kanucks25 Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 3 minutes ago, LionofJudah said: Playing devils advocate here - could those charged just "think" they are innocent? Having not known what they were doing was wrong etc. I could sit here and say I'm something and truly believe it to be true and have 10 other people think something totally different of me. What becomes the truth? In the line of this story, I have had many conversations with my abuser and he very openly and clearly believes he is innocent. Does that make me a liar that I believe a completely different take or him a liar? Based on her story, if accurate, to me it seems like this could be what happened. He was a clueless, ignorant, horny kid and because she would eventually go along with whatever he wanted, perhaps he thought she was playing hard to get and he was just playing the game. It's completely possible that he thought the whole thing was consensual even if it wasn't at all. That doesn't exonerate him in any way, but I imagine that would be side of the story (again, if her side of the story is accurate). It's not uncommon for victims to either freeze in these situations, or just go along with it in fear of worse consequences if they say no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LionofJudah Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 3 minutes ago, fecklund said: It could very much possibly make him a narcissist. My ex was one and I had no idea what I was dealing with until it was almost too late. She almost destroyed my life. My advice is RUN and don't look back - EVER. I have run. However it took me a long time, and a lot of damage was done. Which I'm working through with professionals. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
combover Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 JV toffoli 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 (edited) 4 minutes ago, VegasCanuck said: They wouldn't have to buy him out. If this is real, this would be grounds to terminate his contract. Players are expected to maintain a certain level of professionalism at all times in public. They could trigger an immediate termination clause this summer if real they'll likely have to as this won't be resolved before the buyout window. They can not pay him the 2nd year of the buyout money if he's convicted, maybe go after him to recover year 1 of the buyout money. Edited May 1, 2021 by Jimmy McGill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fecklund Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 1 minute ago, Alienhuggyflow said: Lots of examples like this. What's sad about these comments here are there are people who have experienced terrible events in their life me included and to mention them in the same breath as something that not only hasn't been proven but to say this is as bad as the Pedo who assaulted me along with numerous other boys, or the other people here who've had similar stories in no way belong in the same topic as what's happening with Jake. Let's be honest here, they met on tinder where the main draw is casual SEX, they agreed to go to a hotel to obviously have consenting sex. Of course maybe she decided after all that she didn't want to hook up with him, but if that was the case and he decided to rape her why wait 3 years? I understand victims often wait but those usually involve family or similar complicated scenarios. Sadly it seems there are many cases where athletes have been accused only to be proven it was an attempt to get some monetary gain. I'm sure I'll get piled on here but this is turning into a witch hunt by some and the fact people are so quick to pass judgment because he's a young rich good looking white male, I prefer actual evidence not speculation. If I was a high profile public figure, the LAST thing I'd do is create an online dating profile. I'm in no way saying this girl is lying but those places are filled with sharks, both men and women. As a young millionaire though, I can see how you could mistake the pile of crap as a shiny emerald. Big mistake IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 2 minutes ago, combover said: JV toffoli this has nothing to do with Benning 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dumb Nuck Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 Just now, Jimmy McGill said: this has nothing to do with Benning Didn’t it happen on Bennings boat? Sorry 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arrow 1983 Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 1 minute ago, LionofJudah said: Playing devils advocate here - could those charged just "think" they are innocent? Having not known what they were doing was wrong etc. I could sit here and say I'm something and truly believe it to be true and have 10 other people think something totally different of me. What becomes the truth? In the line of this story, I have had many conversations with my abuser and he very openly and clearly believes he is innocent. Does that make me a liar that I believe a completely different take or him a liar? There is no truth in law. There is law in law. Law is interpretation. That is what you are talking about one's interpretation of law. That is why there is so much Grey area. I can tell you Virtanen does not have to figure out her mentality she says she was sober. We are taught no means no but actions play into it as well if she says no and is stopped from leaving. The law has been broken clearly. She says no and let's him take her shirt off and pants and gets naked she said she had the opportunity to leave but she didn't. Then at the end of the story she says she felt she couldn't leave because he was a hockey player. Virtanen doesn't have to figure out what she is thinking she stayed and was not forced to stay she allowed it to escalate.her actions did not fit her words. I do believe her I think she felt pressured to stay because of who he was but that is not Virtanen's fault. It is a good possibility she went with him because he was a hockey player. She can then not use that as an excuse not to leave. If she wanted to leave she physically could have he did not stop her Mentality I believe she felt she couldn't. That's not Virtanen's fault Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fecklund Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 3 minutes ago, LionofJudah said: I have run. However it took me a long time, and a lot of damage was done. Which I'm working through with professionals. Best of luck to you. It's been about 8 years and I'm still working through stuff too. Baby steps. You'll get through it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad_BOI_pete Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 3 minutes ago, combover said: JV toffoli not here, not today or anyday. this thread is about a serious crime allegation. please post benning related posts elsewhere 1 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 (edited) 13 minutes ago, VegasCanuck said: They wouldn't have to buy him out. If this is real, this would be grounds to terminate his contract. Players are expected to maintain a certain level of professionalism at all times in public. They could trigger an immediate termination clause this summer if real It’s worth noting that the Canucks team statement includes the language “we have engaged external expertise to assist in an independent investigation.” I would assume a big part of the independent investigation would be to determine if there are grounds for contracts termination, regardless of what the outcome might be of any criminal investigation. You are very correct that the CBA and player contracts contain numerous statements that basically function as “morals clauses,” and it likely wouldn’t (and shouldn’t IMO) require a conviction for sexual assault for Virtanen to be terminated, based on this allegation, and the results of the team’s own investigation. EDIT: Just in case anything might be misconstrued, I’m not saying Virtanen is guilty. That remains to be determined. Just that a criminal investigation not resulting in a conviction doesn’t necessarily mean that he’ll escape contract termination. If the team determines they have grounds, from whatever they uncover through their own investigations, I think they would very likely pursue contract termination. (also I don’t know what happened with the font size in this post) Edited May 1, 2021 by SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arrow 1983 Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 How many have you actually read her side of the story Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LionofJudah Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 2 minutes ago, Arrow 1983 said: There is no truth in law. There is law in law. Law is interpretation. That is what you are talking about one's interpretation of law. That is why there is so much Grey area. I can tell you Virtanen does not have to figure out her mentality she says she was sober. We are taught no means no but actions play into it as well if she says no and is stopped from leaving. The law has been broken clearly. She says no and let's him take her shirt off and pants and gets naked she said she had the opportunity to leave but she didn't. Then at the end of the story she says she felt she couldn't leave because he was a hockey player. Virtanen doesn't have to figure out what she is thinking she stayed and was not forced to stay she allowed it to escalate.her actions did not fit her words. I do believe her I think she felt pressured to stay because of who he was but that is not Virtanen's fault. It is a good possibility she went with him because he was a hockey player. She can then not use that as an excuse not to leave. If she wanted to leave she physically could have he did not stop her Mentality I believe she felt she couldn't. That's not Virtanen's fault I can see clearly now the fault in the law... why is there a comment "she said no but let him take her shirt off" even in here. If she said no, why the hell is he even bothering to take her shirt off to open the possibility of her actions not suiting her words. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WillyFox Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 He will never play another game in a Canucks uniform, quote me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LionofJudah Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 6 minutes ago, fecklund said: Best of luck to you. It's been about 8 years and I'm still working through stuff too. Baby steps. You'll get through it Cheers. Best of luck to you as well. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maniwaki Canuck Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 People suggesting we might get out of this by trading Jake must be tripping. Pretty sure they tried that before all this stuff hit the fan. If it didn't happen then, it sure isn't happening now. We are looking at a full-on stranded asset here, or better, ex-asset. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arrow 1983 Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 Just now, LionofJudah said: I can see clearly now the fault in the law... why is there a comment "she said no but let him take her shirt off" even in here. If she said no, why the hell is he even bothering to take her shirt off to open the possibility of her actions not suiting her words. have you read her story. She said no but then he smoothed talked her and he takes her shirt of few mins later. What she doesn't say is she took her shirt and put it back on No and actions have to line up. If she was drunk which she says she wasn't and did not have the capability to stop him or even put her shirt back on then yes no is all that would matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arrow 1983 Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 4 minutes ago, LionofJudah said: I can see clearly now the fault in the law... why is there a comment "she said no but let him take her shirt off" even in here. If she said no, why the hell is he even bothering to take her shirt off to open the possibility of her actions not suiting her words. you quoted it I did not I paraphrased therefore did not use quote symbols Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger-Hearted Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 1 hour ago, gurn said: 1) Who knows? 2) Who cares? Let's just get back to the post you made about not passing judgement, right after allegeding someone had personal demons. Okay, dude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
70seven Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 Hopefully it’s bogus from a humanistic POV.... but not like the team will miss his presence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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