11th overall pick in the 2023 Entry Draft

[Gawdzukes]

22 hours ago, grandmaster said:

Not sure if this has been mentioned but, according to this article, Alvin looking to move up to 5th OA in the draft to get that Swedish centre Carlsson. It would have to be draft capital in my opinion, we don’t have enough prospects or easy players to trade. This year’s 11OA and next year’s 1st?  
 

https://www.canucksdaily.com/MAJOR-Patrik-Allvin-reveals-their-top-Draft-Target-It-going-to-cost-the-Canucks-237558?mibextid=Zxz2cZ

lol, so we're giving up Petey, or Hughes? No one is trading our first this year, and next year for #2 - #5 overall. Maybe Miller, 2023 11th OA, 2024 1st, gets close value wise but none of the bottom dwellers would want Miller unless Columbus has gone insane. This is a non-starter imo. We don't have the assets.

[McBackup]

Maybe Johnny Tightlips is trying to play chess through the media in regards to Carlsson. It really does seem odd for a management group that has generally kept their cards close to their chest to come out and say something like this. There's an extremely high chance Carlsson isn't even there at 5.

 

I have to wonder how this fits into "the plan". It seems counterintuitive to give up the amount of assets it would take to move up that far based on everything else they've said. 

 

I also really hope this isn't a "Swedish" thing. I like Carlsson as a prospect a lot, but if this is true and it isn't smoke and mirrors, I have to worry they're overvaluing him due to the Swedish factor.

 

[Dr. Crossbar]

From the words of a lot of people around here ... it's the deepest draft in years. 

 

As such ...

 

We'll be getting a great player at #11. Even better than most years. 

 

Nothing to be negative about. 

[grandmaster]

Recent Hockey Writer’s article indicating that the Canucks will pick Axel Sandin Pellikka.

 

https://thehockeywriters.com/2023-nhl-draft-baracchinis-mock-draft/

 

11. Vancouver Canucks: Axel Sandin Pellikka, D, Skellefteå AIK (SHL)

The Canucks need just about everything for their prospect pool as it’s pretty bare. Drafting Sandin Pellikka would give them another strong, puck moving defender on the backend. He’s excellent in transition with his skating and puck control and is constantly involved in the attack in the offensive zone. He can make crisp passes and make timely pinches. His defensive game is really underrated as he’s very sound positionally and can be aggressive to break up plays. He would be a welcome addition to their blueline. 

Edited May 22, 2023 by grandmaster

[Alflives]

4 minutes ago, grandmaster said:

Recent Hockey Writer’s article indicating that the Canucks will pick Axel Sandin Pellikka.

 

https://thehockeywriters.com/2023-nhl-draft-baracchinis-mock-draft/

 

11. Vancouver Canucks: Axel Sandin Pellikka, D, Skellefteå AIK (SHL)

The Canucks need just about everything for their prospect pool as it’s pretty bare. Drafting Sandin Pellikka would give them another strong, puck moving defender on the backend. He’s excellent in transition with his skating and puck control and is constantly involved in the attack in the offensive zone. He can make crisp passes and make timely pinches. His defensive game is really underrated as he’s very sound positionally and can be aggressive to break up plays. He would be a welcome addition to their blueline. 

I’m thinking we get either ASP or Benson. Either one brings us elite skill and a high ceiling. ASP as a top pairing D snd Benson as a top line forward. Would be a great draft to get one of them. 

[ilduce39]

Use the 1st ++ to trade for Carlsson.. or deal it for one of these players:

 

(Keller, Lafreniere, Carlo, Anderson, Toews, Brodin, Zub, Cirelli, Liljigren, Theodore, Dubois.)
 

https://canucksarmy.com/news/11-nhl-players-might-worth-trading-canucks-11th-overall-pick

 

Roget puts together an interesting list of C / D targets and reasons why they could be available.  We’d have to clear space, first, or send it back at least so it’s all likely moot. But interesting to think of Hughes - Zub or Hughes - Carlo in front of a Hronek led pair.

[Canucks Curse]

49 minutes ago, ilduce39 said:

Use the 1st ++ to trade for Carlsson.. or deal it for one of these players:

 

(Keller, Lafreniere, Carlo, Anderson, Toews, Brodin, Zub, Cirelli, Liljigren, Theodore, Dubois.)
 

https://canucksarmy.com/news/11-nhl-players-might-worth-trading-canucks-11th-overall-pick

 

Roget puts together an interesting list of C / D targets and reasons why they could be available.  We’d have to clear space, first, or send it back at least so it’s all likely moot. But interesting to think of Hughes - Zub or Hughes - Carlo in front of a Hronek led pair.

Barely an NHL player, not even close as same calibre as others listed

[Canucks Curse]

56 minutes ago, ilduce39 said:

Use the 1st ++ to trade for Carlsson.. or deal it for one of these players:

 

(Keller, Lafreniere, Carlo, Anderson, Toews, Brodin, Zub, Cirelli, Liljigren, Theodore, Dubois.)
 

https://canucksarmy.com/news/11-nhl-players-might-worth-trading-canucks-11th-overall-pick

 

Roget puts together an interesting list of C / D targets and reasons why they could be available.  We’d have to clear space, first, or send it back at least so it’s all likely moot. But interesting to think of Hughes - Zub or Hughes - Carlo in front of a Hronek led pair.

yes to Andersson =Theadore, Cirelli, Brodin, Zub in that order

I would def be looking to trade the 11th OA for them 

[Pure961089]

On 5/20/2023 at 11:25 AM, Baggins said:

In hindsight terrible Ballard not working out here. But moving Grabner I fully expected. He ran out of chances and was waiver elligible. Better to move him than lose him for nothing. Rathbone and Hoglander are in that position this year. Too good to clear waivers, but are they good enough to make the team? Depending on offseason moves Hogs might have a chance at making the opening roster. Rathbone I believe will be moved.

 

The way I looked at the Grabner trade is it was basically a 1st for Ballard and waiver elligible Grabner for taking a cap dump (Bernier). The first was the main part of the trade because if Grabner didn't show he could be lost to waivers. I didn't mind that trade at all. I really liked Ballard when with the Coyotes but didn't see much of him after going east. But as I said, Ballard just didn't seem the same after his offseason hip surgery. I didn't care at all what Grabner became after, and still don't, because it wasn't going to happen here. He would have been lost to waivers here just as he was in Florida. Because he showed up to camp in poor shape (yet again) and was outplayed by others (yet again) in preseason. In 10/11 Grabner had 52 pts in 76 games while Raymond had 53 pts in 82 games. He was really just another Mason Raymond. Who fans here included in every trade proposal. NHL career Raymond had 251 pts in 546 games (.46 ppg), Grabner 276 pts in 640 games (.43 ppg). Yet so many still moan about moving him like we lost some superstar. He spent his career playing for bad to mediocre teams for a reason.

This is what happens when a team can't properly develop players, they're deemed to have run out of chances and they go on to score 30 goals for other teams. Just an indictment of our development staff under Gillis. He ruined Hogson's career because Canucks medical staff misdiagnosed his back injury. They made him play injured .  They said placebo all in your head kid.  

Edited May 23, 2023 by Pure961089

[Pure961089]

And for all those still sleeping on Benson and Cristall here's a scouting report on the 2 of them.

 

 

 

[spook007]

6 hours ago, ilduce39 said:

Use the 1st ++ to trade for Carlsson.. or deal it for one of these players:

 

(Keller, Lafreniere, Carlo, Anderson, Toews, Brodin, Zub, Cirelli, Liljigren, Theodore, Dubois.)
 

https://canucksarmy.com/news/11-nhl-players-might-worth-trading-canucks-11th-overall-pick

 

Roget puts together an interesting list of C / D targets and reasons why they could be available.  We’d have to clear space, first, or send it back at least so it’s all likely moot. But interesting to think of Hughes - Zub or Hughes - Carlo in front of a Hronek led pair.

Swing that trade... anyone not named Petey, QH or Demko. 

If we use any of those, we may as well consider full rebuild. 

Future up front sorted would be sorted. Get it done...

[DownUndaCanuck]

6 hours ago, ilduce39 said:

Use the 1st ++ to trade for Carlsson.. or deal it for one of these players:

 

(Keller, Lafreniere, Carlo, Anderson, Toews, Brodin, Zub, Cirelli, Liljigren, Theodore, Dubois.)
 

https://canucksarmy.com/news/11-nhl-players-might-worth-trading-canucks-11th-overall-pick

 

Roget puts together an interesting list of C / D targets and reasons why they could be available.  We’d have to clear space, first, or send it back at least so it’s all likely moot. But interesting to think of Hughes - Zub or Hughes - Carlo in front of a Hronek led pair.

Bit skeptical about some of those players, and it really depends who's available at 11OA. I would trade most of our players + 1st for Leo Carlsson, I think he'll be the real deal quite soon, he's probably a 3-4C as early as next year, dare I say 2nd line center in his sophmore year and after that the sky's the limit. Carlsson and Petey down the middle is the perfect combination of skill, size, two-way ability and even grit (despite them being both Swedes, Carlsson is a unit). I'd do 11OA + Miller + even some more to get it done.

 

I'd absolutely avoid Laff (no need for another project winger), Carlo would be decent but lacks high-end potential, doubt Anderson gets moved, I think Hanifin is certainly up for debate (almost even as a rental as his deal expires next year), I've liked Zub for a while but we're probably overpaying with an 11OA pick but I'd do it because he's proven he can play solid 20+ minutes, Liljegren no way, he got bullied in the playoffs, PLD would probably cost a boat-load more...

 

These are savvy moves though and I don't think Allvin has the guts to make them - he'll play it safe and just take a player. A stupid/ballsy GM like JB would be all over a trade though.

 

At the end of the day we need a center or defenceman, ideally young-ish, and we'll probably have a stab at one in the draft. My rankings for priority go something like this:

 

*) - Trade 11OA + almost whoever it takes to acquire a top-4 pick - this will never happen but would be fun. 11OA + Miller + whatever for Carlsson would be fun.

1) Draft ASP or Reinbacher - get them young, develop them, turn them into monsters.

2) Trade for a defenceman - probably go Hanifin > Zub > Carlo (controversial I know but Carlo plays sheltered minutes, the other two are top guys)

3) Draft a center - Leonard, Dvorsky, Moore, Benson - these guys will probably be gone so we'd be left with scraps I'm assuming

4) Trade for a center - doubt this happens. Cirelli is surely a lock on Tampa's team and anyway, he has a massive cap hit we can't fit in unless we make other moves.

 

Lots of options but sadly I doubt Allvin will entertain many of them, he'll surely just take a safe pick, he'll get someone who falls to him who he values over the other teams. Wouldn't be surprised if we go off-board and take a Swede who did well in the U18 tournie either.

[MJDDawg]

15 hours ago, Alflives said:

I’m thinking we get either ASP or Benson. Either one brings us elite skill and a high ceiling. ASP as a top pairing D snd Benson as a top line forward. Would be a great draft to get one of them. 

Now imagine if we still had the Horvat first rounder and possibly having both these players. 
 

I still believe we’d be further ahead in three years going the draft route than we’ll be doing what we’re doing now. 

[GunnerStaal]

7 hours ago, DownUndaCanuck said:

 

At the end of the day we need a center or defenceman, ideally young-ish, and we'll probably have a stab at one in the draft. My rankings for priority go something like this:

 

*) - Trade 11OA + almost whoever it takes to acquire a top-4 pick - this will never happen but would be fun. 11OA + Miller + whatever for Carlsson would be fun.

1) Draft ASP or Reinbacher - get them young, develop them, turn them into monsters.

2) Trade for a defenceman - probably go Hanifin > Zub > Carlo (controversial I know but Carlo plays sheltered minutes, the other two are top guys)

3) Draft a center - Leonard, Dvorsky, Moore, Benson - these guys will probably be gone so we'd be left with scraps I'm assuming

4) Trade for a center - doubt this happens. Cirelli is surely a lock on Tampa's team and anyway, he has a massive cap hit we can't fit in unless we make other moves.

 

Lots of options but sadly I doubt Allvin will entertain many of them, he'll surely just take a safe pick, he'll get someone who falls to him who he values over the other teams. Wouldn't be surprised if we go off-board and take a Swede who did well in the U18 tournie either.

What about option 5. 
Send the 11th overall to NSH for the 15th overall + 46th overall - Draft Willander

[HomeBrew]

3 hours ago, MJDDawg said:

Now imagine if we still had the Horvat first rounder and possibly having both these players. 
 

I still believe we’d be further ahead in three years going the draft route than we’ll be doing what we’re doing now. 

Agreed. Would rather just build through the draft than the constant 'retooling' we have seen for the last decade. 

[grandmaster]

4 hours ago, MJDDawg said:

Now imagine if we still had the Horvat first rounder and possibly having both these players. 
 

I still believe we’d be further ahead in three years going the draft route than we’ll be doing what we’re doing now. 

Nope.

 

Hronek, a 25 year old top 4 RHD, is worth way more than an 17OA pick. A pick that might not even make the NHL, nevermind make it as a top 4 defender. 
 

We also gained a good prospect in Raty and a top 6 forward in Beau who ended up playing better than the other Bo!  Beau is an easy trade chip as well, should the need be.

Edited May 23, 2023 by grandmaster

[Baggins]

13 hours ago, Pure961089 said:

This is what happens when a team can't properly develop players, they're deemed to have run out of chances and they go on to score 30 goals for other teams. Just an indictment of our development staff under Gillis. He ruined Hogson's career because Canucks medical staff misdiagnosed his back injury. They made him play injured .  They said placebo all in your head kid.  

Or it may just be the player. Grabner showed up to camp and failed fitness tests year after year. That's on the player. He was cut from Florida for the same reason he never made it here. A poor camp and preseason. He had two golden opportunities to beat out Raymond for a spot and didn't show up in shape and ready to compete. That's on him.

 

Hodgson was not misdiagnosed. That's a falacy. Canucks medical staff - bulging disc. Goes back to his junior team - buldging disc. Goes to his own doctor - buldging disc. Goes to a leading back specialist in the US - bulging disc. Obviously he had a bulging disc. The following spring he comes back to Canucks medical staff and they looked beyond the bulging disc and found a muscle tear aggrivating the disc and had a surgery to repair it. Now had Hodgson been honest that his back was still a problem going into camp the the previous fall the medical staff likely would have looked beyond that bulging disc at that time. But he said repeatedly his back was good. Going into camp, during camp, and during preseason he lied. When he was cut it was - oh my back. He lost a season because he wanted to make the team rather than going back to junior. He wasn't honest the problem was still there.

[Pure961089]

58 minutes ago, Baggins said:

Or it may just be the player. Grabner showed up to camp and failed fitness tests year after year. That's on the player. He was cut from Florida for the same reason he never made it here. A poor camp and preseason. He had two golden opportunities to beat out Raymond for a spot and didn't show up in shape and ready to compete. That's on him.

 

Hodgson was not misdiagnosed. That's a falacy. Canucks medical staff - bulging disc. Goes back to his junior team - buldging disc. Goes to his own doctor - buldging disc. Goes to a leading back specialist in the US - bulging disc. Obviously he had a bulging disc. The following spring he comes back to Canucks medical staff and they looked beyond the bulging disc and found a muscle tear aggrivating the disc and had a surgery to repair it. Now had Hodgson been honest that his back was still a problem going into camp the the previous fall the medical staff likely would have looked beyond that bulging disc at that time. But he said repeatedly his back was good. Going into camp, during camp, and during preseason he lied. When he was cut it was - oh my back. He lost a season because he wanted to make the team rather than going back to junior. He wasn't honest the problem was still there.

You need to be patient with young players. You can blame the player all you want for being a late bloomer but in the end the jokes on the team that gave up on them prematurity.  Islanders gave up on Bertuzzi, the Penguins gave up on Naslund, the Canucks have up on Neely.  The Canucks thought there was a chance Kravstov could be one of those guys. It goes both ways. Not all pan out.

[DownUndaCanuck]

2 hours ago, GunnerStaal said:

What about option 5. 
Send the 11th overall to NSH for the 15th overall + 46th overall - Draft Willander

I'd be happy with that but doubt the 11th is worth that much, the 15th OA is just a bit too much value. If we could do something similar to this, I'm sure we'll get a solid player in the mid to late first as well. Could walk away with Willander and Strbak...

[Angry Goose]