bp79 Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 On 9/26/2016 at 2:54 PM, canuktravella said: dmen that play 23 mins plus per game provide some offense and shut down top teams oppposition and sign 2 mill below market value long term have way more value than a second rounder try a decent young forward a first and a good prospect but he wont waive his ntc hes going nowhere It amazes me how undervalued this forum for the most part craps on Edler. A second rounder is a friggen joke Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smokes Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 I may be the only one but the more I hear about this story, the more I don't like Trouba. What I don't understand is if you are a professional athlete and you are competative, why would you not just go into training camp and try to beat the top two right handed defenceman on your team to earn the spot. To me the kid is crying because is isn't getting the top options handed to him, What does that truly say about this kid as a player? Pass, the Canucks are better off keeping whatever they would have had to give up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrible.dee Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 On 9/24/2016 at 5:44 PM, Warhippy said: So....stuff they want. By offering them futures. One of which will end up stuck again in the depth chart when they're trying to compete and win now. And from our perspective you're giving up a potential top 2 d and possibly a lottery pick 1st rounder for a guy who is going to be a solid top 4 or #2 when we need the depth and futures. Again. Wait until Monty p p before getting crazy 2 Winnipeg doesn't want the salary, this deal gives them huge value at zero cap. What are they going to be offered elsewhere? Nuge who will be a 6 mill guy? One of Colorados guys at the same or greater? Other players who can't wait to get the hell out of Winnipeg first chance they get? The key to running that team is to have guys enter the league there, they are far more likely to stay. Our offer would be seriously considered. As far as we go, you must RISK big time to get top end talent, there's no other way. Everyone on this board wants good players but nobody wants to pay for them, and we don't. We then end up with a stale, middle of the road roster that people don't even want to give up Chris "Mr Exzcitment" Tanev to fix. It's like Vancouver wants the most Vanilla roster possible. And if they don't they think we can give up a lot of things that don't hurt for one big piece. This is reality: If your proposal doesn't hurt,it probably sucks. And if no one on your roster breaks 100 pts 100 PMS and your stars are nearing 100 years old. it's time to SHAKE THINGS UP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Surfer Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 22 hours ago, mll said: McKenzie was just on TSN1040 and said the Canucks do not have the assets. It would need to be Hutton + + + . He says there are very few options around the league for the type of return they are looking for - he names Lindholm and Ristolainen as examples. He thinks that the Jets are going to be very patient and not rush a trade. The hard deadline is 1 Dec because that's the deadline by which a player can no longer play in the NHL for the season. Its a good thing the Jets have a good prospect system. It was already near impossible to attract good UFA's. Making it known they will jam a guy, indirectly via the press, isn't great. I would be offering a good bridge contract > say $4 mill. And letting him know they will be working on his situation. To that end I would be trying to trade Myers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 26 minutes ago, terrible.dee said: Winnipeg doesn't want the salary, this deal gives them huge value at zero cap. What are they going to be offered elsewhere? Nuge who will be a 6 mill guy? One of Colorados guys at the same or greater? Other players who can't wait to get the hell out of Winnipeg first chance they get? The key to running that team is to have guys enter the league there, they are far more likely to stay. Our offer would be seriously considered. As far as we go, you must RISK big time to get top end talent, there's no other way. Everyone on this board wants good players but nobody wants to pay for them, and we don't. We then end up with a stale, middle of the road roster that people don't even want to give up Chris "Mr Exzcitment" Tanev to fix. It's like Vancouver wants the most Vanilla roster possible. And if they don't they think we can give up a lot of things that don't hurt for one big piece. This is reality: If your proposal doesn't hurt,it probably sucks. And if no one on your roster breaks 100 pts 100 PMS and your stars are nearing 100 years old. it's time to SHAKE THINGS UP You're failing to see the issue with that Trouba is currently cheap but will need a huge pay raise if reports are correct. Chevy is not/will not trade him out west. Tanev for Trouba is silly because Tanev is a less offensive Trouba at a larger cap hit and will be stuck behind Byfuglien and Myers like Trouba currently is Giving them our futures for a guy who may be an issue (look at his history for trade rumours/demands and his agent) is crazy They don't need futures they need to compete now Benning flat out said we don't have the assets to make it work When making trade proposals you look at both teams' needs and wants. Winnipeg is deep at the RHD, they don't need more. Winnipeg is deep in prospects. They don't really need more. Winnipeg needs solid young bodies to compete now which we don't have to give. Shaking things up to shake things up is how bad things happen. This is reality, if your proposal is panned by a lot of people even jets fans, it probably sucks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IBatch Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 On 9/25/2016 at 11:05 AM, Eastcoast meets Westcoast said: Okay, What would you give up to get Trouba? Just trying to find the consensus value. Thats a hard one. Maybe Virtanen. But I don't think they would do that given their glut of good young forwards. Trouba would be a great addition to our defense and our future. Maybe using picks straight up would do it for them, who knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monty Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 7 hours ago, bp79 said: I keep hearing about all the young depth the peg has, but what I see is a lot of tweeners and boom or bust types. imo Laine is not worth all the hype. I think Jesse will end up the best player out of this draft and it chokes me to say that. Conner who knows how his game will translate. you keep bringing up the kane trade. and how chevy raped Murrey yet I don't see who came back besides myers who is overrated imo You talk about the Jets having these superb goaltending prospects. Good yes Elite I don't see anyone of them becoming better then Demko or marky for that matter. You say Dano armia etc would be ahead of Hanson sorry but that is laughable. What I see are a bunch of future tweeners. Ehlers seems a bit overrated imo All this supposed talent yet they still are a bottom team year after year. And on a personal note I'm from the the Peg and I love the city because of the people, hence the license plates. Yet you constantly post on here putting people down and being condescending in almost every post. Just cuz you live in the peg doesn't give you the right to act like you are in the know with the organization. What did this entire rant have to do with my response you quoted? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 16 minutes ago, Monty said: What did this entire rant have to do with my response you quoted? You're a community mod too? What the hell so much police police state CDC Don't tase me bro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salacious Crumb Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 Puhleeze! Why does CDC feel the need to propose a trade for every single player that becomes available? We are fine on defence and short on forwards. Don't need anymore on the uptick dmen. Especially when the GM controlling said player is probably not going to trade within the division without emerging the clear victor (anyone remember Edm sniffing around Schneider before he went to Jersey?). Let's try and add to our forward group please. K, end of my rant. Beer time now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 4 hours ago, Warhippy said: You're failing to see the issue with that Trouba is currently cheap but will need a huge pay raise if reports are correct. Chevy is not/will not trade him out west. Tanev for Trouba is silly because Tanev is a less offensive Trouba at a larger cap hit and will be stuck behind Byfuglien and Myers like Trouba currently is Giving them our futures for a guy who may be an issue (look at his history for trade rumours/demands and his agent) is crazy They don't need futures they need to compete now Benning flat out said we don't have the assets to make it work When making trade proposals you look at both teams' needs and wants. Winnipeg is deep at the RHD, they don't need more. Winnipeg is deep in prospects. They don't really need more. Winnipeg needs solid young bodies to compete now which we don't have to give. Shaking things up to shake things up is how bad things happen. This is reality, if your proposal is panned by a lot of people even jets fans, it probably sucks I agree with this valuation of Trouba. I don't want him on the Canucks for sure. Any guy who wants to leave his team, because he feels he deserves more and better ice time is a non starter for me. Plus, since he now has this reputation, the Jets will have to accept a guy with a similar public issue, or futures. That's good though. Hate the Jets, and this is a Canuck's forum, isn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 8 hours ago, bp79 said: It amazes me how undervalued this forum for the most part craps on Edler. A second rounder is a friggen joke Usually comments undervaluing our players comes from fans of other teams, don't you think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ice orca Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 3 minutes ago, Alflives said: Usually comments undervaluing our players comes from fans of other teams, don't you think? The revers happens with a lot of Canuck fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 17 minutes ago, ice orca said: The revers happens with a lot of Canuck fans. I agree, but it's a Canuck's fans' board, no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForsbergTheGreat Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 17 minutes ago, Alflives said: I agree, but it's a Canuck's fans' board, no? Just because it's a canucks fan board doesn't mean us canucks fans need put on the homer blinders. It wasn't that long ago people thought Raymond + Ballard and a 1st could net any player in the league. Player value around the league isn't something to do with being a fan of the team it has far greater to do with a overall hockey knowledge. Over valuing your players is almost poisonous to being a fan of the team. You start to see other deals around the league and they get upset that you're overvalued players didn't get the same types of returns. It's so common to see MG/JB got out GMed. That's why it's best to follow all hockey teams and not live in the bubble that your players are the best. Don't like personal bias get in the way of player evaluation. And most people do tend to like hockey as a sport in general, they can admire other teams and players and it doesn't make them less of a canucks fan. Over the last few years I've really started to enjoy watching the capitals play due to ovi, kuz and backstrom (and for a very brief period filip Forsberg). In the past I used to enjoy watching the Av's due to forsberg, Sakic and Roy. When Bure got traded I tried to watch as many panthers games as I could, I've had flames season tickets for the last few years and I hate the flames. That doesn't mean I liked those teams more, Not at all, if those teams ever played against the canucks I always cheer for the canucks. Watching and liking other teams/players doesn't make someone less of a canucks fan, but what It does do, is it gives them a better understanding on those teams needs and values. A better understanding of total hockey knowledge, which makes hockey discussions much more realistic....That is unless people enjoy living in the clouds, thinking Sbisa straight up would get us Crosby. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 1 hour ago, ForsbergTheGreat said: Just because it's a canucks fan board doesn't mean us canucks fans need put on the homer blinders. It wasn't that long ago people thought Raymond + Ballard and a 1st could net any player in the league. Player value around the league isn't something to do with being a fan of the team it has far greater to do with a overall hockey knowledge. Over valuing your players is almost poisonous to being a fan of the team. You start to see other deals around the league and they get upset that you're overvalued players didn't get the same types of returns. It's so common to see MG/JB got out GMed. That's why it's best to follow all hockey teams and not live in the bubble that your players are the best. Don't like personal bias get in the way of player evaluation. And most people do tend to like hockey as a sport in general, they can admire other teams and players and it doesn't make them less of a canucks fan. Over the last few years I've really started to enjoy watching the capitals play due to ovi, kuz and backstrom (and for a very brief period filip Forsberg). In the past I used to enjoy watching the Av's due to forsberg, Sakic and Roy. When Bure got traded I tried to watch as many panthers games as I could, I've had flames season tickets for the last few years and I hate the flames. That doesn't mean I liked those teams more, Not at all, if those teams ever played against the canucks I always cheer for the canucks. Watching and liking other teams/players doesn't make someone less of a canucks fan, but what It does do, is it gives them a better understanding on those teams needs and values. A better understanding of total hockey knowledge, which makes hockey discussions much more realistic....That is unless people enjoy living in the clouds, thinking Sbisa straight up would get us Crosby. I agree with you completely excepting one point. I think we would have to add a second to Sbisa to get Crosby. My opinions on value of Canucks' players compared to other teams' players are my opinion. Right or wrong, it's my opinion. Tanev (IMHAO) is worth more than Landeskog has been my opinion on these two players' value. Those who differ, it's their opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smokes Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 The logical trade might be Druin for Trouba Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bp79 Posted September 29, 2016 Share Posted September 29, 2016 5 hours ago, Monty said: What did this entire rant have to do with my response you quoted? MY post wasn't directed at any one particular post. Actually, it was more directed to all the comments you made in the Trouba post. Almost every post you made in that thread you put down anybody with an idea. Some people seem to think you have some inside insight to what the Jets are thinking, yet you yourself said the media and fans were not in the loop about his trade request yet you contradicted yourself by saying that you knew as soon as they traded for Myers. So how is it that you knew yet like you said the fans and media were in the dark? Who makes you the expert on the Jets? Just because you live there makes no difference since you get your info the same way we do in Vancouver, through the media, which is usually rumours and innuendo no matter what city. I get you love the Jets, but you are no more in the loop than anyone in any other city and it amazes me that people actually defer making comments until you have given your opinion. You are just a fan who has an obvious bias towards your hometown team, and that is fine we are all guilty of doing that to some extent. What bothers me is that all you ever talk about is the Kane trade as your reason to justify how good the Jets team is. Yet what has that trade done for you? Myers is a bust Lemiex looks like a bottom six at best Armia dido. Now you think that teams are gonna line up for an obvious diva who has declined since his rookie year, And the jets look like a team poised for another long season. I have nothing against a fellow Pegger and i am proud to be born there I just think They are way overhyped and I think it is sad that a city like that has gone nowhere I question your hockey smarts when you say Hanson would be on the 4th line yet he outscored every guy you had ahead of him. I am sorry to call you out ,but for all this supposed talent the jets have yo have nothing to show for it. And for the record, you have no proof that they refused to trade Kane to Vancouver. And chevy can play his waiting game,all that will do is drive down the price of an already overrated diva who instead of busting his arss to usurp Myers, decided he would rather just bail. Maybe im wrong ,but i see a long long season in the peg and all the tire pumping won't change that. And if it is true about Trouba wanting out a good gm would have made a deal before it went public. now you will get a diminished return all because chevy thought he could wait for that perfect deal well good luck on that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monty Posted September 29, 2016 Share Posted September 29, 2016 2 hours ago, bp79 said: MY post wasn't directed at any one particular post. Actually, it was more directed to all the comments you made in the Trouba post. Almost every post you made in that thread you put down anybody with an idea. Some people seem to think you have some inside insight to what the Jets are thinking, yet you yourself said the media and fans were not in the loop about his trade request yet you contradicted yourself by saying that you knew as soon as they traded for Myers. So how is it that you knew yet like you said the fans and media were in the dark? Who makes you the expert on the Jets? Just because you live there makes no difference since you get your info the same way we do in Vancouver, through the media, which is usually rumours and innuendo no matter what city. I get you love the Jets, but you are no more in the loop than anyone in any other city and it amazes me that people actually defer making comments until you have given your opinion. You are just a fan who has an obvious bias towards your hometown team, and that is fine we are all guilty of doing that to some extent. What bothers me is that all you ever talk about is the Kane trade as your reason to justify how good the Jets team is. Yet what has that trade done for you? Myers is a bust Lemiex looks like a bottom six at best Armia dido. Now you think that teams are gonna line up for an obvious diva who has declined since his rookie year, And the jets look like a team poised for another long season. I have nothing against a fellow Pegger and i am proud to be born there I just think They are way overhyped and I think it is sad that a city like that has gone nowhere I question your hockey smarts when you say Hanson would be on the 4th line yet he outscored every guy you had ahead of him. I am sorry to call you out ,but for all this supposed talent the jets have yo have nothing to show for it. And for the record, you have no proof that they refused to trade Kane to Vancouver. And chevy can play his waiting game,all that will do is drive down the price of an already overrated diva who instead of busting his arss to usurp Myers, decided he would rather just bail. Maybe im wrong ,but i see a long long season in the peg and all the tire pumping won't change that. And if it is true about Trouba wanting out a good gm would have made a deal before it went public. now you will get a diminished return all because chevy thought he could wait for that perfect deal well good luck on that. Gotcha. So your post wasn't directed at the post you quoted. It was, like this one, riddled with inconsistencies of my previous posts (ie. reading one thing and taking it a different way), spelling mistakes, and improper grammar. This is the last I'll post in response to you, and instead of pointing out all your inconsistencies when discussing my posts, to which you haven't quoted outright, I'll comment on just the first two in this last post: 1. I knew about the Myers trade as I "occasionally" (I use that loosely) golf with a known Jets insider. He heard serious rumblings about 12 hours before it occurred. 2. My "Hansen" (yes, that is how you spell his name) argument as a 4th liner, was also followed up by saying why he would be a 4th liner on the Jets, due to his age and salary. As I pointed out, the Jets have a boatload of RWs and young talent to fit into the lineup. Bringing in unwanted $2.5M salary isn't in the cards for them. The likelihood is that Stafford is going to be moved to the 3rd line, as the Jets "lucking out" and getting a lottery selection to solve their scoring problem on the right side has pushed a lot guys down. Hansen on the Jets literally makes zero sense. You don't need to have bias to get that, just have basic knowledge of a team's depth chart and salary structure. And I'm also not from Winnipeg. And, had you ever read my posts instead of reading what you choose to hear, the Jets are not only not my favourite team, they are not even my second favourite team. ---------------------------- Now, back on track, as this thread is about Trouba's trade request, not baiting poster's about past posts that have nothing to do with Trouba. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuktravella Posted September 29, 2016 Share Posted September 29, 2016 23 hours ago, bp79 said: It amazes me how undervalued this forum for the most part craps on Edler. A second rounder is a friggen joke ya is absurd id trade edler for first and a top ten drafted dman thats been sonewhat developed in ahl otherwise id tell teams to beat it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lui's Knob Posted September 30, 2016 Share Posted September 30, 2016 Apparently the Jets would like Hutton for Trouba. interesting 1-1 offer especially if stecher works out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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