JB has thrown away far too many assets - needs to be replaced as GM

[Alflives]

3 minutes ago, kanucks25 said:

Yes, every unbiased analyst is a clown because they disagree with you.

 

Very logical.

The TSN guys and eastern Toronto media are not without bias.  They have to be propaganda puppets for the Leafs or they don’t have jobs.  Plus, smearing Vancouver sells.  They are clearly very biased, as are all media.  

[iceman64]

7 minutes ago, kanucks25 said:

Yes, every unbiased analyst is a clown because they disagree with you.

 

Very logical.

Has zero to do with bias...or disagreement dude.. 

However i'd bet you believe everything they tell you. 

Very logical

Edited July 2, 2019 by iceman64

[iceman64]

5 minutes ago, kanucks25 said:

People who disagree with you aren't trolls, they just have a different opinion. Shocking, I know, that you can be disagreed with, but it is possible.

Speaking of trolls.. 

[J-23]

7 minutes ago, kanucks25 said:

People who disagree with you aren't trolls, they just have a different opinion. Shocking, I know, that you can be disagreed with, but it is possible.

A lot of the old heads on here have no idea what a troll is.

[kanucks25]

3 hours ago, debluvscanucks said:

The proof's in the puddin'.

 

Are you enjoying this team?  Or crying because of "what could have been"?

 

Does the future look bright?  Or is it clouded, possibly from exhaust fumes from sticking your head out the window and focusing on what's in the mirror behind instead of the road ahead?

 

There's no "blindly" here...it's more of an acceptance that it sounds really easy to pull this roster thing off but it's all done with some uncertainty, leaps of faith and thinking of current needs and wants as well as down the road.  Some here have tunnel vision - like the tank team that sacrifices the team in the here and now for what "could" be.

 

I'm loving this team and the prospect of the future.  Not sure why others are stuck in the past...you're missing some good stuff.

 

"Assets" are only so if they work out that way.  Not all do - so it's important to keep that in mind.  

 

Assets as "picks" are unknowns.  But some here blindly treat them like they were going to be the best thing for the team regardless.  You just don't know how picks will fare when they hit the NHL.  Maybe, maybe not.

Assuming things couldn't be better, couldn't have been done different/better is just a different type of tunnel vision.

 

JB's tenure hasn't been some sort of inevitable destiny, as if he did everything he could and there were no better options available.

 

Until he puts together a real team, not one that "might" be good in a few years, I don't see how he has earned that benefit of the doubt.

[spur1]

11 minutes ago, J-23 said:

A lot of the old heads on here have no idea what a troll is.

Really.... you do know trolls have been around long before the internet. 

[J-23]

3 minutes ago, spur1 said:

Really.... you do know trolls have been around long before the internet. 

The troll toys?

 

[-DLC-]

1 hour ago, kanucks25 said:

Assuming things couldn't be better, couldn't have been done different/better is just a different type of tunnel vision.

 

JB's tenure hasn't been some sort of inevitable destiny, as if he did everything he could and there were no better options available.

 

Until he puts together a real team, not one that "might" be good in a few years, I don't see how he has earned that benefit of the doubt.

Listen, I'm not saying "he's the best".  Some are saying "he's the worst - get rid of him" though.

 

There are always better options available in this thing...problem is, they reveal themselves after the fact.  Which helps make my point - deciding someone has been bad based on some of those things turning out bad isn't really fair.  There are some good/bad options that pan out...roll the dice and see which ones you've got.

 

What the hell is a "real team"???   I'd like to hear that one explained.

 

This team was actually fairly good last year, considering all things.   New team.  Injuries.   

 

JB hasn't earned the benefit of the doubters, either.   Let's just assess after it's all said and done, not during.  Because that's the standard that the "he's been crap" are applying here.

[kanucks25]

17 minutes ago, debluvscanucks said:

There are always better options available in this thing...problem is, they reveal themselves after the fact. 

Not true; some of the moves he's made have ranged from puzzling to downright baffling from day 1. It's not just revisionism.

 

19 minutes ago, debluvscanucks said:

What the hell is a "real team"???   I'd like to hear that one explained.

Like an actual contender? It's nice to have "pieces" and "prospects" but if they don't amount to anything, then it doesn't really mean anything.

 

I don't believe Benning has shown anything yet to give him the benefit of the doubt. He has no real history of putting together a winner. Yes, he was the AGM of a Stanley Cup Winner but Chiarelli was the GM and look at the complete disaster he was in Edmonton.

[spur1]

25 minutes ago, debluvscanucks said:

Listen, I'm not saying "he's the best".  Some are saying "he's the worst - get rid of him".

 

There are always better options available in this thing...problem is, they reveal themselves after the fact.  Which helps make my point - deciding someone has been bad based on some of those things turning out bad isn't really fair.  There are some good/bad options that pan out...roll the dice and see which ones you've got.

 

What the hell is a "real team"???   

 

This team was actually fairly good last year, considering all things.  He hasn't earned the benefit of the doubters, either.   Let's just assess after it's all said and done, not during.  Because that's the standard that the "he's been crap" are applying here.

I agree that JB may not be the best GM out there, however I think that he is one of the better GM,s now that he has been in place for a few years. Yes he made some rookie mistakes but from what I am seeing he has learned from his mistakes and is making much improved decisions. The team has improved in leaps and bounds in the last two seasons. 

What “The Trolls” fail to mention is the handcuffs JB had in the first years not being able to move the Sedins. (A class move by management by the way). 

Bottom line is if Aqua fires JB he won’t be unemployed for long unlike MG. 

[Zigmund.Palffy]

GM JB a genius ... OP needs to wake up 

[Baggins]

1 hour ago, kanucks25 said:

Not true; some of the moves he's made have ranged from puzzling to downright baffling from day 1. It's not just revisionism.

 

Like an actual contender? It's nice to have "pieces" and "prospects" but if they don't amount to anything, then it doesn't really mean anything.

 

I don't believe Benning has shown anything yet to give him the benefit of the doubt. He has no real history of putting together a winner. Yes, he was the AGM of a Stanley Cup Winner but Chiarelli was the GM and look at the complete disaster he was in Edmonton.

How do you get to "cup contender" without passing through the "might be good" phase? Or is there some secret method of going from bottom feeder to actual cup contender in one year?

[Phat Fingers]

How is this thread at 40 pages? 

 

We all need to pit our devices down and go outside.  

[kanucks25]

1 hour ago, Baggins said:

How do you get to "cup contender" without passing through the "might be good" phase? Or is there some secret method of going from bottom feeder to actual cup contender in one year?

Never said there's a way to bypass it, just saying until it's done, I'm skeptical because I disagree with the majority of the moves he's made thus far.

 

I did give him the benefit of the doubt when he first got the job because of his success in Boston and how strong his reputation seemed to be, but that quickly dissipated for me personally.

[WHL rocks]

9 hours ago, debluvscanucks said:

You lose any credibility here.

 

2018-19 Finished 23rd our of 31

2017-18 Finished 26th out of 31

2016-17 Finished 29th out of 30

2015-16 Finished 28th out of 30

 

Not once during the past 4 years were we "the worst team in the league".

 

When people fabricate or, at the very least, exaggerate their point, it's usually because it can't stand on its own.

 

 

https://dailyhive.com/vancouver/canucks-march-losses-2019

 

"After three years of being basement dwellers in the home stretch – the team has the worst cumulative record in the last four seasons –"

 

I don't know why you quoted my post from back in march and questioned my credibility...

 

But a simple Google search would show you that canucks had the worst record over 4 years. 

 

 It was widely reported and talked about.   I believe there was a thread on the topic on CDC as well.  

 

Edit:

Here's the link from cdc thread back in March 2018 when Canucks were the worst team in NHL over previous 3 years.

 

 

So no I don't lose any credibility. 

 

 

 

Edited July 3, 2019 by WHL rocks

[Baggins]

On 3/23/2019 at 2:21 PM, WHL rocks said:

Perhaps I want the team not to be the worst team in the league over the past 4 years.  

1) It's tough to rebuild an entire team without hitting bottom.

 

2) JB would have needed a better starting point than a team of aging veterans (many with ntc's) on the decline with no prospect pool. 

 

3) With no prospect pool to draw from for call ups we'd need to stay healthy. Instead we've been among the hardest hit with injuries over the past four seasons, particularly among key players.

 

4) Even had JB cleaned house immediately we would have been a team of AHL'ers and low cost ufa rejects. Meaning they would all also need to be replaced guaranteeing us to be a bottom feeder for years regardless of injuries.

 

The simple truth is there was no quick fix for a rebuild. Too many players needed to be replaced and our top prospects in Utica were Guance, Shinkaruk, Jansen and Corrado. None of whom have established themselves as NHL'ers in five years. In all my years following hockey (and I'm older than dirt) I've never seen a GM take over a team in a less enviable situation than Benning got. The moves that seemed to confounded many made sense to me in his situation.

 

At least we haven't become the Oilers:

09/10 30th

10/11 30th

11/12 29th

12/13 24th

13/14 28th

14/15 28th

15/16 29th

 

I'd wager they were firmly the worst team in the league over a 7 year period and likely would be the worst in the league over a nine year period if you added the year before and after that 7 year stretch in. Plus, despite all those high picks and the extra picks they traded for, we just finished ahead of them in the standings. We're on our way up after five years while starting with virtually nothing. 

[bloodycanuckleheads]

There's an aspect to this that no one really looks at...  Behind the scenes, Gillis gave us the best organization in the NHL.  We had all sorts of ridiculous stuff like sleep experts and travel experts.  We even had a contract and salary-cap expert in Gilman.  Anything Gillis could do to make the team a tiny bit better (off the ice) he did.  Benning has apparently dismantled this entire operation and replaced it with...  Nothing.  And, not surprisingly, we seem to constantly have salary-cap and contract issues.  We're getting injured a lot more.  Etc...

[CanadianRugby]

25 minutes ago, Baggins said:

1) It's tough to rebuild an entire team without hitting bottom.

I wanted those high picks so I wasn't mad.  However, you have a 30 out of 31 chance of not being on the bottom.  That's not very tough..  

25 minutes ago, Baggins said:

2) JB would have needed a better starting point than a team of aging veterans (many with ntc's) on the decline with no prospect pool. 

However true that may be.  A much better job could have been done with what they DID have.  Some players that walked had value, some players that were kept for that one more run.. just lost value over time.  When they goal is the playoffs, and not maximum return on vets then that leaves room for criticism when you end up on the bottom anyways.

25 minutes ago, Baggins said:

3) With no prospect pool to draw from for call ups we'd need to stay healthy. Instead we've been among the hardest hit with injuries over the past four seasons, particularly among key players.

Seems like every year 

25 minutes ago, Baggins said:

4) Even had JB cleaned house immediately we would have been a team of AHL'ers and low cost ufa rejects. Meaning they would all also need to be replaced guaranteeing us to be a bottom feeder for years regardless of injuries.

Ya.  So in hindsignt (and what many of us were calling for from the start), draft picks would have been the better choice over vets. 

25 minutes ago, Baggins said:

At least we haven't become the Oilers:

This reminds me of what was said in some Eastern European countries back in the cold war.  "At least we're not Romania."  

Is this where we're still at?  

[oldnews]

24 minutes ago, bloodycanuckleheads said:

There's an aspect to this that no one really looks at...  Behind the scenes, Gillis gave us the best organization in the NHL.  We had all sorts of ridiculous stuff like sleep experts and travel experts.  We even had a contract and salary-cap expert in Gilman.  Anything Gillis could do to make the team a tiny bit better (off the ice) he did.  Benning has apparently dismantled this entire operation and replaced it with a...  Nothing.  a scouting staff. And, not surprisingly, we seem to constantly have salary-cap and contract issues.  injuries

ftfy

[10pavelbure96]

29 minutes ago, bloodycanuckleheads said:

There's an aspect to this that no one really looks at...  Behind the scenes, Gillis gave us the best organization in the NHL.  We had all sorts of ridiculous stuff like sleep experts and travel experts.  We even had a contract and salary-cap expert in Gilman.  Anything Gillis could do to make the team a tiny bit better (off the ice) he did.  Benning has apparently dismantled this entire operation and replaced it with...  Nothing.  And, not surprisingly, we seem to constantly have salary-cap and contract issues.  We're getting injured a lot more.  Etc...

None of that stuff is the GMs job. Maybe the presidents or the owner.

 

Benning deals with hockey ops. And the largest hole he fixed was scouting.

 

These JB haters have really long arms cause they keep reeeaaachhhinng.