JohnTavares Posted May 17, 2021 Author Share Posted May 17, 2021 31 minutes ago, Sbriggs said: No way, OJ has been too limited on his ice time and when he has been in the lineup he has been good. He'll for sure be a top 4. I see you like to shout loudly about the misses that JB has had at the draft but what about his hits? Several home runs as I see it and the best GM at drafting in Canucks history Are you Benning's cousin or something? This can't be real... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSVII Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 (edited) 43 minutes ago, knucklehead91 said: Did you see a future before the Sedins retired? Do you see a future after the Sedins retired? I can see a future now and its not too far away. Petey, Boeser, Horvat, Miller, Hoglander, Hughes, Demko, Dipietro, Lind, Gadjovich, Lockwood, Woo, Rafferty, Podkolzin, Juolevi, Rathbone, another top 10 pick. And many more up and coming prospects with potential. we are lightyears ahead of where we were 4 years ago. Oh I can see it now. We're going to lose one of these names you listed due to mismanagement/a bad trade and guaranteed you are going to turn around and say they weren't a big deal to begin with, just like how people have turned on Stetcher and Tanev. It wasn't too long ago your list would have included Madden, McCann, Forsling, Dahlen, Gaudette, Tryamkin Edited May 17, 2021 by DSVII Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnTavares Posted May 17, 2021 Author Share Posted May 17, 2021 Just now, stawns said: this year is not a year to use as a standard for any player or the team. Until this season his progress was steadily moving upward, with two 20 goal pace seasons, despite not getting time in the top 6 for more than a period or two at a time. Just because you don't like a player, it doesn't change the numbers. I'm glad you mentioned the numbers. 5 goals in 38 games for Jake the Snake, with ample top six opportunities. But somehow it's Greens fault? Are you kidding me man. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bishopshodan Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 JB is good. He has drafted very well. I think that completely explains my opinion in great detail. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 1 minute ago, JohnTavares said: So when team is bad = disregard team is good = regard Wow. You do realize that COVID literally saved this team last year right? They were trending downwards and Markstrom and Boeser were hurt. They likely would have missed the playoffs last year. The Canucks won a couple games in the bubble due to Vezina level goaltending from Markstrom and Demko, and now suddenly that's the benchmark we are using? Some of y'all are really smoking the good stuff. anyone who doesn't put a huge asterisk on this season is a waste of time debating with. Honestly, this was a best case scenario.......it's a meaningless season out of the gate and they'll get a top 10 pick put of it. If they'd won the Cup this year, I truly wouldn't have considered it legitimate. I said that before the season even began. It's a joke 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostsof1915 Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 2 hours ago, Alflives said: Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Alf. When Alf sees a cat. AKA....lunch. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 2 minutes ago, JohnTavares said: I'm glad you mentioned the numbers. 5 goals in 38 games for Jake the Snake, with ample top six opportunities. But somehow it's Greens fault? Are you kidding me man. in a season with no training camp, a ridiculous schedule and a full team covid infection. It's a meaningless, joke of a season and was from day one. Get over it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patel Bure Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 (edited) 6 minutes ago, JohnTavares said: So when team is bad = disregard team is good = regard Wow. You do realize that COVID literally saved this team last year right? They were trending downwards and Markstrom and Boeser were hurt. They likely would have missed the playoffs last year. The Canucks won a couple games in the bubble due to Vezina level goaltending from Markstrom and Demko, and now suddenly that's the benchmark we are using? Some of y'all are really smoking the good stuff. Covid didn’t “literally” save the team last year. It may have, but we can’t make that leap. None of us know what would have happened, and there was just as much evidence to support the fact that we were breaking our slump. While the Canucks had been slumping (largely due to a grueling road trip that pretty much made their home stand feel like a road trip), they were clearly starting to tighten up and play better during their last few games. Demko also started to acclimate to the #1 role a lot better. Prior to the Covid break, the Canucks won 2 of their last 3 games......one of which was against the Avs, and the other against the Isles (two teams that made the 2nd round last year). Your comments are arrogant and biased, and are also very dismissive of our efforts against St.Louis, Minnesota, and Vegas in the bubble. Edited May 17, 2021 by Patel Bure 1 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShawnAntoski Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, Patel Bure said: Covid didn’t “literally” save the team last year. It may have, but we can’t make that leap. None of us know what would have happened, and there was just as much evidence to support the fact that we were breaking our slump. While the Canucks had been slumping (largely due to a grueling road trip that pretty much made their home stand feel like a road trip), they were clearly starting to tighten up and play better during their last few games. Demko also started to acclimate to the #1 role a lot better. Prior to the Covid break, the Canucks won 2 of their last 3 games......one of which was against the Avs, and the other against the Isles (two teams that made the 2nd round last year). Your comments are arrogant and biased, and are also very dismissive of our efforts against St.Louis, Minnesota, and Vegas in the bubble. Just based on the handle of the poster he seems to be just trolling this forum - must be boring in the Laffs (echo chamber) of a forum. Go Habs !; and I wonder who the Zebras will prefer in that original 6 series ? I wonder what his take is on the Laffs performance in last years playoffs were they were once again fodder in the first round ? Edited May 17, 2021 by ShawnAntoski 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanucksJay Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 11 minutes ago, stawns said: Virtanen - cpmplete mismanagement of him' Boes - no brainer OJ - that is completely injury related, but actually turned out to be helpful in the context of the Cap. Had they picked MT they'd struggle to keep him, EP, TD and QH. Petey - all day everyday Hughes - no brainer Podz - again, all day, everyday Pettersson is the best player out of that entire list. Also how about Hog and Demko. Those were gems in the 2nd round Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 1 minute ago, CanucksJay said: Pettersson is the best player out of that entire list. Also how about Hog and Demko. Those were gems in the 2nd round I was just going off the list he provided Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostsof1915 Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 My report card. Drafting: Excellent. Pro Scouting: Ugly to Meh to Great Managing contracts and the cap: Lousy I'd say I've seen worse GM's and I've seen better. Quinn was the best at wheeling and dealing, but miserable at drafting. Gillis was terrible at drafting, Good at cap management. So-so on contracts. Can you really say Gillis was great on contracts when he was giving out NTC's like crazy? Then there's the Luongo deal. Honestly I see where he was going but it was truthfully. Crap. Rarely do goalies play into their 40's. And he saved what? $1-1.3 million per season? He would have been better off paying Luongo $6.3 and 5 years. Done. Now we're still suffering from that contract. If you won't cut Benning slack, why cut Gillis slack? Gillis played chicken with the NHL head office. Thought he'd outfoxed them. Now we're still paying the price. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fanuck Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 The main issue I have with these supposed 'honest conversations' is that rarely - and this thread is a perfect example - is it mentioned or thoroughly acknowledged that throughout JB's tenure its been clear he hasn't been 100% free to build the team his own way - Aquaman has been in the background giving him directives and we have no idea what JB would've/could've done if he had complete discretion. Yes, it's Aquaman's team, but the word 'disingenuous' has been used many times in this thread and I fully believe Aquaman has been disingenuous with this fan base in the sense that he's severely limited JB,s decision making by asking him to do the impossible which is to make payoffs every year starting from a point in time when this franchise was essentially gutted of any meaningful young prospects save for maybe 2 . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 4 minutes ago, ShawnAntoski said: Just based on the handle of the poster he seems to be just trolling this forum - must be boring in the Laffs (echo chamber) of a forum. A thousand and a thousand more very fat and tender cats to you sir for hitting the nail on the head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShawnAntoski Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Alflives said: A thousand and a thousand more very fat and tender cats to you sir for hitting the nail on the head. Glad to see your back - Alf lives ! I miss the comedy during those time.. Edited May 17, 2021 by ShawnAntoski 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josepho Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 19 minutes ago, stawns said: Virtanen - cpmplete mismanagement of him' Boes - no brainer OJ - that is completely injury related, but actually turned out to be helpful in the context of the Cap. Had they picked MT they'd struggle to keep him, EP, TD and QH. Petey - all day everyday Hughes - no brainer Podz - again, all day, everyday Juolevi wasn't projecting well before he had injury issues. He might turn into a decent player, but he very obviously is one of the worst players taken high in that draft. And this logic that it was an excusable pick because he's not good enough to cost money is ridiculous. By the same logic, Pettersson/Hughes/Boeser weren't helpful to our team because they end up costing money and putting us up against the cap. And even if Tkachuk did lead to us struggling with the cap, then we could trade him for a bunch of picks. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 1 minute ago, Josepho said: Juolevi wasn't projecting well before he had injury issues. He might turn into a decent player, but he very obviously is one of the worst players taken high in that draft. And this logic that it was an excusable pick because he's not good enough to cost money is ridiculous. By the same logic, Pettersson/Hughes/Boeser weren't helpful to our team because they end up costing money and putting us up against the cap. And even if Tkachuk did lead to us struggling with the cap, then we could trade him for a bunch of picks. https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/juniors/sportsnets-final-top-30-2016-nhl-draft-prospects/ he was taken right about where he was projected to go and he was a big part of the Mem Cup winning Knights team. It's been well documented that JB was never going to pick MT. OJ was projected as the top dman in the draft and was picked accordingly. He's been very good in his games this year and looks like he will likely slide into a top 4 role next season. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 9 minutes ago, Fanuck said: The main issue I have with these supposed 'honest conversations' is that rarely - and this thread is a perfect example - is it mentioned or thoroughly acknowledged that throughout JB's tenure its been clear he hasn't been 100% free to build the team his own way - Aquaman has been in the background giving him directives and we have no idea what JB would've/could've done if he had complete discretion. Yes, it's Aquaman's team, but the word 'disingenuous' has been used many times in this thread and I fully believe Aquaman has been disingenuous with this fan base in the sense that he's severely limited JB,s decision making by asking him to do the impossible which is to make payoffs every year starting from a point in time when this franchise was essentially gutted of any meaningful young prospects save for maybe 2 . I don't think it's disingenuous for an owner to want to try and make the playoffs every season, especially in Canada. That should always be the bar you try to reach. It makes it tougher to rebuild, but I think JB has balanced that fairly well. I will say, and have always said, that I doubt JB will be here to enjoy the fruits of his labour, much the same way Nonis wasn't after his rebuild. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josepho Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 Just now, stawns said: https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/juniors/sportsnets-final-top-30-2016-nhl-draft-prospects/ he was taken right about where he was projected to go and he was a big part of the Mem Cup winning Knights team. It's been well documented that JB was never going to pick MT. OJ was projected as the top dman in the draft and was picked accordingly. He's been very good in his games this year and looks like he will likely slide into a top 4 role next season. When I said Juolevi wasn't projecting well, I was referring to the 2016-2017 season after he was drafted. I don't care if it's been well documented that JB wasn't going to pick Tkachuk, that's his problem. If he's this "super scout", he should be able to identify the best players for the franchise. https://mapleleafshotstove.com/2016/06/22/2016-nhl-draft-rankings-june-22/ Aggregate rankings had Tkachuk substantially above Juolevi in the rankings -- it was definitely a reach at the time, especially since the top 5 was considered in their own tier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 Just now, Josepho said: When I said Juolevi wasn't projecting well, I was referring to the 2016-2017 season after he was drafted. I don't care if it's been well documented that JB wasn't going to pick Tkachuk, that's his problem. If he's this "super scout", he should be able to identify the best players for the franchise. https://mapleleafshotstove.com/2016/06/22/2016-nhl-draft-rankings-june-22/ Aggregate rankings had Tkachuk substantially above Juolevi in the rankings -- it was definitely a reach at the time, especially since the top 5 was considered in their own tier. mapleleafshotstove is your source? Yikes we wrren't talking about his post draft year, the debate was on who button would have drafted instead. I thought he was taking MT, but I am very glad that he passed 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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