aGENT Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 (edited) 8 hours ago, Realtor Rod said: What's a bit concerning for me, and only time will tell,is JB goes 'off the board' with the best pick. He did it withJV and now with OJ. When everyone I read everywhere had players higher than who he picked. It may workout for us but picking the best player available always seemed like the right way to draft. Neither of those picks were off my board Edited June 29, 2016 by J.R. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostsof1915 Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 8 hours ago, C.m.sawers said: Ryan Suter signing in Minnesota 3 years ago ring a bell? Pretty good #1 dman Stamkos is a UFA this year too. The point is rarely do you see UFA's like that hit the market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
higgyfan Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 2 hours ago, Realtor Rod said: What's a bit concerning for me, and only time will tell,is JB goes 'off the board' with the best pick. He did it withJV and now with OJ. When everyone I read everywhere had players higher than who he picked. It may workout for us but picking the best player available always seemed like the right way to draft. I don't know if he 'went off the board' to pick OJ. Bob McKenzie (who gathers his info from a large # of scouts), had OJ at 6. McKenzie is usually pretty accurate with his picks. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clam linguine Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 7 hours ago, Blömqvist said: Signed as a UFA at age 28. His contract is downright ridiculous, 13 years at $98M, for an average cap hit of $7.5M/yr I agree with Deniro. I'd much rather draft a stud defenseman, have him develop alongside our core to make them better too, and have him at a discounted cost. We could always sign a first line forward in free agency, there's usually a handful every year and we wouldn't need to spend $100M on him either. Stud defencemen aren't drafted....dreams of stud defenceman are drafted. Stud defencemen are signed...and they cost 7.5 million, whether you draft them or not. When was the last time a 170 pounder was called a stud...lol. Sometimes I get on board with this move , but mostly, like now, I think....omg. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Realtor Rod Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 4 hours ago, Gooseberries said: Went off the board with boeser too. look how rhat turned out. He pick who he thinks is the best player. He has to answer for is actions (regarding the canucks) while you do not. Boeser hasn't signed or proven anything. Like I said, we will see, it just seems odd to always go against the grain. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toews Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 3 minutes ago, Realtor Rod said: Boeser hasn't signed or proven anything. Like I said, we will see, it just seems odd to always go against the grain. Imo JV was more of a off the board pick them OJ. I always felt uneasy about drafting JV that high, not something I feel about OJ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowardrobertford Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 7 hours ago, GettinGuddyWithIt said: That's the whole point. These prospects I mentioned all had great seasons. Juolevi was the consensus best D and we got him. Look at Derps post on page 33 and tell me that isn't exciting. Demko is the number 1 ranked goalie in the NCAA and Benning believes he has #1 potential and he will be a great goalie. Boeser is another beast. This guy broke records in his first year. Toews had 42 points in 39 games in his first year at North Dakota. Boeser had 60 points in 39 games! Virtanen will be great. At 19 years he's dropping guys like Kesler..imagine in his prime! This guy has all the skill set and will succeed. My point of the other post was mentioning the prospects we have and what they've done, NOT if they're proven in the NHL because again...they're elite PROSPECTS and you should be excited. How about other teams prospect who have had great seasons. Bennett,larkin, nylander , ehlers has so much better season than Virtanen, who cross the puck waist high as if shooting it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForsbergTheGreat Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 On 6/27/2016 at 11:13 PM, MickVega said: The last time a top Dman in their prime went to free agency was Chara, ten years ago. When is the last time a potential top 2 Dman got aquired in a trade without an obnoxious asking price? You get defence through drafting. That's really the only way. I've only watched Joulevi during the WJC but he made Laine and Pulijarvi better. He'll do that in Van too. Guys like Tkachuk, those are the ones who get scooped during free agency. I agree with your point that it's best for canucks to try and draft players but top paring D man get moved all the time. In fact I would say over half of the nhl teams have a top paring guy on their team they didn’t draft. ARZ – Goligoski BOS – Chara BUF - Bogosian CGY – Hamilton CBJ - Jones COL – Johnson EDM –Soon to be Shattenkirk FLA –Yandle MIN – Suter MTL – Markov/Petry NYI – Boychuk/Leddy NYR –McDonagh SJ –Burns TB - Carle Van – Gudbranson WSH – Niskanen WPG – Byfuglien/Myers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.m.sawers Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 9 hours ago, DeNiro said: He's 31 now and is gonna cost them 9 mil a season for the next 4 years. I'd rather us acquire and develop a D-man in their prime that will cost a fraction of that. Only real way to do that is through the draft. He was 28 at the time he signed and has a 7.5M cap hit a year. Suggest looking up your facts before posting lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
73 Percent Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 3 minutes ago, ForsbergTheGreat said: I agree with your point that it's best for canucks to try and draft players but top paring D man get moved all the time. In fact I would say over half of the nhl teams have a top paring guy on their team they didn’t draft. ARZ – Goligoski BOS – Chara BUF - Bogosian CGY – Hamilton CBJ - Jones COL – Johnson EDM –Soon to be Shattenkirk FLA –Yandle MIN – Suter MTL – Markov/Petry NYI – Boychuk/Leddy NYR –McDonagh SJ –Burns TB - Carle Van – Gudbranson WSH – Niskanen WPG – Byfuglien/Myers Hmmmm. Not sure i agree with that. You're 100% right in saying that these guys were not drafted by tjeir current teams. I dont however consider them top pairing guys (even though they may be on the top pair on their current team). Does that make any sense? For me, I want a TOP defenseman in the LEAGUE. Not just a top guy on our team. Those kinds of defenseman rarely move. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.m.sawers Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 8 hours ago, Blömqvist said: Signed as a UFA at age 28. His contract is downright ridiculous, 13 years at $98M, for an average cap hit of $7.5M/yr I agree with Deniro. I'd much rather draft a stud defenseman, have him develop alongside our core to make them better too, and have him at a discounted cost. We could always sign a first line forward in free agency, there's usually a handful every year and we wouldn't need to spend $100M on him either. I agree the contract length is ridiculous but the cap hit isn't bad for now until suter slows down. Its always better to draft elite defenseman but i was only proving deniro wrong, i dont know where he gets his facts or cap hits/ contract lengths Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForsbergTheGreat Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 1 minute ago, Gooseberries said: Hmmmm. Not sure i agree with that. You're 100% right in saying that these guys were not drafted by tjeir current teams. I dont however consider them top pairing guys (even though they may be on the top pair on their current team). Does that make any sense? For me, I want a TOP defenseman in the LEAGUE. Not just a top guy on our team. Those kinds of defenseman rarely move. #1 D and top pairing D are different, I was quoting the idea that top 2 d don't get move. And these guys are exactly what are considered top pairing guys. There's probably only about 15 true #1 D in the league and these guys cost a lot but they do get moved. Burns is probably the best example but Chara (at one point), McDonagh and Suter could be put into that same category. Jones and Hamilton also have the top end potential to become true #1 D's in the league. So it shows that drafting really isn't the only way to get a #1 D. I think the idea is that people get caught up with 8-10 elite D (which are truly untouchable) and then that these elite players become the definition of what people consider a #1 D. Yes it would be nice to have a Norris contention D, and it is true these elite D are usually acquired through drafting, but it's a long shot for any draft pick to be labelled a league wide future top 10 D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MickVega Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 10 hours ago, C.m.sawers said: Ryan Suter signing in Minnesota 3 years ago ring a bell? Pretty good #1 dman If you read my edit from a day ago you'll see I added that. But sure, 2 free agents signings instead of 1 in decade totally negates my point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 17 minutes ago, MickVega said: If you read my edit from a day ago you'll see I added that. But sure, 2 free agents signings instead of 1 in decade totally negates my point. Your point is valid. To sign an elite number one D man as a UFA is near impossible (Suter and Chara). To trade for one is completely impossible. (NONE) we just drafted a guy (Olli) with that potential. We Win! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.m.sawers Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 49 minutes ago, MickVega said: If you read my edit from a day ago you'll see I added that. But sure, 2 free agents signings instead of 1 in decade totally negates my point. dustin byfuglien was a trade but makes a pretty good #1 dman but i do get your point, Of the 15 or so #1 dman 12 are with the team that drafted them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clam linguine Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 20 minutes ago, C.m.sawers said: dustin byfuglien was a trade but makes a pretty good #1 dman but i do get your point, Of the 15 or so #1 dman 12 are with the team that drafted them. Lol...If there are only fifteen #1 defenders in the league...we need to drop the term. (there should be 30...no?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khay Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 On 6/26/2016 at 1:01 AM, Odd. said: Sami Salo should mentor this guy! Teach him the ways of the clapper... First and foremost, Salo should teach Olli to shoot right. Bring back Sedin to Salo Juolevi PP one timers. Jokes aside, I like this pick more I think about it. A puck moving defenceman that can skate. Sounds like something that we have been wanting for...ever? Sucks that we missed out on Dubois and possibly Puljujarvi (trading up) but we addressed one of our weaknesses through this draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 26 minutes ago, C.m.sawers said: dustin byfuglien was a trade but makes a pretty good #1 dman but i do get your point, Of the 15 or so #1 dman 12 are with the team that drafted them. 4 minutes ago, clam linguine said: Lol...If there are only fifteen #1 defenders in the league...we need to drop the term. (there should be 30...no?) Dustin Byfuglien is not an ELITE number one D. We are discussing Olli's potential of becoming an ELITE number one D. Elite Number ones play in all circumstances: head the PP, PK, 5on5, and they are excellent in ALL those situations. They log heavy and numerous minutes. No matter the circumstance, they control the game when on the ice. Olli did that for London and the Finnish national team, while leading both to championships, winning the award of top D, and at 17/18 years old, against (in many cases) players 2 years older. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elvis15 Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 1 hour ago, clam linguine said: Lol...If there are only fifteen #1 defenders in the league...we need to drop the term. (there should be 30...no?) Semantics. You can say "true #1s" and "top defender on each team" to differentiate if it makes you happy. Generally saying #1 means both the handful of elite defenders and the top level D in the league that can really be a #1 anywhere. Edler for instance doesn't necessarily qualify as a true number one even if he's close. Keith and Seabrook might be in the conversation on the same team though so they could have two #1s versus it just being the top defender on each team. Juolevi could be a true #1, but he has a ways to go to get to that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derp... Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 10 hours ago, guntrix said: Not trying to discredit Juo's effort in the WJC but he was on the ice A LOT with Puljujarvi and Laine. You should watch the shift-by-shift videos, most of his points consisted of passing it to either of those two and letting them work their magic. So one of the things I've noticed is that JUOLEVI is very good at creating time and space for his linemates by drawing forwards to him self of the point allowing guys to get open on the half wall or at the top of the circles. Juolevis game is about the details. Sometimes we need to read between the lines a little 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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