Abby Canucks Coaching Staff Announced

[CRAZY_4_NAZZY]

3 hours ago, Ghostsof1915 said:

Correct me if I'm wrong. But the past few years we've only had like what 3 players in the ECHL per season. And it didn't do very well for their development. I think I've seen

as many as 5 at one point. But the ECHL doesn't seem to help players get better. They get games, but that's it. 

Aside from the 2015-2016 season, the Canucks have not had a steady flow of prospects go into their ECHL affiliate with the Kalamazoo Wings. The highest number of prospects they have housed in the ECHL was in the 2015/16 season that had 8 prospects that were Canuck property. Since then, only 4 that were Canucks property have played in Kalamazoo (Michael Gartieg 16/17, Mackenzie Stewart, 17/18, Mitch Eliot 19-20. Josh Teves 19/20)

 

This past NHL season, 56 former ECHL alumni who spent at least a full season in the ECHL were in NHL rosters, most notable names, Yanni Gourde, Jordan Binnington, Braden Holtby, Jay Beagle, Antoine Roussel, Jordie Benn, Kevin Lankinen, Ben Chariot, Brett Kulak, Anton Khudobin, Carter Verhaeghe, Chris Driedger, Jaroslav Halak and Vitek Vanecek to name a few notable NHL players.

 

Playing in the ECHL may be a long shot overall to get to the NHL, however, it certainly does unearth prospects and can lead to good development when proper systems are put in place to help them succeed. The Canucks just so have neglected to use it as a place for development as they do not hire coaches to go to ECHL affiliates to help further games. Michael Gartieg former Canuck prospect noted that in the ECHL they only have 2 coaches, the head coach and assistant coach. There was no skills coach and no goaltending coach in the ECHL so it was hard to work on little aspects of the games, and even with contact with Ryan Johnson and Curtis Sanford watching over, they didn't follow up on him very much in his time with Kalamazoo. However, even in Kalamazoo, players have been unearthed such as Yanni Gourde, Jordan Binnington, Matiss Kivelenieks have made NHL debuts and played meaningful games for their respected clubs.

 

Sure you may put efforts to yield very few results if any, but the ECHL is like a free token to store other prospects that are very raw, projects, or are not ready to make the jump to the AHL/NHL but are way too good for their junior circuits etc. I.e I have a feeling a Karel Plasek might benefit from ECHL seasoning as the AHL Abbotsford squad is going to be heavily stacked with veterans, it will be hard to find ice time for him to grow his game. 

 

Its just like when we want JB to get draft picks to have as many shots at unearthing a good find. Approaching development should be no different, and considering the Canucks have had a difficult time developing players beyond the 1st and 2nd round, they should look into a full depth audit of how they develop prospects.  

 

Benefits of having an ECHL affiliate:

 

1) natural filter of players to feed into the AHL whether on professional or amateur tryout basis. 

 

2) you give prospects that may be buried or finding hard to crack the AHL roster, time to play and develop if you provide them with a supportive structure.

 

3) You don't have to sign and waste standard player contracts that count to the 50 NHL limit to play in the ECHL. You can sign them to AHL deals or get them to do PTO's. Many players from the CHL, college ranks, and USHL often filter into this league, chances are you might find a late bloomer, such as a Chase Wouters. Not only does he develop in your system for free, but if he turns out good, you can sign him without wasting precious contract space on the main NHL and AHL roster limits. If you cast out a wide net, you never know what you can unearth.

 

I guess my argument is that the Canucks have not done enough to exercise full leverage of all avenues of developing prospects such as using their ECHL affiliates. Perhaps with establishing a new home base for their AHL franchise, they can start to venture out and find other avenues like the ECHL. Yes majority of the time it won't make a huge difference, but you could lucky and find a good player. Whether a serviceable depth guy or a impact bottom six player, or great backup goalie. 

[Stierlitz]

Abby Canucks team is hiring the communication and team services manager:

https://www.abbynews.com/sports/abbotsford-canucks-hiring-communications-and-team-services-manager/

[bigbadcanucks]

On 7/30/2021 at 10:32 AM, CRAZY_4_NAZZY said:

Aside from the 2015-2016 season, the Canucks have not had a steady flow of prospects go into their ECHL affiliate with the Kalamazoo Wings. The highest number of prospects they have housed in the ECHL was in the 2015/16 season that had 8 prospects that were Canuck property. Since then, only 4 that were Canucks property have played in Kalamazoo (Michael Gartieg 16/17, Mackenzie Stewart, 17/18, Mitch Eliot 19-20. Josh Teves 19/20)

 

This past NHL season, 56 former ECHL alumni who spent at least a full season in the ECHL were in NHL rosters, most notable names, Yanni Gourde, Jordan Binnington, Braden Holtby, Jay Beagle, Antoine Roussel, Jordie Benn, Kevin Lankinen, Ben Chariot, Brett Kulak, Anton Khudobin, Carter Verhaeghe, Chris Driedger, Jaroslav Halak and Vitek Vanecek to name a few notable NHL players.

 

Playing in the ECHL may be a long shot overall to get to the NHL, however, it certainly does unearth prospects and can lead to good development when proper systems are put in place to help them succeed. The Canucks just so have neglected to use it as a place for development as they do not hire coaches to go to ECHL affiliates to help further games. Michael Gartieg former Canuck prospect noted that in the ECHL they only have 2 coaches, the head coach and assistant coach. There was no skills coach and no goaltending coach in the ECHL so it was hard to work on little aspects of the games, and even with contact with Ryan Johnson and Curtis Sanford watching over, they didn't follow up on him very much in his time with Kalamazoo. However, even in Kalamazoo, players have been unearthed such as Yanni Gourde, Jordan Binnington, Matiss Kivelenieks have made NHL debuts and played meaningful games for their respected clubs.

 

Sure you may put efforts to yield very few results if any, but the ECHL is like a free token to store other prospects that are very raw, projects, or are not ready to make the jump to the AHL/NHL but are way too good for their junior circuits etc. I.e I have a feeling a Karel Plasek might benefit from ECHL seasoning as the AHL Abbotsford squad is going to be heavily stacked with veterans, it will be hard to find ice time for him to grow his game. 

 

Its just like when we want JB to get draft picks to have as many shots at unearthing a good find. Approaching development should be no different, and considering the Canucks have had a difficult time developing players beyond the 1st and 2nd round, they should look into a full depth audit of how they develop prospects.  

 

Benefits of having an ECHL affiliate:

 

1) natural filter of players to feed into the AHL whether on professional or amateur tryout basis. 

 

2) you give prospects that may be buried or finding hard to crack the AHL roster, time to play and develop if you provide them with a supportive structure.

 

3) You don't have to sign and waste standard player contracts that count to the 50 NHL limit to play in the ECHL. You can sign them to AHL deals or get them to do PTO's. Many players from the CHL, college ranks, and USHL often filter into this league, chances are you might find a late bloomer, such as a Chase Wouters. Not only does he develop in your system for free, but if he turns out good, you can sign him without wasting precious contract space on the main NHL and AHL roster limits. If you cast out a wide net, you never know what you can unearth.

 

I guess my argument is that the Canucks have not done enough to exercise full leverage of all avenues of developing prospects such as using their ECHL affiliates. Perhaps with establishing a new home base for their AHL franchise, they can start to venture out and find other avenues like the ECHL. Yes majority of the time it won't make a huge difference, but you could lucky and find a good player. Whether a serviceable depth guy or a impact bottom six player, or great backup goalie. 

Yup...like a gem like Alex Burrows. 

[Googlie]

Interesting piece on new hire Jeff Ulmer ....

 

https://theprovince.com/sports/hockey/nhl/vancouver-canucks/canucks-well-travelled-jeff-ulmer-brings-a-global-view-to-abbotsford-coaching-staff

[Kootenay Gold]

10 hours ago, Googlie said:

Interesting piece on new hire Jeff Ulmer ....

 

https://theprovince.com/sports/hockey/nhl/vancouver-canucks/canucks-well-travelled-jeff-ulmer-brings-a-global-view-to-abbotsford-coaching-staff

He would be a perfect fit as the poster boy for the Johnny Cash hit     "I've been everywhere"

[Ghostsof1915]

I know the team has been undermanned. But is it time to dump Cull as well? He's a holdover from the previous regime. Or do the Canucks hold off until next season?

[Quantum]

On 1/10/2022 at 7:57 AM, Ghostsof1915 said:

I know the team has been undermanned. But is it time to dump Cull as well? He's a holdover from the previous regime. Or do the Canucks hold off until next season?

I believe Trent Cull will be fired at the end of the season. My suspicion is that his contract is up at the end of the season and they likely won't extend him. The AHL is a huge part of Rutherford/Allvin's approach to developing talent for the NHL club and I expect a more interactive approach with the Abbotsford Canucks soon. If I'm not mistaken, Thomas Drance a few weeks ago floated the name Mike Vellucci as a possible Cull replacement. He's currently an assistant coach with the Penguins (shocker!) but was the head coach of Wilkes-Barre/Scranton Penguins before that. If Vellucci wants to be a head coach again, him going to Abbotsford wouldn't be a huge shocker. In the past, Rutherford has basically had his AHL teams play the exact same way stylistically as the NHL clubs he has run so players can transition from the AHL to the NHL seamlessly. This has not been in the case in Vancouver for years and the closest the Canucks resembled this model was back in the 2000's when the Canucks AHL affiliate was Winnipeg.

 

I also would be curious to see if the Canucks would circle in on Ben Boudreau as a possible coach for Abbotsford. He's Bruce's son who has been coaching the Fort Wayne Komets for the last few years (he's the head coach) and he won the Kelly Cup with the Komets last season. Not sure if it's a realistic option but Ben Boudreau is a younger coach (he's 37) with lots of potential and could do well if given the chance.

 

Regardless, I feel like all signs point to Trent Cull being dumped by the Canucks at the end of the season regardless of result. He's not a stylistic match to Bruce Boudreau and doesn't coach a "Rutherford" style of game.

[Timråfan]

On 2/4/2022 at 4:49 AM, Quantum said:

I believe Trent Cull will be fired at the end of the season. My suspicion is that his contract is up at the end of the season and they likely won't extend him. The AHL is a huge part of Rutherford/Allvin's approach to developing talent for the NHL club and I expect a more interactive approach with the Abbotsford Canucks soon. If I'm not mistaken, Thomas Drance a few weeks ago floated the name Mike Vellucci as a possible Cull replacement. He's currently an assistant coach with the Penguins (shocker!) but was the head coach of Wilkes-Barre/Scranton Penguins before that. If Vellucci wants to be a head coach again, him going to Abbotsford wouldn't be a huge shocker. In the past, Rutherford has basically had his AHL teams play the exact same way stylistically as the NHL clubs he has run so players can transition from the AHL to the NHL seamlessly. This has not been in the case in Vancouver for years and the closest the Canucks resembled this model was back in the 2000's when the Canucks AHL affiliate was Winnipeg.

 

I also would be curious to see if the Canucks would circle in on Ben Boudreau as a possible coach for Abbotsford. He's Bruce's son who has been coaching the Fort Wayne Komets for the last few years (he's the head coach) and he won the Kelly Cup with the Komets last season. Not sure if it's a realistic option but Ben Boudreau is a younger coach (he's 37) with lots of potential and could do well if given the chance.

 

Regardless, I feel like all signs point to Trent Cull being dumped by the Canucks at the end of the season regardless of result. He's not a stylistic match to Bruce Boudreau and doesn't coach a "Rutherford" style of game.

Great, this is probably one of the last pieces to fix since Cull, Green and Benning worked to the same goal wich was bad for the Canucks.

 

If I was JR I would replace Cull instantly because he isn’t any good for our prospects.

Edited February 6, 2022 by Timråfan

[EP Phone Home]

What was everyone’s thoughts on the job Trent Cull did this year? 

[DeNiro]

Just now, EP Phone Home said:

What was everyone’s thoughts on the job Trent Cull did this year? 

Coached a good team to its abilities but couldn’t get his team going when it mattered.

 

He’ll be replaced this offseason as JR will wanna have his own guy running the farm.

[EP Phone Home]

12 minutes ago, DeNiro said:

Coached a good team to its abilities but couldn’t get his team going when it mattered.

 

He’ll be replaced this offseason as JR will wanna have his own guy running the farm.

Thanks for the input. Can’t say I have been able to watch any Abby games this year and only highlights. That said hasn’t Cull been the Canucks farm coach as long as 5 seasons? I believe once Green was promoted to coach the Canucks that’s when Cull took over. Needless to say five years is more than enough time to develop some players from the farm up to the big club. Lockwood,Rathbone and Martin are the only ones who have really got some time with the big club.
 

 

I really hope after what JR said on Tuesday about seeing Abbotsford as a flagship team of the AHL, that he hires a coach that can get the best out of his players. That includes prospects that take the next step rather then bail on the club a la Palmu/Jasek/Dahlen/Rodin. 
 

Edited May 5, 2022 by EP Phone Home

[Fanuck]

2 minutes ago, DeNiro said:

Coached a good team to its abilities but couldn’t get his team going when it mattered.

 

He’ll be replaced this offseason as JR will wanna have his own guy running the farm.

Both JR and Allvin speak exceptionally highly of Ryan Johnson.  Johnson in turn, speaks highly of Cull.  I don't think it's necessarily a given that Cull will be replaced because of this one series loss - Johnson has said numerous times he has done a great job with the club in both Utica and Abby.

 

I've said it before and I'll say it again - you can't develop what you don't have, meaning Cull has been given very few players that would be classified as more than depth/role players at the NHL level.  Rathbone (and Demko obviously) was probably the only player on the team in recent seasons who has a legitimate NHL skill-set and he's developing just fine. 

 

NHL management as well as Johnson know that in the entire 1st round of the playoffs the Abby/Bakersfield match-up was likely going to be the closest of them all.  One overtime game and a 1 goal game support how close this match-up was.  It's unfortunate that the AHL 1st round was best of 3 as I suspect if it were 5 or 7 games things could have been different. 

 

Nevertheless, you're right, he didn't get the job done in the end and if ownership/managment decide to go a different direction I don't think people will be up in arms about it - perhaps it could be the right time to get new people down there? 

[EternalCanuckFan]

4 minutes ago, Fanuck said:

Both JR and Allvin speak exceptionally highly of Ryan Johnson.  Johnson in turn, speaks highly of Cull.  I don't think it's necessarily a given that Cull will be replaced because of this one series loss - Johnson has said numerous times he has done a great job with the club in both Utica and Abby.

 

I've said it before and I'll say it again - you can't develop what you don't have, meaning Cull has been given very few players that would be classified as more than depth/role players at the NHL level.  Rathbone (and Demko obviously) was probably the only player on the team in recent seasons who has a legitimate NHL skill-set and he's developing just fine. 

 

NHL management as well as Johnson know that in the entire 1st round of the playoffs the Abby/Bakersfield match-up was likely going to be the closest of them all.  One overtime game and a 1 goal game support how close this match-up was.  It's unfortunate that the AHL 1st round was best of 3 as I suspect if it were 5 or 7 games things could have been different. 

 

Nevertheless, you're right, he didn't get the job done in the end and if ownership/managment decide to go a different direction I don't think people will be up in arms about it - perhaps it could be the right time to get new people down there? 

Other thing to note about the Game 2 loss was that the GWG was scored on a questionable play.  Doesn't make up for the fact that Abbotsford didn't seem to be able to hit the ground running, but the series was closer than the 2 game sweep indicates.

[higgyfan]

25 minutes ago, EP Phone Home said:

I really hope after what JR said on Tuesday about seeing Abbotsford as a flagship team of the AHL, that he hires a coach that can get the best out of his players. That includes prospects that take the next step rather then bail on the club a la Palmu/Jasek/Dahlen/Rodin. 
 

The one thing all of those players have in common is that they weren't/aren't NHL players.

Even Dahlen is showing that he doesn't do defence and his offensive side took a huge

dip in the second half of the season. SJ will probably be tempted by his scoring (12 goals

is 4th on the team) so they will give him a short term deal 'show me' contract.  Not

that he's had a terrible rookie year, he simply has to work on the holes in his game

if he wants to stay in the NHL.

[EP Phone Home]

26 minutes ago, higgyfan said:

The one thing all of those players have in common is that they weren't/aren't NHL players.

Even Dahlen is showing that he doesn't do defence and his offensive side took a huge

dip in the second half of the season. SJ will probably be tempted by his scoring (12 goals

is 4th on the team) so they will give him a short term deal 'show me' contract.  Not

that he's had a terrible rookie year, he simply has to work on the holes in his game

if he wants to stay in the NHL.

I agree with you about Rodin and Dahlen not being strong defensively. They definitely didn’t play a 200ft game in the AHL. And Dahlen didn’t want to “earn his spot” on the Canucks and asked for a trade out. Had a hot start like you said but fizzled out during the stretch.
 

However I can’t agree with that about Jasek and Palmu. Who were two late picks that I have a hard time believing wouldn’t help down on the farm the way those two have been playing. 
 

Lukas Jasek-Had very good numbers in his last two seasons in Utica and had a very strong season in the Finnish SM liiga this past year had 51 points in 54 games with a +/- of +23. In his last two seasons in Utica he had a +/- of +15 and 27 points in 56 games in 2019/2020 and in 2020/2021 had +/- -5 (not bad but not great) and 23 points in 28 games. Again not ground breaking numbers but good enough to battle for a call up with the club when injuries occur. Why didn’t he hack it in the A when his numbers weren’t bad at all? I sure hope he’s still in the Canucks plans for either Van or Abby. 

 

Petrus Palmu- Another 24 year old prospect who also had a great year in the SM Liiga with +/- of +27 and 59 points in 59 games. Now how does this translates to the AHL is hard to say but his sample size in Utica was very small but I’m sure if he had the opportunity he would be a contributor to Abbotsford. He will get a NHL/AHL gig somewhere this off season. It’s too bad he didn’t work out with Cull in Utica in 

18/19 but looks like he’s a player now. 
 

it’s true that overall we just haven’t had a flowing pipeline of prospects coming through due to not having our allotment of picks the last few years and that effects our farm system with what the coaches can work with no question about it. I look forward to this new management restocking the cupboards so our farm team can be one of the best in the A like JR days earlier this week. 
 

Good chat Higgy!

 

 

 

[higgyfan]

23 minutes ago, EP Phone Home said:

I agree with you about Rodin and Dahlen not being strong defensively. They definitely didn’t play a 200ft game in the AHL. And Dahlen didn’t want to “earn his spot” on the Canucks and asked for a trade out. Had a hot start like you said but fizzled out during the stretch.
 

However I can’t agree with that about Jasek and Palmu. Who were two late picks that I have a hard time believing wouldn’t help down on the farm the way those two have been playing. 
 

Lukas Jasek-Had very good numbers in his last two seasons in Utica and had a very strong season in the Finnish SM liiga this past year had 51 points in 54 games with a +/- of +23. In his last two seasons in Utica he had a +/- of +15 and 27 points in 56 games in 2019/2020 and in 2020/2021 had +/- -5 (not bad but not great) and 23 points in 28 games. Again not ground breaking numbers but good enough to battle for a call up with the club when injuries occur. Why didn’t he hack it in the A when his numbers weren’t bad at all? I sure hope he’s still in the Canucks plans for either Van or Abby. 

 

Petrus Palmu- Another 24 year old prospect who also had a great year in the SM Liiga with +/- of +27 and 59 points in 59 games. Now how does this translates to the AHL is hard to say but his sample size in Utica was very small but I’m sure if he had the opportunity he would be a contributor to Abbotsford. He will get a NHL/AHL gig somewhere this off season. It’s too bad he didn’t work out with Cull in Utica in 

18/19 but looks like he’s a player now. 
 

it’s true that overall we just haven’t had a flowing pipeline of prospects coming through due to not having our allotment of picks the last few years and that effects our farm system with what the coaches can work with no question about it. I look forward to this new management restocking the cupboards so our farm team can be one of the best in the A like JR days earlier this week. 
 

Good chat Higgy!

 

 

 

Your comments on Jasek are correct and I always thought it unfair that he never

got a chance to play a few games with the Canucks.  Why the team didn't like his

game is a mystery, but it's their prerogative.  Of all the players you mentioned,

Jasek was the most diligent.

 

Pulmo only played in 12 games with Utica and then returned to Finland.  I believe

he thought his development would be better with his home team.  His stats do not

indicate he is NHL ready.  Even in his best year, he's 1st overall on the team and is

being challenged by an 18yr old 2nd rounder (Aatu Raty).

 

I don't know that any of these players would have faired any better on another teams'

AHL club. 

[Googlie]

Im really impressed with Colliton  -  very articulate.  Here he is after their 5 -2 win over the Firebirds

 

 

 

I guess having been an NHL coach helps 

 

 

Edited November 5, 2022 by Googlie