[Report] If Pierre-Luc Dubois slid down to #5, PK Subban would be a Vancouver Canuck

[DeNiro]

8 hours ago, Quinn12 said:

Imagine Tkachuk, Boeser, Horvat up front.. Come on

Well the good thing is we have another chance to make that a reality.

 

And Brady is probably going to end up being the better of the two.

[Crabcakes]

On 1/25/2018 at 8:59 AM, Keenan's Moustache said:

Well, if your French is up to par, give this a read:

https://www.habsolumentfan.com/canadiens/marc-bergevin-a-refuse-une-transaction-qui-aurait-sauve-le-canadien?ref=marco

Marc Bergevin a refusé une transaction qui aurait sauvé le Canadien!

Quelle grave erreur!

Publié le mercredi, 24 janvier 2018 par Marco Normandin dans Canadiens

Le 24 juin 2016, quelques jours seulement avant que PK Subban ne soit échangé aux Predators de Nashville en retour de Shea Weber, nous vous rapportions l'information que les Canucks de Vancouver avaient soumis une offre à Marc Bergevin pour mettre la main sur le défenseur vedette du Canadien.

 

 

Cette information, provenant du journaliste Elliotte Friedman, voyait le jour peu de temps après que le DG des Canucks, Jim Benning, avait ouvertement avoué négocier avec le CH dans le dossier Subban.

 

 

Aujourd'hui, dans son podcast 31 Thoughts, Friedman est revenu sur les événements et a affirmé qu'un membre important de l'organisation des Canucks lui a confirmé qu'une offre formelle avait bel et bien été offerte à Bergevin.

 

 

Voici l'offre qui était sur la table en retour de Subban: Le jeune joueur de centre Bo Horvat, le défenseur Chris Tanev en plus de leur choix de 1ere ronde, soit le 5e total.

 

 

Toujours selon Friedman, le DG du Canadien aurait refusé cette offre lorsqu'il a appris que les Blue Jackets de Columbus avaient l'intention de repêcher le joueur qu'il convoitait, Pierre-Luc Dubois, au 3e rang total.

 

 

Si Bergevin avait accepté l'offre des Canucks, le Canadien aurait aujourd'hui son centre de 1er trio (Horvat), un défenseur top-3 (Tanev) et il aurait pu repêcher un de ces joueurs au 5e rang: Olli Juolevi-D, Matthew Tkachuk-AG, Clayton Keller-C, Alexander Nylander-AD ou Tyson Jost-C en plus de repêcher le défenseur Mikhail Sergachev quelques rangs plus tard.

 

 

On se souviendra qu'à l'époque, Tyson Jost était très haut sur la liste de repêchage du CH.

 

 

Si parfois on dit que les meilleures transactions sont celles qu'on ne fait pas, dans ce cas-ci, il risque de le regretter longtemps! 

 

In the summer of 2016 (just after the 2015-16 season and one year removed from losing to the Flames in the playoffs) Bo Horvat put up 16 goals and 40 pts while also posting a horrendous -30 in his second full NHL season (albeit, one season before he was voted to his first All-Star game), Chris Tanev was continuing his stellar defensive play in another sub-70 game season due to injuries, and the 5th overall was just a lottery ticket.  Meanwhile, Subban had put up his 3rd straight 50+ pt season while leading the Habs to their first season of missing the playoffs in 4 years, all the while being just 3 years removed from winning the Norris.

 

While I agree that the trade would've been overpayment on the part of the Canucks, even based on what we know now, this ask was not far-fetched for a Norris-winning #1 d-man.  After making the playoffs the season before, perhaps it was ownership's mandate/belief that the 2016 season was a blip on the radar and that the Canucks were just missing a player or two from getting back to the dance, and this trade would've been able to extend the team's window for a while longer.  It just further cements the fact that top-pairing/legitimate #1 D-men are worth their weight in gold and do not often become available for trade unless a vast overpayment was offered.  In hindsight, sometimes the best trades are the ones you don't make. 

My French is good enough to read Horvat, Tanev and the 5th (PL Dubois)......damn good thing that didn't happen

 

We know the Habs were panting over Dubois but to sell the farm for Subban or any other single player....no thanks

 

Talk at the time was the Canucks wanted Dubois for themselves anyways (that was fan talk and the Van press which should be taken with a grain of salt)

[Calvin's Dog]

Maybe it is true that JB would have done this. At the time Horvat may have ‘seemed’ expendable with McCann in the pipeline.

as someone said: Somtimes the best trades are the ones that aren’t done.

 

We’ve seen what this team is without Horvat!

 

[oldnews]

There's a reason the majority of these armchair scenarios never came to be - most of them don't live up to a measure of realism - this one included.

 

There is no way Benning sells the farm -  Horvat, Tanev, top 5 pick - no veteran asset in the NHL makes sense at that price in this team's circumstances.

 

I think too many people get caught up misunderstanding what this management group is actually doing - because it doesn't quite fit their tankdown aspirations.

The either/or logic and the assumption that is spun off into - that the team is trying to win in the short term - is way off base / misinformed.

It might come down to misunderstanding what is meant by remaining competitive - something in this context that is distinctly different than a short term goal to win.

[The Great Canucks]

4 hours ago, oldnews said:

There's a reason the majority of these armchair scenarios never came to be - most of them don't live up to a measure of realism - this one included.

 

There is no way Benning sells the farm -  Horvat, Tanev, top 5 pick - no veteran asset in the NHL makes sense at that price in this team's circumstances.

 

I think too many people get caught up misunderstanding what this management group is actually doing - because it doesn't quite fit their tankdown aspirations.

The either/or logic and the assumption that is spun off into - that the team is trying to win in the short term - is way off base / misinformed.

It might come down to misunderstanding what is meant by remaining competitive - something in this context that is distinctly different than a short term goal to win.

The real issue with this trade scenario is how serious management was with this offer to Montreal. I actually remember two years ago when Subban finally was traded that the 5th overall pick was the deal breaker for us. Montreal apparently wanted our 5th and we didn't want to give it up. Now, apparently we would have traded it?

 

I want to know how serious our offer was and if we would have pulled the trigger, even if Montreal accepted.

[oldnews]

27 minutes ago, The Great Canucks said:

The real issue with this trade scenario is how serious management was with this offer to Montreal. I actually remember two years ago when Subban finally was traded that the 5th overall pick was the deal breaker for us. Montreal apparently wanted our 5th and we didn't want to give it up. Now, apparently we would have traded it?

 

I want to know how serious our offer was and if we would have pulled the trigger, even if Montreal accepted.

Unfortunately no one that knows is likely to share that information - but I can tell you how much of the peripheral noise I buy....

[MJDDawg]

If the Canucks won their spin on the roulette wheel, we would've drafted Gilbert Perreault.

[Me_]

“[Report] If Pierre-Luc Dubois slid down to #5, PK Subban would be a Vancouver Canuck”

 

Had the Canucks drafted PK Subban in 2007 under Nonis and Vigneault, PK Subban wouldn’t be PK Subban today.

[Nave]

On 1/28/2018 at 7:33 PM, DeNiro said:

Well the good thing is we have another chance to make that a reality.

 

And Brady is probably going to end up being the better of the two.

I would rather we get Svechnikov. Dude has almost a goal a game, and would continue Benning's trend of drafting players with great shots. 

[Nave]

On 1/25/2018 at 2:17 PM, N7Nucks said:

Butterfly effect would then bring up the questions as to whether or not we'd have Pettersson, Lind, Gadjovich, we might still have Gadjovich and DiPietro as they could have gone slightly later. Subban is exactly the kind of puck moving D-man we've been looking for since Erhoff. He would have brought some much needed life to our abysmal PP. How much different would this team be with a legit top 2 d-man? Interesting speculation. Benning was worried about losing Pettersson to New York so I imagine if we dropped behind them we wouldn't have Pettersson. I do feel this team would have been a much better team with Subban in the lineup. But alas, we did not get Dubois. So this is just like salt in the wound over another draft lottery that screwed us. Lol.

I would love to have Subban, but not if it means not having Pettersson and Lind. 
Seems like a blessing in disguise. 

[JeremyCuddles]

3 hours ago, NaveJoseph said:

I would love to have Subban, but not if it means not having Pettersson and Lind. 
Seems like a blessing in disguise. 

Definitely would suck not having Pettersson. Maybe having Subban would have put us in Philly or New Jerseys spot and we draft 1st/2nd overall instead though. 

[smithers joe]

apparently subban was a cancer in the dressing room for montreal. that is why they traded him. would he have killed our dressing room too? 

[smithers joe]

11 hours ago, Me_ said:

“[Report] If Pierre-Luc Dubois slid down to #5, PK Subban would be a Vancouver Canuck”

 

Had the Canucks drafted PK Subban in 2007 under Nonis and Vigneault, PK Subban wouldn’t be PK Subban today.

so columbus could have had subban too? 

[JM_]

1 minute ago, smithers joe said:

apparently subban was a cancer in the dressing room for montreal. that is why they traded him. would he have killed our dressing room too? 

I have a very hard time believing those stories, given everything he did for the community and other team mates saying that isn't the case. 

[qwijibo]

14 minutes ago, smithers joe said:

apparently subban was a cancer in the dressing room for montreal. that is why they traded him. would he have killed our dressing room too? 

I don’t buy that for a minute.  Doesn’t seem to be an issue in Nashville.  Look how many of his teammates joined him in his visit to the children’s hospital yesterday.  Therrien didt like him. French coach in a French city with a French GM won out over an Anglo player. 

[mll]

3 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

I have a very hard time believing those stories, given everything he did for the community and other team mates saying that isn't the case. 

The nominee for the King Clancy is selected by the players on the team - it's described as leadership qualities on and off the ice and who has made a significant humanitarian contribution to his community.  Montreal players nominated Pacioretty the year Subban made his donation.  

 

He also had a video up on his return to Montreal where he says that not once his teammates in Montreal asked to go and visit the hospital with him. He was very touched because Josi and Fisher asked if they could join him.  

[rekker]

21 minutes ago, smithers joe said:

apparently subban was a cancer in the dressing room for montreal. that is why they traded him. would he have killed our dressing room too? 

His personality seems grating. From what I can see on the ice, interviews, documentaries I see a guy who loved to be the centre of attention and will put himself above the team to do so. Ya I know just speculation. But where there is smoke there is usually fire. 

[JM_]

12 minutes ago, mll said:

The nominee for the King Clancy is selected by the players on the team - it's described as leadership qualities on and off the ice and who has made a significant humanitarian contribution to his community.  Montreal players nominated Pacioretty the year Subban made his donation.  

 

He also had a video up on his return to Montreal where he says that not once his teammates in Montreal asked to go and visit the hospital with him. He was very touched because Josi and Fisher asked if they could join him.  

maybe that says more about his team mates in Montreal? 

[mll]

1 minute ago, Jimmy McGill said:

maybe that says more about his team mates in Montreal? 

They seem to really like him in Nashville.  They are actually in Montreal today and there was a whole group of them that went to visit the hospital with Subban.  

[rekker]

But do you really think if he was so well loved they would of turfed him for an older, more expensive dman? This after just signing PK to a long contract? PK who plays a modern style over Weber's stay at home style? A fan favourite? Not buying it. I'm guessing his teammates were tired of his circus act.