Nikita Tryamkin | D

[SilentSam]

1 hour ago, Jimmy McGill said:

man, 3.5? when you look at the comparisons at that salary range I have a hard time getting there and I'm a fan of Niks. If he could bring some offence maybe. Who are you seeing as the comp's? or maybe thats the issue, its really hard to compare him to other players. 

I wasn’t really looking for comparisons Jimmy, but rather Who is he better than on our team, at this moment.

Better than : Fantenburg, Benn, Stetcher , and I know the flack comparing him against Tanev, but I do see him as a better Defenceman with a totally different tool box than CT.   

The last 3 to compare to are Hughes, Myers, Edler,.   Hughes and Myers game are still rising while Edlers is diminishing.

 

Tanev looking for 4- 4.5 and up next season and up will not work.. for either Management or player.

Tryamkin at 3-3.5 will for a player that will give you 70- 82 games and keep the symmetry needed on D lines.

Pair him with Hughes, or Stetcher,  

Pairing with Stetcher will allow Troy to up his game skill wise,

Paired with Hughes and you will have a dynamic pairing that could be paired for years.

 

[SilentSam]

10 minutes ago, Chickenspear said:

I'm sure Tryamkin would be asking for something like the $3-3.5 mil deal if everything was normal, but as he's aware of the cap situation and wants to be here, and barring a compliance buyout (Loui), I could see him taking a 2 year team friendly contract (starting '20-'21, ~$2 mil) until the cap recovers. Extra revenue coming in from expansion, and new tv deals should help a bit in that regard. It would certainly help his image with his detractors taking a cheaper show me deal as well. By the time his contract would be up, we would have a number of more expensive contracts off the books (Eriksson, Sutter, Beagle etc) and the $4+ mil in the Spooner buyout and Luongo recrapture. If all goes well in his 2 years and proves he can be a legitimate top 3/4 D in the NHL, and the cap recovers, he could potentially be offered 5-6 years @ ~$5-6 mil, imo. 

 

 

Perhaps I’m wrong, but I beleive that 1 year deal puts him into free agency..  I would not want to see those offers,.  He would be gone after 1 season.

 

[Chickenspear]

Just now, SilentSam said:

Perhaps I’m wrong, but I beleive that 1 year deal puts him into free agency..  I would not want to see those offers,.  He would be gone after 1 season.

 

I said 2 year deal 

[SilentSam]

1 hour ago, theo5789 said:

While I agree with you that Tryamkin has gotten better. He hasn't proven that at the NHL level yet. I doubt he gets a raise on that merit. He doesn't have much leverage back in the KHL either. I think we hold firm on a 2-2.5 million contract offer and he can choose to have a 1 or 2 year term to prove himself for a better next deal. The other option is if he wants 3 million, then I would ask for more term (4-5 years) to try and lock him down at a "lower" value with no trade clauses (if he doesn't pan out for whatever reason, some team will take a risk on him with his size and skating).

 

Someone like Zadorov just got a 3.2 million dollar deal for 1 year and he's proven a lot more at the NHL level and I think they are comparable players.

I think in our round about ways we agree Theo 

[JM_]

7 minutes ago, SilentSam said:

I wasn’t really looking for comparisons Jimmy, but rather Who is he better than on our team, at this moment.

Better than : Fantenburg, Benn, Stetcher , and I know the flack comparing him against Tanev, but I do see him as a better Defenceman with a totally different tool box than CT.   

The last 3 to compare to are Hughes, Myers, Edler,.   Hughes and Myers game are still rising while Edlers is diminishing.

 

Tanev looking for 4- 4.5 and up next season and up will not work.. for either Management or player.

Tryamkin at 3-3.5 will for a player that will give you 70- 82 games and keep the symmetry needed on D lines.

Pair him with Hughes, or Stetcher,  

Pairing with Stetcher will allow Troy to up his game skill wise,

Paired with Hughes and you will have a dynamic pairing that could be paired for years.

 

If he was a top 4 guy, I guess the 3.5 makes sense. Just not sure he is... I'd like him to be and hope he gets there. 

 

I do think these latest stories are all part of the negotiating process. 

[SilentSam]

2 minutes ago, Chickenspear said:

I said 2 year deal 

Thanks for correcting me ..  I am thinking more of this next season when having NT on the Canucks,

I still see moves created on the D core to make it stronger and more reliable..  I do not see a Tanev on this team next season.

We lose Fantenburg, possibly Stetcher, possibly move Benn.

 

Fanta and Tanev is aprx. 5.5 m.  those moves allow a bump up for Stetcher, a signing for Tryamkin, and money for 2 D Men  out of Utica to travel and work the 2 way deals.

Rafferty and Joulevi,  neither are getting any younger.

[SilentSam]

8 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

If he was a top 4 guy, I guess the 3.5 makes sense. Just not sure he is... I'd like him to be and hope he gets there. 

 

I do think these latest stories are all part of the negotiating process. 

I’m positive he will be with us next season Jimmy, and yes, I think Tryamkin is chomping to be in the NHL now.. and yes, perhaps he signs for a 2.5 - 3ish number to prove it..   this is a player with Longetivity in the game, more so now with having gone back to the KHL  and mentally grow into that man size body to 25 yrs old , rather than have been at the opposite end of some pugilistic players in the NHL at 21 yrs.

He knows this is the best league in the world,.   And he wants to be the best he possibly can

[Nuxfanabroad]

I'd be fine with 5 yrs x 3 mill. Treat this kid with integrity now. Make him feel at home. He'll be a massive warrior for the team.

[CR7]

2 Year deal would walk Nik right into free agency (unless we are counting the 2019/2020 in this 2 years). It's either a 1 year show me or a long term contract. A player is a UFA if they turn 27 on or before June 30th with an expiring contract. Nik's birthday is August 30, 1994 still 26 at the end of the 2020/2021 season therefore still an RFA

[JM_]

27 minutes ago, SilentSam said:

I’m positive he will be with us next season Jimmy, and yes, I think Tryamkin is chomping to be in the NHL now.. and yes, perhaps he signs for a 2.5 - 3ish number to prove it..   this is a player with Longetivity in the game, more so now with having gone back to the KHL  and mentally grow into that man size body to 25 yrs old , rather than have been at the opposite end of some pugilistic players in the NHL at 21 yrs.

He knows this is the best league in the world,.   And he wants to be the best he possibly can

 

27 minutes ago, Nuxfanabroad said:

I'd be fine with 5 yrs x 3 mill. Treat this kid with integrity now. Make him feel at home. He'll be a massive warrior for the team.

It would be interesting to see if Jim's thinking longer term.... an AAV of 3.5 over 5 years would set Nik up for life, thats for sure. If it was properly structured with bonuses early this might be a better idea than a short 2 year deal. 

[-Vintage Canuck-]

 

[Hairy Kneel]

I would expect around 3 to 3.5

That would put him around  Hutton 2.8

or Zadarov 3.2.

I would say 2 years at 3.3 bridge 

I project him around  Tanev dollars  down the road. 

This going off a strong 79 game showing. And KHL seasoning. 

[SilentSam]

6 hours ago, Jimmy McGill said:

 

It would be interesting to see if Jim's thinking longer term.... an AAV of 3.5 over 5 years would set Nik up for life, thats for sure. If it was properly structured with bonuses early this might be a better idea than a short 2 year deal. 

Perhaps that is what’s really setting this timeline up,.  Once we get to draft day and free agency it will be a fresh sheet.. but Vintages posts from twitter make it seems like Nik is penciled in with a fine point sharpie.

 

 

5 hours ago, -Vintage Canuck- said:

 

 

[Pete M]

19 hours ago, gurn said:

So what's he worth?

he is worth more than LE brings

[Gurn]

23 minutes ago, Pete M said:

he is worth more than LE brings

Water is wet.

It gets dark at night.

[Ray_Cathode]

13 hours ago, theo5789 said:

While I agree with you that Tryamkin has gotten better. He hasn't proven that at the NHL level yet. I doubt he gets a raise on that merit. He doesn't have much leverage back in the KHL either. I think we hold firm on a 2-2.5 million contract offer and he can choose to have a 1 or 2 year term to prove himself for a better next deal. The other option is if he wants 3 million, then I would ask for more term (4-5 years) to try and lock him down at a "lower" value with no trade clauses (if he doesn't pan out for whatever reason, some team will take a risk on him with his size and skating).

 

Someone like Zadorov just got a 3.2 million dollar deal for 1 year and he's proven a lot more at the NHL level and I think they are comparable players.

He already played well in the NHL as a rookie from another country and having to make both hockey and personal adjustments - doesn’t that prove that he can play in the NHL, especially when you admit yourself that playing in the KHL has made him better? I can think of two current Canuck defencemen that he is already better than. That said, 1.5 to 2.2 is probably about right.  Why? The league has changed to much more focus on mobility and skill on defence. I have full confidence in his defensive game, but I’d need to see a decent transition game.

[theo5789]

6 hours ago, Ray_Cathode said:

He already played well in the NHL as a rookie from another country and having to make both hockey and personal adjustments - doesn’t that prove that he can play in the NHL, especially when you admit yourself that playing in the KHL has made him better? I can think of two current Canuck defencemen that he is already better than. That said, 1.5 to 2.2 is probably about right.  Why? The league has changed to much more focus on mobility and skill on defence. I have full confidence in his defensive game, but I’d need to see a decent transition game.

I'm not concerned about his ability to play in the NHL, but we offered him 2 million before he left. I replied to a suggestion that he would get 3-3.5 million and I don't think he would he get a raise because he improved in the KHL. I think he needs to prove that here before he gets a raise on the original offer.

[Fred65]

5 hours ago, theo5789 said:

I'm not concerned about his ability to play in the NHL, but we offered him 2 million before he left. I replied to a suggestion that he would get 3-3.5 million and I don't think he would he get a raise because he improved in the KHL. I think he needs to prove that here before he gets a raise on the original offer.

I'm concerned about his view of the NHL. For what ever reason he doesn't seem to relate to the skill level of the NHL. However he can play, we've seen it ourselves and although the NHL has swung towards speed and he's been toiling in the KHL IMO he's a better gamble than players who have never played in the NHL. As of this moment he's a 5-6 player,  and adds an extra dimension to the blue line. Rafferty might bring more offence ( more than Stecher ? ) Vcr is not going to win the SC next season IMO now is the moment to polish some prospects for the near future. You don't just drop them into the mix at the last moment. This is an important moment in the Canucks future. You have to keep your eye on 2-3 years from now not what turns your crank today. JB feels confident the team has 7 prospects NHL ready, well lets see'em Jim

[theo5789]

7 minutes ago, Fred65 said:

I'm concerned about his view of the NHL. For what ever reason he doesn't seem to relate to the skill level of the NHL. However he can play, we've seen it ourselves and although the NHL has swung towards speed and he's been toiling in the KHL IMO he's a better gamble than players who have never played in the NHL. As of this moment he's a 5-6 player,  and adds an extra dimension to the blue line. Rafferty might bring more offence ( more than Stecher ? ) Vcr is not going to win the SC next season IMO now is the moment to polish some prospects for the near future. You don't just drop them into the mix at the last moment. This is an important moment in the Canucks future. You have to keep your eye on 2-3 years from now not what turns your crank today. JB feels confident the team has 7 prospects NHL ready, well lets see'em Jim

Honestly not sure what you mean about him not relating to the skill level in the NHL. He's not "toiling" in the KHL, he's matured and improved in the area that is his calling card which is defensive play (and Benning suggests he's a shutdown specialist).

 

Benning says he expects 6-7 prospects in the next 2 years. That could include MacEwen, Brisebois/Rafferty and maybe Juolevi for next season while Hoglander, Podz, Lind and Rathbone vying for spots the following season. Benning has faith in them, but they still need to earn their spots. The prospects control their own destiny if they put in the work and push someone out, no one is being handed a spot.

 

I disagree suggesting already that we have no chance at the Cup next year. If we make the playoffs, anything can happen. Not to say we go "all in", but I doubt management or the players have that mentality to write off the season already.

[Fred65]

37 minutes ago, theo5789 said:

Honestly not sure what you mean about him not relating to the skill level in the NHL. He's not "toiling" in the KHL, he's matured and improved in the area that is his calling card which is defensive play (and Benning suggests he's a shutdown specialist).

 

Benning says he expects 6-7 prospects in the next 2 years. That could include MacEwen, Brisebois/Rafferty and maybe Juolevi for next season while Hoglander, Podz, Lind and Rathbone vying for spots the following season. Benning has faith in them, but they still need to earn their spots. The prospects control their own destiny if they put in the work and push someone out, no one is being handed a spot.

 

I disagree suggesting already that we have no chance at the Cup next year. If we make the playoffs, anything can happen. Not to say we go "all in", but I doubt management or the players have that mentality to write off the season already.

He came to camp clearly out of shape originally ie he was totally unaware of the NHL bar setting. I think that's undisputed. We hope he knows better next time, assuming there is a next time.

The idea you  just never know what can happen is 80% dreaming. There is the odd exception but as a whole the best team wins. You can't plan with dreams … IMO or I can't and I doubt management can. The concept is a fallacy. There's always a chnace you can win the lottery