Who here is actually happy with the Hronek trade?

[Dr. Crossbar]

1 minute ago, eeeeergh said:

exactly right

 

i honestly dont know why people dont give alvin and the chipmunks more credit. They got a 40 goal scorer for free, signed him to a contract that a 25 goal scorer would ask for, and they managed to sell the absolute pico top on Horvat, convinced the world he was a 1C, and got a top-4 RHD + a top center prospect + a good 2nd line winger for him. 

 

theyre absolutely killing the game right now. 

 

they also didnt let anyone valuable walk to free agency, managed to get picks for schenn, motte, lazar, etc etc. 

 

tip top job to the hairless compadres. 

 

Plus going the extra mile to lure college guys in Hirose, McDonough, McWard, and Sasson. 

 

Positive things happening and the wet blankets don't like it. 

[Angry Goose]

Hoping similarly w JT Miller, Hronek comes in w a something-to-prove attitude 

[Ted Lasso]

6 minutes ago, eeeeergh said:

exactly right

 

i honestly dont know why people dont give alvin and the chipmunks more credit. They got a 40 goal scorer for free, signed him to a contract that a 25 goal scorer would ask for, and they managed to sell the absolute pico top on Horvat, convinced the world he was a 1C, and got a top-4 RHD + a top center prospect + a good 2nd line winger for him. 

 

theyre absolutely killing the game right now. 

 

they also didnt let anyone valuable walk to free agency, managed to get picks for schenn, motte, lazar, etc etc. 

 

tip top job to the hairless compadres. 

 

Agreed…some of the best pro scouting and asset management in recent memory.

 

Also, there’s a great drinking game possible every time PA says ‘here’ or ‘there’

[Alflives]

5 minutes ago, canuckwings said:

I've probably made multiple posts about my feelings on the trade lol. I'm probably a minority cause most ppl here seem to support the trade or want to wait and see. For me I still don't like the trade and my opinion stands regardless of how Hronek performs next year. It's the timing and general asset management approach that I hate. I understand they have to pay for value and Hronek is worth a first rounder. I would hate this less if they didn't give up the second round pick this year. 

 

The team is just simply not in a position to give up that many picks. I don't recall Canucks finding any gem outside of first round in the last decade other than Demko, and he's a goalie, a position teams don't generally draft in the first round anyway.

 

Just because the team hasn't drafted well doesn't mean we should undervalue the picks and be okay with trading those picks away...

 

 

 

Considering we have a great younger core group it makes good sense to add to it. Hronek is s core piece. He’s 25. 
Bo wasn’t a core piece. We didn’t trade our own first. We basically traded Bo for Hronek. And Allvin was able to add New Beau (24) and a high end centre prospect (Raty) to Bo’s value. It’s trades like this that lead to teams being winners. 

[canuckpuckluck1]

7 hours ago, Odd. said:

If Hronek gets 45+ points, we are looking at $8.0M+ minimum as a starting point. 
 

In an ideal world, Hronek is a #4 defenseman, and a #2-4 on a bad team like ours. Would you really want a #3-4 defenseman making $8.0M + the next 6-8 years?

We've already got one of those!!!!     

[Ted Lasso]

Just now, Alflives said:

Considering we have a great younger core group it makes good sense to add to it. Hronek is s core piece. He’s 25. 
Bo wasn’t a core piece. We didn’t trade our own first. We basically traded Bo for Hronek. And Allvin was able to add New Beau (24) and a high end centre prospect (Raty) to Bo’s value. It’s trades like this that lead to teams being winners. 

Agreed. 
 

If you look at it as Bo for Hronek & Beau, we turned the 2nd into Räty (a nearly developed 2nd round pick).

[canucklehead44]

I hated it immensely at the time. However, I have warmed up a bit to the trade.

 

I thought Hronek was an OFD, maybe a solid #3 guy - but the more I dove into clips, reports, and analytics he is actually a pretty rare talent. 

Last season he was one of the best defensemen in the entire NHL and was more impressive defensively and on the PK than offensively/points/PP

 

Also by the way he plays I believe he is going to elevate OEL's game and gives us so many options for matchups. Bear was actually a big acquisition and Hronek makes us so much better.

Based on quality of player, contract, position, and the amount of minutes they play, I would much rather have Hronek over Horvat. And I would also trade a 2nd for Raty, Beau, and a 4th so we come out way ahead. 

With Hronek in and a healthy lineup I think this team can do damage. They are sooooo much better than their record indicated. With tightening up of systems, Demko hopefully back to being Demko, and starting the season with Bear and Hronek we can be a very good team. 

[Odd.]

1 hour ago, Baggins said:

I'm thrilled with the Hronek trade. We'll never be competitve if we don't actively use every option available to improve the team. Stars like Petey, Hughes and Demko will eventually ask to be moved if the team does little to nothing to improve.

 

We've been crying for a legit top 4 RHD for years. We finally get one that's only 25 and now there's crying about getting him. But he's going to cost us money... well duh! Do you think Petey and Hughes won't cost us money? 

Imagine paying a supposed top pairing defenseman from a crappy team who found said player expendable to a $7.5M+ contract for 8 years. Basically paying him to be a top pairing defenseman on our crappy team instead. Hronek on a good team is not a top pairing defenseman. 
 

We need defenseman with size, offense AND can play defense. Hronek is just another offensive defenseman. People calling him a two way defenseman when he wasn’t utilized as such for majority of his career are coping. 
 

So let me ask you. With no draft capital, no blue chip prospects coming, no cap, too many overpaid wingers with term, and a crappy defense, do you truly think we should

be targeting other bottom feeding teams expendable assets and sign them to mega contracts? Do you think being up to our necks in cap as a team that’s made the playoffs once in 8 years should be wasting picks and become buyers?
 

The answer to all of that is no

Edited May 17, 2023 by Odd.

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, Odd. said:

Imagine paying a supposed top pairing defenseman from a crappy team who found said player expendable to a $7.5M+ contract for 8 years. Basically paying him to be a top pairing defenseman on our crappy team instead. Hronek on a good team is not a top pairing defenseman. 
 

We need defenseman with size, offense AND can play defense. Hronek is just another offensive defenseman. People calling him a two way defenseman when he wasn’t utilized as such for majority of his career are coping. 
 

So let me ask you. With no draft capital, no blue chip prospects coming, no cap, too many overpaid wingers with term, and a crappy defense, do you truly think we should

be targeting other teams expendable assets and sign them to mega contracts? Do you think being up to our necks in cap as a team that’s made the playoffs once in 8 years should be wasting picks? 
 

The answer to all of that is no

Hronek is very good defensively. He’s an outstanding player. Detroit went into the dumpster when he went out. He was their most important player. We stole him. Great trade for us. 

[Odd.]

Just now, Alflives said:

Hronek is very good defensively. He’s an outstanding player. Detroit went into the dumpster when he went out. He was their most important player. We stole him. Great trade for us. 

Detroit fans say he’s not good defensively. He was sheltered playing alongside a defensive defenseman in Maata. When he played with Chiarot, that pairing was one of the worst in the league.

 

Detroit went into the dumpster because of injuries. Hronek isn’t the sole reason they became shit.

[stawns]

1 hour ago, Kenny Powers said:

Fair, and safe, expectation. 
 

I’m wondering if he has a contract year bump

That would be an absolute best case scenario for the Canucks, that's for sure

[Baggins]

27 minutes ago, Coconuts said:

Not gonna lie, I didn't read your entire response at first. 

 

Yes, there's a time and place for moving picks, but my preference is to not. 

 

I take issue with the Canucks historical usage of their second round picks over the past decade, and their frittering away picks in general. 

 

Some folks write them off as "magic beans" but most players enter the league via the draft. Seem to be plenty of folks who'd minimize the value of using their own picks. But then again, we've watched the last couple management groups repeatedly try to take shortcuts so I'm not surprised. 

Here's an example of what I'm saying. Edler was drafted in the 3rd round in 2004. Scored a great hit in that draft. We would have been thrilled had he been a 2nd round pick. He played his first NHL games (22 of them) in 2006. He had his first 40 pt season in 2009. If we drafted a right shot Alex Edler (and that's getting pretty specific) in this draft Petey will be 30 when that d-man has his first 40 point season. We cannot depend entirely on draft picks to build around our young stars. If it takes too long it will be a small window assuming that window opens at all.

 

You're right that most players in the league are drafted. How many get traded? There's quite a few that take a while to establish themselves and become waiver elligible before they do. Those guys rarely end up playing for the team that drafted them. There's also late bloomers that don't even get qualified and establish themselves with other teams from free agency on a second chance. Some may even *gasp* ask to be traded. Has any team in the past 50 years won a cup without players acquired through trade or free agency?

[stawns]

4 minutes ago, Odd. said:

Detroit fans say he’s not good defensively. He was sheltered playing alongside a defensive defenseman in Maata. When he played with Chiarot, that pairing was one of the worst in the league.

 

Detroit went into the dumpster because of injuries. Hronek isn’t the sole reason they became shit.

At the time of the trade, most considered Hronek the Wings best all around dman 

[Baggins]

12 minutes ago, Odd. said:

Imagine paying a supposed top pairing defenseman from a crappy team who found said player expendable to a $7.5M+ contract for 8 years. Basically paying him to be a top pairing defenseman on our crappy team instead. Hronek on a good team is not a top pairing defenseman. 
 

We need defenseman with size, offense AND can play defense. Hronek is just another offensive defenseman. People calling him a two way defenseman when he wasn’t utilized as such for majority of his career are coping. 
 

So let me ask you. With no draft capital, no blue chip prospects coming, no cap, too many overpaid wingers with term, and a crappy defense, do you truly think we should

be targeting other bottom feeding teams expendable assets and sign them to mega contracts? Do you think being up to our necks in cap as a team that’s made the playoffs once in 8 years should be wasting picks and become buyers?
 

The answer to all of that is no

[NewbieCanuckFan]

3 minutes ago, Baggins said:

Here's an example of what I'm saying. Edler was drafted in the 3rd round in 2004. Scored a great hit in that draft. We would have been thrilled had he been a 2nd round pick. He played his first NHL games (22 of them) in 2006. He had his first 40 pt season in 2009. If we drafted a right shot Alex Edler (and that's getting pretty specific) in this draft Petey will be 30 when that d-man has his first 40 point season. We cannot depend entirely on draft picks to build around our young stars. If it takes too long it will be a small window assuming that window opens at all.

 

You're right that most players in the league are drafted. How many get traded? There's quite a few that take a while to establish themselves and become waiver elligible before they do. Those guys rarely end up playing for the team that drafted them. There's also late bloomers that don't even get qualified and establish themselves with other teams from free agency on a second chance. Some may even *gasp* ask to be traded. Has any team in the past 50 years won a cup without players acquired through trade or free agency?

Edler had this INSANE player development.  Was playing virtually in a 'beer league' when Gradin spotted him (whatever story wants to believe like he just followed the Detroit scout & "stole him"; I could care less if Gradin went thru his garbage cans for notes lol, it's the results that count).   Thomas Gradin is a rare example where his amazing work on the ice as a player for the Canucks pales in comparison to the work he did as an amateur scout for the Canucks.

Edited May 17, 2023 by NewbieCanuckFan

[iceman64]

8 hours ago, Odd. said:

As many of you might know, I am NOT pleased with the Hronek trade. Our team is nowhere near competitive, and looking at Hronek, he doesn’t exactly fit much of our needs on defense other than being an offensive right handed defenseman.

 

He is not particularly good in his own end, he’s a bit undersized, and is more of a PP specialist than a 5 on 5 catalyst, something I would expect from a defenseman that costed a 1st and a 2nd. Not to mention being one of the only teams out of the playoff for 7 of 8 years trading 1sts like we’re competitive.

 

The problem is, he puts up points, and is in line for a significant raise. Some comparibles are:

 

Sergachev: $8.5M x 8 (averaged 30-38 points a season before extending, career high 65 points)

Trouba: $8.0M x 8 (averages 20-30 points)

Werenski: $9.583M x 6 (averages 30-40 points)

Chabot: $8.0M x 8 (averages 30-45 points)

Morrissey $6.25M x 8 (averages 25-35 points, career high 76 points)

Provorov $6.7M x 6 (averages 25-35 points)

 

All these guys signed their extensions between 23-26. Hronek is 25, and already averages 30-40 points a season. 
 

What is stopping him from asking those types of contracts? We aren’t getting him for under $7M, especially if he puts up 35+ points.

 

In a deep draft such as this, having 2 1st round picks, a 2nd round pick, and a 3rd round pick would have helped this organization immensely both depth and value. 
 

Yzerman fleeced us so hard. What an absolute disastrous trade that I don’t see paying off for us one bit. 

Hronek? Your saying we got fleeced? Omg that's because you haven't seen him play all that much have you? Be honest! 

 A top 4 RHD with good offensive upside doesn't grow on trees in the NHL, and if some is growing some ala pick to time developing and it's looking good then your going to probably keep it with the shortage and demand in the league for RHD's, let alone offensive ones and that keeps the price going up. 

 There doesn't need to be anything flashy about him, his upside offensively is obvious and he is a great passer and reads incredibly well. 

These types of D are hard to find and sign before someone else does, the same thing was said about JTM by the media and now their looking like complete idiots. 

 We did extremely well picking him up, the only thing we really need besides good roster signings for depth and if we keep picking D on draft day until we have enough then we can move on. 

 We're fine.. steady as she goes, slow and sure wins! You'd think Canucks fans more than anyone would get that since we have no cup due to tried short cuts that never worked. 

Oh because of lack of depth? Yes it's nothing new... 

[PetterssonOrPeterson]

8 hours ago, Odd. said:

And we won’t even be a competitive team for the next 3-4 years. Look at our cap situation. 
 

If the goal is to make the playoffs and exit the 1st round for the next 4 years, we are no better than Toronto or Edmonton. Making trades to play an extra 4 weeks in April is not progress.

If that's the case then bye bye petey and quinn.

they both made it clear that they want to play on a winning team. 

Management is committed to this core which is why the hronek trade was made in the first place. Pressure is all on them.

If it's the same situation we're in the next 3-4 years, our "two pillars" are gone. You already know quinn was watching his younger brothers play in the playoffs (not the bogus bubble playoffs) and was probably itching for that chance.

 

They'd better find some sort of loophole/solution to the cap since they decided they want to compete but still have the major cap issues with lots of dispensable players.

[stawns]

1 hour ago, canuckwings said:

I've probably made multiple posts about my feelings on the trade lol. I'm probably a minority cause most ppl here seem to support the trade or want to wait and see. For me I still don't like the trade and my opinion stands regardless of how Hronek performs next year. It's the timing and general asset management approach that I hate. I understand they have to pay for value and Hronek is worth a first rounder. I would hate this less if they didn't give up the second round pick this year. 

 

The team is just simply not in a position to give up that many picks. I don't recall Canucks finding any gem outside of first round in the last decade other than Demko, and he's a goalie, a position teams don't generally draft in the first round anyway.

 

Just because the team hasn't drafted well doesn't mean we should undervalue the picks and be okay with trading those picks away...

 

 

 

The team has been ok with the draft, they've got plenty on Van roster and more on the Abby roster.  Beyond firat roundm we should all be ok with trading them for actual NHL players, as second rounders have a mucg greater chance of never playing in the NHL than they do of playing in the NHL.  If you can get an established NHL player with a second rounder, that's a win for tht alone.

[PetterssonOrPeterson]

8 hours ago, Odd. said:

If Hronek gets 45+ points, we are looking at $8.0M+ minimum as a starting point. 
 

In an ideal world, Hronek is a #4 defenseman, and a #2-4 on a bad team like ours. Would you really want a #3-4 defenseman making $8.0M + the next 6-8 years?

he reminds me a lot of ehrhoff.

a solid player but not spectacular. 

 

DEFINITELY NOT worth the $8.0M+

[Timråfan]

3 hours ago, PhillipBlunt said:

Which in-house defensemen can turn into a top stay at home RHD on the top pairing with Hughes, and which in-house player can pair with Hronek to hold down the second pairing?

Looking at the list of developing in-house players, I don't really see many players with the capability, size or experience to partner with players as dynamic as Hughes and Hronek.

Well, why do you think Hughes need a babysitter when he is a monster himself? 
The problem has been that he was alone at the top.

Now Hronek take som valuable minutes from his shoulders and make sure we have a PP2 that is lethal also.

 

I’m not sure why some fans want our defence to be the best in the league.

It’s not fair since we already got one of the best forwards group.

 

Hughes can have his cheap partner.

OEL and Hronek take the second pair minutes and it will be many if they don’t let Hughes and Hronek overlap a bit.

Hirose, Johansson, Pettersson, McWard seems to be the cheap up and coming that takes care of bottom pairing together with the Abbyplayers that already played a fair bit.

 

Why do you need an extremely good D instantly? 
We have a window of four years now that will be very good from season 24/25.

So no stress this coming season.

We can even have Myers sheltering a younger prospect and when we reach playoffs he won’t get penalties as easy.