau. Burroughs/Poolman/McDermott Im going to focus on. Perhaps mid season or next off season we see something more significant done on the back end, depending on how chips fall.

[IBatch]

3 minutes ago, Angry Goose said:

I think for this season at least see how things play out under Boudreau. Burroughs/Poolman/McDermott Im going to focus on. Perhaps mid season or next off season we see something more significant done on the back end, depending on how chips fall.

That's ok too.   If we play like we did under Bruce we won't have to worry about much anyways. 

[wallstreetamigo]

42 minutes ago, IBatch said:

Wow look at that, someone who feels like i do about this obsession over a right shot D.    QHs isn't going to score a bunch of goals on the left side anyways...as long as we add a quality top four D we've improved our D core.   Can't expect Schenn to keep it up.   Or QHs to get to the next level either.   He's already at a high level .... QHs OEL is intriguing.    Or vice versa.    We can afford to lose a forward .... finding a team might be tough ... it could come down to trading for futures next draft just so we can go after a free agent but that's not the end of the world.    Other teams obsess over not having center depth, or winger depth, or a number one goalie. 

 

Peak Sedin era team didn't have wingers.     Burrows!   That's about it.   Sure Higgins and Samuelson did their best ... same with Raymond.   But nothing like we've got now. 

Been saying for awhile that the best short term solution might be a Hughes-OEL workhorse pairing. I think OEL might be the better fit on the right though. Hughes may struggle a bit more as the main puck distributor whereas OEL has a good accurate shot and could take advantage of one timers on his off side. 

[JM_]

1 minute ago, wallstreetamigo said:

Been saying for awhile that the best short term solution might be a Hughes-OEL workhorse pairing. I think OEL might be the better fit on the right though. Hughes may struggle a bit more as the main puck distributor whereas OEL has a good accurate shot and could take advantage of one timers on his off side. 

not sure it has to be static. I could see them both switching sides during games. 

[wallstreetamigo]

2 minutes ago, JM_ said:

not sure it has to be static. I could see them both switching sides during games. 

Of course. Just thinking that based on their strengths OEL might be the more natural fit. Might actually boost his offensive production and would certainly provide an opportunity with the forward group to play that puck possession style this team needs to play to be successful. 
 

Hughes relies very heavily on walking the line from the left side boards and making cross ice feeds. That will be a huge adjustment for him on his off side imo. 

Edited September 9, 2022 by wallstreetamigo

[DeNiro]

1 minute ago, wallstreetamigo said:

Been saying for awhile that the best short term solution might be a Hughes-OEL workhorse pairing. I think OEL might be the better fit on the right though. Hughes may struggle a bit more as the main puck distributor whereas OEL has a good accurate shot and could take advantage of one timers on his off side. 

Will be interesting to see what effect it has on OEL’s offensive game.

 

The hard part about switching is obviously play along the boards and defending with your stick on your off side but the ability to get point shots off quicker should be an advantage.

[wallstreetamigo]

1 minute ago, DeNiro said:

Will be interesting to see what effect it has on OEL’s offensive game.

 

The hard part about switching is obviously play along the boards and defending with your stick on your off side but the ability to get point shots off quicker should be an advantage.

OEL has played some on the right before and from what I remember he actually adjusted defensively very well to it. Can’t remember what it did to his offensive game specifically but it’s worth a shot imo. Dermott-Myers and Rathbone-Schenn would be ok to try imo. 

[c00kies]

6 minutes ago, JM_ said:

not sure it has to be static. I could see them both switching sides during games. 

Like Loui with the empty net or...  

[IBatch]

10 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said:

OEL has played some on the right before and from what I remember he actually adjusted defensively very well to it. Can’t remember what it did to his offensive game specifically but it’s worth a shot imo. Dermott-Myers and Rathbone-Schenn would be ok to try imo. 

If that's their intention, i sure hope they use the pre-season to sort the wrinkles out.   Last thing this team needs is another silly Green type pre-season, just to find the 13/14th man ...

[JM_]

17 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said:

Of course. Just thinking that based on their strengths OEL might be the more natural fit. Might actually boost his offensive production and would certainly provide an opportunity with the forward group to play that puck possession style this team needs to play to be successful. 
 

Hughes relies very heavily on walking the line from the left side boards and making cross ice feeds. That will be a huge adjustment for him on his off side imo. 

ah thats a good point. OEL is likely to get less rattled as well. Either way, I'm happy to see the experiment play out. 

 

I was thinking with Hughes excellent mobility he could make the transition as well, but OEL does have the far better shot. 

 

It just gives us options to deal with Myers and not stifle OEL. I suspect Dermott-Myers is going to get a long look in camp as well. 

 

[JM_]

15 minutes ago, c00kies said:

Like Loui with the empty net or...  

too soon.... too soon.