How did JR/PA do on TDL 2022? (10 being best, 1 being worst)

[DownUndaCanuck]

The initial sting of losing Motte hurts but when you take a step back, the management group made some smart decisions and what's different to previous management teams is that they're really considering the cap in everything they do.

 

When you look at the contenders, they're circumnavigating the cap with overpaying for retention and using their LTIR sneakily. JB was a good drafter and trader but boy did he not know how to use his cap to the best, whereas we already see a bit more flexibility.

 

I gave them a 5 - nothing great, nothing horrendous. Personally I'd spend up to 2.5M for Motte but I can see why Alvin and co. wouldn't. Hamonic out and Dermott in was some very savvy movement by them, frees up some cap for a lateral move and we get a bit younger and more flexible, not to mention the possibility that the whole team disliked Hamonic, and the entire Leafs team loved Dermott.

 

I agree in that this was clearly a small TDL to feel the team out, still give them a chance to compete for the playoffs and the big decisions and trades will and should be made in the off-season.

[J-23]

37 minutes ago, DS4quality said:

Management got lowballed by New York, and accepted the offer. Saying they weren't going to accept low offers for Motte.  Why not keep Motte and find a way to drop some other dead cap in the off-season.  Why wait until the last minute to negotiate with his agents.

With four assistant GM's the best they could muster is a late 4th?  

If Benning traded Vanek for 5th he would have been shot out of a cannon.

Lowballed, yet, Appleton, Namestnikov, Vatrano, Brassard all went for the same price.

[Coconuts]

I'd give it maybe a 4-5 out of 10, was hoping we'd sell more. This isn't a playoff team and it's a roster that needs more significant surgery than what we saw, moving peripheral pieces in and out isn't going to lead to significant change. 

 

The end result is likely that we play well enough to end up in no man's land with a middling 1st round pick, this team ain't making the playoffs. 

 

Hopefully we see more significant movement in the offseason when more teams will have the flex to make deals with us. 

Edited March 22, 2022 by Coconuts

[-DLC-]

Quote

The Canucks didn’t want to offer Motte a sizeable raise on his expiring $US 1.225-million cap hit and US $1.45 million in actual salary. 

 

With the clock ticking down to Monday’s noon (Pacific time) deadline, Canucks general manager Patrik Allvin was doing double duty in trying to sign Motte while finding out if there would be a greater trade return.

 

“It was a little bit of both I would say,” Allvin said at an afternoon news conference. “For myself, in talking to a lot of teams and feeling out with what they were thinking about our players, that’s where we wound up with the fourth-round pick. There were some teams checking in on him, but we felt the draft in 2023 was a little bit better. And when it was clear we couldn’t sign him, we had to maximize our return.

 

“The (draft pick) value gives us a little more ammunition if we want to do something and gives us time to check this draft (2022) out, if we want to move up, or another player becomes available.”

https://theprovince.com/sports/hockey/nhl/vancouver-canucks/deal-tyler-motte-to-cup-contending-new-york-rangers-for-fourth-round-2023-draft-pick

[-DLC-]

41 minutes ago, DS4quality said:

Management got lowballed by New York, and accepted the offer. Saying they weren't going to accept low offers for Motte.  Why not keep Motte and find a way to drop some other dead cap in the off-season.  Why wait until the last minute to negotiate with his agents.

With four assistant GM's the best they could muster is a late 4th?  

If Benning traded Vanek for 5th he would have been shot out of a cannon.

You didn't answer my question.

[wai_lai416]

7 hours ago, HC20.0 said:

Honestly I’m glad we held onto Miller and Garland both. Not thrilled about the Motte trade, but 3m in cap and Dermott isn’t too bad. 

we didn't gain 3mil in cap space.. dermott and not trading halak earlier before his bad last couple of games now his performance bonus along with dermott will eat up the entire 3mil

[RWJC]

14 minutes ago, wai_lai416 said:

we didn't gain 3mil in cap space.. dermott and not trading halak earlier before his bad last couple of games now his performance bonus along with dermott will eat up the entire 3mil

True, but some minor cap pressure was at least balanced out for next year.

The rest will come this offseason.

between NMC/NTs and some high value contracts vs output, this mgmt team has some work cut out for them.

[DS4quality]

17 minutes ago, -DLC- said:

You didn't answer my question.

It's only guaranteed losing him for nothing if you stop negotiating now.

Your ultimatum means that after the trade deadline he wasn't playing for us. 

So yes I'd risk losing him for nothing.  Nothing is ever guaranteed.  

 

 

[EddieVedder]

29 minutes ago, J-23 said:

Lowballed, yet, Appleton, Namestnikov, Vatrano, Brassard all went for the same price.

Namestnikov would've been a good player to bring in.

[lmm]

6 hours ago, 13231 said:

That's some really wishful thinking, unfortunately. Bottom line is that this Motte trade was completely unnecessary, you do not shake up the locker room and send a completely random signal to a close knit group for a 4th rounder. JR and Allvin better pull some magic in the off season because this TDL was pretty brutal.

whaat?

where did you get that from? You do not shake up a locker room of a team that sharts the bed every second game?

this is a locker room that got their last coach fired and is not responding consistently to the new coach

If you don't trade guys off this roster why not sign them all to NM contracts?

this roster has received more than they have earned

[RWJC]

One thing about all of this that I hope we can all agree on is that we havent yet seen what kind of salary structure model this new mgmt team is going to utilize.

 

Perhaps they are looking at an internally imposed limit as to what can be spent per “tier” and where that money is best allocated. Motte at 2.75-3.5 is not going to move up the lineup. That’s a lot of money spent on a single player on the 3rd/4th who is an amazing motor but doesn’t provide much offense. For 2.75-3.5 that’s almost a requirement for team depth. 

 

Form what we’ve witnessed, the same level of Motte’s total “contribution” can be realized by other players earning in the 750K-1million range.  For 1 Motte you can potentially have 2.75 roster players earning as much in total and forming an almost complete line.

 

This is the kind of assessment that needs to be done in order  for this team to get itself out from under cap restraint hell.  For me, the big question is who does mgmt think are the players in that cap range that can achieve this. Luckily we have had two breakout candidates in Llama and the Stoner, but unfortunately both are upcoming RFA so are due for a raise.

 

My best guess is that we are going to approach the future with a much different distribution of cap amongst the players. Motte is a casualty of this.

 

I loved Motte here but he has clearly played and priced himself out of what is realistically affordable for this team. 

Edited March 22, 2022 by RWJC

[sassbs]

8 hours ago, Itchyfinger said:

Let’s bring in a 37 year old guy that can’t crack the flames roster to replace motte.....

 

Well, with respect, Canucks do not have a fwd group like the flames do!!  I wish we had the depth as Calgary 

[Disgruntler]

From all accounts, Hamonic going was addition by subtraction. So $3m out the door and the locker room has been somewhat smudged.

[CanucksFan8353]

incredibly pissed, enraged really, at all the so-called Canucks fans on here, who say the chances are less than zero of us making the playoffs, when the Knights and Oilers both lost must-win games tonight and the oilers play the stars tomorrow so one team we are chasing is guaranteed to lose ground to us in the race tomorrow!!!!

 

Also, saw calls on here, today, for Alvin, Granato, Rutherford, et al to be fired for not re-signing a 4th liner as if winning it all depended entirely on Motte!  Really??? Apparently, you wanted the team to keep Motte but dump Miller.  Do you know how insane that is????

 

The cockiness, and, indeed, almost joy that shines through, when posters post such things as "this team ain't making the playoffs" is also infuriating.

 

Go Canucks Go!  True fans never give up on their team.  EVER.   Especially not when we have 5 games + one game in hand left against the Knights, Oilers and Stars and especially when we are not even close to mathematically eliminated yet! 

 

When it is the final week and the Canucks are fighting for their lives and a playoff spot seems within reach, please don't jump back on the bandwagon.  You made your bed.  If and when that happens, lie in it.

Edited March 22, 2022 by CanucksFan8353

[Taphouse Canuck]

I posted yesterday that the TDL would be way more interesting than the remaining games.

 

How wrong could I have been

[BigTramFan]

12 minutes ago, CanucksFan8353 said:

incredibly pissed, enraged really, at all the so-called Canucks fans on here, who say the chances are less than zero of us making the playoffs, when the Knights and Oilers both lost must-win games tonight and the oilers play the stars tomorrow so one team we are chasing is guaranteed to lose ground to us in the race tomorrow!!!!

 

Also, saw calls on here, today, for Alvin, Granato, Rutherford, et al to be fired for not re-signing a 4th liner as if winning it all depended entirely on Motte!  Really??? Do you know how insane that is????

 

The cockiness, and, indeed, almost joy that shines through, when posters post such things as "this team ain't making the playoffs" is also infuriating.

 

Go Canucks Go!  True fans never give up on their team.  EVER.   Especially not when we have 5 games + one game in hand left against the Knights, Oilers and Stars and especially when we are not even close to mathematically eliminated yet!

I like the positivity! I am definitely supporting the team in the hopes that we can make the playoffs this season!

 

I think most posters are frustrated that this TDL the new mgmt group appears to not have decided if we are going for it this season (buying) or setting things up for a better year next year (selling).

 

e.g. Selling Hamonic and Motte does not do us any favours for this season (both pretty key guys to our success). Adding Dermott and Richardson helps this season and these two could have been added without selling Hamonic and Motte.

 

I think it just feels like a very unclear plan from our mgmt for VAN fans.

[Canucks_fo_life]

Cammi Granato and Emile Castonguay don't get a free pass either

[Goal:thecup]

10 minutes ago, Canucks_fo_life said:

Cammi Granato and Emile Castonguay don't get a free pass either

Yeah, if this is their idea of 5D chess, they should stick to checkers.

[hammertime]

1 hour ago, lmm said:

whaat?

where did you get that from? You do not shake up a locker room of a team that sharts the bed every second game?

this is a locker room that got their last coach fired and is not responding consistently to the new coach

If you don't trade guys off this roster why not sign them all to NM contracts?

this roster has received more than they have earned

The thing is Motte and his line were consistently showing up and it showed. They kept the country club and traded from the pool of players that was going to work on a nightly basis. 

[wai_lai416]

2 hours ago, RWJC said:

True, but some minor cap pressure was at least balanced out for next year.

The rest will come this offseason.

between NMC/NTs and some high value contracts vs output, this mgmt team has some work cut out for them.

ya i'm interested to see how summer will go.. i honestly don't see the trades happening in the summer as some predicted. if any trades going to happen it's going to happen at the draft before free agency. not after free agency when all the team have no more cap to work with.