[Rumour] Bo Horvat Trade/Contract Talks

[N4ZZY]

11 hours ago, DownUndaCanuck said:

I'd consider we'd be still a winning team if we made a 1 for 1 trade, Bo for a top young defenceman. Otherwise if Bo is the best player in the trade we're worse off.

 

I think we can get him for 8 years x 7.5M but we'll have to do some real clearing of cap in the off-season.

 

Problem is we end up with a couple of mid 30 year olds costing us 15M at some point...

I don't think Bo's going to agree to 7.5M when he can get so much more in the open market. 

 

[N4ZZY]

4 hours ago, Rick_theRyper said:

Canucks need to learn when to cash in and stop buying in on 30 years olds during the off-season. Too many contracts are constantly just" riding them out" 

 

Loved Miller last year but he would have gotten more than Kesler did. Signed Beagle, Rooster, Ferland, Myers etc when we needed to surround the you kids with a good D core. Could have kept Tanev... So many mistakes. 

 

We have the young players and Bo should be the captain, but we blew out budget for 10 years... Now we'll ride out Miller and OEL, Boeser. 

 

Bah I'm gonna be pissed if we trade Bo and keep Miller. His attitude stinks. I watched him Live the other night he lags off the ice slower than Jake did, on the regular. Never hustles stays out too long. Not happy about it all 

Yeah, fans will be quite vocal if Bo's traded. We're already pissed off at the last 8 years, and we've lived through that, and we still have a crap team. 

 

New management with all of their diversity, can't seem to make the right decision. What the hell? 

 

[Drakrami]

3 hours ago, N4ZZY said:

I don't think Bo's going to agree to 7.5M when he can get so much more in the open market. 

 

Funny we could have signed Horvat for 7mil in the summer. Now hes going to command more than that. Is this a failure of the management? Not sure. 

[Alflives]

52 minutes ago, Drakrami said:

Funny we could have signed Horvat for 7mil in the summer. Now hes going to command more than that. Is this a failure of the management? Not sure. 

Considering Bo had a career year last season and has continued with the same this year and our team stinks, no it’s not a failure of management.  It’s smart.  Trade away older guys, who have value.  

Maybe it was a mistake to extend Miller? 

[JCorgi37]

5 hours ago, N4ZZY said:

I don't think Bo's going to agree to 7.5M when he can get so much more in the open market. 

 

Here's a question for the Forum...Does anyone think Bo is going to sign for less than what Miller's extension was? 

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, JCorgi37 said:

Here's a question for the Forum...Does anyone think Bo is going to sign for less than what Miller's extension was? 

Bo will sign for less than Miller.  It will be as a UFA next summer.  

[5nothincanucksohno]

36 minutes ago, JCorgi37 said:

Here's a question for the Forum...Does anyone think Bo is going to sign for less than what Miller's extension was? 

I assume he wants eight years so likely some flexibility on total dollars...so likely willing to sign for lower AAV but probably wants same total dollar amount.

[JCorgi37]

1 minute ago, 5nothincanucksohno said:

I assume he wants eight years so likely some flexibility on total dollars...so likely willing to sign for lower AAV but probably wants same total dollar amount.

You would hope there would be some dollar flexibility if he wants 8 years. However, if Im Bo's agent and I see Miller getting 8 x 8.5...I probably want the same. 

[Phat Fingers]

This team needs to build confidence in Demko.

 

he has faced too many shoots over the year, maybe having flashbacks, ptsd of having to keep the gang in each game for two years.

 

The loss of Myers off the hop was a bigger impact than we may want to acknowledge.

 

If the was a defensively sound AHL call up, then we don’t get royally embarrassed in Montreal.

 

But selling high, that’s a Rutherford way to go.

 

not sure about publicly running down the coach, if not to snap the players into how to not fall apart for whole periods of play.

 

If Horvat is moved. A very real possibility, it would be for a Defenceman that can fix a core issue on the roster.

 

goal scoring is the highest premium, face offs are another, size, another, history as a captain, another, age another.

 

Horvat would tick all the boxes for any team thinking seriously at a run.

 

if one of those teams holds a RHD that can play top four minutes that would suit Hughes, which some years left to play, in the package on the return, our NHL Center depth can sustain the loss of Horvat.

 

maybe this was why Studniak was picked up, to make a rebalancing of the roster possible with Horvat surging and asking for big money,

 

there have been unhappy rumbles, and if your going to change the makeup of the roster, no place more significant to do so, than GM, Coach, Captain and Top Two D or Starting Goalie.

They signed Miller for a reason.  
 

Miller can do everything that Horvat does.  Already proved it.

 

A one two with EP40 and Miller, could really hold its own, with Aman and or Studs being able to sustain their play as newcomers to the bottom six.

 

clearly the Top RHD side of our Defence is at issue.

 

A draft pick and late twenties or early thirties aged D man back with proven play for Hughes, our current Bure, would be like resigning Larionov for him back in 1992 and or getting any Center that was better than our RW Captain, Linden, for so long it hurt.

 

then somehow we get two playmakers that just needed a gritty Two Way winger with leadership and size to bounce pucks off and into the net, with the Sedins…. A younger Trevor Linden, and no one could find a RW that could play with a opposite shooting hand, but we could see what the Sedins did for every winger they played with, From Carter to Hansen, until Player Name Hear took the money and ran, well, not run, more just like hang out and not do anything.

 

so now with this team in a state of unbalance and Rutherford here to make real hard moves… it’s time to see how this gets fixed.

 

if we can either gain a second 1st this year and a RHD of any ability to play better than Luke Schenn and in the 20’s to like 31, that has miles left on the body, for Horvat.

 

take it.

 

If it gives Demko some support and ice time to Brock and Miller to pick up their pace, we should be able to sustain the drop in Offence with the hidden gem of Kuzemenko, and have better overall defence and better depth thru all positions save third line Center, for Aman and Studs to take for now.

 

easier to pick a Center in each draft than a top four RHD.

 

we are in desperate shape without that addressed.

 

demko has shell shock.

 

 

 

 

   

[aGENT]

30 minutes ago, Phat Fingers said:

 Miller can do everything that Horvat does.  Already proved it.

 

 

[5nothincanucksohno]

3 hours ago, JCorgi37 said:

You would hope there would be some dollar flexibility if he wants 8 years. However, if Im Bo's agent and I see Miller getting 8 x 8.5...I probably want the same. 

Miller signed a seven year deal (eight at $7.656M per year if you include this years contract - not real but I am sure was a consideration when the team agreed to the deal), so an eight year deal for Bo could potentially lower AAV

Edited November 11, 2022 by 5nothincanucksohno

[Canuckfanforlife82]

3 minutes ago, 5nothincanucksohno said:

Miller signed a seven year deal (eight at $7.656M per year if you include this years contract - not real but I am sure was a consideration when the team agreed to the deal), so an eight year deal for Bo could potentially lower AAV

Yes let's keep the same team together because it's done so well as a group. Makes no sense. We stink yet let's keep everyone long term. Hmmmmm.

[Alflives]

Bo to the Avs for Newhook or Byram? 

[Gurn]

12 minutes ago, 5nothincanucksohno said:

(eight at $7.656M per year if you include this years contract -

Why would you count that?

[Coconuts]

18 hours ago, Toyotasfan said:

Horvat and Myers for Barbashev and Parayko 

is pretty close salary wise. 

Parayko has a full NTC, and St. Louis, despite their struggles to score this season, have missed the playoffs only once since 2011-2012. The argument that they're better than they've shown holds a lot more water than it does when applied to our team, they've got history backing them. They had 49 wins last season, even if they miss this season it's more likely they bounce back this season or next than it is Vancouver suddenly pulls it's shit together. Biggest issues for the Blues has been a lack of scoring from the wing and ROR's disappointing start. 

 

He also won a cup there. I don't see any reason why Parayko would waive, let alone for Vancouver. 

 

They also don't need Horvat, they've already got Thomas's 8M+ deal kicking in next season and they've got Schenn backing him. Maybe they re-sign ROR, but as it stands they've already reallocated much of the cap they'll free up from Tarasenko and ROR to Thomas and Kyrou. 

 

https://www.capfriendly.com/teams/blues

 

18 hours ago, Junkyard Dog said:

If we trading Bo we might as well rebuild and trade others as well. Like Miller, Kuz, Garland, etc.

 

Boeser i'd probably wait for now cause his value is low and with those guys out he'll play top line minutes which means more opportunity for production. Could do this with Garland as well.

 

If you can find a trade for OEL move him but I wouldn't use any picks to move OEL. 4 years after this one anyone we draft in 2023-2025 will expire close to or at the same time as him(Probably most in 2023 since I don't see anyone besides a top 5 pick stepping in right away). I guess he can be a veteran for a young D to play with.

 

Myers you probably right retention then someone might take him. If not higher chance someone takes him next year with 1 year left and retention. Same goes for Pearson.

 

Try to do what Ducks did and sign someone like Klingberg(above average player who can't get contract) for a year that you can flip. Or take cap dumps for picks/prospects from cap strapped teams. 

If we trade Bo we should absolutely be moving out other features of this veteran core. Starting with Miller, but also guys like Pearson and Myers. 

 

Boeser was can afford to wait on, same with Garland, just throw Boeser back with Pettersson and Hughes and his production will likely get a boost. Moving a guy like Miller would see guys like Garland and Boeser get an boost in offensive zone minutes. 

 

I'd keep OEL, bottom line is we're gonna need someone to play D and it's not worth giving up assets to move him. Having vets on the roster is still a good thing to have, he's as good a vet as any and someone's gotta play top 4. 

 

Myers we could probably flip next year on an expiring contract, I question what kind of value we'd get from him this season. If we retained there might be value but he's much easier for a team to fit in as a pending UFA. 

 

Totally on board with bringing in players to flip, or players on short-medium term stopgap deals. 

 

16 hours ago, R3aL said:

Ya agree it is scary to think is in 2-4 years when his production starts to drop, he will probably get more frustrated, make worse mistakes and create more turnovers. Be slower physically and be caught out of position even more. 

 

Miller needs to go in my mind. And I think he could really be successful insulated in a strong system on a strong team and a PP1 weapon. So I could see how teams see his value. And I think he is moveable. But the ego / to the decision making of signing him as our guy then in a matter of months reevaluating like OOPS is bad team optics and they may refuse.

 

Problem with BO is he could really want out. He may not want to spend another 2-4 years to hopefully turn it around. I think he wants to stay in a perfect world, if we were winning or he could visualize a path to winning I could see him signing. But the problem is how does he sign for less than Miller at this point? If I was him I wouldn't. Why should he get offered less than Boeser makes? It's rather insulting. He wont be easy to replace but if we can get a quality haul from him, something for Miller and a top draft pick this season it could be whaat we need.

 

Then we can trim the fat from the Vets that need to go: Myers and Pearson 

 

I am sure they will look at moving OEL by any means necessary with minimal retention if any, unless his drop off is truly because of his foot right now. OR might even just in general.

 

Hard to be an optimistic fan right now it really is.

 

Im not even sold on JR as a team builder either. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I fully expect more Miller gaffes as he ages and inevitably slows. He should have been gone months ago, I never thought he lined up with the timeline of the younger core. 

 

As for Bo, I could totally see it. Most of his tenure as a Canuck has been spent on losing teams, this isn't an indication of his play though so much of an indictment of the quality of the teams he's played on. Could totally see him wanting a fresh start somewhere more competitive. And I don't view that as a lack of loyalty, every player wants to win and it's not every guy who wants to stick on what's been predominantly a loser. 

 

Myers and Pearson would probably be easier to move at the deadline next season, as pending UFA's. 

 

I'd keep OEL, moving him isn't worth what it'd cost us and we can't really afford to move out picks and prospects to dump cap anymore. Someone's gotta play his minutes anyway, may as well be him. 

 

JR, at his age, was never going to be around too long. He's got influence right now, but it's PA I question long term. We'll see. 

 

6 hours ago, Alflives said:

Considering Bo had a career year last season and has continued with the same this year and our team stinks, no it’s not a failure of management.  It’s smart.  Trade away older guys, who have value.  

Maybe it was a mistake to extend Miller? 

It was always a mistake to extend Miller. 

[bishopshodan]

If we trade Bo, might as well trade everyone not named Elias or Quinn. 

 

The Miller signing signalled that we should be loading up and going for it now. But here we are twiddling thumbs. 

 

Halfass JR, quickly becoming the worst hire the Nucks org have committed to. 

 

[R3aL]

15 minutes ago, Coconuts said:

I fully expect more Miller gaffes as he ages and inevitably slows. He should have been gone months ago, I never thought he lined up with the timeline of the younger core

 

As for Bo, I could totally see it. Most of his tenure as a Canuck has been spent on losing teams, this isn't an indication of his play though so much of an indictment of the quality of the teams he's played on. Could totally see him wanting a fresh start somewhere more competitive. And I don't view that as a lack of loyalty, every player wants to win and it's not every guy who wants to stick on what's been predominantly a loser. 

 

Myers and Pearson would probably be easier to move at the deadline next season, as pending UFA's. 

 

I'd keep OEL, moving him isn't worth what it'd cost us and we can't really afford to move out picks and prospects to dump cap anymore. Someone's gotta play his minutes anyway, may as well be him. 

 

JR, at his age, was never going to be around too long. He's got influence right now, but it's PA I question long term. We'll see. 

Ya he has played better lately though outside of that horrendous Dach giveaway they have to just put him back on the wing and really set him up to succeed so we can move him.

 

Maybe aa GM will see him and think their teams culture and system will cover his deficiencies and he will be a beast for them on the PP and off the wing with the ability to cover C in a pinch / injury.

 

Myers I could see last to the TDL potentially, but I think they will try to move him in the summer.

 

Pearson I don't think makes it to our next training camp. From when he returns form injury to then I think they will be actively trying to move him.

 

OEL I think we are mostly stuck with him for now and am really hoping things improve for him and this isn't his new normal.

 

Ya I think they are tied together. If the JR Aquaman relationship strains I think PA will be gone regardless.

 

 

 

Question:

 

What do you think of targeting Zach Whitecloud from VGK?

 

https://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=165828

 

Great age, great size, has shown well in his career up to this point. Haas been a little sheltered but has shown well when he's been elevated. Good defensively with some puck moving ability. I like his heart and character too. 

 

Good cost controlled contract 2.75M

 

But he's a little buried in their system and wont be jumping Pietrangelo or Theodore unless there is an injury and they could replace him with guys up and coming and always have salary issues on the bottom pair.

 

I like the idea of him playing with OEL or Hughes and as RHD PKER.

 

If we could pick a guy like him up and add a top RHD prospect thats close to NHL ready would be huge for our group.

 

[Alflives]

Drance saying Hughes is playing injured.  No “pop” in his stride.  Playing him with Myers v the LOSER LEAFS.  

If we move Bo it has to be for a proper partner for Hughes.

Edited November 11, 2022 by Alflives

[R3aL]

9 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Drance saying Hughes is playing injured.  No “pop” in his stride.  Playing him with Myers v the LOSER LEAFS.  

If we move Bo it has to be for a proper partner for Hughes.

If we trade Bo has to be a RHD or a C that’s younger but shows promise to be as effective as a player as Bo in their respected positions plus a pick. 
 

We can’t give a C entering their prime and not get a younger premium asset back (C/D)

[aGENT]

42 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:

If we trade Bo, might as well trade everyone not named Elias or Quinn. 

 

The Miller signing signalled that we should be loading up and going for it now. But here we are twiddling thumbs. 

 

Halfass JR, quickly becoming the worst hire the Nucks org have committed to. 

 

Signing Miller signaled that management made a huge judgment lapse as to how close this roster was to contending. Here's hoping the course correct.